For those of you who know my story, you know the relationship that I have with my dad. He is now in the hospital for some health issues and is receiving physical therapy. The doctor wants to recommend a nursing facility after discharge due to the issues. I'm in agreement because he needs help fulltime and I can not do it. But I do not think my dad is going to agree with this because he keeps talking about what he can do on his own and he can't. He was verbally/emotionally abusive to me as a child and to my mother as well. The abuse continued into my adulthood. He is also demanding. Even one of the nurses at the hospital told me that he is. When I go visit him, he finds things for me to do! Such as hand him things that are right by him. The doctor is supposed to talk with us this week but I will working and can not take off work. I'm afraid that decisions will be made without me being there. I have also noticed a change in him cognitively that was not present before. My question is, am I responsible for being a full time caregiver upon discharge? I can’t do it.. I have cried for two days thinking about it. I'm not a bad person, but I know it would not be a positive experience.
Can they change the meeting to a time when you can be there?
Or is it maybe better if you aren't there?
The doctor needs to lay out for dad that he can't go home; he either needs discharge to rehab (is that what is being recommended?) or to LTC.
You are not an option. I trust you have made that clear to the doctors and discharge planners
I plan to try to reach the doctor by phone. I also spoke with his case manager and told her that I'm not able. She gave me some options to look at for facilities. I think the doctor means LTC. As of right now, he is unable to stand on his own and needs help with everything . He has been receiving therapy and there is some improvement but not enough to live alone. Some of his family members are good at trying to bully me into doing things and I will not allow them this time. I have been the one that has been there for years and they were no where to be found.
I know just what you mean. They got away with it before, but not anymore. Stand your ground. No.
"No, Aunt/Uncle, I cannot quit my job to care for Father. I couldn't do it even if he were cooperative and appreciative, and he's not."
" He needs to be somewhere with people who can make him listen to what he needs to do to stay safe. That's not me."
"No, I do not owe him my life. That idea is laughable. I am the ONLY person who can take care of me. He has other options."
"I won't listen to this any longer. My being his caregiver is not on offer."
Send the discharge planners an email, text, fax or drop off a written letter "I cannot provide care for my father. He will not be safe at home because he will be alone, despite what he may tell you."
Also, since you are NOT his POA, you really have no authority here. Remember, if you decide to help find a rehab/NH for him, you don't sign ANYTHING. HE signs for himself. You are NOT the responsible party
Consider having the state take guardianship.
I hate waiting for the other shoe ( parent ) to drop .
No.
Sometimes it takes a person a going home & failing before they admit they do in fact need more care.
Read over Barb's tips. They work!
I swear, sometimes I had to fake it til I made it when sounding assertive!
Have you made it perfectly clear to the DP that you canNOT be his caregiver, and that he will be unsafe if he goes home? Also make sure that IF he discharges himself to home that you do NOT participate in any such transport home.
Follow the great advice below and tell all your family members who want you to sacrifice your life for your abusive father to Kiss Your Grits.
Has Dad had a formal cognitive evaluation? A lifestyle in-home evaluation by an OT? An assessment of his living quarters and how practically they can be adapted has his limitations increase.
I know of no state in the US that imposes the obligation of physical, hands on care. Any obligation on you might be financial, but I’ve ever known of a case in which that obligation was imposed.
Google “Assisted Living/Memory Care/Skilled Nursing”. There are levels of care that might be a good fit, and incorporate his medical issues into a less restricting environment.
Your situation already appears to be woefully out of balance, and you’re holding the short end of the stick. You are doing too much, and that allows him to be more complacent concerning his own opportunities to do for himself.
Last thought- FOR YOURSELF- Google “Free and Low Cost Counseling”. You need someone to sift through your stuff, help you weed out the stuff (thinking) that is painful for you, and help you assert your right to be a”care manager” not a hands-on “caregiver”.
Yes, you’re RIGHT. GRAB IT.
It has been suggested that you leave your father to the care of the State guardianship programs. If you choose to see him, visit him, assume care of him that is entirely your OWN CHOICE and your own responsibility.
If it is difficult to absorb this from us why not visit an elder law attorney for LEGAL reassurance.
Dad is setting the stage perfectly now, with FOG tactics, to break you down, bit by bit, day by day, to where you throw your hands up in surrender and agree to go care for the "poor soul".
Do not fall for these tactics. You have no rights to make ANY decisions on his behalf! It would be insanity for you to even consider taking on his care w/o being medically trained AND having POA.
Stay strong and let logic prevail. Use your head and not your heart!
What Dad does is his concern.
His choices. His life.
I am not a rehab hospital.
I am not a nursing home.
I am certainly not his care solution.
I am his daughter. My contact level will be of an occasional visitor.
Luckily the meeting with the doctor will be Monday instead of tomorrow so I will be there. I plan to talk to my dad today and let him know that he needs full time care. Meanwhile one of his family members is agreeing with him but I know what I see and he is not capable of living alone and I'm not capable or willing to be fulltime caregiver.
Just an idea. And no, you don’t have to do anything for your dad. The more you can stay out of it, the better.
I am glad that you don’t have a cold heart like your father did towards you and your mother. Use the love that is inside you to care for yourself.
Your dad doesn’t have any right to expect you to care for him. There are many people who don’t have children and they are cared for by others. Your father will adjust to others caring for him.
You deserve to have peace in your life.
My situation is the same. I can’t provide the level of care he needs. Even if I was not working, I still could not. I found out that the meeting will be Monday, instead of tomorrow , so I will be able to be there. I think some people have the misconception ( I know his family does) that me agreeing with the doctor that he needs a nursing facility means I don’t care but me wanting him to be cared for by professionals is caring!
tell the place they cannot deposit this human without cognitive power to take care of himself… there is no full time help at that address
I told the SW that I was unable to care for him and she gave me information on facilities in the area.
As many of have mentioned, please put the fact that you will not be providing care or transportation to your father IN WRITING .
Do not be afraid of your father, or of what "others will say". You are the only person who can take care of YOU.
That said, I think you need to step away from your father's hospitalization and discharge planning. As long as you are present in his life, he will not be amenable to a nursing facility.
Call the social worker/case manager right now and tell them that you are not going to be involved in caring for your dad. If they try to persuade you with their "We'll get you home help" baloney, be blunt that "Only a nursing home can help him."
If your father was so awful to you and your mother and remains an entitled and demanding person to the point that you say you're depressed and anxious, why on earth do you keep him in your life? Do you not see that you're in a toxic relationship with him? What are you going to get out of going to this meeting on Monday?
The only thing that she will get out of it is conflict with her emotions and possibly health issues that will stem from stress.
By meeting with discharge planning and social workers, by meeting with doctors (your responses below), by being involved with your father you are painting yourself into a corner of BEING responsible for your father. You are participating in his discharge plans and his care. That is making yourself responsible. You need not to be meeting with all these folks and to tell them that you are not responsible if you don't want to BE responsible. Otherwise, in many ways you are making yourself responsible and I can only wish you good luck with what is your own choice for your life.
If you want the state to take over tell them you are not able to take care of him and are not available in any way in the planning of his care . Let social workers find a facility .
My fear is if you get involved, it will be a huge mess because your father may refuse to go to a facility . Then it will be a headache for you being stuck with him if they decide he’s able to make decisions and discharge him to his home . They are more likely to do that if a family member is in the conversation .
Sometimes it’s best to say you can’t help in any way and walk away , so then the hospital can force your father to go to a facility .
Also no matter what ….do not be his transportation anywhere , he will refuse to get out of the car if you take him to a nursing home .
Three times the hospital tried to get me to be transportation to take my parents to rehab. I refused every-time because I knew my parents would demand I take them home and they would refuse to get out of the car if I took them from the hospital to rehab . I made the hospital arrange ambulette service. And now my husband always does the same with his father as well . These old people lie to these hospital social workers and say “ Oh yeah my daughter can pick me up “. Nope . Don’t do it .
*I must help* vs *how much can I reasonably do*
Not now. I have clearer vision to what I will or will not do.
Past incidents of refusal to go to respite/rehab, stalling, manipulation - performances of passive aggressive feigned inability to get in or out of the car - actual mobility problems, incontinence.
All this now falls under the heading of "No. Need another option".
Please listen to those who are telling you to stop being involved. You are not obligated to meet with anyone. Your dad and the staff can work this out without your input.
Don’t place this burden upon yourself. You had no control over things as a child but you do now.
Years ago, my mother asked me to look after my oldest brother’s welfare after he had a serious accident.
I checked in on him at the hospital for my mom. Very soon afterwards I realized that I couldn’t be any part of his care due to how he lived his life.
I told my mother that he was her son, not mine and that I was not going to get involved with his care at all.
Mom wasn’t happy about it at first but eventually realized that it was for the best that I walked away from helping him.
I didn’t attend any meetings to sort out his future care.
I was sick and tired of his manipulation and completely walked away. He asked to move into my home which was never going to happen. I didn’t see him again until shortly before he died in a hospice facility. I took my mom to say goodbye to her first born son.
Look after yourself now. The rest will fall into place however it does. You can help him by showing him how to help himself.
A lot of times people will listen to other people far better than family members, and if they don’t they will suffer the consequences of their actions.
If so, I’d suggest that you use any visit and any conversation with his MDs and the facility to let them know that you “there is no safe and secure discharge in his home to return to as you will not be there AND you will not be involved in his placement & that in addition - as you are not his POA - that you will not and cannot sign off to any responsibility for his placement”. Should anyone continue to try to push responsibility onto you, tell them “my father abused me in my childhood” and that “due to this it is beyond difficult to discuss this further”. Case closed. Be fixed and firm with this. Walk out of the NH or a meeting if need be.
Your dad will try his best to continue to emesh you in FOG.
He has been wildly successful in doing this in the past, but no longer!
He will deny or deflect from whatever happened in your childhood to you & your mom. As will other family members.
You owe him & them zero.
We are here for you.
Many of us here worked well with discharge planners because we had mentally well, non-abusive parents who understood that they needed to go to LTC, and discharge planners who understood without asking that none of the professionals ("the kids") in the meeting was going to be providing care. The question never arose.
FB has only recently returned to work. She has an abusive, entitled father who has already told family members that her job is temporary and that she will be quitting to provide him with care in his home. Her relatives are already piling on with the "you are obligated to do this" speeches, making her feel guilty, doubtful of her own stance and vulnerable.
Our fear is that she will agree to look at homes. And then be persuaded to become POA. And end up being called relentlessly by her abusive father to fix this, that and the other thing. And to take him home.
That's my worry. Which is why I'm thinking that backing off now might be a good idea.
I agree FB is vulnerable , as she stated
she has “ bigger heart “.
I did too and it took a long time to recover and get my life back .
It’s so easy to get lost in FOG .
You are having trouble abruptly walking away. It can be hard because it is in your nature to be kindhearted.
You have already told your dad that you will not be caring for him. That’s done.
Why do you feel like you must meet with the staff?
If you are feeling like you shouldn’t walk away without personally addressing any issues, you can easily write a note saying that you are not going to be involved any longer in your father’s care.
All loose ends will be wrapped up with the least amount of stress. You can be at peace with not having to interact with the staff directly.
Think of it as writing a letter of resignation. Briefly explain your reasons only if you want to. You don’t owe them any explanation if you would rather not state your reasons.
Wishing you all the best as you transition into living peacefully on the other side of this difficult situation.
((((Hugs)))) and Courage to you !!!!
You can do this 👍🏻.
Sometimes someone kind-hearted, big-hearted has been trained to be the *helper* all their life. Be a good girl & do... what a great help you are.. it's not evil. Just being trained up to be useful. But.. the power imbalance of adult : child can sometimes be misused. A parent can assume their child is their servant. This is wrong - can slide into abuse.
So to step back, walk away, say no, can feel like a huge dent to that self-worth of being a helper/kind-hearted. Being *good*.
This can be all-or-nothing thinking.
I must help - or I am not good.
I must fix their problem - or I am not good.
I must do as they say - or I am not good.
Silly right?
What about respect instead?
Eg I respect it is your decision Dad.
To choose LTC, rehab, home with adequate services or home alone with none. You are free to decide - also free to change your mind.
However, you cannot decide for me. Cannot decide about my job, my time or what I will do.
A person can be very big-hearted, be proud of that, be respectful - but not a servant.