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DofNPDmother Asked October 2019

How do you handle safety concerns for a parent with dementia (regularly experiencing delusions) who insists on going out on "dates"?

Mother continued to date her ex-husband (not our father) for 15 years after their divorce. The Ex is 68, mother is 91. After her first fall which occurred two years ago and resulted in a brain bleed, she began experiencing dementia. It has now escalated to severe dementia with delusions. During the past 2 years the Ex has taken her on overnight dates every weekend. (His motives are unclear) The delusions began about 2-3 months ago. They are now daily occurrences. The Ex has demonstrated poor common sense - he took her out (against our wishes) when she had a cold, kept her overnight without a suitcase (and no Depends), and then walked her in 90+ degree heat the next day. She came home wheezing and ended up with bronchitis. This is just one example; there are others.


The problem is that she is adamant about going out with him. I talked to him about her condition, laid down safety guidelines for him to follow (including no more overnights), and in response he says to her, "Did you know they gave me rules?" trying to get a rise out of her. Due to her mental state, she may request to do things that are not safe. He will say, "She asked me to." I asked her GP yesterday what I should do, but he didn't have any real advice. I plan on enforcing even stricter boundaries and wish I could end the visits altogether. But Mom will not forget about him. (Isn't it funny that they forget everything but what you want them to?) I thought that someone in this forum may have dealt with a similar situation and have some advice for us. We never liked him, he never liked us. We were adults when they married. He lived off her money and tried to sue her when they divorced but she had a prenup. I suspect that he thinks he can get money from her now. We have overheard her tell him, "Just make a list of everything you want." Thank you!

DofNPDmother Oct 2019
Thanks for all input. It helped to talk it out. My husband will call the Ex (better for both my brother and me) this weekend and let him know that their dating life has come to an end. It is for her safety and best interest. I have contacted Seniors helping Seniors to get extra help. It's time to move toward more appropriate activities. Bless you for your help, and sorry to repeat the question! Xx

Sendhelp Oct 2019
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JoAnn29 Oct 2019
I just read that ur POA. You can keep this ex from seeing Mom if you feel he is a danger to her well being. Run it by a lawyer. Tell him/her that the ex does not use common sense or take in consideration Moms Dementia or health. U maybe able to get a restraining order against him. As POA have u checked her bank accts? If not, I would. As POA and Mom being found incompetent it is now your job to take over. You need to protect her.

JoAnn29 Oct 2019
You need to find out if you were ever assigned POA. Start with the lawyer who drew up the paperwork.

Yes, is the answer to if the ex could get guardianship. But, I doubt if he can afford it or the Court would allow it. Guardianship overrides POA.

Looks like Mom is well off. You could file for guardianship and use Moms money. Then u definitely have control over the situation. You can keep the ex from seeing her. You can place her in a safer place eventually. Looks like from a previous post, its now over a year since u asked pretty much the same question. Mom is not getting better. You need to be able to get to her financials. You probably have no idea if she is giving him money or not.

I would also start thinking about ur brothers future. A POA would be wise for him. People with brain injuries eventually have somekind of Dementia. Does he work? Is he getting SSD or SSI? Medicaid for his health insurance? If he is doing OK now great, but he and you need to look ahead to the future. First, though, you have to concentrate on Mom and its time to be proactive.
DofNPDmother Oct 2019
@joann29 I made sure my brother would be taken care of years ago when he was first getting sober and I advised Mom to tell him he would inherit the apartment rentals if he remained clean. It was a great motivator. He does have SSI now too. Yes, she had her first brain bleed / fall / over 2 years ago now.
Katiekate Oct 2019
You asked this question back in September.....i guess you didn’t like the answers?
DofNPDmother Oct 2019
Wow, you are right. I was so stressed that I asked the question and forgot to read the answers, and they are good! Thanks for the reminder.
Rainmom Oct 2019
You have mentioned a trust - who is the trustee(s)? POA and trustee are not the same thing and can be different people.

Out of curiosity, how long were they
married and what was the reason for the divorce?
DofNPDmother Oct 2019
@rainmom I am the co-trustee with my mother although now she has been declared incompetent. They were married for about 13 years. The reason for the divorce was primarily because my brother was getting clean from meth and needed unfettered access to call her and come over to her house for support. The ex hated my brother and would not allow this. It's complicated. My brother sustained a traumatic brain injury at age 19. He had a frontal lobe injury. He has a personality disorder as well. He is a difficult person. But it wasn't until a new psychiatrist looked at his old brain injury pictures and records that we were all told that this injury had caused permanent effects for which he was self-medicating with meth. Just finding this out gave my brother the confidence to quit all drugs and alcohol completely. Mom chose my brother over the Ex. It's been about 15 years since their divorce. They had a prenup but he tried to sue her for her assets at that time anyway but did not get them. Mom started seeing him again about 2 years after the divorce simply because she liked having a companion to go out with.
DofNPDmother Oct 2019
@surprise I am not familiar with guardianship. If, in Mom's trust, she has appointed me in charge of health and financial decisions when she has been declared incompetent (which she has), would it still be possible for the Ex to take us to court for guardianship? By the way, she established the trust AFTER she divorced him, so he doesn't know about it. I can't imagine that HE wants 24/7 care of her. He has only ever taken her out once a week on "dates". Maybe I can read more information about guardianship. You are right, I should consult the attorney no matter the cost. Even though it is "her" money that I am spending, our family has all been brought up to be very thrifty, so we have the tendency to conserve rather than spend. :)

surprise Oct 2019
I'm guessing he has a will that he had her sign and backdate and he's trying to speed up her passing. I really would invest in a chat with your elder attorney, paid for with mother's trust since this is really a question about protecting her assets (You do know that the previous atty expense should be paid from her funds since it related to her care.).

The attorney should be better able to give you advice about how to protect your mother. Consider the risks that he has taken with her already! You'll have to ask the attorney about the actual law there, your responsibilities, and criminal prosecution of any elder abuse that might occur.

On the other hand, you might chose to obtain guardianship. This would prevent the ex from receiving guardianship (which he also might be planning). You would have many more responsibilities but would be allowed to control her coming and going.

DofNPDmother Oct 2019
@Geaton777 My brother lives full time with my mother. I am 20 minutes away. I am currently looking for an additional companion/aide. I guess I could ask the estate attorney about my legal rights. When I gave the attorney the letter of incompetence from Mom's doctor, he charged $150 for "emails regarding letter of incompetence." So I have avoided reaching out to him due to the cost. I will keep a journal, thank you for that suggestion. We are now thinking of telling the Ex that due to Mom's mental incompetence and health concerns, we don't feel comfortable letting her go anywhere with anyone other than family. I do have a bit of a suspicion that he will try to pull something to get back at us - just don't know what that would be.

Geaton777 Oct 2019
Does your mom live by herself? If so, is there any way to take her into your protection temporarily? The problem with PoA is that the ex may get her to change it. Guardianship is a legal process which may be expensive, time-consuming and lengthy and the ex may decide to jump into that fray and the courts may decide it will have guardianship. Maybe a restraining order? Are there notes in your mom's medical history that indicate her compromised state? Start keeping a journal and write down every incident where he seemed to mistreat her or ignore her medical/physical needs. Then I would spend the money and consult an experience elder law attorney. The ex seems either completely stupid and a danger to your mother, or sinister. Good luck!

lealonnie1 Oct 2019
Since your mother is suffering from extreme dementia with delusions, is there any way you can get guardianship/POA for her? If so, you can THEN prevent her from seeing the ex husband who is obviously after her money. If not, I don't see any way that you can prevent this 'relationship' from continuing, nor can you enforce any rules you set down for her safety. What are the consequences to HIM if he does not obey your rules? He knows nothing will happen to him, so he'll go along his merry way, doing what he wants, when he wants, with no regard to anyone but himself.

It's disgusting how low some people will stoop in pursuit of the almighty dollar, isn't it? I wish you good luck and Gospeed trying to protect your dear mom from her ex husband.
DofNPDmother Oct 2019
@Lealonnie1 Yes, she does have a trust and I am the POA, and her doctor has written a letter of incompetence. The real problem lies with the fact that my mother still wants to go out with him and we don't think he uses good judgement. He undoubtedly thinks he is going to get her money (he stated so directly to my brother), but he won't.

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