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I. How We Work in Washington. Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services. APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
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III. When We Tour. APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment. You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints. Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights. APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.I agree that: A.I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information"). B.APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink. C.APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site. D.If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records. E.This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year. F.You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
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Thank you for taking the time to respond. I appreciated it. We are trying to form the case…we know what happened is not right and every single social worker we talk to, as well as other medical professionals tell us we have one.
So we’ve actually done a lot of work so far, and have documentation, and a timeline It’s just hard to keep up with the actions and manipulations of the bad actors, care for our father, ( given the circumstances) and work full time.
Yes indeed. I hear you. I know we need to prove undue influence, violation of. scope of practice, coercion and manipulation. Here is what I synopsized earlier…it’s just a part of the story.
There are very few lawyers in Michigan willing to dig into an undue influence case. That is changing. But they are harder to prove. Thus, no “facts” no case. However this is changing. The lawyer we were working with, wiling to connect the dots, and look at the patterns of behavior AND the facts could not continue because of a bad illness and overflowing caseload …. ………………………………………………………….. “I actually wrote a very detailed account of my situation with my Dad, but decided to erase the post because I had a paranoid moment of the problematic bad actor “finding out”. I tried to erase this rather vaguely stated query, but the system wouldn’t let me, and I”m new here, so getting up to speed navigating the whole forum thing.
My sister and I have spent months and months documenting, making phone calls /lawyer consults, lots of them…. The result is that I have come to discover that the courts may function but they are horrible with addressing influencing factors that have created the problem in the first place. Be that as it may…
To respond as to whether there is a case or not: My father was taken out of a brain injury rehab center while being treated for a TBI and multiple injuries, without the knowledge or consent of the acting MPOA, my sister and myself.
We had just gotten our 92 year old dad safely out of the hospital, after a horrible premature discharge, after a major care accident ( his abusive “girlfriend” at fault). Broken neck, sternum, and documented diagnosed TBI for which neuropsych evaluation was ordered pre-release to the rehab facility. My sister has been until recently our father’s MPOA and advocate, guiding him through countless falls, emergency room visits, operations, and much much more.
My sister specifically requested they wait until our father had understood all his options, which he had agreed to do with my sister, and we were setting up that appoinment with an excellent probate attn.
The RN and her brother and sister ignored us and took our father out of the facility …they had been manipulating him prior. our father into signing a sweeping DPOA giving the RN’s brother total control of our father’s finances. She later manipulated herself into the MPOA position. She interfered twice with our fathers VA PCP’s follow up to schedule the neuropsych and the VA has this in their records. The brother, the DPOA stopped communicating with us after he attained his new appointment.
We are working on filing an APS case, and a complaint to the SBON. Finally got an appointment with a psychotherapist social worker specializing in Elders and their families and complex problems, and he asked again if we had found a good lawyer.
These are people, our cousins, who never. showed up to help our parents until only very recently. “
Attorneys, if they are honest with you will let you know that there is no "recovery" in a case of an elder over 60 years of age. Because recovery is limited to 250,000 and attorneys would need to INVEST much more than that in information gathering, expert witnesses and proof of wrong doing outside any norm expected, they will not take on such a case. They would have to invest tremendous amounts of time and trouble attempting to gather evidence and the DAMAGES (which always come down to financial recompense) on an elder, not expected to live many more productive years in any case is almost ZERO. I hope some attorney has been honest enough to tell you this; if not, run what I said past them and ask for their opinion of what I said here.
Next, if you are being asked for money for anything you are being taken advantage of for your lack of knowledge in wrongful death or injury cases. Please never put in your own money. If they don't take it on contingency that is THEM telling YOU that there is no case.
Next, The only cases that get anywhere are cases where the person injured is NOT dead, but is SO injured that they will need private complete care for a lifetime AND the person had a good job and HAS a family who will be robbed of their lifetime of earnings. Now, THAT IS A CASE, and even those are difficult to prove.
I do wish you good luck, whatever case you are here working on. Please find an attorney who will really level with you about the current laws, the current amounts of damages allowed, the current likelihood of GETTING any damages. You need some very honest attorneys here who will avoid hurt feelings and truly level with you about the advisability of continuing on with all of this.
When there is death and injury, grief counselors tell us, people will do anything to stay in denial and away from truth, because the latter means there is nothing but a difficult walk through the finality of grief. They will blame facilities and doctors, even family members, and sadly EVEN THEMSELVES. It is a known phenomenon, and exceptionally common. I am so sorry for all the grief you have endured.
If the elder was influenced while not having a documented medical diagnosis of cognitive impairment, I don't think you have a case.
If the elder was manipulated after a medical diagnosis of sufficient cognitive impairment was in their medical records, this is more proveable. But you still have to have actual proof of what and when.
If you lose the case you still have to pay the attorney.
Thank you very much for your response, I actually wrote a very detailed account of my situation with my Dad, but decided to erase the post because I had a paranoid moment of the problematic bad actor “finding out”. I tried to erase this rather vaguely stated query, but the system wouldn’t let me, and I”m new here, so getting up to speed navigating the whole forum thing.
My sister and I have spent months and months documenting, making phone calls /lawyer consults, lots of them…. The result is that I have come to discover that the courts may function but they are horrible with addressing influencing factors that have created the problem in the first place. Be that as it may…
To respond as to whether there is a case or not: My father was taken out of a brain injury rehab center while being treated for a TBI and multiple injuries, without the knowledge or consent of the acting MPOA, my sister and myself.
We had just gotten our 92 year old dad safely out of the hospital, after a horrible premature discharge, after a major care accident ( his abusive “girlfriend” at fault). Broken neck, sternum, and documented diagnosed TBI for which neuropsych evaluation was ordered pre-release to the rehab facility. My sister has been until recently our father’s MPOA and advocate, guiding him through countless falls, emergency room visits, operations, and much much more.
My sister specifically requested they wait until our father had understood all his options, which he had agreed to do with my sister, and we were setting up that appoinment with an excellent probate attn.
The RN and her brother and sister ignored us and took our father out of the facility …they had been manipulating him prior. our father into signing a sweeping DPOA giving the RN’s brother total control of our father’s finances. She later manipulated herself into the MPOA position. She interfered twice with our fathers VA PCP’s follow up to schedule the neuropsych and the VA has this in their records. The brother, the DPOA stopped communicating with us after he attained his new appointment.
We are working on filing an APS case, and a complaint to the SBON. Finally got an appointment with a psychotherapist social worker specializing in Elders and their families and complex problems, and he asked again if we had found a good lawyer.
These are people, our cousins, who never. showed up to help our parents until only very recently.
There is no covert under the law, really. Things can either be PROVEN or not. If something is "hidden" (covert) then it can either be flushed out and proven in court or it doesn't exist.
We don't even have a clue here what sort of lawyer you are speaking of? Criminal? Real Estate? Trust and Estate?
I suggest that you talk to those you know in your own area, do a bit of looking online for exactly whatever type of attorney you require, and buy and hour of time to discuss whether or not you have "options" for "a case". While some will ask for contingency fees make it clear that you need a simple bit of advice whether or not you need/can use an attorney. And that you wish to pay by the hour.
Whatever your case, I wish you luck, but remember, things under the law cannot be "hidden" or "assumed". They are either proven or not proven. Good luck.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
We are trying to form the case…we know what happened is not right and every single social worker we talk to, as well as other medical professionals tell us we have one.
So we’ve actually done a lot of work so far, and have documentation, and a timeline It’s just hard to keep up with the actions and manipulations of the bad actors, care for our father, ( given the circumstances) and work full time.
Yes indeed. I hear you. I know we need to prove undue influence, violation of. scope of practice, coercion and manipulation. Here is what I synopsized earlier…it’s just a part of the story.
There are very few lawyers in Michigan willing to dig into an undue influence case. That is changing. But they are harder to prove. Thus, no “facts” no case.
However this is changing.
The lawyer we were working with, wiling to connect the dots, and look at the patterns of behavior AND the facts could not continue because of a bad illness and overflowing caseload ….
…………………………………………………………..
“I actually wrote a very detailed account of my situation with my Dad, but decided to erase the post because I had a paranoid moment of the problematic bad actor “finding out”. I tried to erase this rather vaguely stated query, but the system wouldn’t let me, and I”m new here, so getting up to speed navigating the whole forum thing.
My sister and I have spent months and months documenting, making phone calls /lawyer consults, lots of them….
The result is that I have come to discover that the courts may function but they are horrible with addressing influencing factors that have created the problem in the first place. Be that as it may…
To respond as to whether there is a case or not: My father was taken out of a brain injury rehab center while being treated for a TBI and multiple injuries, without the knowledge or consent of the acting MPOA, my sister and myself.
We had just gotten our 92 year old dad safely out of the hospital, after a horrible premature discharge, after a major care accident ( his abusive “girlfriend” at fault). Broken neck, sternum, and documented diagnosed TBI for which neuropsych evaluation was ordered pre-release to the rehab facility. My sister has been until recently our father’s MPOA and advocate, guiding him through countless falls, emergency room visits, operations, and much much more.
My sister specifically requested they wait until our father had understood all his options, which he had agreed to do with my sister, and we were setting up that appoinment with an excellent probate attn.
The RN and her brother and sister ignored us and took our father out of the facility …they had been manipulating him prior. our father into signing a sweeping DPOA giving the RN’s brother total control of our father’s finances. She later manipulated herself into the MPOA position.
She interfered twice with our fathers VA PCP’s follow up to schedule the neuropsych and the VA has this in their records.
The brother, the DPOA stopped communicating with us after he attained his new appointment.
We are working on filing an APS case, and a complaint to the SBON. Finally got an appointment with a psychotherapist social worker specializing in Elders and their families and complex problems, and he asked again if we had found a good lawyer.
These are people, our cousins, who never. showed up to help our parents until only very recently. “
Any other thoughts most appreciated.
thank you!
I hope some attorney has been honest enough to tell you this; if not, run what I said past them and ask for their opinion of what I said here.
Next, if you are being asked for money for anything you are being taken advantage of for your lack of knowledge in wrongful death or injury cases. Please never put in your own money. If they don't take it on contingency that is THEM telling YOU that there is no case.
Next, The only cases that get anywhere are cases where the person injured is NOT dead, but is SO injured that they will need private complete care for a lifetime AND the person had a good job and HAS a family who will be robbed of their lifetime of earnings. Now, THAT IS A CASE, and even those are difficult to prove.
I do wish you good luck, whatever case you are here working on.
Please find an attorney who will really level with you about the current laws, the current amounts of damages allowed, the current likelihood of GETTING any damages. You need some very honest attorneys here who will avoid hurt feelings and truly level with you about the advisability of continuing on with all of this.
When there is death and injury, grief counselors tell us, people will do anything to stay in denial and away from truth, because the latter means there is nothing but a difficult walk through the finality of grief. They will blame facilities and doctors, even family members, and sadly EVEN THEMSELVES. It is a known phenomenon, and exceptionally common. I am so sorry for all the grief you have endured.
If the elder was manipulated after a medical diagnosis of sufficient cognitive impairment was in their medical records, this is more proveable. But you still have to have actual proof of what and when.
If you lose the case you still have to pay the attorney.
My sister and I have spent months and months documenting, making phone calls /lawyer consults, lots of them….
The result is that I have come to discover that the courts may function but they are horrible with addressing influencing factors that have created the problem in the first place. Be that as it may…
To respond as to whether there is a case or not: My father was taken out of a brain injury rehab center while being treated for a TBI and multiple injuries, without the knowledge or consent of the acting MPOA, my sister and myself.
We had just gotten our 92 year old dad safely out of the hospital, after a horrible premature discharge, after a major care accident ( his abusive “girlfriend” at fault). Broken neck, sternum, and documented diagnosed TBI for which neuropsych evaluation was ordered pre-release to the rehab facility. My sister has been until recently our father’s MPOA and advocate, guiding him through countless falls, emergency room visits, operations, and much much more.
My sister specifically requested they wait until our father had understood all his options, which he had agreed to do with my sister, and we were setting up that appoinment with an excellent probate attn.
The RN and her brother and sister ignored us and took our father out of the facility …they had been manipulating him prior. our father into signing a sweeping DPOA giving the RN’s brother total control of our father’s finances. She later manipulated herself into the MPOA position.
She interfered twice with our fathers VA PCP’s follow up to schedule the neuropsych and the VA has this in their records.
The brother, the DPOA stopped communicating with us after he attained his new appointment.
We are working on filing an APS case, and a complaint to the SBON. Finally got an appointment with a psychotherapist social worker specializing in Elders and their families and complex problems, and he asked again if we had found a good lawyer.
These are people, our cousins, who never. showed up to help our parents until only very recently.
Any other thoughts most appreciated.
thank you!
Things can either be PROVEN or not.
If something is "hidden" (covert) then it can either be flushed out and proven in court or it doesn't exist.
We don't even have a clue here what sort of lawyer you are speaking of?
Criminal? Real Estate? Trust and Estate?
I suggest that you talk to those you know in your own area, do a bit of looking online for exactly whatever type of attorney you require, and buy and hour of time to discuss whether or not you have "options" for "a case". While some will ask for contingency fees make it clear that you need a simple bit of advice whether or not you need/can use an attorney. And that you wish to pay by the hour.
Whatever your case, I wish you luck, but remember, things under the law cannot be "hidden" or "assumed". They are either proven or not proven.
Good luck.