This is at least the 3rd xmas we've had to deal with vile and nasty behaviour from my Grandma, I actually found a post I sent a few years ago on here in the same situation 😂 This xmas my 82 year old grandma spent xmas day, boxing day and day after out and in company but Saturdays weekly visit ended up and a blazing shouting argument where myself and my mum walked out. As soon as we got there getting snide remarks on not having visits or calls over xmas. We didn't bite. When leaving my mum went to kiss her and she blanked my mum (through sulking) when mum just walked off the shouting and screaming started accusing my mum of 'going off in a huff' and that she has a huge family and no one called, no one loves or cares.

I tried to reason with her saying she had 3 other kids and 6 other grandkids that never call or hardly go round and we visit every Saturday afternoon, it didn't work she said its only for 2 hours and can't wait to go home. The reason is our parting gift every visit is nasty, vile comments. She then rang my mum at midnight only to shout at her! (We left her at 5:30) My stepdad had a heart attack earlier in the year and my mamas comment to mum was ' well if anything had happened to him you would know what true depression was' .... When my grandad had 3 heart attacks 2 cardiac arrests and a triple bypass my mum moved in with her for weeks despite me being around 6 years old to help her! Every xmas she starts an argument with us. She old nasty and ungrateful. I haven't rang her over xmas for years so whys she starting this crap this year? Mum said she will still visit next week as its her mum but I'm the one who drives there as my mum doesn't drive and I really don't want to go. My children have said they don't want to go either they heard it all. She has been the same for years calling family members to each other, we cannot do anything to please. If I do go next week I want it out in the open to tell my mama another nasty comment and I will not come again as at present she says what she wants, hurts people yet we still show each week, there is no comeuppance to her actions! But how do I tell my mum this without upsetting her? I know she is only going as its her mother not out of love anymore. I'm just waiting for the horrible phone calls now for new years (my mum had this the other year and when she refused to answer the phone my mama left poisonous voicemails 🙄)

My grandma does not have mental illness or dementia she is just horrid! Apart from to the dodgy carer and her husband that can't get enough praise even though they have broke protocol, doing jobs for cash in hand, going round off shift and even taking her on holiday! They have been reported for these antics but seem to get away with everything. Is my best option to give her an ultimatum next week as I've had enough? One more argument, snide comment etc and I shall not come again. I'm only a grandchild and only 2 out of 8 of us go to see her.

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Drive mom to her mom's house if she truly wants to go, but schedule errands to do while mom "visits".

Has your mother ever had counseling or therapy to learn how to deal with her mentally ill mother? Have you?

I have no idea why you think that gma's behavior is not a manifestation of mental illness/personality disorder. This is NOT the behavior of a well person. Just because she's being doing it for her whole life does not make it normal.

Happier New Year! Google "setting boundaries with toxic loved ones".
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rovana Dec 2018
I suspect the idea that grandma does not have mental illness has to do with the concept that a mentally ill person does not have moral discretion and therefore is held harmless for their behavior.  But there is a difference between mental illness, like psychosis, which means a person cannot discern morality or control their behavior and thus cannot be blamed, and the kind of mental illness, often termed behavioral disorder, in which the person does understand moral issues, can control their behavior and chooses not to do so.  From a religious standpoint this could be considered sin, However, secular society seems to have problems with calling sin "sin".
Seems to me like the poster is saying that grandma is in the latter class - she does know what she is doing and thus can be considered responsible for her treatment of others.  I don't believe that you get some "free pass" just because of age.
I know you say grandma doesn't have mental issues, but I disagree, anyone who can treat and talk that way about their kids & grandkids have to have some kind of mental problems! This is not normal behavior!

I think it is time for you to lay the law down. If your mum is willing to take the abuse so be it, but that doesn't mean you have to.

My mother's mom was a horrible, mean, hateful woman. I never knew her growing up she lived in another state. However, my mother moved my grandma up here when I was in my early twenties. One day a black male friend showed up to see how I was doing. We went to school together and he was a dear friend. Well, my grandmother called him all kinds of names and me as well! I told my mother knowing she would not do anything about it. My grandmother would call my father and my mother horrible names as well and my dad just let it go becase he stated "my life and who I am has nothing to do with her (grandmother). I know who I am". My mother on the other hand, just took the abuse and kept doing whatever she could for her mom. It is really sad if you think about. Any who, I refuse to see my grandmother after that and when she died I did not go to her funeral. I felt bad for my mother, but I really didn't know the old lady and I believed that I did not owe her my respect nor my presents at her death!

You were not put here on God's green earth to be a emotional punching bag. You will just have to tell grandma here are the rules for you to see me & I am sure your mum will hear them too, being in the same room with you. You can give your mum a ride there and sit in the car, or arrange for other transportation for mum.

But a good rule to live by is "we teach people how to treat us".

Just my 2 cents!
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Some people are simply toxic. Period. And your grandma sounds like one of them. She is a miserable person, who like my mother was, probably is not happy unless she is unhappy. Mom was also a Drama Queen and a martyr. Add to that the delusions and hallucinations of dementia and we have a completely impotable cocktail.

Your grandma is someone who should not, under any circumstances be argued or disagreed with. It is exactly what she wants. She is orchestrating dramatic performances that she enjoys and prides herself on. You seem to be unwittingly participating. I remember once when my mother was in the facility and was given a roommate. She was a recluse, antisocial and was furious that now she had to share a room. She attacked the roommate on the premise that she thought the roommate was a man. To this day, I’m not sure if she actually believed it or not. When I visited her next, she sat in her chair with a little smile as she described smacking this poor woman and getting a room of her own.

Never engage your Grandmother. When she starts to become angry, insulting and anxious, leave as fast as you can. When she phones, let it go to voicemail.
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I don't see any point in issuing ultimatums which may or may not be remembered 6 weeks from now, in my opinion they key to demonstrating boundaries is to consistently react to inappropriate behaviour as it happens - grandma says or does something horrid and you (politely) ask that it stop and then leave when it doesn't. Visits might be very short.
And I agree with Barb about not having to visit because you are the one providing the transportation, just drop your mother off and leave, no explanations required.
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My opinion, when she says no one visits tell her its because she is such a Witch. Tell her, who wants to be around someone who is always putting you down, complains and doesn't have a nice thing to say about anybody or anything. Tell her to count her lucky stars that your Mom continues to visit. But, if she doesn't show Mom some respect, you will refuse to drive her over anymore. Tell her its her choice. If she chooses to continue this way, then she will die a lonely old woman and that will be her fault no one elses. If she then starts mouthing off, walk out. That will leave her to think about what you said. Turn the answering machine off. Turn down the phone. Wait a couple of days, turn the AM on. If she still is horrid, turn it off. Ignore her behaviour. Don't play into it.

I stay away from a SIL who seems to think being condescending is OK. Its VERY hard for her to give a complement. She got so bad her family had an intervention and she still didn't see where she was wrong. I didn't visit for ten years because of the way I was treated. My BIL had to beg us to stay at his house for his sons wedding. She has improved a little, but I am always waiting for that shoe to drop.
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I agree with others that her bad behavior needs to be voiced to her, and that  if she continues you will walk out.  Then follow through.  It sounds like you've started doing that.  What an example she is of how NOT to be.  Good luck.  If Mom still wants to go, I guess you could still drop her off.  Or give mum taxi money.
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Come Saturday, your grandmother had no recollection of having been out and in company on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Is that correct? - have I understood your description correctly?
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BarbBrooklyn Dec 2018
Excellent point, CM.

Hibbo, you can attribute GMA's behavior to "horridness" or you can encourage you mom to get Gma evaluated for dementia/mental issues.

Did you know that UTI's can cause behavioral issues in elders?

Lots to look into here.
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Thanks everyone I'm sorry you all know someone like this 😢 My mum is very angry and says she doesn't want to visit either, we just don't like it will be left to my aunty and uncle to deal with her. Mama has 5 kids and 8 grandkids but only 2 kids go up regularly and same with grandkids. I know everyone keeps bringing up mental health, for one I work in a field of business dealing with many mentally ill clients and know she is not mentally ill. She saw a psychiatrist who stated it wasn't depression or personality disorder she had it was lonliness (my grandad died 6 years ago) And not a 5 year water infection. My grandad had those and remember him hallucinating dead fishermen on the floor! She was never like this up until a year after he died. She used to be the best mum/mama you could have she is just unrecognizable now. She does remember going out, she remembers hella lot of things ..... everything you've ever done wrong in life, any time we have stood up for ourselves with her oooohhhh she remembers all that quite clearly and brings it up regularly! Shes great at playing silly games every Saturday and waiting for us to leave for nasty parting gifts. I have told mum if we go Saturday I am going to tell her one more vile, horrid, nasty comment again and I'm off and not returning. I have nothing to loose and everything to gain that's what my Mama doesn't realise. I can better spend my afternoon taking my kids out with my Husband! Think mum agreed she had no comeuppance leading from her actions, so, act like a child get treated as so! Great roll on Saturday 🤦‍♀️
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