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Teagle Asked May 2021

What documents are needed?

I have an 84 year old widowed uncle who doesn’t have any children. When he dies he wants to leave everything to charity. I told him that is fine but I just need to know where the paperwork is to make sure his wishes are carried out.


The only paperwork I have that is up to date is his medical directive. He has an outdated Will that I told him he needs to update immediately as the ones listed as executors are deceased. (He may think I am a nag but I am just organized)


He is currently in great health but I know things may change.


I ask him questions like if he ends up in the hospital how will his bills get paid etc. I have no answers. I have nothing to gain just want to help as I know the work involved after settling my mom’s estate. I told him that I don’t have to be listed on anything but he needs to have a plan in place. I live on one coast and he is on the other. I call to check on him a couple of times of week and fly home once or twice a year to visit him. I want to help so that the charity receives what he wants rather than the state but I can only do so much. I want to gather the answers and will present to him and he will do what he wants. I teased him when he told me when his wife died years ago he was told to update and I asked what has been the delay. He is retired. He has time. Lol

Llamalover47 May 2021
Imho, hire an elder law attorney for the will update and to obtain PoA.

MsRandall May 2021
My brother was dying, did not have a will, power of attorney, etc. I hired an attorney to meet him at his house in the privacy of his room. I didn't ask. I just did it. That did the trick. My brother worked with the attorney and did everything but the do not resucitate order.
Ricky6 Jun 2021
Question: How do you find a lawyer that you can trust?

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Taarna May 2021
It would be best to update his will.

If he does not have anybody with power of attorney for medical and financial, then the local courts will assign a legal guardian to act as his representative.

Riley2166 May 2021
Somehow he needs to make an updated will and you need a POA while is alive. Let's hope he names you an executor in his will. If possible, speak to an eldercare attorney in his state. You might also contact the probate office in his county and state for information on how to process an estate. They will send you lots of information which will be most helpful. Somehow you must get through to him that you will do whatever he wants done but he MUST sit down and cooperate and get papers in order an current. Set your boundaries and threaten if he does not cooperate, you walk and he will be on his own with no help from anyone. Good luck. Shame on him not to be current in every way and you for "allowing" this from him.

bicycler May 2021
Teagle, most states have a process known as "Small Estate Affidavit" that allows a competent adult (usually with some degree of heirship) to collect and distribute assets of a deceased person according to that person's known desires or (which could even be an outdated will, if that's all there is). The definition of "small estate" is $100,000 in Idaho, but each state has its own definition, e.g. $166,250 in California. Most importantly, the "Affidavit" process avoids the expense and most of the hassle and delay of the formal probate process. You can do an internet search to see what's involved where your uncle lives. For an example, here's a helpful link for the Small Estate Process in Idaho: https://www.idaholegalaid.org/SelfHelp/small-estates
 
While your uncle is living, your having a copy of his medical directive is a good start, but obviously getting his bills paid if he becomes incapacitated is also important, so telling him that if he doesn't put in writing his choice of who should handle his finances in the event of incapacitation, a county judge will likely assign someone to do that and that person could be well-paid from your uncle's assets -- telling him that my motivate him, but it sounds like motivating him has been futile, so far. Also, if a family member is willing to be executor, then without his written designation, the state or a county judge will choose such relative(s) per statutory priority, which your uncle may not prefer and maybe knowing that will motivate him. Maybe to make it easier for him, you could send him some fill-in-the blank DPOAs for finances and for health care and a "designated executor" update for his will, all that meet his state's requirements. Good luck.
 
As to the "state receiving his estate instead of the charity of his choice," that won't happen because he has at least three living relatives who, after his death and all bills are paid, would receive any remaining assets divided per his will, outdated or not, and/or the state's statutory guidelines, if necessary. But if his charity choice is in his will (whether or not designated executors are alive), then that charity should receive the share that he wanted it to receive, via probating his will or even via the affidavit process described above if his estate is eligible for that.
 
Best wishes in motivating your uncle.

TouchMatters May 2021
If he doesn't make you or someone else his POA and he needs assistance with these matters, he will likely be assigned to a stranger (conservator) by the state and YOU will not be allowed to know ANYTHING they are doing. It is a horrible situation if not handled in advance.
* I've heard of horrendous sad situations where a 'friend' for years did everything for his friend, 'as a friend,' and he was pushed out completely when she needed him the most since nothing legal was in place.
* He is putting off very important need. You likely know this. He will be like or a 'ward of the state' and assigned a stranger to manage all his affairs.
* You can only do what you can (do). gena

NYCmama May 2021
You can give him all the info he needs but that doesn't mean he will go. If you're not going there soon, go the distance and find a well regarded elder law attorney in his area and give him the contact info. Tell him to make the appointment or you will. That's the only thing that will motivate an old timer, I can almost guarantee once he has that appointment, he will go.

igloo572 May 2021
Does he want to be buried next to his wife? If so,likely paperwork that needs to be done or updated to have that happen. If she died years ago, the costs will have gone up and substantially even if they had some sort of plot bought. Just Maybe, maybe, this could be the reason he realizes he needs to get things done?

Could he be under the belief that the charity will somehow come in and settle all his affairs as they are to be the beneficiary? Charities or nonprofit organizations have “planned giving” systems….. all set up ahead of time; tend to involve life insurance policy to have them listed as a beneficiary.

if you know what the charity is, I’d suggest that you contact them to see what precisely they do for planning giving. Have them send their packet to you so you can see what needs to happen.

And he needs to be aware that a charity can decline the “gift”. There is a small drama on this with the estate of an acquaintance of my moms… both families settled in the same area and involved in the same church in 1920’s-WW2 period. The unmarried daughter lived in the home with her mom. Mom died, left home to this daughter & she did a will leaving her estate (the home family had been at since 1920’s) to the church with her married sister as her executor. Cue to 2016, unmarried gets cancer and house start to run into disrepair, taxes not getting paid. Neighborhood dramatically changed and house is now on a major street with a bus stop. A creek diversion project takes part of her back yard as well as the service alley and demos good 1/3 of the block. So now it’s a much smaller parcel, zoned R-1 in an overwhelmingly C zone. She goes into a NH & dies. Sister dutifully opens probate and contacts the charity and finds they are going to decline as they are not set up to take over the property, pay it’s tax bills, do maintenance. There is no secondary beneficiary in the will as both were expecting the Church to gladly become the owner. Property has dz of blight notices; the owner of house at the corner has been dealing with this and posted on Next Door which I’m on (& how I recognized the name). The Executor sister died in 2019, with house still in limbo in probate. City has to wait till the State does their filing with PC to have it taken out of probate and escheated to the State, then State can transfer to the City & City places at auction. Stuff like this probably happens way way more than we realize. That charity your Uncle favors may not have the resources to deal with an estate; they are geared to only getting $ paid to them. Please try to find out.

If he flat refuses to do any planning or updating, you cannot make him. Upon his death whatever his estate is will escheat to the State unless whomever name as Executor has a valid will to get probate opened. If escheated estate has real value, then you can hire & pay for an atty to do a lineal heirship filed in PC to establish that you are a heir. Lineal requires Notices posted in cities counties where both of them lived (so that anyone who thinks they could be an heir can contact the attorney ) and documentation for prior marriages and children born. There can be surprises as to heirs end up being & benefit, even tho you paid the atty.

Good luck, you’re a good niece to be so concerned.

marydys May 2021
Besides all of that, it might be a good idea to make sure his doctors have you as his contact person OR whomever is going to be his medical and financial power of attorney.

cweissp May 2021
I agree with others - maybe when planning your next visit with him you can get him an appointment to an elder care attorney and accompany him to the appointment - maybe a free consultation.

He should have:
DPOAs for medical and financial decisions
Complete a new will - or update the old will
Do a financial review to make sure his finances are in order

If his assets are exhausted for use in his care - his financial records should be easily accessible in case he needs to be enrolled into medicaid.

Good luck

Teagle May 2021
“If your uncle died, would they even know how to get a hold of you? Do you have phone numbers for his neighbors, etc?”

my contact information is listed on his medical directive. I do have phone numbers for his friends that live near him in the event I can’t reach him by phone. I speak with him briefly multiple times during the week.

MsRandall May 2021
Tell him that all these decisions need to be made by him before he gets sick because once he is incompetent. Someone will make the decisions, it may be the state and it may not be to his liking. Also, people assume that the "next of kin" will be given the authority. BUT state law dictates who is in the line of decision making. Remind your uncle that if he does not make the decision while he is competent -- it could end up with someone he doesn't want - or the state

As to documents

Health Care Power of Attorney
Durable Power of Attorney (providing authority to manage affairs when incompentne)
Will
Teagle May 2021
I will remind him again. I always tell him that I don’t have to be named but someone does.
Allye1 May 2021
Well if you are next of kin, legally you might desire to at least ask him to update his Records and put your name, address, phone number in case of emergency.

Place your name on Bank Records as beneficiary or Payee Upon Death, otherwise you or another family member will need to probate all affairs. So, you must ascertain if you are the next legal member of his family, no wife, no children, no siblings alive, and that he wants you.

If his mind is good then why is he not doing anything? You might want to leave your name with any neighbors as well, unfortunately I have seen this too often people desire their neighbors or some friend to come in and care for them, you might not know, but they do not give you access to any real decision making because they have someone else in mind. Now, problem is they use these people for years, the relatives run in and do not give not one ounce of Respect to those who were utilized, so you might desire to know, if he fails to acknowledge you, then he is very aware of what he is doing. Go about it another way, what all is he doing with his life and offer to meet any neighbors and friends in his life, you might find out more.

Interestingly enough, men are more apt to do this than women, so do not believe he is just waiting about. My father was offered our help (daughters) he declined all of us, and stayed with a "friend" who got it all and that was that. I did not contest as it was what he determined to do, so did he say this, no he got to visit, yet this end of life plan was made by him and her, and we were left out. So, if he does not give you anything does not mean he has not given it to another.
Teagle May 2021
You have asked the million dollar question. “ If his mind is good then why is he not doing anything?”

My guess is because he doesn’t want to. He tells me he will get to it. My response is you have been retired for over 30 years. When are you getting to it? You have time. Lol

Like you I have offered. That is all I can do. I can’t make him do something he doesn’t want to do. Only time will tell what happens.
NancyIS May 2021
He needs to get his paperwork in order, or the state will decide how to distribute his assets after his death. He needs to have an up-to-date will. He should set up power of attorney for medical and financial decisions, in the case that he becomes incapacitated. He needs a living will with his medical directives. Many financial institutions have their own POA forms. Somebody should be on record with Social Security and Medicare to be able to speak on his behalf. You'll probably need an attorney to help with all of this, and it's best to get an attorney that handles elder law. Perhaps you can go with him to the attorney on your next visit to take care of these things. We never know when something might happen and a POA will be needed. This is something we all need to do. If he is resisting the discussions, perhaps he'll be more forthcoming while you are with the attorney. You also need to know what his wishes are if he becomes unable to care for himself. Can he afford to have aides come in to help him? Or would he rather go to an assisted living facility? You are doing a wonderful thing, helping him, and it is so much more difficult long distance. This will be more doable if you are POA if the time comes that he needs more help. I did this for my aunt who lived halfway across the country. Fortunately, she was cooperative.
Teagle May 2021
oh I know he needs to have this done yesterday. Thanks to everyone for helping me know exactly what is needed. I have presented him the information and will bring up him seeking help from an elder law specialist again.
Littlesistercg May 2021
Is he depressed? Depression often leads to procrastination. Could you set up an appointment with an elder care attorney so that when you visit next time, you can just take him out to lunch and lawyer? Maybe sit down and have a Q&A about his wants and wishes before you go and bring the list with you. Seeing it in writing may help him to see the need as well.
Teagle May 2021
I don’t think he is depressed. It just doesn’t seem like on the top of his to do list of things to do. He knows he needs to do it. When his wife died he was told to update the Will. We are years later.
Taylorb1 May 2021
To be honest with you I feel that you are wasting your time and not being appreciated try not calling him during the week and see if that changes anything don’t waste any more time as I feel he sounds ungrateful
Teagle May 2021
Outside of not having his documents in order he is fine. I don’t think he is ungrateful just slow in getting this done. Slow for me but I guess not slow for him. I have sent him information so what he does with that information is up to him. I have a clear conscience knowing I tried. I will continue my normal routine of checking on him via phone.
Ricky6 May 2021
Your concerns are legitimate and real. I hope your uncle heeds your advice. A few years ago there was a New York Times magazine story about a man named George. He passed without any living friends, relatives, or a Will. The newspaper article tells his story and what the State does in these situations. You can probably read it if you have a NYT subscription.
imadaughter17 May 2021
I'm reading the article right now. It's called the lonely death of George bell. If your uncle died, would they even know how to get a hold of you? Do you have phone numbers for his neighbors, etc?
JoAnn29 May 2021
As said if Uncle does not have a Will and POA in place, the State will take over who receives his money and will make decisions for him concerning where he is placed if he becomes incompetent. Yes, he is healthy today but tomorrow may have a stroke that effects him being able to make his own decisions. He can no longer procrastinate. If you need to, take him to a lawyer.

Since you seem to be the one who keeps in touch, you are probably the best candidate as Executor and being assigned POA. But, leaving far away will cause problems. So better if he can pick someone close by. Even the lawyer.

Explain to him that having everything in place will make sure his wishes are carried out. If no Executor is listed then someone needs to become the Administrator. This person carries out the same responsibilities that the Executor does except the State determines who inherits. In Uncle's case it would be Siblings and if they are no longer alive then nieces and nephews, etc.

Good Luck
Teagle May 2021
Hello JoAnn29,

Iota of good information. I will try everyone’s suggestions and see where I get. I will try to get him to an elder attorney. I totally understand things can change in a second. I have asked him he has to go in things like if he goes in the hospital how will his bills get paid? Etc. I always say he doesn’t need to name me but he needs to name someone.
AlvaDeer May 2021
Are you the only relative and the executor of his will? If you are his only relative you should say "Uncle, you have expressed your wishes to me. Am I the executor? If not I cannot do your wishes. If I am I will require a copy of your will to present, and should have a POA so I can take care of your funeral and etc when that time comes. I will ask you this just this once. If you don't wish to provide any of the following I will, as your only relative, bury you, file probate after finding your will and carry forth your wishes as stated in your will OR, if I cannot find your will, I will distribute your funds, after taking my own fee for acting for you, to charities of MY choice." End of statement.
It he is the procrastinator you suggest he is you will likely not hear a thing. Then, when he dies, it is up to your what you do. Because "the dead don't care", as Thomas Lynch, the poet, author and funeral director always says. Wherever they are going, they no longer care about all that stuff. You can bury him and do the above. Or you can let the state bury him and do a probate and distribution to heirs, which is, I guess, you. Then you can do as you wish with the proceeds.
I wish you luck, but doubt you will get anywhere with him. You will have tried. What more could you do?
Teagle May 2021
Hello AlvaDeer,

I am not the only relative or the executor of the Will. The Will was as done in the 70s and both listed executors are deceased. i am trying to get ahead of this because I know the headache to come. I will share all of this helpful info and if nothing comes so be it. I tried.
Geaton777 May 2021
Not sure what happens in probate if there's no live executor (or how long it takes to go through that process).

Perhaps you can let him know that without a legally assigned durable PoA, the county will eventually become his guardian and will make all his decisions and manage all his affairs, including his finances. He will most likely go into a county-run facility and even you won't have any say about it. All it will take is one trip to the ER or a friend/neighbor to report him as a vulnerable adult to APS for those wheels to be set in motion.

In the end all you can do is give him information about process and outcomes. Many people are in denial about aging and decline and so put it off. I realize you are concerned for him but it's not your problem if he doesn't take action. I hope he sees the light before he sees "The Light".
Teagle May 2021
Hello Geaton777,

I am not sure either. Yes all I can do is share the info. I try to help. There is no financial benefit for me just trying to help honor his wishes for everything to go to charity.
BarbBrooklyn May 2021
Teagle, the truth is that the money will go to YOU if you are his closest living relative, lol. Maybe THAT will get him into action!

You need Medical and Financial powers of attorney and an advance directive. Burial plans (plot, prepaid funeral services and the like) are another idea.

Perhaps find an eldercare attorney near him and set up an appointment for him.

There is a neat little book called "Five at 55" about the 5 documents we all need in place by age 55. Send him a copy.

https://www.amazon.com/55-Essential-Legal-Documents-Need/dp/1610352580
Teagle May 2021
Hi barbrooklyn. I am not the closet living relative. He has two siblings that are still alive. I will check out that book. Thank you for the link. I have been telling him that I don’t need to be the executor etc but it has to be someone.

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