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Long story short, my fiancé has been dealt a tough card of being the caregiver of a 97 year old, a mentally ill father in his 60's, as well as an uncle who also requires assistance. All three live together, his father and grandmother recently came home from the hospital after a 3 week stay (diabetes and major mental health issues for his father). His grandmother refuses to go to a nursing home yet she is extremely weak and requires complete care, but she is cognitively there--just very emotionally fragile. Hard to imagine but she constantly orders her son and my fiancé around. She then cries and my fiancé feels so bad that he gives in to whatever she wants/needs.



My fiancé is completely burnt out. ..took over 3 weeks off work (unpaid) to go to the hospital several times a day, deal with doctors, etc as he was dealing with multiple crisis situations at once with his dad and grandmother. He also had to check on his uncle (who was now alone, doesn't drive, and needs assistance) several times a day during all of this. I was away traveling for work at the start of all of this and he had to also come back to care for his 14 year old dog.



We live together about 30 minutes away. I am a single mom with two little kids and no family nearby and a professional career with lots of travel and heavy work responsibility. I also drive over an hour to and from work on the daily basis and have to cart my kids all over the state for travel sporting events. (just trying to paint the picture here of the situation).



I feel extremely guilty for being very resentful of my fiancé's situation. The situation has become progressively worse. He continues to say he is trying to get it under control so he can live his life, be more available for our family and my kids, stabilize the situation and go back to work, yet I don't see enough forward movement. (hiring more caregivers, etc). I progressively warned him that he shouldn't have them come home without all the help in place since it's unsafe for his gram to be home without people all the time, as well as making sure the house was in his name and not theirs---since there is a chance of a nursing home stay in the near future. She was in a rehab facility but kept demanding to go home, he gave in. Nothing has happened---he continues to drag his feet and do it all.... I'm very afraid he's going to start having major health issues himself from all of this.



I feel so bad for him but also resentful which makes me feel horrible. I feel like his family isn't thinking of him with all of this (him taking off work and then ends up falling on me to pick up the financial slack) and then I get the "who wouldn't help their family" from him and then I feel like such a horrible person.



My issue is that I feel like there's no end in sight and that me and my kids are the casualties with all of this. But maybe I am not being empathetic enough. I truly wish I was able to assist more to take the burden off him, yet my own schedule and life is barely do-able if that makes sense. I have to hire my own help here (cleaning person, etc) due to my crazy schedule and my Childrens crazy schedules.



How can I lessen the burden on all of us?? I am about ready to tell him to go move in with them and maybe we should take a break while everything is figured out. Yet he is insistent that he doesn't want to live there.



I'll add this in, we got engaged a year ago and right after that was when things seemed to go downhill with his family. We haven't been able to plan for our own future, plan a wedding or do anything because of having to worry about the next crisis. I am 39 (he's 48) and this all feels very overwhelming--I think for both of us.



I also want to say I feel for all of you that are caregivers. This situation has made me want to strongly plan for my own future so that my children aren't stuck picking up the pieces if I get ill.

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Go with your gut. This will not get better. His parents are already having health problems. He cannot take care of 4 people. Those people have to find their own solutions. I would not marry into this circus.
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He should take them all to the ER, tell them it's unsafe to discharge them to their home, and refuse to take them home if the hospital tries to get him to pick them up. The hospital will find placement for each of them.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
He just did this...dad went to the ER and was in hospital for 3 weeks...they tried to find him a rehab facility for 1.5 weeks and still nothing so finally discharged him and told fiancé he had no choice but to pick him up...

Grandmom went from hospital to rehab facility and then was discharged as well.

so if they both went to the ER again it would be starting that same process all over.
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So, it sounds like this is a complex caregiving situation.

What resources has he involved in helping his family find care? Being a caregiver doesn't necessarily involve being on site and doing hands on care, nor should it prevent you from earning your living, saving for retirement and having loving relationships with others.

If any or all of those things obtain when you are caregiving, you need help.

For starts, he needs to call the local Area Agency on Aging and get his family members "needs assessments" so that he has a good idea of what they ACTUALLY need and not just continue to put out fires. Experienced Social Workers and RNs who work at these community agencies can see the big picture in a way that most family members cannot.

They can also identify resources (aside from your fiance) that can help with caregiving.

Does anyone have POA and Health Care proxies for these folks?

Some folks see themselves as superheros and like to ride in on a white stallion in the midst of an emergency. Then they get stuck in the trenches and their lives go down the drain because of caregiving.

Grandma should have gone to rehab, not returned home weak and disabled. Is she getting home therapy? Can that be arranged?

We have a poster here named Beatty who says "there will be no plan if YOU are the plan".

If gma is in her "right mind", Fiance needs to ask her what her plan is when he returns to work. He's done his share.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thank you! Yes the situation is very complex. Fiancé feels he has been thrown into it because there is no one else left to help. He's basically been doing hands on care, and putting out fires as well as talking to so many doctors on the phone. I will advise him on calling the local area on aging for more help and assistance. He has the POA for them. He def seems to have hero syndrome, and feels if he isn't doing it then he gave up. I agree its completely unsustainable and counterproductive.
Grandmom went to rehab but complained and complained so he brought her home. She is receiving physical therapy at home now though. She is in her right mind, but her answer is "let me just die at home" with no real plan in place of caregiving and it all falls on him. This is why I am resentful and feel it isn't fair. She is of such sound mind she is able to pay her own bills, keep track of doctors appointments, etc even at 97...just extremely physically weak and very emotional (constantly crying). Its a terrible situation.
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"because there is no one else left to help."

Yes, there IS other help available, but gma won't accept it and he accedes to her demands.

As long as he isn't willing to have a "I can't do this anymore, gma" conversation (HARDEST convo I EVER had with my mom; she was in her "right mind" but had had a small stroke and didn't get that I would lose my job if I had to keep running away from work in order to put out fires), he is doomed to lose his life to her F.O.G.--Fear, Obligation and Guilt. Look it up.

I would not attach myself to someone who can't see that he has some hard choices to make in favor of his continued existence.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
He seems to be having more "I can't do this anymore" convos with her but she's not hearing it..and he ends up going there and doing more for them. He's not strong enough to not give in to her demands. She cries and he just feels really bad for her and then I feel I get blamed somehow. I will look up that FOG...
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Happy, so nothing has changed in a year for the better?

If he is depending on you to take care of everything, pay all the bills and he does whatever he "feels" he needs to for his family, I think you have your answer. He doesn't see you and your children as his family. For me? I am not a sugar mommy, hit the road and go take care of your family so I am not being sucked dry emotionally, mentally or financially.

At 48 if he doesn't have the mental fortitude to say no, he will never be able to.

Grandma wants to die at home? Fine, this is what that will take granny, home help, not me.

Daddy's always having mental breaks? Stay on your meds or be committed to get stabilized and placed in an appropriate facility.

Uncle? What help specifically does he need? Find someone, not me.

There's a saying, Crap always runs down hill. There's a reason you feel like you are at the bottom of his list.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Your response of "he doesn't see you or your kids as his family" is what I've said to him as well. If he did, I don't think he would place us at the bottom of the priority list. As far as his gma...theyve gotten some home help but not 24/7 and seems to not be too great (home health didn't even know yesterday that hospital didn't send home the right prescription or look into her meds situation; fiancé was scrambling to deal w that mess); they did something with his dads meds to adjust ( a shot of meds that can't be missed)...thank you. For some reason I still feel a level of guilt that just may be my own issues though.
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Your fiance needs to understand that there is a huge difference between giving people what they need and giving them what they want.
His grandmother can't be allowed to call the shots here. Neither can his father and uncle.
Your fiance cannot provide the level of care these three people need. No one person would be able to. I've been an in-home caregiver for almost 25 years and I couldn't handle your fiance's situation on my own.
He is not the only one left to help. He has choices. Homecare is a choice. Nursing home placement for grandmother is also a possibility.
Have a talk with him. The 'who wouldn't help their family' mentality he has is likely based on a good many years of guilting. It's not helping his family if he drives himself into the ground trying to do for them. What good will it do for him to enslave himself to them?
He can help them by arranging for them to be cared for. He does not have to do it himself. If these family members refuse to accept the help you and him can offer, screw them and walk away. Good luck.
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When your loved one is in the hospital, there is never "no choice" not to pick them up.

"No, I can't possibly do that."

"I'm out of town."

"If they are competent to be discharged on their own, send them home in a cab. And then I'll call the local TV station and my state representative. We can BOTH play this game."

"Find a rehab that will take him. I don't care WHERE it is."

Just a few suggestions of how to play hardball with the discharge planners at hospitals. Make them do their job.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thanks....my fiancé would never do this to his family EVER. I wish he would have boundaries with them....it just won't happen. This is why he is in the situation he is in IMO.
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What is the financial situation of these folks?

It sounds like they need to hire a geriatric care manager to manage this complex situation.

I have a cousin; at one point, she and her husband (both working full time but with no kids still at home) were managing 6 elderly adults. One lived with them; they had 24/7 care for her and their adult children stepped in as well. Two (my aunt and uncle) were in their own home, also with round the clock care. 3 were elderly spinster aunts who were in Assisted Living.

Believe me, this was exhausting just doing the managing. Tell Fiance to take a huge step back, make sure these folks are in care and MAYBE he can manage the "big picture" stuff.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
The financial situation isn't the best. Her grandmother has a little in savings (not too much), a home she owns outright and a life insurance policy.

Dad and Uncle both are on disability (and have been since they were in their mid 40s). Both dad, uncle and gma live in the one house but all require care to some extent.

When dad is mentally well, he is functional and can care for the other two. When he is unwell he can be so severe that he barely knows his name.

Fiance isnt in any financial position to care for any of them at this time.
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If your partner can't implement some boundaries, you will need to. This situation could go on for years or even decades as his Dad is relatively young.

You will have no future if this situation remains as it is. This should be a time when you are spending time as a family, nurturing your own children, and securing your own financial future.

He is letting his family dictate how you both will live your life and impact your own kids and future.

The only option is to stop. Regardless of what they think, they need paid care or to be in a facility. If he can't make this happen, I would take a break as this could be your long-term future.
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You say he has PoA... for all 3 of them? If so, this is an unsustainable amount of work/responsibility for someone who isn't retired. I realize he had no idea of this when he agreed to it but it is the current reality. I have PoA for 3 people (92, 100, 102) and pray daily they all don't fall to pieces at the same time. Please confirm for whom he has PoA.

Your fiancee has options but he is frozen in place by how he thinks different solutions will be received by his charges, by what others will think of him, and his own personal prison of Fear, Obligation and Guilt.

He doesn't know/wish to create healthy boundaries because he has a dysfunctional co-dependent relationship with these relatives. He's been in it all his life.

Options for him can include (but no limited to):
- resigning PoA for his uncle (you don't give a lot of details like age or conditiion of this person and why he needs a caregiver so it is difficult to come up with viable suggestions since he also lives in the same house).

- moving Gramma to a good facility for her own good. If she's crying "all the time" this can be a symptom of dementia. As her PoA, your fiancee should take her in for a cognitive/memory test so that his PoA is active and then he calls the shots. She needs medication that would address the crying and anxiety.

- regarding his father... is he schizophrenic? Depressed? Bipolar? What's his issue that he can't be responsible for his own life? He could maybe be transitioned into a group home setting and have a case worker involved.

- Your fiancee could resign all of his PoAs and call APS to report all of them as vulnerable adults and let the county acquire guadianship of all of them. They will be managed by the guardian and he can continue having a family relationship with them and none of the baggage. It won't be an easy or nice process and may take a while. But it is still an option.

Not including hands-on care, just managing the finances and medical stuff for 3 people is way too much work. It is absolutely unrealistic and unsustainable for someone who is not retired.

So, he has some decisions to make and actions to take if he values his own life and a future with you and yours.

You and your family are not a priority, and may never be, if he doesn't make significant changes. It doesn't matter what he says -- it matter what he does to show you're #1 in his life.

He isn't responsible for their happiness. He can't fix them. He shouldn't be their only solution/enabler. They are adults who had their entire lives to figure out their care but instead chose to "assume" him into a life of relentless servitude -- and they obviously don't care how it wrecks him. You need to put up boundaries and stop being his only solution/enabler. I know what I'd do if I were you. May you receive much clarity, wisdom, courage and peace in your heart.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
He has POA for Dad and GMA, not sure about his uncle but if dad is unable it would definitely be him. Dad and Uncle are twins in their late 60's. Uncle is unable to drive and has a lot of medical appointments.

Dad has a diagnosis of manic depression and very impulsive. If he's fine he can take care of the basics...grocery shopping etc. But he is very unstable. When he was recently in the hospital fiancé had POA due to his father not even knowing who he was/where he was for almost a week. He snapped out of this delirium, yet its unknown when/if this will happen again and if he will need further care outside of the home.

The only positive regarding the finances of all three is that they all live together and basically one unit. His dad has been the one to drive gma and uncle to the appointments. The problem is if/when dad is unable to drive and continue to do this. Dad also can not manage doctors, etc so fiancé has to be the one to speak with the medical professionals.

The way that fiancé sees it, he has no other choice but to care for them. He sees it as me being selfish that I don't understand this. He also said "if I were your family you would do the same". I said I do the same...yet its for my kids... and wish that he would view my children in the same way (if that makes sense).
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Happy,

Your fiance can have the 'I can't do this anymore' conversation with grandma to kingdom come. She will simply ignore him and will continue to ignore the conversation as long as he remains her care plan and the solution to the family's caregiving needs.
If he stops being at her beck and call and stops asking 'how high?' every time she says jump, at some point grandma is going to get the message that her grandson meant it when he said he couldn't do it anymore.
Your man needs to leave grandma, father, and uncle to their own devices for a while. I guarantee if he gives it a few weeks they will suddenly become very reasonable to whatever care plans he suggests.
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sp19690 Apr 2022
He already made his choice. He chose the old people over her and said she was a selfish person for wanting to put him, her and her kids first. She really should dump him and move on.
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Hi! You might have a different opinion of marriage. This is just my opinion:

One knows that when one decides to marry, one is marrying into his/her family. 

The rest is luck:
In how many years will MIL and FIL need help. Elderly family members? Every couple that gets married, knows this will be a topic.

The more you love the person, the more you’ll try to make it work - no matter what.

Married couples go through all sorts of stuff. Weak bonds break. You’re not married yet.

Life maybe threw this as a test. How much do you love him? How much are you willing to keep looking for solutions, together with him? Or give up, walk away?

Marriage is a promise, through tough times and good times.

Taking a break? That means abandoning him exactly when he needs help to figure out solutions.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
I see your point. I guess my issue is that he gets defensive when solutions are brought up by me. I’m not included in the discussion /equation regarding that situation. I feel abandoned and have two young children to worry about beyond myself. I would be in no position to be caring for older people with two young children that need me and he decided to propose knowing he would also become a stepfather to two young children.
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My half-sister is choosing to marry a man who can't possibly use the word NO with his 83 year old mother. She's selling her house b/c his mother 'refused' to budge out of the house she's lived in with her son for the past 40 years, so sonny-boy 'can't' buy a new house with his new wife and move mother in with them. He's consumed, heart, soul & body, with his mother, and her health, well being & welfare. With her medications, what's wrong with her, her DOUBLE INCONTINENCE, whether or not she's getting dementia (yes she is, based on her symptoms), and what stuff my sister is 'allowed' to move into mother's home and what stuff she cannot. Mother can easily live another decade or more and my sister will not even have a home to call her own b/c she's marrying a man who, in reality, is married to his mother!

Your fiance is busy making so many excuses for why he 'had to' pick up his family members from the ER b/c he 'was told to do so' that he has no time left over for you & your kids & a life together. With THAT many elders to take care of, how does he even have time left over for HIMSELF? He obviously also has trouble with the word No and/or setting down boundaries to make his life (and your life) manageable. As long as he's there for all these elders he's caring for, he's not there for you and your kids. #Truth.

It's now up to you to either be my half-sister or take a different road. If it's okay with you to play second fiddle to all these elders your fiance is busy caring for, then go for it. If not, then seriously think about what you're getting into, both emotionally AND financially, since you make mention of taking up the slack with the finances too. And with your 'crazy busy' schedule you keep mentioning, how is it you have time for your own life and your kids as well as your fiance and his issues?

It sounds like the two of you have scheduling issues to really work on before either of you can commit to a life together. There are only 24 hours in each day for all of us. The time that's spent on a job isn't coming back to anyone. Nobody's tombstone ever said I wish I spent more time at work before I died. Perhaps you need to reevaluate how many hours you spend at work, and your fiance needs to reevaluate how many hours he spends on elder care so you can meet in the middle somewhere and build a life together, that includes mostly the two of you and the kids.

It's no wonder you're overwhelmed. I would be too, faced with the lifestyle you both lead.

It's time for a change before both of you wind up sick and in the hospital yourselves, God forbid. Then what? Then who takes care of all these elders and/or the children?

Wishing you the best of luck.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thank you! My schedule is busy but more so with the kids activities; I’m home by 5 everyday and get 15 weeks off a year. So honestly you can’t beat it it’s just a high level of responsibility. I work at a university and kids could go to college for free-so I really value my job and position.

However there is a major clash with my fiancés situation and me/kids. It’s hard for a retired person to take on what he’s doing let alone someone that has 20 years left of work.

We are at the earlier stages of a relationship: wanting to plan a wedding etc but everything is on hold and honestly I can’t see it happening now.

you’re right we need our own lives and for the first few years of our relationship we had that. We would go for weekends away, bike all the time, skiing, etc. but once this happened it’s been priority and I don’t think we have made any real long term plans since. We’ve been engaged for a year and still no plans due to the main focus being his elders. He needs a break too. I feel completely frustrated tbh; and I would never put my own kids through this when I age (one of the reasons I want to keep a good job to ensure I have the means to pay for my own care).
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A 97 year old, to be blunt, is self limiting in terms of years moving forward of care.
A 60 year old mentally ill is not. This is now 40 years, 4 decades moving forward possibly, of care.
Going to first recommend a book, a memoir by a woman who tried EVERYTHING including dozens of caregivers and social workers to deal with her mentally ill Mom. She didn't live with this woman once she was grown, yet her life was held prisoner by her until she died eventually in a shelter.
Liz Scheirer's memoir is called Never Simple.
After you read this book you may have some decisions to make.
It's already clear to you what your Fiance's decision are. It may be getting close to time for you to make some of your own for yourself and your already here family.
You should also discuss the future if you continue living together; would he ever want to move any of these elders he feels so responsible for into your home? Where YOUR children (not his) are living?
You cannot change others. You can only make decisions for your own life.
Things here are not going to get better. They are only going to get worse.
In all truth, love is grand. However, it doesn't overcome all of this, and likely won't. Your husband basically "has" a primary family already, and so do you, and those primary families are not really going to be a good fit joined together IMHO. I think your post indicates you already recognize that.
Only you can make decisions for your own life. I needn't remind you that the lives of your children depend upon them being the right decisions. I sure wish you luck. This is a tough one.
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I'm going to be as gentle as I can here.

I don't think you have a caregiving problem; I think you have a relationship problem with your fiance.

You said: "I'll add this in, we got engaged a year ago and right after that was when things seemed to go downhill with his family." I personally find the timing of that rather convenient. Could it be that he had an inkling about how fast things were going to get bad, and figured the best way to "hold on" to your relationship was with a proposal?

You also don't want to be perceived as being selfish ("then I get the "who wouldn't help their family" from him and then I feel like such a horrible person.") That's a clever statement with no good answer...designed to make you feel guilty if 1) you ask him to not help his family and 2) you say no when he tries to rope you into doing more for his.

If it were just 97 year old grandma with ongoing health issues, I might tell you to stay the course if you really love this man. The law of averages would be on your side, if you catch my drift. But dad in his 60's with mental health issues? Is that really the course you want to chart with this man? I speak from very personal experience here, just living with someone with mental health issues is EXTREMELY difficult, never mind being their caregiver. Often times, you're walking around on eggshells in your own home, afraid of saying or doing the wrong thing, however innocent, that sets the person off. Please heed me here: this is not something I could even fathom doing with small children living in the home.

The only advice I am going to give to you is to ask yourself, honestly, with as little emotion as you can, is this relationship- is this MARRIAGE - going to be worth the difficulties that are going to go along with it? And not difficulties just for you, but for your CHILDREN who are your primary responsibility. Because of all of the advice you're going to receive, that is the question you need answer first, before you try to solve any of your fiance's caregiving issues.

I really, sincerely, wish you nothing but the best. I hope you can find an answer to this that you can be at peace with.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thank you. I too don’t think this will end well. I really do love him; but I’m not willing to sacrifice my entire life and my children for a situation that will only get worse. We can’t even leave to go on vacation (I’m not from this area; I live here because I have to be close to my kids father since we have 50/50 custody) so it’s painful to not be able to leave the area when my family is not here. I’ve decided I’ll go alone for now on and can’t wait around longer.

I feel caught in a really bad spot, where I know this situation isn’t sustainable but where I still love him. I just feel like I’m second fiddle and it hurts, but at same time I feel selfish.
I decided to start focusing more on my kids/self and see what Happens with the relationship. I’m going to get my doctorate degree and branch out more with friends but I know this will take me away from the relationship. It just feels so painful right now.
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Your ex won’t let his children stay with a mentally ill man in his 60s, which is how this ends. You are still in your 30s and have given it a year. Plus these aren’t your fiancé’s kids and he’s gonna be putting these three people ahead.

You can cohabit for emotional needs until it gets too bad. Easier to leave without a marriage
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
I don’t foresee his dad ever moving in with us, as he’s only been here one time and he won’t leave the town he’s from. If anything—he will stay in grandmom house (where he currently lives) with fiancé checking in on him on. Very regular basis.

I agree with cohabitating for emotional needs until it becomes too much. It feels like too much now, but I still love him and am not ready to end it.
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Fiance slid down the slippery slope of 'family duty' & is stuck in the mud.

He will need to 1) see he chose to step in, 2)that he is not powerless 3) he can plot his way out *if & when he wants to*.

Once he is unstuck, he can start building his life with you.

The big questions are:
How long will this take him?
How long are you willing to wait?

Sometimes love is not enough. We have to move forward on our own path & sometimes our speed does not match those around us. They may need to stand for a while.. or take a turn for a different path. You will build the life you want - he will join you if he can.

The future is unclear right now, like a dark night - but the stars will come out eventually.
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Dear HappyTimes, it sounds more like 1984 than 1982. This answer comes from my experience, which is different.

I’d start with the kids. When DH1 and I split, it became very clear that I could not live up to the ‘mum’s taxi’ expectation and ferry them all over the place to activities. Unless you are the type of parent who thinks they can be Olympic stars, kids grow up OK with a decent school and one or two activities that happen locally. DH1 and I did a shared care arrangement that meant I had them Monday and Tuesday nights, he had them Wednesday and Thursday nights (which meant I could travel interstate for the normal times of meetings) and we alternated weekends (which of course were always in a block of five days with one parent or another). It also meant that one parent always did a particular activity.

If you are on more or less OK terms with your ex, you could meet and agree a more reasonable set of activities and travel for the children. Before you shriek that your kids shouldn’t suffer, just remember that it’s just what BF is doing now. OK so one daughter didn’t do ballet – but she’s now too tall for it anyway, and it doesn’t seem to have ruined her life. It’s a different time/life issue, but it’s NOT irrelevant. Sacrificing yourself unnecessarily in a difficult situation is NOT a good idea.

Simplifying your own life for the better, puts you in a less stressed position to expect BF to do the same. If you can do it, so can he.

Moving on to the relationship, I was single from about 30 to 50, when I met my dear DH2. In the meantime I had various relationships and learned a lot about different men with different ideas and skills. I’ve now been married to DH2 for over 20 years, and we are very happy together (in spite of flood, fire but no famine). I worked out that brains, commonsense and practicality was what I needed in a partner – pity about no artistic or literary interest. He found out what mattered to him – and brains and temper control were far more important than he first thought.

I’m sure that you have a fair bit of love for BF now. Love is the easy bit, in fact. Respect is more difficult, and more important.

Don’t get stuck in a bad situation because you can’t see a way out. There is a way out, for BF. And for you, with or without BF. Love Margaret
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What put the 97 year old diabetic grandmother in hospital?
What happened to your fiance's mother?
How long have you and he been in a relationship? - you've been engaged for one year, you have two "little" kids whose custody you share with their father, I'm just wondering what your fiance's circumstances were before everything went downhill and whether he's ever been free of his family. In short, I suppose, what have you got yourself into?!

It sounds, very approximately, as though grandmother was running the show but in the last few years has gradually become unable to maintain control of a household with older, manic depressive twins in it. Fiance is being appointed her successor. How that fits with being a good husband and even more to the point a safe stepfather... well, does it fit?
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thank you....seems quite accurate of a response. Her sugar was all over the place so fiancé admitted her. Fiancé's dad and mother have been divorced for a very long time and she is basically out of the picture. Weve been together for 3.5 years. For the first few years he wasnt very involved with his grandmother and father beyond just visiting and mowing their lawn. He was very invested in our relationship and I really wasnt completely aware of the situation in that household until their health declined (mostly his grandmother). My situation hasnt changed at all since he met me (divorced, 2 children, same job, etc). I would never have signed up for this situation if I was completely aware due to my own situation and children's ages, etc. I think for a long time he wasnt overly involved with his family (beyond the typical), but with his grandmother's decline he feels he needs to be the caregiver.

Yes, grandmother has been completely running the show to the point of being enabling with her two kids. When she was in the hospital she was very worried her son (fiance uncle) wouldnt eat or take his medicine. She was crying in the hospital worry about a grown man in his 60s. Fiance said that since his grandmother wasnt there, his uncle was actually doing much better (doing way more for himself and in better spirits)..he said it was like a different man.

This situation doesnt fit into my situation that I have. I love this man and he continues to say this is temporary, but I ask myself, is it really?
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I've been having some very pointed discussions with fiancé about all of this and he seems to think I am just not being supportive and am selfish. I've brought up some discussions regarding setting boundaries etc and hes taking it as me being selfish. AM I? Honestly, Im so caught between feeling guilty about worrying about my own situation and then what he has going on. I feel really bad about all of it.
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PeggySue2020 Apr 2022
Happy, the way it is is that he sees and will always see these three as his primary family. Not your children.

You see it as the complete opposite.
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So, being "selfish" by definition is prioritizing one's minor/petty needs over those who might reasonably think they can rely on you.

1. Your minor children are your FIRST responsibility here.

2. Your wage-earning status is not petty. Else how will you provide for those children and your own retirement.

3. Your finance's family has no reasonable expectation of your financially supporting their grandson/nephew/father so that he can caregive.

You are not selfish. Self-preservation is what it is called.

No one else is going to take care of YOU, therefore, you must.
His family can hire caregivers. Gma can go into care and adult sons can go to supportive housing.

The fact that these folks have NO plan ain't your problem, sister.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Yes I agree. Being the breadwinner, if I don't take my own job seriously then who will pay for my children?

He realizes that if he did not live with me and the kids he would not be able to support himself alone with the amount of caregiving he is having to do.

I do feel like his family does not realize that I am picking up the slack financially, or if they do, they do not care. I think they view their grandson as a man just living with his girlfriend and her kids but not as someone that is trying to become a husband/stepfather, if that makes sense.

It bothers me that their plan is basically just to 'stay put'...when in fact that means SOMEONE will need to provide their care. His grandmother keeps stating she can't afford to pay anyone (fiancé says otherwise).
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Are you being selfish? Hmmmm....

First of all, I just want to point out this irony - usually when someone calls you "selfish", it's because you won't do what THEY want you to do. So usually that word is bandied about to try and guilt you into doing what the person who has called you selfish wants you to do. AND when you start to do things out of guilt, resentment generally quickly follows. And that is not a healthy foundation for ANY relationship, but especially a marriage.

Secondly and more importantly - SO WHAT??? So what if people think you're "selfish"? Because you have set boundaries and won't move them, because you know if you do no good will come of it? Because you have the mental wherewithall to be able to recognize that this future your fiance sees is NOT what you want for either you or your children? Even IF there weren't children involved, there is no shame is saying "nope, I'm just not willing to be an elderly person's caregiver, and I'm not willing to put my entire life on hold while my partner takes on that role". Especially when you have spoken up about your concerns and have been ignored - or worse, been told that "you're selfish".

So go ahead and embrace that "selfishness" - because 1 year, 5 years, 10 years down the road, you will look back and see how you dodged a major bullet.
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sp19690 Apr 2022
Excellent advice.
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What kind of job does your fiance have?

I think he's the one who's being selfish. You live together, and you provide the financial cushion when he can't contribute financially because he's not working while caregiving.

Once married and IF there is agreement that one or all of these people need facility placement, will YOUR financial contribution be required for that?

If you have 15 weeks off each year, don't you think that you will be expected to be helping out, too?

Your fiance has made his choice -- his family over you and yours. When someone shows you what they are, believe them.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Fiance is a landscaper. If he isn't work, he isn't making money.

I made it clear that I wouldn't pay for anyone else. I don't have extra beyond my own children. However, if we are married and he decides to assist with paying for them, then I do realize this would end up affecting me. This is a fear of mine since fiancé doesn't have the means to support anyone beyond himself.
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Love does not always lead to marriage and nor should it. If anything, any talk of marriage should be put on hold for now. Your finace has too much on his plate. Grandmom needs to be placed. Her diabetes needs to be managed and your finance should not have that responsibility and seems Dad and Uncle can't do it. If Dad and Uncle are capable then they should place her. Then both Dad and Uncle need to be evaluated with good physicals to determine what they can do for themselves. Fiance should not disable them. My cousin has bi-polar but has no problem caring for himself.

This is probably very overwhelming for ur fiance. At this point, allow him to do what he feels he needs to. But tell him he is going to need a longterm plan. Because if you marry, you and your children need to be number #1.

Grandmom needs to be placed. Seems her sons can't do the care and a grandson should not feel he needs to be doing it. Next time she is hospitalized, she can be evaluated for 24/7 care and transported to a NH from there.

Find resources for Dad and Uncle. 60 is not old. Fiance needs to learn to set boundries. He cannot be responsible for even 2 people.

You are not selfish. You have children to look after. At this point, these people are not even related. Step back and let him do what he needs to do. You can research resources for him. If he or his relatives don't want to take advantage of what is out there and fiance is not willing to set boundaries you may just have to break it off.

I am 72 and have been divorced raising one child alone. The last thing I would have wanted was BF with all the responsibility yours has. I wanted security. I got that with a man who took on my child and my cat. I did care for my Mom for a short time but eventually placed her which worked out well for both of us. TG I was not further tested by having to make the decision to have his MIL live with me. That I am sure would not have worked. Good for 1 week at a time once or twice a year. 😊
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IMHO I would not even consider marrying this man until he first extricates himself from being the primary caregiver to 3 people. I would absolutely not go into a commitment with him until he proves he is willing to make you and your kids his #1 priority. I would un-engage myself from him, but would maybe still carry on a relationship, just with some very clear and strong boundaries on your side.

Think of it slightly differently: it would be like marrying someone who is an alcoholic who says he doesn't want to be an alcoholic, says that you're a priority to him yet won't stop drinking, complete rehab or even go to AA meetings. When you ask him to do those things he says you're selfish. But promises he'll get sober if you get married, *then* he'll change. Nope. Don't keep waiting for him to change, don't promise to stay exclusive to him. Then you'll see just how much he does (or doesn't) love you. You being his indentured helper won't make him love you, either. It will just continue to enable him.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Good advice. Im trying to do this "wait and see" approach with him while I live my life and he lives his to see how this all shakes out. He is already expressing being extremely overwhelmed by it all (but geared by his job...he is saying he cant maintain his job which he loves and do all this and he is NOT willing to not work) however this entire situation is very alarming.
Since we live together it would be impossible for us to not stay exclusive...so not sure how I could approach that without a breakup. He feels there is no way around this. I think he is saying YES too much and its just not sustainable.
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It sounds like Fiance would benefit from therapy.

He needs support in valuing his life and career. No parent/grandparent has the right to refuse caregivers because they "only want family".

This message would be more powerful coming from a disinterested person, rather than you. He can push back with you and call you selfish. The therapist, without a stake in his saying "no" will be more effective.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
I totally agree. He views me as having other interests and that im just upset that Im not getting his time etc.
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I would not be planning a wedding until this is sorted out.
1. A bit confused, am I getting this that your fiancé is living with:
Dad
Uncle
Grandfather
Grandmother
(If grandmother and grandfather are living in another place that makes it only slightly better.)
Obviously you know that 1 person can not care for 4 dependent people with no help.
Are any of these people that need care Veterans? If so the VA might be able to provide some help. Have him contact the local Veterans Assistance Commission and they can help determine what benefits they would be entitled to. the service is free.
I am sure others have mentions the local Area Agency on Aging, check and see if they qualify for any services.
The local Senior Center might also have some options.
If at any time ANY one of these people is taken to the hospital he must talk to the Hospital Social Worker and inform them that this person can not be safely discharged to their home as there is not a caregiver available to help.

Your fiancé needs to get his act together and begin to be a Care manager NOT a full time Caregiver.
He is not responsible for each one of these people. He may feel an obligation because they are family but he does not have to do all the care.
He needs to inform each one that he needs to back off, he will help them get them the help that they need but he can not continue to do it all.
BOUNDARIES...

He also needs to show you that you and the family that he is to have in the future is his priority. If he doesn't I hope you delay your wedding plans until this is all sorted out. (with a father in his 60's it might be 20 or 30 years...how long do you want to wait)
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thank you. Fiancé lives w me and my children in a house I lived in prior to us living together. He moved out of his house and moved in with us about 1.5 years ago.

His grandmother, dad and uncle all live in his grandmothers home together. His grandfather died a very long time ago.

It does seem like he is attempting to be just a care manager, but with one crisis after another he continuously needs to step in for someone in the house whether its his dad, his grandmother, even his uncle.

He feels an obligation that extends into even cleaning their house, redoing the inside of the home (painting, etc), taking out the trash, grocery shopping, etc beyond medical appointments.

Since this all started last summer, I have delayed planning anything for the wedding. I halted all plans and we don't have a date set. I realize that I don't want to walk into anything that does not work out.
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Happy, all the anger and annoyance you have said about your man being with his family is near identical to what he could say about your kids from their expensive sports camps to them living with him when after all they already have a dad. While I understand why you are not supportive of his baggage, you also have baggage that you want him to throw his baggage over to prioritize.
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
I agree with you on that. Although he’s signing up to be a stepdad, not just a husband. My expectations of a stepdad would be that he would be a full partner to me and my kids. I didn’t assume the role of taking care of another family; just the family I currently have and adding him into the equation which is why he proposed to me (and knew what he was getting involved in). I didn’t sign up to also have another family as well. Am I wrong to feel this way? You’re insinuating that I am.
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Dear Happytimes1982,
I think that the first thing you need to hear is that everything you are feeling is legitimate, your concerns are real and valid. Caregiving can be exhausting, frustrating and seemingly endless not only for the caregiver but also for those who care about the caregiver (eg their spouses, partners, etc). I think it is good that you can put a voice to what your are feeling. What may be happening for your fiance is that he is sooo overwhelmed and worried etc. that he may not even know what he feels because he doesnt have time to feel as he is actively IN it. I speak from experience and can offer that what has and is making a difference for me is therapy - where I get a chance to talk about my situation and realize what I am feeling, realize how it is affecting my relationship and ultimately becoming able to voice my fears and see that there is help. Once I started taking to time to feel rather than just reacting to the caregiving (and crying at night and feeling guilty for being resentful that my life was detoured/derailed by all this); then I could map out potential solutions. I began to accept help - from palliative care and my local area agency on aging. I found adult day care options and funding to pay for it. I waded through all the paperwork to get my parent qualified for Medicaid. And this was only possible when I stopped being IN it as much as stepping back from it if only for an hour a week while i talked through it with an experienced therapist (who had been through the same thing with both her parents. oh, and I only found her by making the time to attend local caregiver support groups (you would be suprised at how many nursing homes have such groups that you can attend even if you have no family member in the home. Caring.com and APlacefor Mom can also help you A LOT by putting you in touch with your own local resources. I think the best thing you might do is talk to your fiance about how you are feeling and what you are seeing him go through, and both of you seek and accept help. it is out there. wishing you well - Jocelyn775
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Thank you and that is great advice. I really appreciate it. I do think he is extremely overwhelmed and feels like a big Mack truck has blindsided him. He really really needs help. I will absolutely tell him to please seek help from a therapist. Right now, he doesn't have time for anything other than attempting to be a caregiver and trying to work in between doctors appointments and caring for his elders.

I have attempted to seek out more help in our home (hiring someone to cut the grass so he doesn't need to do it); however he's positive he can do this.

Its not sustainable. I want to be as supportive as possible but my patience is thinning. I know I would be so much better if I didn't have children (as my ability to be that great caring for anyone else is limited both emotionally and physically). Just a rough situation overall.
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Happy, it is past time for you to say very directly to him "this isn't working out for me anymore. Either you pay your fair share of the rent (or whatever you're splitting with him) or you need to leave."

Was this guy an "adult" when you met him? Living on his own, paying his bills, having good relationships?

Or was he living with parents/grandparents and sort of drifting?
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Happytimes1982 Apr 2022
Barb—he was living on his own and by himself in a house that he rented. I’m confident he wouldn’t be doing this for his family if he was still alone since he simply couldn’t afford to. Or if so, I think he would put pressure on them to assist him financially if he had to take off work.
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