My mother has always been bad with money. Her and my Dad lived apart for over 40 years, but when he got sick, she took him in and took his money. My Dad has since passed and she retired. Her memory is getting sketchy and she's spending massive amounts of money on lotto. She now expects her children to supplement her spending if she runs out of money. She has not admitted to playing lotto. Claims she loses her money. Within a week she took out over $500 but didn't have $10 to purchase cat food. Her fridge is always empty. When questioned, she deflects the question by asking, why are you looking at my bank account. When I tell her to be mindful of what she spends her money on, she gets defensive. When her bank balance gets very low, she goes to the bank asking where her money went. She has accused me in the past of "stealing" her money. When I remind her that I supplement her social security so she has extra spending money, she tells me she'll pay me back (which of course she doesn't because she has no money). I do have an appointment with an Elder Care Lawyer. I made arrangements to have her social security deposited into an account she has no access to and will transfer spending money into her account. My question is, if I spoke with the store owner and requested that he doesn't take the $100 per day she is spending on lotto and he doesn't agree, is there something legally I can do to stop him from taking her money? My mother is 85 years old. Thank you.
I see you are in NYC, yes? Call 311 and find out what Agency is assigned to assist with elder affairs in mom's area. It may be Catholic Charities or Jewish Board of Famiky Services. It doesn't matter what religion you are--they have social workers who can help you with this.
Mom needs case management and a needs assessment. Start there.
She is going to have to be put on a very strict budget. All bills paid first including groceries and pet foods...everything she needs each month. I would put some in to emergency fund too. After all the bills are paid, dole out the remainder to spend how she chooses to spend it, I guess. Divide up leftover by days in the month and that's how she gets it so she doesn't burn through on day one.
If there's a chance she's going to need memory care or assisted living, does she have enough income to pay for facility care? If she really doesn't remember spending the money each day, that you give her money every month, etc the elder atty may be able to help you with guardianship so you can just take all the finances over before she breaks the bank.
If you were to ask this shop owner to halt your mother's purchases, that would mean that you are cutting into the man's revenue. Your mother needs help to curtail this stubborn habit. Discontinue enabling her habit.
It sounds like dementia to me.
Mother needs a MD diagnosis.
It really has nothing to do with the store owner (from my perspective).
The issue is how this woman gets the money to be spending it on gaming / gambling as she is. If she doesn't have it, she can't spend / waste it.
Are there other ways for her to meet these needs?
Has she lost sense of the dollar value? Become impulsive & addicted?
Finding out the reasons for her overspending & gambling may be useful, but as a protective measure right now, restricting harm will be a good start.
So chat to Mom..
Dissues how impulsive behaviour of spending all your money on 'fun stuff' on pay-day means there is nothing left for 'boring stuff' like bills & rent.
Discuss how spending too much has consequences.
Eg Electricity bill not paid?
Lights will go out.
See if she is willing to make new arrangements? To manage her money in a more responsible way.
Is there a POA already in place? If so it may be time to use it. POA takes over managing the bills, the big stuff & Mom gets a SMALL allowance to spend - on whatever.
Then she will still have some freedom but her bills gets paid.
Also, my part of the new arrangement would be to advice MY new rules;
1. You overspend - I do not lend. You go without.
2. If you cannot look after or feed your cat - I will take the cat away. No second chance.
I believe it has to do with her brain chemistry.
Dementia and logic do not work together.
It is, as you ask, a matter of who has the POA and who can legally make financial decisions on behalf of the mother, who cannot take care of her own health and welfare.
I'm sorry, I'm no help.
However, as someone pointed out. If her memory is bad enough for placement into a MC ward, she would NOT have the freedom to leave the ward to buy lotto tickets. However, she could use the time in MC to purchase goods on-line....which has its own set of issues....
He didn’t think twice about spending every cent that he had at the black jack table. After he died, she continued to gamble because as Burnt said, some people become addicted to gambling.
My friend is POA for her mom and set up two accounts with her mother’s money.
Her mother only has access to a limited amount of money. My friend will not be an enabler to her mother’s gambling addiction.
She has never given her mom any additional money because she knows that if she did her mother would run to the casino with it. My friend calls slot machines the crack cocaine of gambling.
Her mom complains but fortunately my friend allows her complaints to go in one ear and out of the other one.
I wouldn’t even bother speaking to the store about not selling her the tickets because it isn’t their responsibility to watch over other people’s spending habits.
Store owners are there to run their business. I doubt that they would be interested in being in the position of saying no to a sale and monitoring how people spend their money.
Stop giving your mom additional money. See an attorney if you want to. Only give her a certain amount of money for necessary purchases or buy needed items online for her.
Mind you. If your mother invents excuses to you and wriggles out of any suggestion that she is spending her money and more on gambling (which is, by the way, a serious addiction), why would she accept advice from the store owner? Don't expect heroic miracles of him.
Sheila - you are asking how to control someone else's behavior. The only person whose behavior you can change is yours.
You would be wise to follow the suggestions given by the posters here.
Package stores don't restrict an alcoholic from coming in and buying as much booze as he can pay for.
Convenience stores and gas stations don't refuse to sell cigarettes to a smoker because they have smoking-related illnesses.
Restaurants don't prohibit mobidly obese people from buying their food.
Businesses are in business to make money. It's not the store owner's job to stop some old fool from gambling away their rent money. This is the job of a POA or a conservator.
Your mother very likely has dementia. You did well to start having her SS deposited into an account that she cannot access. Your mother should have nowhere near $100 a day spending money unless she is a millionaire.
Please, whatever you do DO NOT give her a cent of your money to supplement her gambling addiction. That's ridiculous, and if you are giving her money you are her enabler.
Stop the candy man and discuss what type of information you will submit to the Elder Abuse Council (Office for the Aging) if the scam continues: https://aging.ny.gov/programs/elder-abuse
If she switches stores, have all her money redirected to her SS account and don't give her a debit card..............instead tell her you'll give her $20 per week allowance for being a good girl.
Get real
If you give her spending money from her own funds give her 5.00 a day to waste on the lottery. It's not up to you to buy her groceries etc when she is spending her money on crap.
And I am still sick of these selfish old people who do crap like this.
What is wrong
Not being able to manage entirely independent anymore does not mean a person is ready for memory care.
It often means they're ready for homecare and someone to manage their finances and big decisions.
Are your siblings also supplementing her SS income, or is it just you?
Why are you enabling her?
(And I don't think it's any shop owner's responsibility to rein in your mother's spending.)
Prayers
Get it straightened out with attorney, establish boundaries and stick to them, no gambling money, if need be order food for her online, have it delivered.
Best of luck!
At her age and she likely has dementia so she isn't going to get recovery from her gambling addiction.
She should be allowed a few lottery tickets a day and a POA has to be in charge of appropriating her funds.
Stop providing for her. Let natural consequences occur.
Are you the POA? If not it may be too late for Mom to confer that upon you. You may require guardianship to manage mom's finances if she is judged incompetent. I will tell you that doing this for an uncooperative senior can be a nightmare; it's hard enough when dealing with an organized and willing senior.
I think that you are going to learn a lot with your elder law attorney and hope you will come back HERE and tell us just WHAT you did learn. It would be a huge service to others, because you are not alone in this. I wish you good luck. Either mom is incompetent and needs a financial guardian, or she is not and will lose all her money pretty quickly. Only the laws can help now for her protection. Or not. I am so sorry you are going through this and I wish you the best of luck.
My main concern here is the fact that you're helping to supplement your mothers income with your own money. You do know that that's called enabling right?
I mean WTH are you thinking? If she spends all her money on the lotto and has no money left to buy food or pay her bills, well...that's on her not you.
I find it interesting that you feel the need to continue to bail her out. You do know that she'll never change as long as you continue to do that, at least I hope you do.
Let her suffer the consequences of her poor choices. It will only be then that things may turn around. But as long as you're there to pick up the pieces, things will never change.
If you can change her acct to a different one then u must be on her accts. SS does not recognize POAs. So now you can control how her money is spent. Don't close the old acct down till ur sure the new one is working.