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I moved in my father from North Carolina one year ago to Florida to live with me and my family. Before he left North Carolina he had already totaled his car. 11 days after he was here he and I went to the medical supplies store and I allowed him to drive my car in which he rear ended the same car six or seven times by pressing the break and the gas at the same time. He is convinced that he’s able to drive a car in an unfamiliar surroundings and he’s depressed and almost angry. He is Diagnosed with sundowners and has cognitive and physical impairments due to stroke. I am his primary caretaker I know for a fact that this man should not be behind the wheel. And one conversation that I had with him his response was people with no legs drive cars. So that right there told me that he is not thinking with a full deck so to speak. He has an impaired gait when he walks and uses a walker and mostly a wheelchair when we go out for errands etc..He Makes me feel like I am doing this on purpose to him. A man that can barely walk 20ft unassisted thinks he can drive a car. It’s almost like he’s mad at me that he doesn’t have a car but I wasn’t with him in North Carolina when he had two car accidents and then finally totaled the car. Out of that conversation I found him taking pictures off down the wall and had a little pile of his belongings together on the table and I said what is that for daddy? He says” I’m carrying that home with me”. So he was thinking of renting a U-Haul truck and rolling up at his old building in Raleigh North Carolina and they are just gonna let him in to a government assistant building as soon as he arrives there. So I had to explain to him that that is never going to happen from this point on and unfortunately this is where he is in his life right now. I also expressed to him how I’ve said that I was upset that he wanted to leave because I completely been over backwards for him. I take care of all of his needs from puréeing his food, his doctors appointments, all meals, shopping, phone calls, cutting his toenails, bathing him, every single thing that it takes to live in a daily life I do for him because I really want him to live his best life but he is making me feel that everything that I do is never good enough. I do all of these things with no thank you, good job daughter, or even a simple hug or I love you. Everyone warned me that I did not know what I was getting myself into when I decided to move my father and our home. We cleared out our master bedroom and he has the master bedroom and bath and a private outdoor entrance while my my husband and I are split up with my husband in the smallest bedroom of the house and me on the couch with my clothes hanging on a rack in the middle of the dining room. We’ve made great sacrifices for my father to live here and he seems he doesn’t appreciate anything. Instead he always talks about how terrible life is here and he wants to go back to North Carolina and doesn’t realize the sacrifices that we are making and how hard this is on us and the A+ caretaking treatment that he gets here. I’ve tried to explain to him to having a car comes along with responsibilities such as he could kill himself or kill others. He is not familiar with the area. He would have to pay for car insurance and repairs. What else can I tell him they will not I’ve said him so that he understands that her car is not any longer in his future? If he ever did obtain a car, which he can’t because he needs me to be the mouthpiece and do all the phone calls because he can’t do that himself, I would be the one carrying him to the car putting him in the car taking the repairs for the car I am not doing all of that I do enough already. It’s simply is not going to happen has anyone any advice on how to break it to him that he will never own or drive a car ever again? Believe me I wish that he was capable of having his own car. My husband and I are in our early 50s with kids. Busy

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"He is Diagnosed with sundowners and has cognitive and physical impairments due to stroke".

Strokes very a lot. You may kindly say he is now a 'stroke survivor'.

But you could also bluntly call it post-stroke brain damage.

We call it 'brain changes' in my family.

Stroke damage may cause lack of insight, reduction in reasoning skills, comprehension, judgement & emotional swings. All sorts of things you cannot 'see' but you have described here.

To me it seems he now needs a driver - not just for the car. He may need a 'life' driver, to manage every area of his life, including financial matters.

Is there a stroke foundation to have a chat to, find out more about stroke?

I think adapting to your Dad & looking at what he can still do will be important. But driving car won't be one of them.
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FlaSandwich Nov 2020
Thank you for your answer but it doesn’t really answer my question. This topic is a source of tension between he and I. As far as a driver, I am his driver and have never told him no. I’ve heard tips such as disconnect a battery I pull out a spark plug from the car but he totaled his last car and now wants to buy another car. In some ways it was a blessing in disguise. Besides if he had a car he’s a former mechanic so he would know how to repair it if he was physically able and had the brain to do it but he doesn’t understand that. He is extremely socially awkward, he is new to Florida knows no one and due to cover 19 it put the brakes on joining any type of senior citizen club in the neighborhood besides he isn’t interested in doing any of that either. He looks to me for his entertainment and caregiving. I sometimes don’t even know if he realizes that II am his daughter and not an employee.He says he feels like he’s in a different world when he’s driving a car. Cars were always his passion and now that’s taken away from him and now it’s up to me to fill that void somehow so I was just looking to see if anyone else has any experience with this topic
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PS if you become ready to stop running a nursing home for one with only one or two staff - please speak up!

Preferable before your DH quits.
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We are in a similar situation with FIL, except he still has a car. All of his issues have been near misses. And he blames us that he isn't driving, but even though he says he can drive just fine, I think deep down its all talk and he realizes he can't. For him it is all a facade, he would never in a million years admit to us that he knows he can't drive.
That being said, Florida is now his permanent residence. When does his North Carolina license expire? What are the requirements for him to obtain a Florida license? Could he potentially pass those tests? I'm not suggesting he NEEDS his license. Only that the testing process might rule out being licensed at all and you could get him a state ID while you are there. Maybe if an authority figure tells him he can't drive it might set in. Though even that is a slim chance. If he is like my FIL, COVID is the only reason he thinks we aren't letting him drive. He keeps saying, " when all of this is over I can't wait to go out again ", which just means we are going to have to fight the battle later. The bonus for us is that the longer he is home and without assistance to load his scooter on the lift, put his seatbelt on and a few other essentials, he really literally cannot even leave the house.
Are there obstacles, real or manufactured, that you can throw in his path. As in, don't help him obtain anything, don't clear any sort of path.
Is the way you are living sustainable? You are separated from your husband for the long term. Is him living with you permanently going to work for you?
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Sorry, I'll try to answer your question better.

The thing is it's not your fault he can no longer safely drive. The reason is the stroke. (Sadly, my Mother is still waiting for her stroke to 'go away' so she can walk again).

I suppose I would sympathize that giving up driving, something he loved, really sucks. As does old age & illness 🙁.

I think the real world consequences will keep him from actually driving - as you said, he couldn't buy a car without your help.

As for physically stopping him from driving your car - it will need to be always locked & keys kept in a secure place. Others on the forum have mentioned this specific issue - hopefully some will write in.

It's totally understandable he is upset. He has lost a lot. He will need to grieve.

I tell my Mother to blame getting old. I didn't do it to her & I sure can't fix it!
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As I read what you have written, I notice that you are really dealing with a whole lot more than just your father’s car.

Putting the issues with the car aside for just a moment, are you thinking of any alternative solutions for the way you and your family are living right now, or are you accepting your household arrangements as permanent?

You have described your dad as someone who is much more impaired globally than just from the effects of stroke damage.

He either can’t or won’t do typical self care activities, but either way, he isn’t caring for himself, and you are picking up the slack. If your whole family is onboard with this new arrangement, you may be able to continue it temporarily, while attempting to develop an alternative to being his sole caregiver.

In my own life, learning that someone you have loved and trusted since your birth is no longer able to be regarded as a self sufficient adult is THE HARDEST human experience that ever occurs in human interaction. From what you’ve written, it seems that you are at or approaching that place.

I want to be wrong by telling you this, but whether I am or not, please consider. He needs more help and a different environment than where he was before he came to you, or where he is now.

He is fortunate to have you as his loving ally.
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FlaSandwich Nov 2020
Hi Ann. Thank you for the kind words. Yes I guess you picked up on it that it’s a lot more than driving. In a perfect world I would love to be able for him to live in a facility amongst adults his own age etc. that was the original plan before he came down here to stay with us temporarily until we find him housing. But now I’m afraid that I have spoiled him and made him so comfortable here that now pushing him into assisted living wil further his declineSince he’s already unhappy.I thought this would be easier but I am been learning as I go and have found out that we can’t afford any type of housing for him anyways. So I guess for now my family my husband and I have to except this as permanent. I feel like my hands are tied and we have no other option . this is it.He received $1200 a month Social Security and complains that if he goes to a facility they’re going to take all of his money . He is very selfish about his money as if he has big plans to do with it, I like purchasing a vehicle. That’s never gonna happen. In my area it is at least $2000-$2500 a monthEven for a mediocre ALF. And he said he will not live anywhere unless he can park his car there and go and come as he pleases. But he doesn’t even have a car anymore because he totaled it. He still literally believes he is going to be buying a car and driving. Anyway it’s A sore subject. I will just have to continue wearing my chauffeur hat for as long as I can...thank you for your response, I really do Appreciate that someone out there is listening and gets it
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I am just going to deal with the car issue. (you have a LOT of other things going on as well)
Tell him in order for him to be able to get the car he has to get the following things.
1) a Doctor's WRITTEN approval that he can drive.
2) he needs to PASS a medically approved drivers program.
3) he needs to pass the written test at the DMV
4) he needs to pass the driving test at the DMV
5) he needs to be able to pay for the car as well as the insurance and the maintenance of the vehicle.
Now that you have this plan I doubt seriously that he would get the Doctor's WRITTEN approval.
I doubt that he would pass one of the medically approved driver's programs.
I doubt he would pass the written or drivers test at the DMV.
Almost anyone can get a car now so that is not the problem but paying for insurance and the upkeep on the car might be a problem particularly if he has had the accidents that you mention.

You might want to look for Assisted Living Communities that can provide him with transportation when he needs it. Will provide him with activities and people that he can do things with.
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graygrammie Nov 2020
I am wondering if he would even be approved for insurance on a vehicle. That could close the door right there.
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Being diagnosed with Sundowners? I don't understand. Sundowning is a symptom of dementia. Is he diagnosed with dementia; has he had a complete workup; would he DO a complete workup?
You have moved your Dad from his state to live with you in your home. For me, the car is the least of it for you with a very full plate of your own; but I DO understand your fear your Dad will injure himself or himself AND others. That has to be pretty terrifying.
I think I agree with every single word AnnReid said and I would only be repeating if I repeated it. I read your response as well, and understand the limited assets. I cannot help but think that all of this is progressing toward an unfortunate accident; that will at least lead, in all likelihood, to a formal diagnosis. It did for my brother. Then it will come down to what to do about that. The choices are either for Dad to be in your home, contributing to problems there in a worse and worse way, or to go into placement, which he may not do voluntarily.
You have such a lot on your plate. I would love to have some answers, but I just don't. I am so very sorry.
I believe you are dealing with a demented mind, so no, there will be no "thanks". In his mind he is moved from his home, there are folks telling him what to do with his life, and that will cause further resentment and acting out.
I hope there are others coming, wiser than I, who can help with some hints. I hope you will update us on your journey. You aren't alone in problems you have taken on, but you have more than the usual serving of them.
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"...Everyone warned me that I did not know what I was getting myself into when I decided to move my father and our home. We cleared out our master bedroom and he has the master bedroom and bath and a private outdoor entrance while my my husband and I are split up with my husband in the smallest bedroom of the house and me on the couch ..." Your father wanting to buy a new car is the least of your problems. Forget about your dad buying a car. Get busy looking for new housing arrangements for your father.
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Is your Dads Dementia noticeable? Because any reputable Dealer would not do business with him if he can see there is some cognitive decline. If Dad has been diagnoised with Dementia and your POA (hope u have one) is in effect he cannot sign any contracts.

Just humor him. He may not even realize that the average new car is 20k at least. Does he have a license, if so get a doctor to say he cannot drive, or better have him report Dad to DMV. If Dr gives you a note, take it to the DMV and ask that his license be changed to an ID.

When a person has Dementia, and for all you have to do for Dad I would say he has a Dementia of some sort, they have lost the ability to appreciate and show empathy. They get self-centered. There life is whatever goes flitting thru their brain. TV and dreams become part of their reality. They hallucinate. My Mom always had a little girl with her that disappeared when I showed up. Mom eventually thought I was her mother.

Everything you have written about Dad is someone who has a Dementia. Your Dads brain is dying little by little. If you haven't done it, Dad needs a good physical. Labs and a neurological work up to determine what type of Dementia he has and what meds may help him with anxiety.
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Your dad can’t drive. We don’t have to tell you that. You know it!

You’re not able to control his thoughts. No one can do that.

You sound very frustrated and the issue of driving is just a small portion of the situation. He can’t drive without owning a car. He won’t be driving your car.

Are you regretting that he moved in? You don’t have to continue this arrangement if it isn’t working out. Start touring facilities in your area in case you decide to place him in a place that has a staff to assist him.

Caregiving is a lot of work. Don’t feel badly if it’s too much for you to handle. Many people think that they can care for their parents and at some point discover it is too much for them to do on their own.
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Talk to his doctor and get his drivers license taken away.
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Have you thought about just backing off about the car for awhile? Let him save up money for a car.
Because, he will need a Florida license, and didn't he lose his NC license?
And you are not going to take him to get one, no need to announce it or inform him, incurring his wrath.

And buying a car, you are also not going to assist in any way, no need to tell him this.

No need to break it to him. It will slowly dawn on him, giving him time to accept it. When he cannot get a license. When he cannot buy a car on his own.

Take a break from stressing out, from being over responsible and overly accommodating. And it is not your job to "inform" him. Allow the DMV to do their job if and when it comes to that, so you won't be the bad guy and his jailer. Things are bad enough without borrowing trouble that is not here yet.
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I went through similar situation with my dad. Not playing with the full deck of cards, mostly jokers and wild cards, never knowing what his next argument was going to be. Alzheimer's is a very confusing disorder for many of us to understand, but you seem to realize the brain isn't working with all cells firing to make good judgement. No matter what you do and how hard you try, their memory is so short they make a new friend every 15 seconds (exaggeration) and that friend is the same person. Your father still lives in a time where he was able to drive. The more you do to sway your father against driving the more he will push your buttons, since you have children you should be able to relate. Let your dad save his money to buy a car, he has to be able to get to the dealership who will he turn to in order to get there? If he doesn't have a license he will not be able to get plates, insurance and other things necessary for driving a car. This will take the burden off you as h e will be rejected by official people and it won't be you. I did find that one of the hardest things for the elderly is not being able to have freedom that having a car does. Imagine this, you need or want to go to the store to purchase a candy, but have no car and must rely on someone to either buy it for you or take you. This isn't for a couple of weeks due to a surgical procedure, but if you have had any time in your life where your wheels are taken from you, you should understand. My dad thought that he could drive, he had advanced alzheimer's also, however, he was pulled over by the police they took his license, he and I went round and round about getting his license back. It was a futile experience. His doctor finally told me he had an idea, I was to tell my Dad that I would take him to the courthouse and go in front of a judge to ask for his license to be returned, but my Dad had to make the call to the courthouse, pay court fees, etc. Dad never made the call, he did try to drive our car, so we had to hide the keys. It is going to me a hard road, but, do your best to not talk about the car with your dad.
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I just re-read OP's backstory. I think it's a situation that comes up a lot & is a huge challenge for so many families. An elder knows they are not coping, they ask to come & stay then move in. But the reality is just not The Waltons happy family. (Who was it that mentioned that??)

Looking at the big picture here: Dad/Grandad moving in is working for HIM - but being honest - is it working for anyone else in the household?

If he is unable to arrange his own care, he will need someone to arrange it. This is often the adult children (whether POA, legal guardian or not). The adult child here has literally lost the bed she sleeps in to provide his care.

FlaSandwich, your needs & the needs of your DH & children are important too! IMO Dad needs care, but not at the expense of his decendants.

I do hope your Dad's medical team, your area of aging & other sources can offer real practical help.
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Your father is in denial about his driving abilities. And I get it. I do not look forward to the day I can no longer drive. That will be awful.

You are a good person for feeling his pain. But you seem to wonder whether he should have a car or to drive. Let me be clear: do not let him drive. It's sad but based on multiple accidents and physical impairment his driving days are over. You know he will kill himself or someone else on the road.

But I think you are asking about other things mostly. You talk about his and your anguish, pain and sadness. You talk about the difficulty to talk about the matter. Those things are not easy.

I do recommend honesty. Tell him he's done driving. Tell him it hurts to tell him that. Tell him you love him.

Do look into elderly transport service. Don't know if you have such in your area or whether it's affected by covid. But some semi independent mobility might be enjoyable.

You seem to be getting to resentment for care. Not feeling appreciated. Remember that he cared for you when you were a baby. You didn't thank him for changing your diaper 1000 times or feeding you with a spoon. Don't expect thanks and you won't feel resentful. That is as easy ... and as hard as that sounds.

Do take care of yourself. I think you should reclaim the master bedroom. Giving it to him a wonderful gesture but maybe too much. Consider your husband. Consider your sex life.

Can you get some help? In home care for bathing, nails... Anything to remove at least some burden.

If you can find harmony under the same roof then good for you. If not consider an apartment for dad. My dad lived in IL/AL that both he and I liked.

You sound so stressed out. I feel for you. Take a break. Find some space. Rearrange space and routines to make them livable. Good luck. You are a good person.
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MammaDrama Nov 2020
Oh no. No no no. Do not ever compare caring for a child to caring for an unruly adult with dementia. Not the same at all. It is completely normal to feel resentful about caring for an elder who does not or cannot express gratitude.
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Maybe he could use some male companionship! It would take the pressure off of you, increase his self-esteem in that area (what's more macho than a car, after all). This could take place in the form of phone calls. Also, maybe he can be assigned to do your car's maintenance, changing oil, washing/waxing, checking under the hood, etc. Even starting the car in the morning, but get one of those locks on it so it can't go anywhere. (e.g., steering wheel lock). Let him watch car videos and do a car paint-by-number. A car calendar. That part of his life enlivens his spirit. Also, maybe get a volunteer (from a senior center) to be his personal driver. These are a few examples of how he can keep cars in his life. Next, maybe the reason he wants to drive is so he can visit his friends and familiar surroundings in Florida. Can someone take him for a visit to Florida on a regular basis? Again, show him how to use google maps on the computer (google earth) to zoom in on where he lived; it's fun and will be a great stress reliever. Better than getting toenails clipped! Have a Florida party, a Florida room, etc. Somehow keep that connection with Florida.

My mom is 97 and was a concert violinist. So I've committed to keeping that element alive by getting out the violin and playing it (badly) myself. Once these important things disappear, part of their spirit disappears.
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jacobsonbob Nov 2020
Perhaps you could ask your mother to coach you as you play (if she is still capable)--this would be a genuine use of her knowledge and would help you play better. Making use of someone's expertise is a great way to make him/her feel connected and relevant.
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You are dealing with someone who cannot reason. Trying to reason with him just isn’t going to work and in fact it makes things worse. I found that with my mother when I argued with her and tried to explain to her why she couldn’t drive she got angry and dug her heels in. When I responded to her by saying “OK”, she relaxed and forgot about it quickly. Of course when I said ok I never meant I would buy her a car and let her drive. Wasn’t going to happen. Just the idea that she could do it calmed her down.
I was out with my mom driving through her hometown and she said she wanted to buy a house down by the river. And I said that’s a nice idea and we chatted about how nice that would be. And that was the end of that.
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disgustedtoo Nov 2020
Acknowledging their "reality" is something that we have to try to do. That doesn't mean complying with it, just go along with it as best you can.

Trying to explain isn't going to work for many reasons, primarily because in their mind they are fine. They will come up with all kinds of explanations and rationalizations, some of which can be very bizarre!

Arguing is even worse, as it builds tension in the relationship and will only lead to frustration and resentment, probably on both sides.

MammaDrama has given some good examples. Tailor them to your needs.
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I'm really sorry you are going through this issue with the driving. My husband, who has Alzheimer's, complains every day about "somebody" taking away his driving. Recently our doctor recommended that my husband have a driving evaluation by a Licensed Occupational Therapist. Their training will evaluate the person's ability to respond appropriately to stimuli around them, their physical ability and so much more even before they take a road test with the therapist. I have taken the steps to have my husband tested with the therapist but now he he is telling me he won't do it because he's afraid he'll fail. So the decision is now in his court. Believe me, it won't stop the complaining but may relieve you of any guilt about your decision to not let him drive. You can look up information about Occupational Therapist for a better idea of their training in this area.
Warning: insurance most likely will not cover the cost (around $350). However, if denied an appeal may get the coverage needed.
I hope this will help with another avenue to deal with this troublesome issue so many of us have.
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disgustedtoo Nov 2020
"... it won't stop the complaining but may relieve you of any guilt about your decision to not let him drive."

While it's easy to accept guilt and harder to let it roll off your back, anyone who is feeling guilty for whatever they feel they must do to keep everyone safe needs to work on rejecting the guilt. Guilt should only apply to those who have truly done something that deserves it!

On the flip side, if you give in to the guilt and let him drive, how much MORE guilt will you have to deal with if he injures or kills himself and/or others?

I was the catalyst behind talking mom's "wheels". I saw the need. Docs, etc were of NO help. I was able to enlist YB to help (he did the talking, he took the key, he disabled the car per my suggestion.) Of course I was the one to get ALL the flak, but I accepted NO GUILT, ZERO, NADA, ZILCH! It was a necessary move. You don't wait for someone to be at the edge of the cliff, about to fall, before you take action. Same situation. It was a matter of time before something awful would happen. So, why wait for someone else to step in or for the disaster to happen?

NO guilt.
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You are not going to be able to reason with your dad or convince him to do anything he doesn’t want to. It’s clear from your posts that he’s lost his executive reasoning ability.

your roles have reversed now. You’re the parent he’s the child. You can fib a little here and there, maybe redirect him on some things but lots of times the answer will have to be NO.

He’s angry right now living with you. He’ll be angry if he lives in assisted living. He’ll be angry if he moves to his old place. No fixing this.

You are young, busy and have kids. Your dad will likely live for many years. You really up to this?

I went through all this stuff with both parents. Moving them to assisted living and ending the driving were the toughest issues. They were mad at me before, during and after . (Up in heaven now, still mad)

Look into Medicaid. Don’t use your money. Get POA if dad is competent enough. Start looking at assisted living places near you. Lay some track.
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jacobsonbob Nov 2020
Will Medicaid pay for AL in Florida?
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the answer is "hide the keys and NEVER EVER let him drive anything again".......its that simple.  When he throws a fit, tell him he cannot drive, end of story.  with dementia there is no need to go into big explanations, just say NO.  And honestly it sounds like he should be in a NH where they can take care of him, etc.  You are going to wear out doing everything and it sounds almost like he needs 24/7 care which if it isn't now, it will be shortly and do you have the time/energy to do that.  Contact an elder attorney and get things rolling. check out NH (and yes they will take people right now, they are just put in a separate area for 2 weeks to quarantine due to virus) and if he has no money, find a place that will accept Medicaid.  But IF you continue to let him drive OR he finds the keys and does drive and causes an accident or kills someone.........you will feel terrible for the rest of your life.  Do HIM and YOU a favor.............never let him find the keys.  wishing you luck.
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Your dad’s dr should be able to assist. My fathers neurologist told my dad and reported it to dmv . It was the eye dr that informed my grandfather he no longer was capable of driving .
Also, rehabilitation facilities perform driver evaluations , it requires specialized training by an OT or Pt .
I am not familiar with what is available in your state .
kessler in NJ performs the driver evaluations .
wishing you the best of luck
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disgustedtoo Nov 2020
Many doctors don't want to get in the middle (we had that problem, along with the state DMV rules saying someone with dementia should self-report, BWAHAHAHA like that would ever happen!)

Even when doctor and/or DMV, or anyone else states the facts to those with dementia, many will either forget or just disregard and do what they want. Same with drunk drivers who have been suspended or revoked - too often they will drive anyway and potentially maim or kill others and/or themselves.

We had no doctor support (NOT for lack of trying.) YB did the talking to mom (I was there, but said nothing.) He took the key. On the way out, I suggested he disable it as I was sure she had a second key, so he pulled the battery cable.

Day 1 after the "chat": she calls ME and demands I bring the key back, it's her car and so forth. I told her I didn't touch her key. So, just overnight she forgot YB talked to her and took the key.

Day 2 - nastier call demanding I get down there right now and fix whatever I did to her car. So, clearly she found that other key and tried to drive!

Multiple times after that and after we took the car itself away, she would whine and beg to get her car back, assuring me she "doesn't go far." I was well aware that her "circle of comfort" for driving was very small, but as I told her, if you go 2 feet and hit someone, they could take everything you've worked for. End of subject.

She whined a bit now and then about us taking her "wheels" away, but eventually that morphed into it being the worst thing SHE did was to give up her "wheels" (as if it was HER idea!!!) Over time even that stopped.

So, sometimes we're on our own. We have no support from docs, DMV, even the police (too often they say they can't do anything until after the fact - I'm not about to wait to let that happen!)

Some will argue that the car is their property and we have no right. Sorry, but when my mother has dementia, hearing loss, macular degeneration and is also over 90, I will take the consequences of potential legal action over her injuring or killing herself and/or someone else. Given the accidents she did already have, along with the dementia, I don't see the legal profession having a lot to stand on. But, either way it played out, I would still choose taking the car (BTW, a nice, big behemoth Grand Marquis, 8cyl. Talk about a tank!)
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Please excuse if this sounds frivolous, but I wanted to add to what purna2go posted regarding to car-related recreational activities. Do you think your dd might be interested in those car racing video games? I'm not a gamer, but believe there are some setups that have actual little steering wheels. Others use joysticks I think. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/video-games-senior-citizen-video-gamers-growing-by-millions/

Of course this isn't going to resolve all the other issues attendant on bringing your father into your home. But if he's capable and interested in playing certain video games, it would a nice hobby for him going forward, and something he could continue to do if he were to end up going to an ALF. My brother in law is in a nursing home and they have wii bowling (and other games) for their residents and it's a big hit.
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It is a shame that some of elderly population continue to drive if they are incompetent. If the elderly are good drivers there shouldn’t be a problem with them being on the road.

Biologically we slow down with age so when a person starts driving 20 miles per hour on the interstate they need to stay off all highways!

There are exceptions to the common practice of the elderly driving slowly though. My 98 year old cousin gets speeding tickets and tells the cops that she shouldn’t receive a ticket. She has no dementia. She just has a lead foot!

Of course it is worse if dementia is involved but they don’t even have to have dementia and many are still incompetent drivers.

When I was a teenager my mother sent me to the store with my dad’s brother.

My uncle was driving up the exit ramp on the interstate. I was terrified at the thought of a high speed head on collision. All I could envision was my uncle and I driving in the wrong direction on the interstate!

I am sure that I wasn’t wearing a seatbelt and I was in the passenger seat. Seatbelt laws weren’t in effect then. We most likely would have been killed in a car crash.

Thank God there were no cars on the street behind us and I told my Uncle that he had to drive backwards down from the interstate exit.

We went to the store for my mom. As soon as I got home I told my mom that I was never going to go on another errand with my uncle ever again in my life!

Yes, anyone can be a bad driver at any age but I am in favor of the elderly population having to retest for their driver’s license annually. In my state a license last for six years!

I am so grateful that my parents graciously stopped driving. Daddy had a stroke and mom has Parkinson’s. No way could they continue driving.

Most of us know people that have been in horrible battles with their parents about driving. It’s a serious and difficult situation to be in.

Sure, I have empathy for the elderly that are losing their independence but I don’t ever want to be in a car with them or share the road with them. It is dangerous for all of us.

So anything and everything must be done to keep unsafe drivers of any age off of the road for our protection, as well as their safety.
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Sendhelp Nov 2020
Hi NHWM!
In my area, anyone going the speed limit is in trouble already.
I don't drive just before a full moon because the other drivers get crazier!

As we get older, and slow down, we may be good drivers but less able to do defensive maneuvers when a huge pickup truck is zooming up to your bumper and tries to run you off the road from the slow lane! And so many angry, aggressive drivers, it gets to me. I won't be driving voluntarily soon because it is just not worth it to risk my life going to the store for eggs.

Still, there are very few drivers that can meet the basic safety standards required to be on the road today, imo. And I am supposed to get in the car with them? I tried once to tell an uber driver to pull over and let me out. But he could not understand me, while talking on a cell phone, looking at a map, not speaking English, while passing my destination.

Still, I am not in favor of elderly drivers driving with diminished capacity.
Or anyone-such as while drunk.
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Can you distract your Dad? When he brings up driving, just say: "I am driving you today Dad, get ready". "We will sort this all out later".

Do you think he may qualify for senior housing, independent living, or government subsidized housing again? Maybe put him on some wait lists until you know more.
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Your biggest job is to remove yourself from daughter mode to caregiver mode. Take your room back. This is YOUR home...not his....HE needs to be placed in assisted living or a memory care facility. If he obtains a car then hide the keys and tell him he has lost them.... or dismantle the car so it doesn't start. You are not required to do anything to enable this man, so don't. Also...when the subject of the car comes up, change the subject...do not engage with him on the subject. You are the caregiver....you have to take charge and do what you know is the right thing to do. First and foremost....take your room back!! And start searching for a memory care facility. If you think you've got it bad now, you've no idea how bad it's going to get. Not to scare you but to warn you. Good luck!
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Your Dad has had enough accidents already.

You allowed him to drive and he rear-ended someone.

Maybe you could learn to speak with more authority once you make up your own mind about him not driving.

Not judging you, this is a very difficult situation for you. It's your Dad! He will still be your Dad after he can no longer drive.
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Is there really any chance he can actually get a car? Let alone drive it? If not, why worry? Why waste your breath trying to discuss a car that he won't get? Don't argue about it. If he wants a car, let HIM do the calling or whatever he thinks he needs. He's just unhappy with his life in general right now. Don't respond to his complaints. Give up expecting to get any gratitude from him. You've bent over backward for him. (I'm not saying to put him out, but can't you take your master bedroom back? It is YOUR house. This doesn't sound like a healthy situation for you and your husband!. Do what's best for YOU)
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My moms stroke is actually what made the whole “you can no longer drive” easier for us. I’m not sure when your dads stroke was but was he ever actually given the ok to drive by a doctor after he was released from the hospital? When Mom had her stroke and was released from the hospital part of the release orders said no driving...as they typically do when one is released after most hospital stays, hers however had no ending date. After some time and lots of PT, her permanent issues are all aphasia related so ST, she started talking about driving again and our response was ask the doctor, ask your speech therapist, it wasn’t up to us...everyone knew she should never drive again except her...she did bring it up with a doctor I think first who referred her to her speech and occupational therapist to set her up with a test they do for patients who have been impaired specifically for driving. I guess they are taken through cognitive reflex tests as well as actual driving, for Mom the real issue was her reaction time, her brain just didn’t fire that quickly and she knew it she was just hoping it would keep getting better. She never pursued the special testing and when she talked about just driving her car down to the store and short distances after moving back home we explained that since she hadn’t been given the specific medical OK to drive again if she were to do that and get into an accident (which can happen to anyone) the insurance company and any injured party could come after us, her children for allowing her to get behind the wheel. Point is her driving or not was out of our hands (even though we certainly expressed our concern to doctors of course and weren’t going to let it happen) we could commiserate with her and help make it easier by arranging transportation for her and driving her ourselves. We got her hooked up with several transportation options that lasted for a little while and gave her the option of independence even though she stopped using them after 6 mos or so.

I really think you need to remove yourself from responsibility for his not driving if you can, place the responsibility on doctors and the system, put yourself in the position of hero for helping rather than villain for telling him what he can and can’t do. This. Isn’t even help you learn how to take the drivers seat with Dad in general too. You always have to pick your battles and I am a strong advocate of remembering they are adults not children even if their brains make them act that way sometimes and deserve respect even when doing things necessary to care for them and keep them safe that they resist.

It doesn’t sound like he would actually be able to rent a Uhaul, pack himself up and go back to his old state/apartment without help, rather than fight with him about it what would happen if you just said “ok if that’s what you want to do I won’t stop you but I won’t help you either because I believe the doctors when they tell us this isn’t a safe plan for you”.

Its just as important to remember that you and your family are just as important and while it is of course your choice, it is not necessary to put your father ahead of the rest of the family to take good care of him. In fact giving him so much control over your family may be more harmful than helpful to him, it isn’t helping him come to terms with his health and life. Rather than focusing on how to maximize what he can do and maybe coming to terms with his limitations, appreciate the support he has you may be unwittingly enabling him to ignore his physical and cognitive limitations. Your house isn’t big enough for everyone and making him so comfortable that he never sees that is a pickle, he should be in the little bedroom and maybe not so comfortable that he has no reason to think about other living situations. I hope he is contributing financially to the household. I’m sure someone else has mentioned it but do you have all the legal paperwork in place, DPOA, MPOA, equivalent? Stay strong
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You already explained it to him. He doesn't get it. He never will. Give up explaining. Adult daycares are probably not open due to COVID-19, but is it possible to meet another family in the same situation that you are? Then you could do simple activities with them--drive in the country, trip to the mall, work in the yard, "organize" the garage. This could take his mind off the car issue. But it sounds like his care is more than you were expecting and you were not prepared. He is disabled, he has dementia, he has no awareness of his own limitations, he has no empathy for you or other people, and his personality is changing for the worse. He needs someone to mind him and respond to him every hour of every day. You must reevaluate if this is going to work for your family. Can you bring in paid help?
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Yikes, you need a caretakers group ... I don’t know about you but, I would be angry and a bit nasty if I was no longer able to do what I used to. There are so many thing I have learned from my caretakers meeting. First and foremost was that his brain is broken and no longer functions as it used to . That was a revelation to me . All the talking and explaining was not able to make an impact on him ..., The ability to process that info was gone . I have learned to FIB, a lot .. My feeling was if my man could not remember how to navigate the remote for the TV that he was no longer capable to drive . With his vehicle not being moved during the whole pandemic, we sold it , ( why pay insurance, registration , upkeep Etc, if it was not being used. )with the statement of when you are walking better and more stable on your feet we will shop for another one ( not going to happen .) I was getting quite resentful. Everything fell upon me to take care of. I did get a POA , he signed it and can make decisions for him and am on his bank accounts etc. I keep his credit card in my wallet but slip it into his when we go out. He misplaced it more times than I care to mention . He had used it while he was still driving to the tune I’d close to $50,000. I was able to recoup all but 7,000. I agree with most every thing he says even if not true because to argue is futile . It only frustrates me more. I think the second most important things I learned was to take care of my self . Easier said than done . He really is not much different than he was before his decline but my tolerance level really slipped. BUT, it is thru no fault of his own , his brain is broke.
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