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Husband and I live in the same home with his dad. His dad’s natural personality is narcissism, all he cares about is getting his coffee, newspaper, donuts cookies (he’s diabetic type2) and his MONEY. His dad is 72 & was married for 24yrs until 7 months ago when she broke her hip and then 2 mos after broke her other hip. She did EVERYTHING for him I mean EVERYTHING. He had a VERY mild stroke the drs said they aren’t worried about the location of the stroke all he needs to do is keep walking and he will be 100%, well he wanted to be wheeled around in a wheel chair all the time even at home especially when he realized he was getting attention from other people. Now he CANT walk without falling or assistants. He divorced his wife 7 mo ago and told the day time caregiver (old friend of his, I thought I had it made with Sue she did everything for me I guess I was wrong). He stays in bed all day everyday, he has had 6 home health physical therapies and 1 outpt therapy stopped after 2 visits, showers every 2-3 months, won’t eat what is given to him but maybe 2 bites then tells the dr I don’t cook and he is withering away on Sandwiches (yes I stopped cooking for him), he can’t even write (as I said the wife did EVERYTHING for him), in the past month he has had 11 bowel accidents in the bed and on the carpet because he can’t walk fast enough to the toilet and he is ok with that because there is always someone to wipe his butt he has even told me after cleaning him up I’m not done I’ll just lay here and go on the towel (I don’t say it but I’m like what the F***) and poops on the carpet. When he was in the hospital a few months ago for pneumonia he has told drs and PT therapists “my WONT power is greater then my will power, when my husband & I go out he says just make me a care package and leave the front door unlocked (I am again what the F***), when I reach my limit and blow my top, he pulls on my husbands heart strings over these past 7mos he has put a big guilt trip on my husband (his dads now ex-wife was my husbands stepmom) so his dad tells him your mom gave me the gift of life YOU!!! She died when my husband was 15mos, my husband does have his moments of blowing his top at his dad, he hasn’t seen the dr in about 5mos and hasn’t done his lab work, he has had had 5 falls in the past month, he has cashed out 3 life insurance policies totaling over $100,000.00 for total of approximately $10,600.00. PCP says he has dementia on top of his type 2 diabetes and other things. He will not go to a neurologist to confirm it and to see how far he is in the dementia. He will not bring someone that is licensed qualified to help him because he doesnt want to pay. His friend that is helping in the day time he short pays her so my husband and I pay the difference and she is about ready to walk out the door and never look back he has ruined their friendship. The hospital and PCP has reported him to APS for neglect of self care. I have told the Dr the other things he has done including the life insurance situation, the decisions he is making are incompetent decisions and is actually putting our daytime caregiver, my husband and I in big jeopardy of bad repercussions, he has done other things not listed. APS doesn’t know everything he has done, he sounds competent but you can see on their faces they know he is lying. I don’t talk to him or look at him, give him his crap and leave the room. I almost lost my state job of 15yrs because of him and still on a thin line and he knows it he says it is not that hard to take care of me. He refuses to try to try.


WE KEEP a daily log book of EVERYTHING, said, done, food and we have pictures.


Do drs only report certain things? Has anyone gone through this with APS? Are there others steps of APS? Is there other ways to get proper help? Can we get in trouble if we move out? Where is the caregiver protection?


I am so dumbfounded of how the system works when it is right in front of their faces.


Dumbfounded

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You are being taken advantage of, bigtime. I'm guessing that YOU change the poopy messes because your H throws up? Start gagging and say that you can't do it, either. Is HE in danger of losing HIS job? I bet not.

There are other siblings who refuse to have anything to do with FIL, so their lives and their families' lives are unaffected. That's not the case for YOU, though, is it? How did your H come be to the POA?

STOP putting up with the old man's nonsense. You and your H can MOVE OUT, as long as the old man is still deemed to be competent. Your H can resign as POA.

Do NOT jeopardize YOUR future. If your H wants to jeopardize HIS (including his life, since he is so stressed that you are concerned he will have a heart attack), that's his problem. If H refuses to move out and leave the old man, then YOU do so. Save yourself.
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Reply to CTTN55
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"He gets his coffee, newspaper and junk crap to eat when I am ready to do so I make him wait an hr maybe 2 before I do anything."

"I don't talk to him or look at him."

That right there is abuse.

Provide the care if you are prepared to, or refuse to provide the care if you are not prepared to. But don't do this.

I recommend your DH hires outside caregivers to visit your father 3 or 4 x daily and provide support with ADLs. Seeing as FIL won't agree to pay for this at the moment, I suggest your DH keeps punctilious accounts and recoups the money in due course - either when your FIL can be persuaded to agree, or when he's past the point of managing his finances.

You stay away from him, at least for as long as it takes you to recover somewhat. Your FIL's care is legally your FIL's responsibility (at least for now). Next, it will be your DH's responsibility. It is not your responsibility and can't be yours without your consent.

How the system works... What, exactly, are you expecting the system to do? Physically pick the man up and stuff his head in a CT scanner? APS visit. They interview him. He answers their questions. He may be a [several interesting words deleted], but they have no evidence that he is non compos mentis and without that they can't do a thing.

And for God's sake stop subbing the friend/caregiver! Thank her effusively for her loving care and forbearance but get rid of her. She's part of what's propping him up but she can't do enough to take the burden off you - explain to her that it's essential that everybody stops enabling his poor decisions. Surely she'd be relieved, wouldn't she?
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Reply to Countrymouse
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I am finding out the hard way that the law is NOT on your side. It is on the side of the ELDER if they are competent and have their mind!!!!
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Reply to elaine1962
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If I understand you, Dad is legally speaking mentally competent. You might want to check with an elder attorney but I would think you could just move out. Can you talk to your husband about how this will ruin your marriage?  Does he realize this cannot go on?
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Reply to rovana
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This is a completely toxic relationship. I hope you can find the courage not to care for him anymore. It’s going to emotionally and physically drain you. It’s too much for you to deal with. I wish you the very best. Please stop this insanity. He does not appreciate your help and it’s going to kill you.
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Reply to NeedHelpWithMom
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DollyMe said it.

But it won't happen without a game plan. Even if you both start saying no.

Dad has diabetes & dementia (post-stroke & possibly alcohol related also). As you already know, no point trying to reason. He can't.

Pre-action plan:
Leave some pre-made sandwiches where he can reach & go out with your DH for dinner (or cafe, pub whatever). Have a proper chat away from Dad. Are you on the same page?

Next will be trying all the services available to you that can help - Area of Aging, APS etc. Ask how to get a Social Worker or Case Manager.
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Reply to Beatty
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Move out.
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Reply to HelloImMinsu
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If you are living in his home, I would move out ASAP. If he is living in your home I would give him a 30 day notice to vacate the home, he needs to be moved in AL, time to cut the cord and start living your life.

He is not going to change it is up to you to make the necessary change.
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Reply to anonymous912123
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Answer - Assisted or skilled nursing. If he is not cooperating with his care, then he is on his own. I would also definitely move out - and let APS know. You are not responsible for his care when he is acting like that. Been there - done that. Also - he is not YOUR father - let your husband and other siblings (if any) deal with it.
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Reply to MAldridge
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I am confused a little. Your FIL divorced his wife when she first broke her hip? Did he cash out the insurance to avoid having her get anything? Who lives in whose house? ( I sound like Dr Suess, sorry) He has fallen 5 times in one month? Call EMS when he falls, let them cart him off if he will allow it,, or deal with the embarrassment of the constant calls,, don't harm yourself picking him up.. Lying there in poop may be an embarrassing situation for him.. Don't let your job suffer, let hubs deal with any of that crap, when hubs gets tired of it, it WILL change.. And you need to build up your own retirement for when you need it. And by the way,, if he wants his coffee and doughnuts badly enough he will move his butt to get them, or get them on your time schedule..
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Reply to pamzimmrrt
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Dumbfounded Feb 10, 2020
yes He is my FIL but I don’t call him that anymore. Divorce - Well we found out while she was gone when the bills came in she was taking money from him to support her adult daughter and grandson, yes her daughter does work and also because she became broken and couldn’t do for him anymore. he sprung the divorce on his son and I about the 3rd-4th month in after her first break. We’ve been living with him for some years now, when he found out we were planning to move out he begged us not to leave, he didn’t want to live with her alone especially when he started to decline, there are more things she had done and try to do to him. I believed he cashed to avoid her getting anything. When she found out he had an attorney for the divorce she willing signed the divorce decree. I guess he thought he had it made thinking my husband and I would continue to do as she did, but it has slowly back fired on him, which I honestly believe his rapid decline is because he doesn’t know how to take care of himself because she did it ALL. He was a raging alcoholic for about 20yrs he was very abusive physically, mentally, verbally and emotionally to my husband and her. Yes 5 falls in 1 month he fell last week hit the wall and his head EMS came out and he refused he said he was ok. He gets his coffee, newspaper and junk crap to eat when I am ready to do so I make him wait an hr maybe 2 before I do anything. My FIL’s siblings won’t have anything to do with him. My hubs brothers won’t have anything to do with there dad. My hubs tries to help the best he can - when he had to help his dad with a poop incident my hubs had to go outside to throw up, he has repeatedly told his dad we can’t care for you the way is needed, my hubs has tried everything, reasoning, talking to the drs, threating to put him in a home, talk to the case workers at the hospital when he was there a few months ago. I’m afraid my hubs is going to have a heart attack if this keeps up, it brings my hubs to tears the way his dad treats me and us. My hubs loves his dad and my hubs is POA. My hubs and I know he needs LTC but It isn’t going to happen in this house. My hubs just wants someone of authority to come in and just tell his dad you have no choice so a skilled nursing facility is where you are going. In our log book that we have been doing since July 2019 shows is his incompetency to care for himself and the lack of will to even put any effort in and how he is an endangerment to him self (all falls that have happened, all bowel accidents and lack of eating) but we can’t get the help to look and listen.

is there anywhere caregivers can get help.

thx
dumbfounded
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I guess ur living in your husbands father's house? Because if not (maybe even if) the next time he is hospitalized for 3 days or more, send him to rehab. Have him evaluated there for LTC. Then start the Medicaid process. We have one thread going where the OP (original poster) is doing this and so far its working. Tell them you know longer will care for him and he is not safe in his home. If u don't have POA, you may have to turn his care over to the State.

I agree, you need to step back and tell husband you can't do it anymore. His father, his job. You job is in jeopardy. If the home is his Dads, leave and contact APS and tell them there is a vulnerable adult. That your livelihood is now in jeopardy. If husband is not for this, then maybe its time to leave. It might be what is needed for husband "to see the light". This man is not old and should still be able to live on his own. My DH is 73.
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Reply to JoAnn29
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You need to let your husband deal with his dad. When you step back and make him deal with him, you will see change happen. How many times will he wipe a poopy behind when dad could have went to the toilet.

His is a manipulative old reprobate and you need to protect yourself, even if it costs you your marriage. This behavior is beyond, beyond acceptable.

Your husband's dad obviously has mental illness, people don't poop on themselves and think it is all good unless they have some serious mental issues.
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Reply to Isthisrealyreal
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