if you are POA can you give it up to the secondary POA without getting an attorney involved?

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my father recently had a tramatic surgery in which the first week he was under a lot of meds and could not do his own bills.The poa( my sister) took over for a few weeks and then she got sick and gave all the bills to my other sister who was on my dads paperwork as the secondary poa. she did not go to the attorney or anything and just started writing out his bills,even tho he can do his own and will not give his checkbook back to him even tho he has asked for it.He has not been deemed incompetent and is able to do them himself!!! I fear she is using up his $$ for her own expenses and that is why she will not give it up! She is also forging his name on the checks by only writing his name. HELP!

Answers 1 to 10 of 16
It sounds as if what your sister is doing is illegal if she is paying her own expenses under the POA. That is not the way a POA is suppose to work. Forging his name on checks is also illegal. You may want to contact an attorney.
We recently had this situation in my family and we had to wait for my mom to recognize the situation for herself and contact her attorney and have the POA changed. Sometimes, it's just a matter of the individual not knowing what the role of POA is ... they only step in when the individual is not able to attend to their affairs, such as when your dad was having surgery and recovering. Can someone tell her that dad wants to do it himself now and that POA does not allow for her to continue when he's not competent. Can you help dad set up automatic payments from his account which would eliminate the need for someone to be involved? My mom only has phone and cable but those are automatically paid from her checking account.
Where do you all live in relation to each other...near...far?

I'm assuming your father has told you that second sister will not return the checkbook? Why do you think she's paying her own bills with your dad's money? Has either the primary POA sister or yourself ask her to return the checkbook?

How do you know she's signing your father's name? She may not understand that she's supposed to sign her own name as his attorney-in-fact.

You have given some really slim information here. Do all three of you visit with and have open dialogue with your father? Why ELSE do you think your sister is doing this? Why does first POA sister I think 2nd POA sister is doing it? BTW, just because first POA sister gave materials to second POA sister while 1st was ill, that doesn't change the order on the POA document. 1st sister still has primary say so. Are YOU on the POA document as a third agent for your dad?

You say your father has not been deemed incompetent but do YOU suspect some type of impairment?

IF your father is of sound mind, he can change his POA at any time and he can also change the way his bank account function. You could take him to the bank to do this but the least confusing way as well as the most appropriate way would be for the first POA sister to also go so that there's no appearance of wrongdoing, manipulation or undue influence on your father. Is 1st POA sister well enough for a trip to the bank?

Please give more information in order to receive better ideas and suggestions.
We again have a situation where the POAs are not defined. The presumption here is that we are NOT discussing the health POA, since your question deals with financial matters. POA expire upon death (although there are some limited exceptions in the health POA that allow for Joyce is to be made regarding the disposition of the deceased).

That said, there are two fundamental types of general POA's (which usually cover business and other financial matters), regular and durable. The regular general POA can act now on behalf of the person but cannot act if the person becomes impaired. Within the durable general POA, there is the immediate type which allows the POA to perform the tasks that are outlined in the POA right away, and there is the type that ONLY takes effect IF or WHEN the person is found to be impaired and an able to handle their own affairs.

Personally, my preference is the immediate general durable POA because it gives you the ability to help the elder in the broadest circumstances. However, there isn't a POA in the world that is good enough for helping if you can't trust the agent.

Another question that comes up is, does your father have a trust? IF your sisters are operating as trustees, its a somewhat different matter. You would usually need a lawyer to change a trust but you don't necessarily need a lawyer to change the POA documents. Depends on if the lawyer wrote them in the first place, if they're complicated or if you use standard forms.
The appointment of Power of Attorney given only by the donor is a trusted position and should be carefully considered, requiring a Notary Public and an attorney ( sometimes the same person), as well as at least one witness. A relative may not be the best person for the job. The attorney who set up the POA should be informed that the Secondary has taken over. After that, it goes into another mode. Abusing this position of trust is a serious offense. It cannot be ignored, but you must have proof. Gathering proof and turning those docs over to the lawyer will be the next step. He also needs to know why this transfer was done.. Let him/her handle it from there.
If your father is of sound mind and is aware of what is going on, then he has the legal right to change his POA at any time. Get him the new forms and let him sign them then take them to a Notary Republic. This will supercede any prior POA papers that were made by for the day your father changes it. Good luck. I went thru this with my sister and the lawyers told her that the most recent papers are the ones that the law will enforce. She wasn't happy and unfortunately neither will your sister be. But this is all about protecting your father, Right!!!!!!!!
POA's require notarization, sometimes Witnesses also depending on your state, but do not require an attorney. We don't know if the original POA forms were done personally or by an attorney but it doesn't matter at this point. I wouldn't engage an attorney or THE attorney and incur additional costs if there is a simpler (meaning FREE) way to do it.

As queried before, IF the father is competent, HE is still in charge of his own choices. If not, and the POA is of the durable type, then it is the number one sister who has the right to make decisions. This matter can most probably be handled by the dad or the first Agent POA number 1 sister.
To answer your question, you do not need an attorney to change a power of attorney.
you can go to the attorney who dealt with the poa or the people who stamped the forms all receipts need to be kept failing to do so could elimate the poa
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Just a note- I have a POA signed and notarized here in CA. Signed prior to Moms Alzheimer's getting as bad as it is today. I do not have any kind of court certified docs. We caregivers are being ran through the wringer. I generally handle all her bills with online banking avoiding having to sign checks although I did get myself on her accts back when so I could sign. The thing I wanted to mention is to be very careful in what you may request or tell Social Security/Medicare if they get wind of incompetency they will start treating you like a criminal and require you or someone to be "representative payee". The catch twenty two is that they don't recognize POA's. I made an innocent call to them to verify address and now the dung has hit the fan. I am scrabbling for doctors letters and have no idea what they are going to require of me to prove all is on the up and up. Will try to post again after my meeting with them next week. BEST TO KEEP YOUR CARDS AS CLOSE TO YOUR VEST AS POSSIBLE IN ALL REGARDS. THESE BUREAUCRATS ARE RUTHLESS.

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