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Spouse goes to SNF. Resources left by Mom: house about $240K, $150K mutual funds, a mix of CD/IRA worth about $25KK. All heirs live in different states. A Trust was formed by parents about 10 years ago. Some assets are in process of distribution in 2015. The house will remain a rental so rental proceeds must be allocated between the 3 heirs. Both personal and estate income taxes were filed for Mom in 2014. We may need to do a 2015 tax return for the trust. The heir who's spouse may go to the SNF is also executor of the estate. We are all concerned Medicaid will have loopholes that stretch beyond the immediate resources of the affected couple. There was no time to "plan" as one died and the other became too injured within a few months and may not be able to return home, triggering the Medicaid process.

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if community spouse receives inheritance can medicaid take money to pay for husband in nursing home?
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Concerned54 - All Resources - half is applied as his, + half as hers in our state. Some resources are counted "to the extent of the snf resident's equity interest". Your aunt is now an snf resident from you're saying.
If you and aunt have jointly owned funds, at least half will likely be counted for Medicaid eligibility. Original and sole owner/s of the Mutual fund? If it's both of you it may be half hers/yours? Has it been sitting/growing or were there contributions made throughout the years and by whom? "Name on the check" rule - does that apply in your case? Medicaid eligibility information obtained listed assets that "might" or "must" be spent down. I was told much has to do with how easily and quickly a resource can be cashed out and spent. I wouldn't do anything with the funds while she's trying to become Medicaid eligible. I would be concerned that Medicaid would consider her to be "moving" money and that would count negatively for her.
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IF the spouse is already on Medicaid when the Executer inherits money it should be considered income or property of the Community Spouse. Assets held by one party d not count for the Medicaid party. Advise them to see a lawyer who specializes in Medicaid law.
Income from annuities and other investments that come to her directly are the property of the Community Spouse in the State we live in.
Example......
Couple where he is 87 and has Dementia. She is 55 and is still working and living in the home.
He needs round the clock care so she sees an attorney who sets all the
450,000$ in liquid assets into an annuity that pays her 6,000 a month. He lives on 2,000 a month and gets approved for Medicaid.
I have no idea if that was her money or his money or joint money. But its hers now.
Good Luck
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Contact your local Medicaid office and ask if you will be considered owner of
1/2 of the fund or if the entire fund is subject to Estate Recovery.
Good Luck
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I have jointly held mutual fund with an aunt for over 20 years. She is now in a nursing home and applying for Medicaid. How can I protect my share of the fund?
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another aspect to consider, is if it is a community property state (the heir now ill & possible Medicaid, with spouse). Yes, check with an attorney! this is way too complicated to rely on "guesses" on AgingCare dot com.
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When someone dies with outstanding debt, their debt must be settled before money is passed on to their heirs. Once this has been done, each heir will receive their share according to the will or however it is set up. Then if one of the heirs has to go into a SLF (or their spouse) it is up to that heir to cover their cost. If the heir places the inheritance into an account free of the spouse, the heir may not be liable for the cost of the nursing facility for the spouse. This is not commingled funds. However, I would check with a lawyer on this one. I am not positive about this but I do know you can inherit money and as long as it is not commingled with your spouse, the spouse has no rights to that money.

However, see an attorney.
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See a Medicaid Planning Attorney, If the share of the estate is inherited by you alone and is in your name, it may be considered your income or asset not your spouses.
Pre- planning saves money and headaches.
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Houseplant, you need an attorney as well as an accountant. I am neither, but the little that I do know, has me questioning these items, in no particular order---"The Trust and not Mom is "owner" of the house"-- Medicaid in some states overrules Trusts (these assets could still be considered countable), that would be something an attorney could answer, for your state. I am going to put in multiple dashes to separate things (I can't get the paragraphs to work on this forum).
----"Some money needs to be saved to take care of the rental house"----Medicaid doesn't care one iota that the heirs may want to rent out the house, it views it as an asset; if your mom's name is on it (again it varies from state to state about the Trust) then it might be a countable asset.
----"it seems this heir's spouse may be penalized"----Medicaid doesn't care one iota about the family split or anybody feeling that someone is "penalized" they just want the MERP to move along and get the state's money back.
----"The well spouse's money will hopefully be viewed as seperate ownership"---if the well spouse receives $50,000 that will be counted as part of their approx. $114,000 Community Spouse asset allowance. And if Executor wants to try and "preserve" the 1/3 inheritance, somehow, and Medicaid caught a whiff of what was happening.....again here you need the advice of an attorney; perhaps someone else of the 3 kids is going to need Medicaid? You can't keep going down the road of "we wanna inherit" eventually, any assets anybody has, PLUS anything they might inherit, are to be used for their care.
----Conclusion-----you need to seek expert advice from an attorney who knows your state's Medicaid inside out & backwards. Don't be so anxious about your situation, there are many many millions of people who have NOTHING. Be happy that your family apparently has something, and USE some of your assets to figure out this complex situation and if possible, "protect" it. Quit thinking that someone is getting "punished", be pro-active, and "PROTECT" it. Put your energy into a good solution---with a good attorney (not just ANY attorney, make sure they know Medicaid in your state....not all do!).
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The first parent died over 2 years ago at home so there was still enough left. The health of the remaining spouse was more complicated, beyond what family could take care of. Now both have died, so some of the money is being used to pay medical. As I wade through some statements, the CD/IRA is about $21,000.00. Mutual funds are about $130,000.00. The house is about $240,000.00. Some money needs to be saved to take care of the rental house. If the easily reachable funds can be used for her care without having to sell the house, the rental income continues to get split between 3 heirs each month. Around $50,000.00 to 3 heirs came from a mix of trust funds and accounts outside the trust in the past year so we don't know if heirs may be penalized. The Trust and not Mom is "owner" of the house. The trust is still intact with the home being the primary asset at this point. It seems the home may be able to be kept by the 3 heirs. When the spouse of one heir needs SNF for a period of time, the uninjured spouse is in a position to inherit some resources. We're trying to figure if the well/unijured spouse will loose a share of property if Medicaid counts that in with the couple's regular income. Would this put the 2 remaining heirs at risk so that Medicaid can get the money for the 3rd heir? With 3 heirs and the spouse of one possibly needing SNF, it seems this heir's spouse may be penalized. Even though it's the heirs spouse who needs the nursing home. This also gets into the practices of how much is joint or individual property. The spouses generally aren't left much of their own, but having to give up the monies when it from the other's family doesn't seem right. Medicaid is looking at the heir's information with about as much time and energy used for this couple's resources. So the injured spouse would hopefully count only his money for his care. The well spouse's money will hopefully be viewed as seperate onwership and not be vulnerable to loosing the third of the family's remaining resources. The best hope is that all bills from Mom can be paid from her rosources and that heirs would get to keep their share of the house and any income it might produce without having it levied by the state. Parents always worried they might outlive what they had, but toward the end she started distributing - before there was any obvious need to plan for a SNF stay for her. Now we have the worry of the injured spouse requiring a lot of care for this year at least and maybe Medicaid trying to get some of that money. If the injured is not an heir, the spouse who is the heir may be penalized if Medicare procedures and reporting are imperfect at best and bad timing at worst. Pay off one hospitalization and hope to inherit, but then face the fact that Medicaid may penalize an heir. Or , penalize the injured by saying we won't admit you because your spouse has more money in the near future. Or does Medicaid take the injured and go after the remaining spouse's inherited rewources - we don't know.
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This is so complicated, and the dollar amounts allowed by the remaining spouse so very unfair. Makes me not want to re-marry... no wonder some elders live together without marriage, less complicated.
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As I read this again, I think palmtrees1 is correct...this is about the parents being gone, estate going to heirs but one of the heirs now has to go to SNF.

And for ladylee1115, I did not say it clearly....there was a big spend down of almost all assets to get my Dad qualified. Mom left with house and 1 car and the limit of $114.000 in assets, however, not that much left... she is now home with private caregivers, so her remaining cash will only last about 5 months now with her at home. We have an RV to sell and then the house or car. So no, she's not likely to have her assets last the rest of her life. She will be looking at AL real soon, and she's refusing to consider that. She wants to die in her home. But with caregivers getting about $3000/mo and being down to less than $10000 in cash IF we cash in the IRA and Annuity.... it's all going to go fast. I was not suggesting that I should get an inheritance while gov't paid for their care....just lamenting the fact that in the beginning, I had the option of 'taking a salary' for all that I do, and I said, " Well why should I do that to my parents' never figuring on what a mess it would be, how much time it would take and how my home business would be destroyed in the 3 years since I took this on.... while all the inheritance that my parents planned to leave me, would be used up and when it's done, hubby and I will have nothing but social security for the rest of our lives, if our business has lost so much it's not able to be sold to anyone. Just lamenting how life turns out and how easy it is to be screwed no matter that you try to do the right thing! I am having a really bad time right now is all. I'll likely be better tomorrow.
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Have the parents passed and the estate is being distributed?
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They should simply look at the spouse who is going to SNF's funds. I can not see how this has an effect on the other siblings. It is not their debt. The siblings should each get their share and the one going into a SNF will have to hand over their share to pay the bill. Am I missing something here?
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Joannes, This should be Federal Guidelines. each person individually who qualified for Medicaid would have to spend assets. Your second sentance conflicts " ALL needs to be spent down before Medicaid pays for even one of them. My Mom could have the $114,000 plus house and one vehicle in her name after Dad qualified."
Perhaps Mom won't ever need Medicaid and she will be able to meet her care needs with the money she has left plus the Life Insurance from your Dad.
The Purpose of Medicaid is to care for people who have no resources to care for themselves, not to preserve family money to pass it on to the next generation.
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I have the eldercare attorney who knows Medicaid law; the trust situation and I am trustee and POA for both parents. Certainly I am NOT an expert....but in AZ, when I took over, parents had a fair amount of assets. ALL needs to be spent down before Medicaid pays for even one of them. My Mom could have the $114,000 plus house and one vehicle in her name after Dad qualified. His name had to be removed from ALL assets. He couldn't even be beneficiary on her life insurance. She had to name me. He must have less than $2000 in his checking account at all times to remain qualified. There will be NO INHERITANCE left for me, except any life insurance policies that I am the beneficiary on. Mom has an annuity and an IRA left.....and we need to spend all on both of those...thus loosing a lot of money because we'll have to take a cash out option and it doesn't matter that I am the beneficiary on those, because they are assets for Mom that she has access to, so they have to be spent down before she could qualify. Then, in the end, when we have to sell the house, Medicaid has the option of coming in and wanting to be paid back all $$ spent by Medicaid out of home proceeds. Now my attorney says that nationwide, Medicaid has only ever tried that one time in Nevada and the courts turned them down...so he says it's not likely that they would exercise this option with anyone's house. However, I just think of all the money trouble the country is in, and wouldn't surprise me if they do when the time comes. SO....been going through this hell with both parents for 3 years now, and I have accepted that there will be no inheritance for me in the end except perhaps from 1-2 life insurance policies....IF I am the beneficiary on them. I don't even know that at this point. Dad has one, where the beneficiary currently might be Mom....in which case it would be her asset and would have to be changed, but Dad cannot even sign to change a beneficiary anymore. And a POA cannot sign to make THEMSELVES a beneficiary, so I still need to see if a Trustee can do that? I think Mom's has me listed already cause Dad had to be removed. Anyhow....that's what I know about it from here in AZ.
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You must consult with a Medicaid Planning Attorney. Laws can vary from state to state. If the inheritence is in the name of the Non Nursing Home Spouse they are not countable for Medicaid. Only Joint or individual assets for the institutionalized person count for Medicaid eligibility in the state I live in.
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Medicaid is pretty exacting in what it expects income & assets to be in order for one to be eligible. It is in my experience, it is not medicaid who has loopholes but family who is hoping to find loopholes. And to do that you need to have experienced elder law attorney based in the state of the elder to guide them and their DPOA to possible options. If they are at the point where they are in a facility, family is very limited in what can be done creatively. The state can require prior 5 years documentation on all possible assets and income sources. State can & will issue a transfer penalty if $ was moved about outside of medicaid rules.

For an individual NH medicaid, it's 2k in non exempt assets and about 2k in monthly income (exact amt depends on your state as each state administers its program uniquely). They have to be "at need" financially which means impoverished. For couples, the NH spouse needs to be impoverished BUT the community spouse is allowed up to 114K in assets and their assets are fixed ( often called the snapshot day) on where they were financially on the date of the application. If the CS is realistically right behind the NH spouse in needing that level of care themselves, they are just going to have to spend down to get to the 3K asset allowed for couples.

No matter how you look at the math, your elders have $. They are not impoverished and will need to spend down to qualify.

Yours have significant assets and assets that are easily findable as their names & SS # are tied to assets. 150K mutual funds alone.....they are not impoverished. State expects them to use their $ to pay for care first & foremost. By applying to Medicaid, they sign off on state getting an all-access pass to IRS, tax assessor, banking, investments, retirement sources,etc. An all access pass & nobody gets a tour T-shirt, or a lanyard to get into the after concert backstage party.

Are you saying that the home is rented and that the rent is being given to the 3 kids (& future heirs)? If the property owners are on Medicaid, what happens with the rental income are under Medicaid rules. There is a poster on this site who has their moms house rented - hopefully she can provide insight on this.

Also house will be subject to " intent to file a claim or lien" process by MERP after the last one dies. Try to clearly speak with attorney as to how MERP is done for your parents state and what state requires for non resident executors.
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The type of Trust that was made 10 yrs ago, makes a difference in how it might be counted as an asset by Medicaid. Revocable Trusts are countable. And in some states even Irrevocable are counted. Miller & others....I hope someone else (like Gabriel Heiser who sometimes answers questions here) offers some clarification. I am not an expert, you need to talk with one about your particular situ.
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I'm not totally sure I understand all your details, but it sounds like your mom & dad's combined estate is worth 240k plus 150 plus another 25k (or 250k?) . Total 415k? (Or, is it total 640k? Not sure if one of your k's was meant to be a zero....). At 415k, if both spouse go to SNF, it will need to be spent down to 3,000. This would take several years. After they reach 3,000 joint assets then Medicaid kicks in. Assets in a Trust are usually countable assets for Medicaid purposes. There will likely be nothing left for heirs, unless both spouses expire soon. And even if they both expire soon, Medicaid does not disburse what is left--they only come into play at probate court if there are unpaid bills. Consult with a Medicaid - experienced elder attorney (not just an Elder attorney,, a Medicaid-experienced, and tax-experienced, attorney, and perhaps they have an accounting firm working with them to crunch the numbers ). There are some general knowledge books out there to give you a rough idea (Gabriel Heiser's " Medicaid Secrets") but for personalized info, you need a Medicaid - experienced attorney.
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