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Lisa82 Asked August 2020

My MIL has dementia. Sometimes I'm convinced some of the things she does are intentional. Like how a cunning conniving person would. Thoughts?

When she gets in one of her frequent and numerous episodes of temper tantrum, if we just ignore her and shut the door to have privacy and ignore her blabbering nonsense, she would retaliate by dropping her 'depends' diaper in the toilet (she never does this, only when she is being deliberate like this) and she would deliberately make a mess of the bathroom floor with the toilet paper strewn all over. I know it is deliberate because I'm her sole care giver for years already and I know her pattern very well. There are few other instances where I think some of these old folks are putting on a show too. Has anyone ever experienced this? I don't coddle her or anything partly because I can't stand her because she is the laziest, dirtiest and GREEDIEST person I know.
There are other things she does that makes me think a lot of things these guys do are deliberate but when caught red handed they act pitiful or weak and helpless and put on a show and people overlook it because they think it is the dementia part doing it. Im sure some instances are but NOT ALL!!! One time I confronted her about something I just saw her do very deliberately and the moment I confronted her she started putting on a show shaking her hands when it wasn't shaking in the first place and she would pretend she doesn't know what's going on but I can see in her face the bad acting. Her son coddles her and makes all kinds of excuses for her but I think that's one of the reasons this old conniving woman does her acting. She knows she can't it off with me though. When she starts her crying drama I totally ignore her and shut her in her room and let her exhaust herself out with her own drama. And it always works. Or if she's weeping away (her usual once a day HABITUAL weeping session) I just ignore her and she sees I'm ignoring her she stops very quickly. The moment she sees her son and she does her weeping he goes to cuddle her and she would wail and sob and speak so emotionally, blabbering nonsense.
Anyone else experience any thing that might seem intentional?

IhaveQuestions Aug 2020
I also care for my MIL and I believe you are 100% right about some things being
deliberate and intentional and it baffles me that a later stage dementia patient has the ability to determine when and how to act the way they do. If my husband is home and I try to ease her into taking showers, sometimes she is hesitant and will complain, but if I am home alone trying to get her in the shower, also gently, she will become angry, aggressive, take off her underpants and throw them in my face. Once they had feces in them. That is just an example. Attitude changes almost immediately when my husband gets home in the evenings. The "whining" starts, and he babies her. Not all of the time, but most of the time. I try to just ignore it, and she KNOWS that, and thats why she doesn't whine too much with me. An example, she has one of those heavy calming blankets on her bed. All day everyday she has no trouble getting into bed and covering up herself, at night when my husband is home she suddenly can't pull the blanket up over herself because its too heavy. These are just some examples that I have which make me believe that she knows what she's doing. She is extremely hateful to me since living with us and we've had a great relationship for the past 25 years, but it has changed my feelings and it's something I can't help. I'm not taking care of my MIL anymore, its someone else that doesn't have a history with me and knowing this will ease my guilt about the way I feel. It has come to the point that we have decided to put her into a care center because it's just too much. So I understand and I do sympathize with you. Until you have walked that particular road, you just don't understand.

KaraOkay Aug 2020
I believe you. I believe you can recognize the differences in her behaviors. I don't think anyone should make you feel bad for your question. Everyone's situations are different.
That said, I am figuring out care for my dad. I have cameras around (he knows), because hey, gotta sleep, use the bathroom, go to the store, etc. It's been a sanity saver for all of us giving care. Funny what he can do when he wants to.
He's lazier than the lazy he's been my whole life. He makes a mess most times because he doesn't care, never has. Lately I've handed him a paper towel or whatever and let him know he has to clean up the pee/poo/food/drink. He hates it like a 2 year old. I don't make him do anything unsafe and I do end up doing a thorough job after him (when he isn't looking), but even with some dementia, the repeated accountability for his actions has been breaking through his "slobbability".
-When your MIL pulls the tantrum-diaper-toss, hand her a coat hangar or gloves and trash bag.
-When she blabbers, either put on headphones or walk around ignoring it or vacuum/dust/rearrange the pantry or call someone and have a conversation for her to hear about your concern for having to put your MIL in a home because you're confused about her ranting and think it may be safer since she's so difficult to help.
-When hubby coddles her, calmly tell him that until he does 2 weeks or more with her on his own, then you'll need his support in order to retain your sanity and marriage....you aren't asking for anything but him to show that he believes in you, since he obviously trusts you to handle things when he's not there.
I understand you are the caregiver for a reason, too many to list. I also understand that not all elderly are sweet and reasonable (possibly their whole adult life).
YOU know your story. I believe you are a good person. Why? Because I don't believe that someone would go to the trouble of getting an account, writing out this question, gathering experiences over time, and STILL providing care would be twisting this up for any reason. I could be wrong (for those thinking poor MIL), but this is my OPINION, so there's that.
cherokeegrrl54 Aug 2020
Agree with you totally!!!

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CTTN55 Aug 2020
From another post of yours: "Shes just a greedy lazy dirty cunning old lady. I just have to care for her but I hate her." And from another post (06/26/20), you write about how both you and your H yell at her. Please know that I am not criticizing you or your H for losing your cool -- MIL sounds like too much for anyone to handle!

Why is she living with you? H has at least one sister, correct? And she likes to tell the two of you what to do?

Why isn't she living in a facility? What is MIL's financial situation?
AlvaDeer Aug 2020
There we go. Finally got to "hate her".
As I said, I shudder to think of this elder in the hands of someone who CLEARLY does hate her.
Kimmotion Aug 2020
It's funny, I was just thinking the same thing today as I was changing grandma's bedsheets! She drove me nuts this morning and I thought "how much is real and how much is put on just to toy with me? Do seniors do this sort of thing just to wind people up and watch them go?"

I'm a big Beatles fan and it reminds me of "A Hard Day's Night" with Paul's grandfather- "he's a king mixer" who stirs up trouble and gets people riled up for his amusement. It just makes me wonder, you know? I've caught my grandmother doing this a few times to me. She'll say something that she knows annoys me, then laughs like "I got you!"

Old people are crazy. I love them, but they're crazy. They really do act like little children. They can't help it though.
earlybird Aug 2020
I bet others will think the same as we age.
Mysteryshopper Aug 2020
Ours would call the paramedics (for no reason). She wasn't trying to get them to take her to the hosp, she just wanted them to come and "assist" her. We could always sense when she was going to do it - lots of manipulation all the time about all kinds of things - not just this. She was just that type of person. Once, she purposefully called them to perform a task for her but had completed it by the time they got there and told them "nevermind." She told us it was her right to do this as she'd paid her taxes, etc. We told her that is NOT the case. The time she had an honest to goodness life or death emergency, it was her life alert that automatically called the squad - not her.

earlybird Aug 2020
My mother has on occasion has temper tantrums, I would never close the door on my mother, but try to calm her down with a tender touch and tell her I love her. This is your MIL, it seems you do not have the patience to care for her, it is not your responsibility to begin with. I am being honest here. You asked and I am not going to sugar coat it. How was your relationship before MIL moved in with you? Your husband did the right thing and it did calm her down. He seems like a really nice, decent son. Sometimes you just need your own loved one to give you some tender loving care. Closing the door on a person who is ill is wrong period!! Making fun of her is not nice! Ignoring her when she is crying, how sad! She would be better off in a decent facility. I would have a long talk with hubby and explain your concerns. Is your husband aware of how you are treating his mother?? Show some compassion for this elder!

lkdrymom Aug 2020
My father would do this. He constantly wanted to go to the ER for constipation. It got to the point the assisted living would refuse to send him. So he would tell them he fell and hit his head so they would send him. Not such a befuddled old man. He would try to manipulate me. It was so obvious it was insulting he would think I was so gullible.
AlvaDeer Aug 2020
It is very common for old people whether demented or not to become obsessed with their bowels. And they get quite frantic around this whole thing, would do anything to get care for it. It becomes a real obsession, not some game to drive you crazy.
Countrymouse Aug 2020
I don't think it's a good idea to be the 'sole caregiver' to a person you 'can't stand.'
earlybird Aug 2020
Good for you, Countrymouse!
lealonnie1 Aug 2020
It sounds to me like the situation with your MIL living in your home is not working out for a variety of reasons.

My mother has moderate dementia, and lives in Memory Care. I see a lot of manipulation with her because, in spite of dementia, that's been her personality type for 93.5 years. It's not going to change b/c she has dementia; it will, however, exacerbate. Some things she says & does I believe she can't help while others she CAN help but chooses not to. She loves to push my buttons and does so like a real champion.

The bottom line is, I don't have to deal with her issues in my home 24/7, thank God, or I'd be writing a post like yours, I'm sure. Whether your MIL is doing what she's doing intentionally, unintentionally, or a combination of both (most likely), you need to have a Come to Jesus meeting with your hubby and let him know it's time for his mother to move into a Memory Care Assisted Living residence now. You've had enough and you're at the end of your rope. There should be no shame in making such a statement, either, because dementia normally reaches a point where in-home care becomes IMPOSSIBLE for most human beings for many reasons. That's why Memory Care ALFs are popping up on every corner. If your MIL does not have the $$$ to self pay, then apply for Medicaid and see about placing her in a Skilled Nursing Facility instead. In the end, you will all be better off for making the right decision.

Wishing you the best of luck laying down the law now and crying uncle.

TArden9 Aug 2020
YES. My mom does the same thing.AND..YES..I believe she is doing most of this on purpose. I have tried everything possible from confrontation of facts to ignoring her. She actually told her neighbor she does it on purpose.
Isthisrealyreal Aug 2020
That would be the end for her at my house.
cherokeegrrl54 Aug 2020
With dementia in the mix, its hard to tell isnt it? Record these episodes on your phone and make your husband watch them. Just may open his eyes to what is really going on. He should be supporting you in this, not his mommy!!!
AlvaDeer Aug 2020
Yup. I would LOVE to see this recording as well. I think we should show it to Hubby and to the District Attorney or Adult Protective Services.
Clementine49 Aug 2020
Not everyone is cut out to be a caregiver. Here's an article that might help: https://www.agingcare.com/articles/not-everyone-cut-out-to-be-a-caregiver-162192.htm
LoopyLoo Aug 2020
Thing is, she shouldn't be the caregiver at all. It's her husband's mother, not hers.
AlvaDeer Aug 2020
The behavior you are describing sounds like someone with dementia. It also sounds, in certain instances like someone who is terrified and who is being abused.
I am more than a bit disturbed by how you describe your living circumstances, in all truth. "Blabbering nonsense" (2 times), "Her HABITUAL weeping session", "crying drama", "conniving old woman", "she would pretend she doesn't know what's going on", "I just ignore her", "I shut her in her room", "The moment I confronted her she put on a show shaking..", "the things these guys do are deliberate".,"ignore her and shut the door", "I know it's deliberate", "I don't coddle her", "they put on a show", "they act pitiful and weak". She is "the laziest, the dirtiest and the greediest"....
There are those on the forum who believe that we should never really give our honest opinion of the OPs who write questions; that these people (translate "you") are under pressure and suffering. That we should be sympathetic. Well, that isn't me, and it won't be me my worst day alive. So if what I am writing is "wrong", then report me, and let the chips fall where they may; I trust the admins to make any decision they feel is best.
I have no doubt you are suffering. And I have no doubt your husband is suffering caught between his ill Mom and a furious wife. But I fear your MIL may be suffering a good deal more than both of you put together. Not only is she not in charge of her life, not only is she ill, but she is trapped and helpless, isolated with a DIL who seems quite honestly to loath her. She is defenseless.
I am not one to pussy foot around what I am hearing. Your letter, which you have volunteered to us describes someone who seems to me abusive. I do not know why anyone would even ADMIT to the things you feel, the things you have done. The things you have said. I shudder to think what this woman, your mother-in-law is going through. Do you do these things you describe in front of her son, and does he let you, or is he completely unaware, and is your MIL too afraid or too confused to tell him.
Please get your mother in law placed for her OWN safety, and please get yourself some psychological help. Please tell your husband you are no longer mentally able to care for her and that she is in danger.
To tell you the truth I have NEVER seen anything this disturbing since I have been on Forum.
Just my humble opinion, but my heart absolutely BLEEDS for your poor MIL.
TArden9 Aug 2020
Your assumptions of her honest frustrations are judgmental. I feel bad for her and her MIL and family. taking care of mentally ill people especially family members is not easy and i am grateful for this forum. Hopefully a place that anyone can express TRUTH without judgement. Caregivers of dementia struggle with living in a daily expression of the "patients" illusions. MY mom does EXACTLY the same thing. pretends to cry. repeats what she KNOWS to get a reaction. (I ignore) My mom says.."Your yelling at me!" (pretty much 50 times a day) I do not yell at her. My mom apologizes and says I love you another 50 times a day. My mom repeats the same tape recorder incorrect beliefs sitting in the living room. she pretends to cough and hack and blow her dry nose everyday sitting in the living room. She talks to objects like they are people. She will talk on the phone and not know who she is talking too..but pretend to know the person. As soon as a neighbor comes by..she is
perfectly fine. She even forgets she has oxygen and cant breathe. My mom forgets to take her medication. She thinks the bed vibrates because everyone in the neighbor hood has their air conditioners on. she will walk into peoples houses and yell at them because they keep her up.
Now.. the from where i sit..the issue with caregivers is needing support with what works in the moment and keeping a hold on reality while living in illusions. Lisa82 can see the truth. And i admire her expression of it. Maybe just me letting her know that her MIL and my mom act similar and how each of us deal with it may help her own sanity.
LoopyLoo Aug 2020
Why is this person living in your home, and WHY are you the sole caregiver when your husband should be? It’s his mother, not yours.

JoAnn29 Aug 2020
People suffering from Dementia become like small children. Like playing parent against parent. You are the baddie. 😊 Pretty sure u wil, get some answers to this one.

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