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It has a death insurance policy on it and I have already paid $16,000. He died intestate and I am his only beneficiary, will the bank return the money after I transfer the deed?


I also paid his credit card for $5000.00. I feel very stupid as his Dad 97 yrs old died four weeks ago.


I was quietly informed by the bank that there is a death insurance policy on it but I was just paying it down cause I won it and don't want the bank to forclose, perhaps the probate will clear things up.

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I'd get a legal consult with an attorney who specializes in such matters. With so much at stake, I'd get competent legal advice immediately.
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Athena - it’s good that “you are happy to have the finances to share” as you will need to draw on them to deal with all this. The atty will have to deal with your brothers situation. And if your state views lineal as all relatives, then you and your dad ( and anyone else who can crawl out from your brothers past with standing as a heir) will be heirs.

Yeah, dad has now died. But he outlived his son so IF he’s considered a lineal heir by how your state determines lineal heirs then he will have an Estate. Your dads Estate will have inherited his share of your brothers (his son) estate which includes that heloc’d House and whatever else are assets of the Estate of your brother. So likely probate in some way is going to be need to be done for your dads estate as well.

Brother died first, so his estate determined first with that distribution done. Then dads done afterwards as his Estate determined by what the distribution to dead dad from dead brothers estate. The same atty does both if at all possible. Btw lineal usually requires postings in newspapers of wherever he had property or lived for significant period of time to call out for any heirs to come forward. Doing this takes time.

Did you father have a will?
Or did he too die intestate?
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Mom and Dad had a will with only their house owned no debt..willed to Brother,who has died and Daughter me who is only heir..no wives,children..
will was done fifty years ago.
Brother died intestate and I have been paying down his Heloc for a house
that I have inherited but am not Executor yet...so I hope the Bank honors the death rider on the heloc and returns my 16,000 that I paid for the past six mos. reason being DAD was in a NH and I was too busy with him and recov. from sudden death of brother to start probate he only had a house with a HELOC OWED FOR 18,000 WHEN he died...so I paid on it..did nto even consider there was a Insurance rider for death on it, did not know about this..i also paid his 5000 credit card.
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If there is a policy than use it. It will pay off the balance. I don't understand why you are waiting. You need to ask the bank these questions.
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igloo572 Oct 2018
JoAnn - if Athena doesnt have some document showing authorized legal standing, the bank probably cannot do squat. Everybody now seems to go the extreme in ordered to give any info out or address changes to an account or loan. When my mom died I got like dz+ Letters Testamentary originals and I have like 3 left. Even to get garbage cans switched to the smallest minimum required size I had to turn in a document showing my “authority”. Athena imo is going to have to get an atty to start the intestate death & heirship process to get thru his dying intestate. My guess is 5k upfront to secure probate atty to represent just her interests & probably another 2-5 or more to get through the PC court docket to the distribution point assuming no other heirs or debts against the estate or messy encumbrance the property. What I’ve found amazing consistently is that folks somehow believe that after death of the owner property taxes are suspended till it sells or probate clears...... meanwhile assessor can place interest at 18%-30% per mo. It adds up fast and has to be zero to transfer.
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So your out 21large on things you do not own, imo shell out another 5k+ to get an experience probate atty who does intestate work.

A “death” rider usually means if borrower dies then balance of the loan is paid to the lender by the life insurance tied to that specific loan. And a release of the lending agreement &/or title is issued to “Estate of” or the corporate name if $ borrowed by an Inc, LLC. The insurance premium is included in the overall lending & probably was a separate line item in the heloc paperwork. That insurance policy should have paid the 16k balance off.

Usually someone - like Executor or atty - certified mails a current payment due with an original death certificate and it starts the cancellation / release process. Then lender then gets $ from insurers & then should have provided an Release of Deed of Trust type of document with the original Heloc with a cancelled stamp on it to Executor or atty. The Release document, the Executor or atty, should have filed at courthouse as it gets attached to the chain of documents onto the PPIN of the house. To ever sell or transfer the house, anything that had the property as securitization (Mortgage, heloc) has to have a release filed at the courthouse.

Was lender notified in writing of death with death certificate?

& what are you doing abt the intestate status?
You can’t just automatically be a beneficiary or a heir. You have to have “standing” to legally become that. Intestate means usually all assets escheat to the state so state in control of as theres nobody with legal standing to be heirs. You need to speak with an atty to find out exactly what your states requirements for intestate are. My guess is you’ll have to get a probate atty who does “Lineal Heirships” or whatever those are called in your state to establish that you are heir. Lineal - like all things probate - is not a DIY as it’s very timeline document driven; and if brother had other heirs or children even from long ago marriage or relationship, or an old will surfaces, those are entered into the process. The state may petition for an outside or dependent administrator for oversight, and the judge will grant that and it will mean increased time and costs. You should ckearly speak with your attorney as to how overarching your state is for intestate assets.

You can’t be all maybe manana on this as most states have a set period of time in which probate or heirship has to be filed.
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Thanks......Im happy to have had the finances to help..who knows when tragedy will strike as my brother was only 69 years old...thinking he would outlive his Father 97 who he was caretaking for years...and living only on soc and rental
from his home...….as well as Dad who did not have any assets...…….just his social and aid and attendance given to him at 95 yers old...………..
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Bloody hell.

I agree with CW that you need to get professional advice. If you look for 'citizens' advice' or something like that in your area, you might well find experienced independent people who will go through the information with you and help you decide what to do. Be very wary, and do not get caught out by people who offer one free session and then trap you into paying fees for their services. Make sure you are talking to genuine 'pro bono' counsellors.

What worries me is that a life insurance policy taken out as part of a loan agreement is supposed to clear the outstanding debt if the debtor dies - that's the whole point of it, that's what it's for. So your brother's insurance should have cleared the equity release loan, and you shouldn't have paid a bean. If the same financial services company provided both the loan and the life insurance policy, they want taking out and spanking - but all the same it could be cock-up rather than conspiracy...

The fact that you have quietly gone on and on making repayments, and the mortgage provider has let you, makes me very concerned - so, absolutely, DO get professional advice.

Paying his credit card debt - if your brother's estate was large enough, it was correct for this debt to be paid - but by him, not by you. I hope you will be able to reclaim this money from your brother's estate once you have everything sorted out. Good luck, and please let us know you're getting on.

PS Just one thought: did you or anyone else tell the equity release provider that your brother had died?
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Thank you, and I waited as brothers father was going into nursing home
As brother was his caretaker for ten years...no excuse but clerk did say transfer of deed was no big deal...no heirs,no wife or children,but I simply kept paying on heloc as I was only heir,and yes they had death cert. Feb 8
As I paid credit CD. And had to do a poa for dad switching acts from brother to me his sister.
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I think you need to sit down with someone who understands your questions - a lawyer, CPA or financial planner. You don't want to pay for debts that you don't owe - especially since it isn't clear that there is anything left to inherit.
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Thankyou so much to all, I delayed the probate as brother predeceased Father who was next in line, so now I have
contacted a lawyer to file the probate, since iwas the only heir I did not understand that the system requires notation
proven, of who Iam...meanwhile I did use my retirement
as I knew there were no cash assets...so I helped my family also with funerals, etc. and filling paperwork for the NH
for Dad until he passed five mos later. so the bill paying was not to avoid a lawyer as I had contacted the clerk of the court...earlier...…..meanwhile im curious as to the ending..there was no paperwork of death insurance on the heloc...I did not even think of it...…..as well as paying credit card which was as a joint account..so I figured I would pay for that while I was being delayed with the POA,
elder law firm this took four weeks..for DNR,poa...I also paid first mortgage off of nine hundred and did not ask for death on that loan. Iam learning what lawyers do.
I used my funds for my brothers funeral.....in shock at the time……..I have to tell current lawyer that I have been contributing for six years to the family.
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