Does living rent free count as my pay?

I paid caregivers $25/hour in Southern California three years ago. At that rate, you're owed right around $657,000.

Contact the state labor board and see if you have any kind of case. Absent an actual employment contract, you might be hard-pressed to get that kind of money from the son, but I have a feeling you can put together some kind of case using receipts, witnesses, and recreating time cards to account for the time you've been there.

This post is from June. Hopefully the OP has done something by now.

Of course you should get paid. There are, after all, labor laws. And rent free will not cut it for the full-time care you are providing. (By the way I hope the previous worker went to the Labor Board to get justice.) I mean, time to land on these people claws unsheathed. If the family don't care, then time to get the help of Adult Protective Services in getting care for a vulnerable senior.

Yes you should get paid, receive holiday pay and have time off to do what you want with your friends. Don't you have work regulations and minimum wage salary in California ? you need money for clothes, toilet and to go out with friends, Why haven't you looked for another job?

It sounds like the son either can't afford to pay for the lady who cared for his demented mother or he just didn't care. I definitely think you should get paid.

the problem here just may be that the son does not care about his mother safety, life or well being. I knew of situations where some elderly needed help but the family refused to step in. This elderly was diabetic with heart condition and the family did nothing with their parent getting into accidents weekly and found passed out in the middle of intersections monthly. Their parent was a danger to themself and the entire community and the family was only concerned with their inheritance.

I take care of my 91 year old mom who can still manage somewhat. She dresses herself, cleans herself in the shower (I'm close by in case I need to help), brushes her teeth, does her makeup, dresses herself. She can still walk but does have a bad knee and is a huge fall risk. I have to use her lightweight wheelchair, which is wonderful, if we go out. We were living in my house and I decided I wanted to sell one of the homes and decided on mine. We moved to her house and I think she has been happier around her own things. She pays my bills and I live here free. She doesn't have a mortgage, No other bills other than utilities. But I clean her big house, cook a good hot meal every night, I do her laundry, I take her to every doctor's appointment, to getting her nails and hair done. I haven't had any of my three brothers give me a break in 17 months and all I wanted to do is go to lunch with a friend and go to my house and take a very long nap where it is so quiet. I am sure I am still on the short end of the stick but I'm keeping up two houses now, two appointment calendars, two sets of bills, two yards to keep up, etc. Tons of calls and then to keep track of it all. You certainly do deserve to live there free and get paid on top of it. My mom had two girls prior to myself and she paid them and they spent the night on certain nights. She paid them 11.00 and hour. They got paid for it and my mom fed them. They had to cook but my mom is an excellent cook and she taught one of them how to cook the way she did. This person was a thief and stole my mom's money out of her wallet, medications, jewelry, so much. The last thing I found missing were all her gorgeous antique German Santa's s and Christmas decorations. I put the tree up and was so excited to be hanging up all her lovely decorations and all gone. I was so livid and my mom was so sad. You are working for free. If she had a sitter she would have to pay 17.00 an hour or more and some of them work a double shift. 16 hours a day. No sitter would stay a minute with an elderly person and not get paid. They are taking advantage of you dear. Ask them for money.

The fact the woman’s son also refused to pay the relief help you hired shows this is intentional exploitation on his part, pls update us how your doing, have you decided to demand payment or quit or another route?

I am in the same position so I know what you're saying. I look at it by how much would it cost me to live somewhere else? How much money could I make in a regular job. My free rent also includes utilities, car insurance, cable, internet... you get the idea. I DO, however, get paid for extra things, like paperwork and help with things that would fail outside of the range of care. Usually, by the hour, I make around a dollar which with all the rest I mentioned is good pay. You should not go penniless altho many people with dimensia are older and remember the days when they raised a large family on a hundred a month and believe they're being generous. Ask. Hopefully, the worst that would happen is they might say no. Good luck. A church may be a great place to look for a "friend" for your person to come visit and give you a break.

How innocent you sound. How helpless and confused! 24/7? Do you sleep at least? Oh Boy, if you want to tabulate 24/7 even on a $10 an hour: $240 a day multiplied by 30=$7200? But private care is a little more than $10 an hour. How can a person maintain a 24/7 schedule defies all logic, not too mention the constraint on the body and mind. Just doesn’t add up as one would eventually collapse under such pressure. Best of everything, though.

What did you agree upon initially? I wouldn’t consider living there as payment. If you are hired as an employee, you deserve a paycheck. Does the person that hired you consider living there as payment?

Did you have permission to hire the other person? If you did, why wasn’t she paid? Do you want to remain there as an employee? It doesn’t sound like a feasible option to me. What else do they provide? Food?

This is a confusing posting. Can you please give more details so people can respond. There is absolutely no way that you can keep up this pace. Sleep deprecation is brutal. Plus, how can you properly care for someone if you aren’t caring for yourself?

California is an odd place in terms of laws and wages. Many cities have their own wage requirements so it is complicated.

I am going to assume that son will say you are not an employee but a "volunteer caregiver."

So in your case, California has a domestic caregiver coalition. Here is the link:

https://www.cadomesticworkers.org/

It tells you wages of your area, etc. If I were you, I would reach out to them for assistance.

whether you get paid or not, you cannot keep up doing what you are doing.

Doesn't seem like you're telling the whole story. In the beginning did you agree to this arrangement? Are you a LEGAL US citizen?

It counts if that is what you negotiated - as long as it meets other legal requirements (minimum wage). There certainly is value in room/board). If this is income, you should also be paying taxes.

If, however, you do not agree that this is a fair wage, ...because it is “at will” employment, you can leave any time. If the family is failing to meet legal obligations (paying workers) l, this is not a secure position.

You are considered a "Domestic Worker". See the California "Domestic Worker Bill of Rights" at this link to see what you are entitled to: https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/DomesticWorkerBillOfRights-FAQ.html

"Can meal and lodging credits be applied by an employer against a domestic worker’s wages? Yes. Meal and lodging credits can be applied. However, an employer must abide by the limits specified in Wage Order No. 15. That is, meals or lodging may only be credited against the minimum wage if the employer and the employee enter into a voluntary written agreement before the work is performed. (This requirement applies to all types of domestic workers.)"

Thus, if your employer did not make an agreement with you to subtract meal and lodging from your wages, if you file a wage claim or file a lawsuit, you will be entitled to minimum wage for 9 hrs per day and overtime for anything over 9 hrs per day or over 40 hrs per week.

Also, note that if you report your employer and your employer retaliates by firing you, etc. you have recourse under the law.

I would find someone who knows the work you have done all these years - a personal reference who can vouch to your next employer that you have done above and beyond what is required, or a physician who knows the care you have provided, etc. and extricate yourself from this situation.

You are being robbed. Contact INSS in your county. If that does not exist- call elder abuse. If she does not have the money the state should pay. You are owed 3 years of back pay! Get it and buy yourself a home!

Until someone actually has to contract a Home Health & Caregiver, the cheapest relatives would count living in a spare bedroom with a roof over your head as a compensation for care giving. What they really don't understand are the other intangibles to an uncompensated 24/7 Caregiver. The errands, whatever life management for an estate. A pet that needs care as well. I find out real fast at the end that how cheap & selfish others can be. See you'll ruin your career, society won't work with you to jump start your career when it's over. I had 2 brothers that pulled that with me. And 3 years later, well, you see what the pandemic was all about. Reboots into low ball income with no benefits & mismanaged poverty. That's if that is even the goal. Cheap on the pandemic relief is exactly what you'll get as Caregiver.

Do the math, 24 x20/hr is $ 480 a day. $ 20/hr is what a home health would charge. And Home Health isn't cooking meals, isn't maintaining a household. They're just collecting vitals & monitoring. $ 480/day for 365 days and that's $ 175,200 gross. Show me any bedroom on the planet that costs that much for you to rent for that for a year of your life. For that matter, show me a caregiver that is compensated that much, ever ? Quite often a house or other assets would need to be bought & paid for, liquidated to pay a Home Health group to pay for that level of care. In effect, you're saving the estate for an inheritance to beneficiaries that won't divy up the workload. This is what I found out about the human race & what life all about. Don't get me wrong, what I did for last remaining parent & dog was a burden I would do again. I'd do it differently though this time.

I have interviewed for a similar situation in Ca. 5 days a week. Free room and board plus $25/hr

I pay an agency $96 for four hours ($24 an hour) of care twice a week for my husband who has dementia. She does cognitive therapy with him including puzzles, play cards, etc., no household chores.

The agency I use charges $340 for 24 hours. The caregiver must have eight hours of free time during the 24 (so she can rest or do whatever she wants).

Twenty years ago, my mom and dad paid their live-in caregiver $120 a day plus room and board.

As others have said, you need to be paid!!!!

I knew a caregiver who got free room and board in the home of the wealthy elderly person she cared for 24/7. She was paid $60,000 plus social security. She tidied, but there was a housekeeper and handyman to manage the house. If you’re in the right location and good at your job, expect to be paid accordingly.

I believe you should be paid as well. If she were in a facility she would have to pay $3500 to $6000+ a month. So find out what her cost would be and what you would pay for rent. Does she buy all the food? Does she pay when you take her to the dr? To go get groceries, anything for her? List is all what you do. You shouldn't look at it as your living there rent free, look as you are a live in care giver. People pay for that and they pay well bc its hard to find good care for the elderly. YOU NEED TO BE PAID!

No one should work 24 hours a day and 7 days a week.
Especially if you are not being paid. I doubt your situation is legal.
Please, please do not continue to do this, you are being treated like a slave.
You need money for your own life, and future
This is so upsetting to read, please look after yourself

When you have a 'normal' job your pay is greater than the cost of your apartment or house. Plus you have money to pay other bills, go out to dinner, go on a vacation.
So----NO you are not being paid enough.
I would decide what you neeed (time off, respite care, etcc)then have a professional talk with the son. Get something in writing.
Is it time to tell the son that his mother really needs the supervision of cared nursing facility?
Good luck to you. Be STRONG, be BOLD!

I'm inclined to think this was a good arrangement for you 3 years ago. Perhaps you needed a place to live and the lady needed help. Maybe the agreement was for your food, misc needs, or paying some bills for you? There had to be an agreement for the arrangement, and seemed to be a good deal for you at the time, considering you've done it for 3 years. No one, even those who have food/housing paid for can go three years without a dime in their pocket - so assuming there's a little cash here and there. I just think there is more detail.

At any rate, no one says you have to stay there. You refer to 'the ladies son', so assuming you aren't related to the lady or the son. Give the son notice - say a month - and tell him you can't do it alone and no longer want the deal you made in the beginning. Even long term employees at a company ask for raises from time to time. See what he offers. If not acceptable, move on your notice of departure date. End of story.

Imho, whatever your arrangement was with the son of this elderly lady something has gone afoul.

As SAHM for many years, I remember my Dh once reading about how much he'd have to pay me if I were a salaried employee. It was about $60K per year, at that time, ( mid 80's) almost as much as DH was making in the workforce. It shocked him to the core--but this article spread out all the stuff a SAHM DOES!! Meals, dishes, laundry, child care, cleaning (and cleaning and cleaning) chauffeuring kids & him, being a FT nurse on many occasions, bookkeeper, shopping for gifts, keeping up a yard and then snow removal, car maintenance...I could go on, but you get it. IF he had to pay separately for all those things, he couldn't afford to live!

My daughter lives in CA. Her rent is $3000 a month. She MAKES about $10K a month.

While I realize she's highly trained and educated...she's still paying $3K for her rent. So your 'rent' is about that, or less. You should be making $20 an hour beyond what the free rent is. And it should be run through an accountant, taxes and SS paid.

Daughter works a typical 40 hr week. You work much more. And you have no time off? Wow, these people saw you coming!

Find another place to go & another job then confront them with your demands. If they say 'no' then tell them goodbye and start anew.

Seems harsh, but you are being taken advantage of, big time.

California has very strict laws about this. I believe that they would say that the "room/board" was at your employers convenience and that as an "on call" employee, you are entitled for overtime etc. You are also eligible for workers compensation, unemployment insurance and you (and your employer will have to pay into social security)....etc etc.

Call a meeting with the womans son and explain to him that you can no longer live there 24/7 for free.  Tell him you need to come to some sort of agreement that includes a salary and specific days off, during which time he will have to have a second caregiver for his mom on your days off.  NO ONE WORKS 24/7 for room and board.  Do the math.  I don't live in California so I don't know what an apartment would cost in your area, but for easy math, lets say a 1 bdrm apartment cost $1,000 per month.  There are 672 hours in a month, so divide $1,000 by 672 = $1.48.  You are working for a $1.48 per hour.  That is insane and he is taking advantage of you...probably to save his inheritance.  Tell him your requirements of a salary in addition to room and board and your required days off and if he refuses, have a letter of resignation ready.  Give him appropriate time to find a replacement and for you to find other accommodations.  No more than a month.  Once he starts checking around to see what it is going to cost him, he will see the error of his ways!

A Live in usually gets paid a small amount while getting Room And Board.
They also get one 24 hr day off so a replacement should be hired for that 24 hr period.
You really need to renegotiate with your Employer the Terms of your Live In.
If Employer does not come to a satisfied agreement with you, give your Notice to quit.

Also, Employer and you should each sign a paper listing what is expected from each other and the amount if time off and pay, ect.

I found an Agency that would furnish 24 7 Live In care for $500 a week but I don't know what they would be paying their Employee who would actually be living in.
I do know the Live In is expected to have an 8 hr sleep per night, a Bedroom, bathroom and meals plus 1 day (24 hrs) off a week.