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Someone please tell me that it is unusual for a person to use funds from the very person for whom she is trying to gain guardianship. I cannot believe this is legal. (I could see reimbursement begin appropriate if guardianship is determined to be appropriate.)

I find it odd that people on this thread are advising @lonelyandold to roll over, count her blessings, and consider that things could be much worse if she didn't have a daughter. How do you know? We don't have enough information to know that the OP is giving away huge amounts of money or being scammed. We don't have enough information to take sides.
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BarbBrooklyn Aug 2019
TX, Yes, you use your parent's funds to apply for guardianship. If guardianship is denied (at least in my state) then you are on the hook for the expense.

Most of us have the experience of trying to help our parents; some parents are very resistant to help, even after they've been diagnosed with dementia. Children who care worry that their parents give away money and will be left impoverished just when they need nursing home or memory care, which is expensive.

There are situations where the parent is too intractable and the children walk away and let the state take guardianship.

Some parents lose the ability to see that they may need money in the future to pay for care. They think "oh, I won't live that long" or "I'm going to die before I need to go into care". Read Dorker's thread for a cautionary tale of an elder to did a reverse mortgage so she could fund a facelift.

I'd love for the OP to come back and tell us more; I doubly wish that the daughter would find us as well.
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I think we need a lot more information in order to respond intelligently to this post.

The line that gives me pause is "she doesn't want me to have a car".

It goes one of two ways, doesn't it? Either the daughter wants to control mom's actions......OR mom is having multiple accidents, getting lost, calling daughter to come find her. Or a doctor has told OP that she shouldn't drive anymore.

Lonely, please come back with more information.
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TXGirl82 Aug 2019
"It goes one of two ways, doesn't it? Either the daughter wants to control mom's actions......OR mom is having multiple accidents, getting lost, calling daughter to come find her. Or a doctor has told OP that she shouldn't drive anymore."

Yes, thank you. The OP doesn't necessarily need to thank her lucky stars she has a daughter. Daughter may be a monster, or she may be an angel.
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Does your daughter have Power of Attorney? Does someone else? Are you considering giving POA to someone other than one of your kids?

You say that your daughter doesn't want you to have a car.

Do you mean that she has told you that you shouldn't be driving? Has one of your doctors told you that? Are you in agreement, or do you think that your driving is just fine?

What do you think your daughter's motivation is?
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disgustedtoo Aug 2019
If daughter had POA, there would not really be a need to apply for guardianship. It is a VERY expensive and time consuming process (note that there is an attorney for the daughter, the son AND the OP!! ALL of the court costs will be charged to mom's accounts - some SERIOUS money being spent here and mom can't be allowed to buy a "dollar" item??? WHO is in charge here?
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lonelyandold, people of all ages are being scammed, I read this in the local police report. People in their 20's and 30's are believing whatever the scammer is saying, thus out of fear the victims drive to the local stores to purchase iTune gift cards, or other types of gift cards that the scammers can use. I am curious, is that why your daughter took away your vehicle?

This sounds like an issue that has been ongoing for some time with various scammers due to the fact that your daughter is filing for guardianship. Plus, you are lending money which you may or may not get back. I made a mistake 20 years of lending money to a co-worker to which she filed bankruptcy, and I never got a dime back.

Just keep in mind, it is expensive getting older. I had major sticker shock when my very elderly parents [90+] needed caregivers and eventually moves to senior care centers.

Try not to think of this being cruel and unnecessary, instead your daughter wants to make sure you have funds for those rainy days.
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FrancescaOC Aug 2019
Your answer is timely. I read this just a few days ago.

Older Adults Scammed More Often By Relatives Than Strangers, Study Finds

https://www.studyfinds.org/older-adults-scammed-elder-abuse-more-often-by-relatives-than-strangers-study-finds/

Lonely and old, trust your gut.

Enough said.
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My mother was mentally competent, yet someone got her information from her and they were debiting her bank account until they got her into an overdraft position. She was terribly ashamed. She had to admit to my sister and I that she let this happen. We were able to get the funds recovered, but it took a lot of work on our parts. After that, mom asked us to take over paying her bills.
It is a growing problem that seniors give so much of what they have and what they don't have without realizing it. The majority are being scammed. Be thankful your daughter is looking after your best interest. Would you rather be destitute? What if you did not have a daughter? Enjoy the things you can and let go of the rest. We have so much to be grateful for in this life, count your blessings.
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TXGirl82 Aug 2019
"Be thankful your daughter is looking after your best interest."

How do you know this?
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Hang on.

Can we just go through this bit:

"I lent a person some money. I and my husband both did this when he was alive. She is convinced I am being scammed, She is possibly right, I've had doubts and hired a detective, checked with FBI and other agencies. I told her I would stop sending money..."

What do you mean, you *would* stop sending money? Does that mean that in spite of your reservations, in spite of your husband's no longer being with us, in spite of ongoing investigations even, you are STILL sending money?

Why???

You write so well and so fluently and seem so in command of the facts of the situation, that I'm wondering how it could be that you haven't yet extricated yourself from the clutches of a fraudster, if that's what's going on. Plenty of people fall for them, alas; it is by no means indicative of mental incompetence.

What does your lawyer say?

How would you hope to repair/retrieve your relationship with your daughter?
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AT1234 Aug 2019
Thanks for asking those questions, I too am a only daughter who has lost my relationship with my mom over paranoia and scammers. It is very difficult to stand back and watch strangers take advantage of loving vulnerable parents. But, the alternative is almost worse!
Obtaining guardianships over competent adults is almost impossible, so unless there is overwhelming medical evidence, Lonely doesn’t have to worry about that part, but it could be necessary if she’s being stripped of her assets.
Healthcare is not what it used to be and she will probably need every dime for the future. Remember, her version of the truth may not be so accurate also, In any case it all causes sad situation.
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There may be several ways of looking at this. To begin with your daughter should not be using your money for her children. I was around your daughter's age when I had to take control of my mother's finances. I am not assuming you have the same issues but I will explain why I had to do this. My mother was paying a huge interest fee on a relatively small credit card bill. She could not comprehend that it was simply better to pay the bill in full even though we had extensive conversations about this. There were charities that were charging her card monthly. She was not financially in a position to continue to endlessly contribute to them. She was moving money around from bank accounts and causing overdraft fees. There was no reasonable explanation for this. I have had to cancel a number of credit cards because I could not get the company to block certain vendors. She does not have access to her checkbook. If she did she could potentially lose thousands of dollars. I give her a check when she requests one providing it is for a reasonable purpose. My husband and I pay all her bills. We safeguard her money. She has use of one credit card which we explain had to be used sparingly. We do not do all this because we are on a power trip but because we saw how out of control her spending could be at times. I also buy her clothes rather than take her shopping. She has severe mobility issues as well as incontinence. I hope you can find some resolution. Your money should be used for you. Even though we do alot for my mother I do not take her money for any of my own needs. I simply am trying to safeguard her money rather than watching it filter away on expenditures that are not relevant.
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worriedinCali Aug 2019
the OPs daughter isn’t using her mother’s money on her children. The OPs daughter has filed for guardianship and that is why the OP is paying legal fees for various people. It’s her own children’s lawyers that she paying for. Not her grandchildren’s lawyers. The OP said absolutely nothing about her daughter spending her money on her (the daughters) children.
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How to stop daughter's quest for control of your life? See an elder law attorney to prepare your POA's, DNR, will, last wishes, etc. If you are considered competent, no judge will award guardianship to anyone. Guardianship would not be necessary.

Maybe she is POA now? You have the right to select another POA if you so please, if competent. It certainly sounds as if you are.

Maybe daughter is looking out for your best interests. You may be competent, get with your doctor and ask for a diagnosis. You have the legal right to make your own decisions, if competent, regardless of how bad daughter thinks they are.
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FrancescaOC Aug 2019
Thank you gladimhere. That was an excellent and sensible non emotional answer. I tried to answer but was putting myself into it too much as I am 77 and this could happen to me someday. I have wonderful sons, but as Lonely said, she thought she had a good relationship with her daughter before she moved nearby.

I also decided I didn't have enough information. You said pretty much what I wanted to say without all the emotion that I had.
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Please trust your daughter. She has your best interests in mind. I know you don't want to hear this, but more than likely you have dementia and she doesn't want you to get taken advantage of. She is helping you, so please be grateful she is there for you, as you were there for her.
My mother has dementia, and she went through what you are going through mentally. At the beginning stages, she became very paranoid of me. She didn't understand that I wanted to help her. Instead, she thought I wanted to "take over her life," just like you. Your reaction to her is breaking her heart.
Please listen to your daughter and follow along. She is doing what is best for you. Please make it easier for her to help you and thank God she is there for you.
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TXGirl82 Aug 2019
So, because you had an issue with your mom, OP's daughter is to be trusted?

You don't know this woman's situation or her daughter's motives.

This is dangerous advice.
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