Asking me not to talk to their mom about her assets. I am a volunteer advocate as this woman had no one. She has not heard from her 45 year old daughter in 6 months. This daughter calls me up and tells me her mom's budget for caregiving, and I wanted to say "Why are you calling me?" She was concerned as people are advising her to refinance and if the mom needs help, she should call them.
My part in it. I am a caregiver and was too busy to caregive for her. I sis put advocating for 6 months. I found an awesome team. The day after this daughter tells me to cut back on them.

I know this has nothing to do with me, but does it? But, it is so obvious she wants mom's assets and mom is only 71. I asked her who the mom's medical poa is, she would not tell me. Again she never calls or sees her.


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“But, it is so obvious she wants mom's assets and mom is only 71”.

That is another assumption of yours, because finances and assets are important. This woman’s daughter could be worried about finances because her mother is still relatively young and is thinking her mother may need money for her future care needs.

When you bring a question to a public forum you are inviting discussion. It’s not being judgemental but more like presenting different scenarios.

It appears that your heart is in the right place but please don’t jump into such complicated situations & expect everyone to agree with you. You have come here voluntarily and ask for the forum’s “thoughts”.

You assume the daughter doesn’t care because she only called her mother once in 6 months. You don’t really know that for sure. The woman may be playing you! You’ve stated this woman leaves her financial info all around the house for all to see. She may not be of sound mind or she could be adept at manipulation.

You make assumptions: who doesn’t call their mother for 6 whole months? Must be a bad daughter. Yet her son is around frequently. Daughter asking you not to talk about her mother’s assets - don’t you see why this would be a concern?

You are comparing their relationship to you and your mother’s. If you are going to be an objective “helper” you have to be willing to work with others that do not share your opinion, wipe the slate clean and not have your opinion get in the way AT ALL. I am a RN, have been for 40 years. I have seen many funky family situations over the years and am willing to accept that those situations I may think are odd *work* for that family unit. Abuse, a totally different story - I report it & fight like the devil as a patient advocate.

Use this as a a learning experience and keep moving forward.
Helpful Answer (5)

The children may seem "difficult" but the full story isn't known to you. The mother leaves her income information lying around for all to see--interesting. And why would an adult child stay gone so long--for no reason?

My mother always pretended to be an angel to her "friends" and family but is the meanest person I've ever known. Over the last half century she has painted herself as the innocent victim and me, the only one who stands up to her, as the monster who left inexplicably and won't have any more to do with her. She leaves her will lying around, turned to the page that shows what each person will get so that she can be in control and have everyone flock around and suck up to her.

What little you've said about this woman rings a bell--there may be more to the story than met your eye.
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AlvaDeer Aug 2019
Davina, from her replies it is pretty clear to me that the adult children are quite involved. They in fact gave the caregiver an exact amount that their Mom had budgeted per month to pay for in home care, I believe the sum was 1,200. It seems pretty clear to me that the children feel there is some overstepping of bounds here, and they may be worried about their Mom. While the caregiver-arranger of care--advocate claims that there are family issues she doesn't know what they are. I think she well may be getting a lot of differing information. I think the children, knowing that the arranger-advocate is attending their Mom at doctor visits, may feel that she is pressuring to step into some sort of POA for health or financial. While none of us here can ever know the answers in this mixup, I think that with a woman who is NOT demented, in her early 70s, already with caregivers and with a family who seems to know a good deal more than she thinks they do--well, it sounds like a good situation for her to step away from. This woman again is NOT demented, and is well able, apparently to arrange her care and handle her finances, and if not does have family who clearly knows enough to know the exact amount budgeted for monthly in home care.
No one is accusing this woman of elder fraud, but I do think there is a family here with "issues" as she says, that she can have no idea of, and any sort of explosion of accusations would leave her in trouble. She says that she is a Licensed Advocate. I don't even know what that is and haven't heard of it, but there are more things in heaven than I know of; my concern would be for her licensure.
I think she would be well advised to step away from what is clearly a mess; the woman is receiving good care and is not in danger and is not in need of help; she has no dementia. And does have help ready should she require it.
The caregiver has suggested in her original post, at the end, that the daughter wants the Mom's assets. While the daughter may not be overly fond of the Mom--who is to know--she has suggested that the Mom has budgets 1,200 per month to spend on in home care. This doesn't sound to me like someone trying to wring cash out of a failing parent. And the fact that the advocate feels this way about the family suggests that she has made her mind up, and may no longer be a disinterested party in this matter.
Just my thoughts.
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"Regardless of all that, My motives are this "pay it forward", why is that such a bad thing. I want not one thing but for this woman who applied for help to get the help she needs and now she does and that makes me happy"

To whom did you client apply for help??

"I have nothing to do with anything other than to see the look on the mothers face of the contentment and feeling loved was worth all of the words I said wrong, incorrectly."

Do you have an accurate, unbiased history of this family? From both sides?

We are being blunt because you appear to be an outsider who is catering to this clients "wants" while at the same time not attending to the limitation of her income/assets.

Frankly, I think you are reasoning from a false assumption. Someone who is broadcasting their assets has a cognitive problem.
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how can I close this post down
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AlvaDeer Aug 2019
I don't know that you can. Perhaps someone else does. However, if you do not return to it people are likely not to see new comments and it will tend to disappear into the great blue yonder. There are no names. No one has a clue who you are. So just leave the post, get on with life, and you will be just fine.
I agree with Joann, you aren’t finishing your thoughts so your replies are all over the place and hard to piece together.

I can see why they told you not to talk to their mom about her assets-her assets are really none of your business. You are apparently doing this “pro bono”/for free so they are probably concerned and wondering what your motives are. You say the daughter also told you that if mom needs help she should call them, well she’s right. I think you back off and let her kids handle things.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
All of you are correct.

I am a very positive person, and reading this and the responses is obvious that I am the one that did not word any of this correctly.

I want NO glory for any of what I do, this has been my passion since I cared for my mother for 12 years.

Next time, maybe I will rewrite something that makes no sense.

Regardless of all that, My motives are this "pay it forward", why is that such a bad thing. I want not one thing but for this woman who applied for help to get the help she needs and now she does and that makes me happy.

I have nothing to do with anything other than to see the look on the mothers face of the contentment and feeling loved was worth all of the words I said wrong, incorrectly.

I want to say something though. Why are people so at times blunt on here.

I did not write this to get any star, I wrote it because after 6 months a daughter calls me and tells me all of this stuff which I find odd, because her mother and her had not talked for 6 months.

Thanks have a good day.
Yes, I find this whole thread confusing.

What I get from it is that it throws you off that after you do all this work probono that this woman has a daughter who knows her Moms income but does not get involved with her care.

I think the problem is u don't finish your thoughts. And, sorry, I personally am not comfortable with people who toot their own horn.

At this point I think you should step back. Like it or not her children need to help her. You have found her resources its now her children's job to use them.

I am 70 and I hope at 71 I could figure out what I have to work with when it comes to money. I would think as an advocate you would need to be aware of a person's finances to be able to know what resources she would need and afford.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
you are right, I did not finish my own thoughts, and no i do not toot my own horn. I was trying to explain that the mother was very uncomfortable with this, because now I find out, as I talked to the mother today, her daughter when she does come to visit, the caregivers quit. I guess next time I will know differently.

I have stepped back, and am. I will let you know that her children will not help her, they told me that yesterday. It is too weird of a situation to write out.

I don't give a darn how much I did, it is the end result. A person that is disabled that had no help that I was able to find help for.

How did I get involved between the mother and daughter. They have not been speaking for 6 months. I don't know the drama .

I will end this post with I have learned a lot.
Goodness - sorry again, I hadn't realised how many responses there had already been!

But I'm not much less confused.

Makeadifference - to go back to Square 1, WHY does a woman of seventy-one need caregivers?

And, just to pick up on one detail, adults of sound mind do not generally announce their financial information to everybody who walks into their condo.

Again, I applaud you for caring what becomes of this lady, but I'm not at all sure that you're not seriously out of your depth.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
Disability hip surgery and bone on bone and complications

She has her income for all to see when she walks in the house. That is who she is.

You are correct. I am a very private person

Out of my depth. ????

I have been a paid unpaid private consultant, Concierge, Aide, Advocate all certified and licensed.

This story is over. I should have never started writing it, there are so many people on here that "oh what are the motives" that makes someone feel wierd. I write on an Aging Care,I thought the word care means these people care.

My motives were simple, "pay it forward" After you pay it forward you move on. I will obviously not focus on this one, as I myself would never ever again work for a family with difficult children. And yes, children that tell me they have and won't come up because of their mom are 1, not taking good care of her, and 2. they choose to pick on the volunteer, whatever my life is moving on

Thanks though for you politeness
I'm sorry, but I'm terribly confused about the detail of what has happened.

You have become aware of a lady of 71 who seems to need support.
How? Is she a friend, a neighbour, how do you know her?

Why is this lady in need of support? What are her difficulties? Why does she need caregivers?

The lady tells you that she has not heard from her adult daughter in six months.
Are you sure that's true?

The refinancing - who is advising whom to consider refinancing as an option, and what for?

You say you put together an awesome team, and all credit to you for looking for practical solutions. But if you are concerned about this lady's welfare and have no real authorisation to act on her behalf, it would be better to contact either your Area Agency on Aging or Adult Protective Services and ask them to connect with her. They're professionals, and they do have the authority to act.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
I did not give myself the credit, it was the way I worded it.

I typed up an add and she and I went through it.

How do I know, because this woman or daughter adult admitted it.
and I only live 6 miles away.

I do have authorization to act on her behalf. I have the medical pot that the mother just gave the me and the two other caregivers that are near her. I was on it as a back up not the main person.

I want to move on with positiveness please.
I’m still trying to piece this together.
What exactly is your issue? I don’t mean to be glib. Do you now feel uncomfortable with the arrangements? That the daughter got on the phone & said her mother has a $1200 budget for home care? That won’t go too far.
Does mother have to refinance her home to pay for her care or are her assets liquid?

Lets turn the tables for a moment. What if this was your mother & a stranger appeared in her life. Over time that stranger and your mother have developed a relationship and now the stranger is no longer a stranger but essentially a CG/advocate running ads, interviewing staff, signing forms, getting paperwork together.

Maybe the daughter is wary of you. You haven’t really said anything nice about the daughter so I can assume you’ve formed your opinion on her & it’s not viewed as warm and fuzzy. Maybe she senses this. I too would be on the look out to assure the stranger doesn’t overstep professional CG barriers where my mother was concerned. But you are not really her CG nor a friend. So yes there is enough red flags for me as a daughter and I will monitor you to protect mom.

What is your worry? Are you second guessing your decision to arrange for care? Did you do something that you regret or are you afraid of litigation? Something you are not certified legally to do?

I am still unclear.

I say this’s better to be seen as working as a team with the client & their family unless the client chooses to shut out her kids. You’ve pre-judged her daughter as uncaring and cheap with mom’s resources but her mother is competent and writes the checks to the CG agency so it is a non issue. Something is bothering you about all these transactions, it seems. Do you feel you shouldn’t have did what you did?

Moving forward use this as a learning experience in your quest to be an elderly advocate.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
My mother would NEVER have a stranger appear, because I was with my Alzheimer's mother for 12 years of her life until the night she passed away.
I would never not talk to my mother. The mother has stated her daughter has issues. I don't care I don't want to know about that stuff.

I had everything nice to say about her when I met her one week ago. Then she said she wanted to call to let her brother know what we talked about when we met. She called and took the floor and all she cared about was not her mother, but the finances.

I just don't care anymore, I am sorry but if I have many positives on my caregiving, why would the daughter call me, I don't know, but I don't have to talk to her again.

I have been doing this for 15 years, I did just get 7 months ago my certification to be a Elderly Advocate in my State.

Nothing is bothering me. What I tried, was getting back on Aging care and I still find it the same. Number one. right a question that is simple. That is my first lesson, and 2, it appears that people are judging me and they don't know me but that does not matter.

All I was wonder was one question.

But, thanks to all of the support I have received I took it to my Elder Care Attorney, because it was obvious this was too detailed to write here and I did not mean to confuse everyone, but I did not mean to be the stranger that shows up on the door.

And I get it, get along with the kids, 15 years, do you know what adult kids are like at times, when mom and dads money is involved.

This is to me the best job in the world, caring for those who need care, but to me the family is what makes or breaks my jobs.

I have 5 wonderful families that treat me like gold. That is all I want to say, and I truly feel blessed. All I wanted was one woman to get the support she was not getting from her children, and I know that because they live across country.

She finally found support God Bless to her
The Client tells everyone who walks in her condo what her resources are. She is not demented. She has an active bright brain.

She needed to know about how to get from A to B to C.

I have very strict guidelines that I need to follow as a certified Advocate for the Elderly.

She heard from the home health nurse when client started talking about paying for care, he said there are many options, but refinancing is one way, but there are many others as well.

All I am is the one that Lynda must talk about alot to the son, because I was there when no one was.

She does not have a POA, and is doing it now.

No the daughter called me to apparently let her brother know about her mom's health and what we discussed. We never discussed when I met her to never discuss her resources.

All I am saying, is this client is sound mind body and able, she can do anything she wants, I would want nothing to do with any of it legally, because my life is a very calm life, and by being a truly caring person and many times assisting her needs, I guess I am the person that gets told.
I told Lynda she needs to be responsible for her caregivers.

She picked their hours, she picked the days.

Sorry to be so confusing. I guess after the call, I was like, there is a huge part of the family dynamics I am missing, and I am glad I immediately texted them in the beginning, and I have never heard from either one of them regarding any of these details.

I did give her an eldercare number, and she can afford care and she pays it with her money when her caregivers give her invoices.
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importantly as a volunteer by choice, my job will never be done in life, but I want nothing for any of this.

I did meet the daughter with her mom. It was weird that the daughter texted me. I politely texted her back.

She said lets follow up in 2 weeks, to regroup. I said great, that would be fabulous.

I took the call and her twin brother was on the phone almost 97% silent. She started talking all about finances.

I never would ever give anyone advice about their finances ever. I am a former Corporate woman with a Series 7 and 11 years ago. If someone is homebound and mentally fit and she is very mentally fit, the nurse told her today, "she can make any decision on any document she wants",

This clients issues are chronic pain, not crazy in the head.

The daughter told me that my mom has a 1200 a month budget. I said, I did not know that for caregiving? She said yes. I said, does your mom know that. She did nothing but put her mom down. This client, shares with every harry dick and jane her income. She needs financial counseling. I advised her to go to a class. Alot of people advise her, they do not tell her to do this or that. I never tell a client they need to do this.

I said "if you need assistance with money, you should or if I were you find a class online"

So I am not legally into it because i have never been paid a penny and I have talked to the home health team that she has, and she has the home health team because I have signed all of the legal documents to get and obtain information and to be able to call the doctors office.
Now that she has her team, I can focus on my life. The daughters demeanor was tell her to call us. I said, I thought you are not talking to her, and that is not my business, but I certainly will.
This is an issue between mother and daughter, and the mother is very upset because I have been the only human being that has helped her through some very dark times.

I have an Eldercare attorney, I am apprised of the wording that I need to use.
The daughter seemed very fixed on the money, nothing else, and the son said three words, because he lets his sister control the show.

All I am saying is that it really left a bad taste in my mouth because where are they? They are several states away.

I am never giving anyone legal or financial advice. I have not taken a penny from her. I have from my heart given her things she needed for her disability that I had from previous clients that had given me for other to use.

I truly am the person that is a kind hearted person, and Elder Abuse, to me is someone that never visits nor asks about their mom, and does not know that she has had some serious issues, and they obviously have had my number as I have been texting them to get some help, as I have my own career and clients.

She was and is a very as her mom said greedy person, and wants the condo because of this and that. What does that have to do with me?

I guess I am bad at writing my own issues, but honestly I would never again work for a client with adult children drama.

I have the nicest clients with the most awesome children, and I am licensed, and advanced trained in most all areas of ADL,
Alzheimer's Dementia, Chronic Pain, Parkinson's but all I really have been to her at the end of this is a person that she can turn to that happens to be a part time caregiver that will not care for her because I have a job as an accountant and do not have the time. It is like a part time thing. With chronic pain because she needs a hip surgery, that is not an easy thing.

Her caregivers were chosen by her.

Can all of you re read that and let me know what you think.

It does to me feel like "run" and run fast, but the two women that she hired legally are really great, and the daughter said, why don't you cut down there hours. I said, that is not my place to, your mother is in charge.

Everyone else is giving her advice, not you have to do this.
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Hello and thanks to all of you and allow me to share a bit more, because all of you have very valid points.

I work as a part time caregiver, (licensed), and as a Certified Advocate. There are not enough to go around as there are many people that need assistance. I have been a very caring philanthropist in my life, and I really truly love what I do.

I have a variety of care jobs.

I met the 71 year old in february. At that time, and I know because I never heard a word about the children that live out of state that she had no contact with your daughter. (she just came up here and saw her mom for 3 hours). She did not mention anything at all other that questions to her mom.

I wanted from the standpoint that this woman had no adult children here to care for her to talk to her children.

I emailed them both back in March, and stated my concerns, and her son called me back, and was very nice, and I felt it was an open topic. He said he would call me from time to time.

I never had heard back from him.

The daughter said "I am not sure what you want to talk about, but Dory can talk to you and get back to me"

That was in March

The client in the meantime became homebound. I have a full-time plus another 5 jobs of my own that I am paid for, but I am a person that believes in giving from your heart to help those in need.

Because I was to her a Volunteer Advocate, I have a certificate in Advocacy with the Elderly, however I did not and don't charge her.

She had an ad on, she picked the people, I ADVISED HER ON NOTHING. I did exactly what the IN HOME HEALTH PEOPLE DID. They talked about her options in paying for care.

She is not a person that has Dementia at all, that is another client. I should update my profile, but thanks to all of you for helping me.

I went with her to her doctors and signed a form that the doctor required because I am helping her. ADL. Not everyday, and my goal was to assist not tell her, in finding the right people for her. I have a gift in doing this for a living, and by that, I mean I have done this several times for clients and caregiving teams are needed when a patient is in chronic pain.

I don't spend a lot of time over there, but she is a person that I do enjoy talking to. The Client.

In caregiving, we can only give ideas, if they ask (the client).

So 6 months had gone by, and the client said she was so frustrated because her daughter had disowned her. As a human being I said, "I think that sons and daughters possible have their own reasons, and it is not disowning, but please know those are my thoughts"

Then home health came in and she got three other peoples thoughts. This has been weighing on her. Her daughter not talking to her.

So her daughter has a rental home in her area. She was here two weeks before she visited.

The client (or unpaid client)has alot of issues and home health is caring for her, none of them are about mental acuity. She is bright, with it and can make her own decisions.

When I say I found her caregiving team, I assisted her. I wrote in what I think she needed, and two woman applied and she asked me to write to them, as typically I have good skills, I guess, I am in my gut a little worried. Because the truth is this.
Friday after 6 months this team was put together. I assisted and the Client made the decisions, the client chose the people, the client made all of that herself.

The daughter then would only text me when she was here to see her mom, no her own mom, and I met her for 1 hour.

The client has a hard time communicating things properly and she stated things that I could not believe, about the truth but I do not want to be acknowledge for anything other making a difference hence "makeadifference" in a person's life.

I have been the only adult she has had to lean on. I have given her and entire resources book to lean on.

She now has caregivers that are very good and everything is legal, more
Helpful Answer (1)

I don't know why, if this person is demented at all, you would believe that she has an uninterested family, BUT if you are not licensed to do you, and you are advising her on financial things and providing her a "team" of some sort, advising on care and assets, I think that you need to be EXTREMELY careful at this time.
You say that she has no family. However, it seems that she DOES have family and they have found out about your voluntary advising pretty quickly, and have swooped right in on you.
You describe yourself as a voluntary advocate for this woman. You also describe yourself as a caregiver. I am very concerned that you would not direct this woman, who apparently wishes to discuss her financial affairs, to call either family or if none wish contact, an elder law attorney for direction and quidance, or even her own bank, who could act as fiduciary for her should she so wish.
I fear you could be coming very close to being accused of Elder Abuse, and dependent on the state and area you live in, the process alone, even if you are completely innocent and well meaning, can be scary and costly. Should you have to answer in court you would need to hire your own attorney. Always expensive.
So I would never give any financial advice to any elder were I you, but would attempt to guide them to qualified and licensed people who can act in their interest if their family is either unwilling or unable.
Take great care, and protect yourself.

I am uncertain how much you can know or trust in how much communication there is currently or has been, because boy, they sure got wind of this voluntary advice fast. They may be very concerned that someone is trying to defraud their elder relative.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
Thanks for your post, I never said demented.

Also, I never said I gave her financial advice. I never ever would do that.

Elder Abuse is not finding or assisting her in typing what she needed and she told me who to call.

To me Elder Abuse is a daughter who has no contact with her mother because "she has not time for it" in January of 2019, then calls me today and apparently has all the time in the world. This woman needed her children, the son said, I purposely don't come up there what can I do but hear her cry.

it obviously is a dysfunctional family and I appreciate you writing.
Makeadifference, I see from your profile that the client who has Alzheimer's is living Independent Living? To clarify, does that mean that the client is living in a senior facility, or is she living in her own house? This is where I am not clear, as usually with Independent Living one doesn't need a caregiver, as the Staff in the facility handles what is needed, and the Staff contacts the appointed family member.

When it comes to caring for a "client" one usually speaks to whomever is the financial Power of Attorney before any caregivers are hired. How is the caregiver or caregivers being paid? I would assume the family POA is handling this matter.

One also needs to remember, whenever someone has Alzheimer's/Dementia it is not usual for them to make up stories, like the client telling you she has no one. The client could very easily be speaking with her grown children on a regular basis but telling you something totally different.

This could also be a case where the client refuses to leave her home to move closer to her children. Or refuses to move into Assisted Living/Memory Care. Thus, the children do not want to enable the situation.

Considering the client's age is only 71 or 72, Alzheimer's can be part of her life for up to 15 years, thus I can understand her children wanting to be careful with Mom's funds so the funds can last over those years. Aging is costly, I know I had major sticker shock when it came to my parents own care.
Helpful Answer (2)

It is too bad the daughter doesn't visit or help with the confusion.  Is the woman at home?  Does she have any money to pay for living costs?  Does she have a social worker who can speak with daughter?  Not sure what it is you want to know.
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Makeadifference Aug 2019
Yes she is at home.

I took ads out on that she paid for and I wrote the ads she picked the people, and I was there to help her interview, because I have the experience.

Barely enough for the cost.

I don't want any glory, but she has a social worker, an in home RN a Physical therapy and occupational therapy.

She is homebound.

She can live yes.

I want to know nothing anymore. I wish people knew that I am only human, and I left this site years ago for the reasons that people need to be more careful with their words.

my husband said he is married to "one of the most compassionate loving women for the elderly that he knows"

The end.
I'm sorry but your post is very unclear. I don't understand what the issues are.

You are a volunteer advocate for a woman with Dementia. The woman is 71.

You have found her an awesome team.

The women's daughter called you and told you what her mother's resources are?

Who is going to refinance what property?

Who holds Financial POA for this woman?
Helpful Answer (2)
Makeadifference Aug 2019
Barb you are correct. I wrote and I was sent and I could not get it back.

She does NOT have dementia at all.

She was on I wrote the add, she picked the people.
She was of sound mind body and able to make changes to anything. I have a talent for knowing someone and then finding them. I am a certified Advocate that normally gets paid to do this, but this one woman I felt needed assistance and that assistance has built her self esteem and actually now she feels so much love and assistance.

The woman's daughter called me as I guess she now wants to get involved, as possibly she thinks I have a motive. Ask the homeless what my motive was. Ask the young man who I paid it forward what the motive was. My motive, is that I want to as much as I can afford help people in this area because I know alot about this business and about the people in the care business and want to always to my best to lead people in the right direction.
An Advocate be it paid or unpaid is trained and they are the roadmap through the eldercare process.

It was just an odd call, and the mother is really frustrated, because this budget stuff was from when the children came there four years ago. She became homebound with huge gaping vascular sores. I gave her my comment: I am driving you to the ER.

Thanks for your advice
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