Toileting transfering burnout. Any help?

You don't really need to post 3 times; in fact it only splits up the answers and prevents others from seeing what's already been posted. I would PM the Admins and ask them to delete the other 2 duplicate posts.

I haven't been through this, so I don't have many suggestions except the floor to ceiling (what looks like a stripper) pole, that your mother could hang onto while you're cleaning up.

It seems the difficulty is mobility, strength and positioning and something that your mother could hang onto while standing might help, the question being whether or not she has that strength.

Another option is to have a pull down bar installed from the ceiling. She would hold onto that with her arms, while standing. Again, the question is the issue of strength.

There might be other options, such as a bar that swings out from the wall; again she would have to be able to hold onto it while standing.

If you did choose any of these methods, the installation would have to be by a professional carpenter who knows how to attach them into the studs; mollies aren't acceptable.

I wish I had some good suggestions for you, but I know there are others here who have gone through this and I'm hoping they come along to offer help.

I'm wondering also if the nurses her have suggestions as they would have seen this situation at hospitals.

Gardenartist , thanks but my Mom cannot hold anythng, her hands to not work like ours, she has no understanding of it.

Would a bidet that you attach to your toilet help out? It is a sprayer that would clean your mom while you hold her in place. You can buy them to attach to a toilet.

Another idea would be to use toilet rails and have a very soft piece of long fabric that you'd loop around your mom's waist and attach her to the rails to keep her somewhat upright?

I don't have that issue with my mom, so I have no idea if either of these would help. Good luck...you're doing a very difficult job by yourself.

Sorry; I kind of suspected that. Hopefully someone else has experience with this situation.

It occurred to me that some people here have worked in hospice; they might have some suggestions to offer.

Sorry I couldn't be of any help.

I'm not sure exactly what is happening, she can't sit up on the toilet without support, or you are having difficulty with the transfer, or both? Or is it more that you are having difficulty cleaning her up after because she can't help?
Don't be shy with the details.

Would she hold on to commode rails if you got one? (Like a frame around the toilet) and a footstool to keep hips and knees more flexed? There are more supportive commode chairs available too.

Hi , thank you all. Details. No she cannot use her hands to hold on. I basically stand her up, weight on her legs somewhat, twist her onto the toilet and sit her with a 8" foam pillow behind her. As I am leaning over her (in front of her) her feet slide out. What a bugger to get them back, she doesnt move, strong as an ox, if her brain only could tell them what to do. So shes kind of like trying to lay down on the toilet and starts leaning over. I am trying to wash her bum and keep her up at the same time.
I did try a commode chair but there was a bar across the chair on the bottom (like behind where ankles would be), and I couldnt get her far enough back into the commode chair.

PS I bought her thick treaded sneakers but I cant twist her on the toilet with those so I had to go back to the regular ones so I dont twist her ankles.

Just rereading your posts and wondering...if she doesn't walk, I assume there's some atrophy in her legs. Would this be why she kind of slips when she sits down, b/c of lack of strength? If so, then maybe there's another approach to the problem, but I honestly am not sure what it would be.

Nurses and hospice workers, can you help out???

Just had a thought -- gripper strips for her feet. We used them on walker handles; they're either lightweight rubber, or something like that. Wrapped around the handles, they provide extra traction for someone to hold onto.

I'm wondering about a gripper strip on the floor so her feet don't slide?

Just googled "gripper strips"; I see there are larger strips to put on floors to prevent skidding and/or sliding. Maybe something like that would help provide traction, to at least address the slipping aspect?

I don't know how expensive they are, but there are combination wheeled shower/commode chairs. She would have the support available in a wheelchair and you would be able to remove the bucket to clean her, even wheel her into the shower if necessary.

Reverseroles, the hospitals use a device called a Hoyer Lift.... I don't know it sure looks scary and it all depends on how brave the patient is wanting to be swinging in one of those things. Plus it depends on how much room you have to maneuver it. And the cost $$$.

It seems to me that maybe it's time to say that mom is incontinent and figure out the best way to keep stool out of her vagina? I don't know if there is a way to do thst, but maybe someone has some ideas.

Thanks all, I do have a hoyer lift but I would have to put Mom naked onto it meaning rolling or lifting her onto the sling. then the sling would be dirty. I did get great grip sneakers but then I couldnt twist/pivot her to set her on the toilet, her legs didnt move.
What doesnt eveyone else do with bm incontinence? Thank you all again, so appreciative!

PS medicare covers a hospital bed and a hoyer lift free, you only need an RX from their doctor with 3-4 reasons why.

The more I think about it the more I think a bidet might be a good solution.

Why do you think so, because I could hold her while it washed her bum? How would I know if it were washing the right spot and wouldnt it be cold and scary for her? Hey I am up for all suggestions, let me know. I researched them like a year ago on amazon and you can add it to a toilet but its cold water unless you add a mixing valve. Any experience with them? Thx, I hate to let her poop in her diaper when I know if I can get her on the toilet she will go, as long as I do the miralax.

There are slings for the lift designed for toileting, check out videos in youtube. Do you have room in your bathroom for the lift?

I don't have any help as far as the transfer except to use a transfer belt so you can hold onto her safely so you don't need to pull on her arms and possibly hurt her, but if you need to clean her up if she goes while she's in bed, the method I learned when I was a nurses aid in the nursing home might help. You can use a changing pad like you'd use to change a babys diaper. Roll her to one side and fold up the dirty pad as far as you can under her and replace it with a folded clean pad. Then roll her to the other side, clean her, and remove the dirty pad while opening up the folded clean one. Sounds complicated but it's not and it's so efficient and much easier than trying to lift her. I agree it's very hard to clean while they're using the toilet. Try to protect your back with a back brace. God bless you for trying so hard.
d

What do professionals use or do? As above, nurses, hospice workers, MDs. Has anyone called Kaiser, Geriactrics Department? Some people must have experience with this.

I have no experience with this, but what if you laid her on the bed and put a bed pan under her? I might be more clean up, but it would be less stress and strain on both of your bodies.

What i did was put a commode in a spot where I had enough room to work and where moms feet rested comfortably on the chair. It was placed in the corner of kitchen with short walk behind it and long walk beside. Put a bar of the wall. Angled chair when done going towards wall where I had a grab bar then put a good rubbered backed rug under her feet. Scooped her up to standing, I would put her hands on bar and cirk her fingers around bar. This worked for years. When mom was no longer able to hold her own weight, this became a two person job with many times sitting back on commode to regroup. Our bathroom just did not have enough room to accommodate 2 people and the wheelchair. I was fortunate that my sons had just graduated from college as my moms major decline started. I can't really think of a way for this to be easier for you without a second person to help. Good luck

It sounds as though you are reaching the end of your ability to care for your Mom. And that you have done an incredible amount and effort so far.

Sometimes we have to just surrender to the hard reality that the job of caregiving has gotten beyond our means to provide all necesary care at the level our loved one deserves.

Had another thought. Is your mom eligible for any Medicaid or hospice services. Perhaps scheduling those visits at the time you need the most help. I mentioned to my neighbor on my smoke break on the front step that it was getting harder to get mom in pitty by myself. She very kindly offered to help anytime and I did not hesitate to ask when I had no one else. Didn't take long and she was more then happy to help. I'll post again, if you don't mind, if I think of anything else

I think a Handicap toilet chair, you just push the whole chair over the toilet, then when she is done push the chair away from the toilet then you can clean her w/ the toilet out of the way.

Thank you all for your ideas. I do have a hoyer with commode sling but how do you get her pants off and on and how do you clean her when the sling is in the way. I would be lucky if her rear end was naked and landed on the hole of the sling. If she was naked, her sling would get urine on it because she wakes up wet and when I take off her diaper and put the sling under her it would be all pee pee smell from her back. I did go apply for medicaid choices for independence today. If accepted its a 3-5 month wait for help. I am good during the week as I pay for help but weekends are a killer. I did buy and return a shower commode chair that rolls over a toilet but there was a bar across the bottom behind her ankle area. In order to lift her back into the chair, I need to pull the chair forward as I am holding mom in front of me and that bar got in the way so I couldnt get her "Back into the seat" enough. I did recently find one online with no bar, maybe I should get that one. Argh thank you all again, appreciate it. I thought maybe let her poop in her diaper and get her on a poop schedule that way. As of now, she poops 3 hours after miralax but on the toilet. One day I waited and finally at 5pm I took her in, and she went kaboom. I think she held it. She doesnt have grip, or balance, nor can she understand but for some reason she goes bm on the toilet. The commode I bought it huge but you can reach under it to wash them.(not easy for me, I am a big girl) thanks again

First I want to say thank you for posting this question and I feel your pain! My mom can hold onto a walker & stand from a bedside commode, we can't get her into bathroom. But her standing is getting bad, she wants to bend her knees, leans back & to the right and you feel like you've been in a wrestling match by the time you finish cleaning her from BM. One thing sometimes I just have to set her down and start over, sometimes it takes 3-4x before I'm done. I was wondering in your situation, it sounds like if she was laying down it might be easier to clean her, just not when it's the full BM you're cleaning. What if you let her go on the pot, then maybe wiped a little and put diaper back on. Then get her to the bed to finish getting her cleaned up? I know I've learned that for me even tho I usually am the type to want to push thru and hurry up & finish something, when it comes to mom sometimes it's easier to break it into tiny steps.
Also, I've seen a portable bidet on amazon(pretty cheap) that you fill with water(so you could do warm water) and looks like you just squeeze it out. Not sure how good it works, I wanted to try one for my mom but she's a bigger girl & I couldn't fit it behind her on that potty chair.
Also, have you asked the hired help how they handle it? And if you're saving the miralax for weekends, I wouldn't. Let hired help do it. I have made myself realize this with mom & bathing bc it's hard for me. It's their job, just like you have one during week, and you're paying for that service to make your life better/easier. They aren't being paid to house sit and just watch tv & play games on their phone(can you tell we had one girl that only wanted to do that lol) I hope I've helped in some way & if you do find a technique that works, please post it bc this is getting to be very hard thing for us too. You're also right about the lift, I've often wondered how that would work any differently than you described!!

I don't think there is one solution that can actually be good. I have heard of some people, have the doctor put in a colostomy, therefore no more messes. You just change the bag. Easier & Cleaner on the both of you. It also helps by not having to lift her. Save your back & less chance of dropping her.

A colostomy to avoid messes? I question whether any doctor with a sense of responsibility would do that. And what justification would have to get insurance to pay for it? That's pretty drastic.

I just remembered when my dad was in rehab after back surgery they would fill a squirt bottle with warm soapy (no rinse type) water so he could squirt even if he couldn't reach to make sure he was clean. Might be worth a try.