Follow
Share

A few years before he died, my father spoke to me about his estate and eventual death. He made a few specific points


1. He did not want any kind of funeral, and certainly not a Catholic one. He didn't want any obituary printed in the paper. He was to be cremated and buried. We assumed it was because he was not religious at all (even though his family was Catholic), and had ex-girlfriends he didn't want showing up to the ceremony. He reiterated this a couple times in the following months, and made me promise I wouldn't give him a funeral.


2. He told me his trust was to be split up 4 ways upon death (his 3 children and his girlfriend would be the heirs). The portfolio was to be liquidated (turned into cash --and it is like 5 million+) and distributed to the heirs upon estate settlement.


After he died last week, my sister-in-law announced that there will be a large (and expensive) Catholic funeral that will be open to the public (obituary in several newspapers, etc.). One of my father's girlfriends, whom a number of people in the family despises (she stole hundreds of thousands of dollars from him when he was suffering from dementia, among other things) is invited to the funeral, and will be in the front row. I expressed disagreement with this, but my sister-in-law told me to "get over it".


My sister, who is the executer of the estate, wants to hold on to the investments in my father's portfolio until estate settlement, and then distribute the stocks, bonds, etc. in kind to the heirs. She says she can do this as it is a better idea than liquidation and distributing cash.


So I have a sister and SIL directly going against the wishes of my father. The SIL claims he had a "come to Jesus" moment on his death bed and agreed to a funeral. I wasn't there and never saw it. While he was alive, my dad was dismissive, if not hostile, towards religion.


Should I even show up to this funeral? Am I overreacting here?

This question has been closed for answers. Ask a New Question.
Anyone in this situation, just go to the funeral. You are more likely to regret not going than regret going. If someone you don't like is there, sit away from them.
It seems to me that funerals are for the benefit of the living. I had a friend who's husband declined to have even a memorial at our church. My church does NOT charge for this. Many people were upset. We had no way to express our grief together. When another friend died her family did not want a memorial at her church since they disagreed with her choice of religion. She had many friends at our church. At first the church said no memorial, but I said if we can't do it at the church then I'm having it at my home. The church relented and 25+ people showed up (not her family, they were invited and again free of charge. )Everyone was given a chance to speak about their memories. It was lovely. When my relative died, I had a memorial at my church but not in the chapel. This was to honour the relative being agnostic. I have purchased Catholic Mass cards to give to mourners who are Catholic even if the deceased was not Catholic. I am not Catholic. I have received Mass cards, and appreciated the feelins of the giver. I believe anything you do, religious or otherwise cannot harm the deceased but can comfort the mourner.
The will. If you have a beneficial interest in the will, contact the attorney listed on the legal notice you receive with any questions. You have that right. I don't think you have to accept in-kind pay out, but this is a legal issue. It makes sense to keep investments as-is during estate admin if the investments are being managed by an investment manager.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

One concern here is who is paying for this event. If there is documentation of your late father's wishes, your sister would need written proof to the contrary in order for the estate to cover the costs. This is one of many reasons that it's essential to document your wishes.
Helpful Answer (1)
Report

The biggest issue is that you lost someone who you loved and will never be around again. If you go, do so with love. No matter what happened in the past, it is the past. And your father is no longer holding a grudge against his ex-girlfriend, so you shouldnt either. As for the executor decision, wait a few more days or months. Your father trusted her, so should you. The money belonged to your father, not you. You will get your equal share in time. Be patient.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

People in life have sometimes very little say ; but the rights on paper of a loved ones funeral should be carried out to the letter ; maybe if is even bizarre . I know when my Grandma on my Fathers side died all the kids squabbled over very little ; such a shame. So your Dad didn't want a fuss and he should get his dying wish. But don't spite your own face or deny your Father your present at his Funeral. Think about it-- I don't think it will hurt anyone but you . Love your Father and give him a loving Good-bye ; God will know who is true to heart or just plain greedy ! My Mom doesn't want all the fancy things either and this is the least of what I can grant her .
Helpful Answer (0)
Report
rovana Dec 2018
I had the impression that these wishes were never properly written down, so it seems to me that if dad really wanted certain things done or not done, it was up to him to get it on paper. Otherwise it's on him.
(1)
Report
See 1 more reply
Silence is golden in some situations. I would go to my fathers funeral. It is just his bones there, but you have to do what is right for you.
Your fathers wishes he expressed to you are being discounted by the rest of the family. I always thought funerals are intended to support the living. Your family needs the attention or support so give it to them, you are the strong one.
Ask your self, what would dad do? Would he go along with his siblings to avoid a family divide? Maybe.
Good luck, your father knows you did the right thing.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report

Silas1066, I realize I have put my $.02 into your life as so many, many of us. We're really trying to support you and we all have different ways of expressing "what we would do" IF we were to be in your situation. I know for myself when I was a teller, I always thought I KNOW EXACTLY HOW I WOULD HANDLE A ROBBERY. I happened to experience 6 robberies. I handled each differently because each was different from the other.
I agree with many you should attend BUT if you feel very strongly about your Father NOT wanting a funeral, ask the funeral home if you can have private time with your Priest and "talk" with your Father about your feelings and why you won't be in attendance.
Your sister may be Executress, BUT that just means she has to EXECUTE your Father's Will which apparently she's not following.
Absolutely hire an Attorney ASAP. Again, you may or may not be an heir even though it has to do with your Father. You can CONTEST by having your attorney take her to Court whether it be a Will or Trust. You can also CONTEST if the girlfriends have their hands in it, nut you have to prove it.
NO ONE gets anything until the Court decides. The Court could take EVERYTHING OVER since your sister has already gone against his wishes.
The best thing if nothing has happened yet, get the attorney and go for it.
Best of luck.
P.S.
I don't feel that anyone HAS TO FORGIVE everyone for everything every time.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
rovana Dec 2018
Good advice, but it is not clear to me what the will actually says and it is that that counts, imo.  Your attorney should be able to see if you are an heir and what the provisions of the will actually say. Same should hold true for a trust that will not go through probate. It is very hard when you do not have copies of these documents, but an attorney should be able to help you to them.
(1)
Report
I don’t think over reacting by not showing up. Sometimes you gotta let your past go and in difficult situations and dealing with individual as 24/7 caregiver.
Helpful Answer (1)
Report

Sorry to hear of this situation at a time of mourning.
If I were you, I would ask myself:
(1) Will I feel better going to the funeral? Would going be out of duty or guilt?
(1a) Could you have a private memorial lighting a candle - being alone?
(2) In 6 months to a year or 2-3-10 years from now, how will you project you'll feel about not attending (or attending) ?
(3) My first response (too) was GET AN ATTORNEY.
(4) Forgiveness (is powerful - for me) and letting go are ways I 'return to my center' and well-being.
Focus on what will bring yourself peace.
Again, if me and I decided to go, I would 110% give myself permission to get up and leave at any moment. The memorial (as previously stated) is healing for you. I would meditate and ask the universe for guidance. Or sit quietly and listen. This is what I am doing NOW, in general. Meditation, asking how to let go and let the universal God/desses guide me. Gena.
Helpful Answer (3)
Report

Hire an attorney for your interests, and his wishes. This will be a rocky time for you. Good luck.
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Hire an attorney.
Helpful Answer (5)
Report

By law you are entitled to a copy of the trust if you are a beneficiary.

Get that and go see an attorney if she is spending money inconsistently with the trust.
Helpful Answer (6)
Report

You are not overreacting, the death of a loved one is emotionally draining and when their wishes are being ignored it's an emotional rollercoaster for all involved. Whatever is in the will is what must legally be followed. If the will is being ignored by the executor you can force the issue. Forcing the issue may require legal help and cause family rifts that will never be mended. However, if he neglected to update his will to include the personal preferences he talked to you about, then whoever is the executor can do pretty much whatever they like.

Basically the only thing you can control is how you respond, react, and act during this time. You can get a lawyer and fight tooth and nail. You can let them do whatever they like, take whatever they give you when it's all over, and keep the peace in the family. You can attend the funeral and make a speech about what his wishes were and how his wishes are being ignored. Etc Etc. The options are limitless with each one having it's own set of consequences and emotional toll on you.

In the end you have to decide what you are willing to do and not do and how important it all is to you. I've had to make choices similar to the ones you're making more than once. I'm sorry to say, I know it won't be easy. My advice is that you should do what you must in order to be able to later live peacefully with your choices. (hugs)
Helpful Answer (7)
Report

Get a lawyer now! Yes, funeral/final arrengements are for the living. I believe a simple memorial event is appropriate, and even needed, to provide solace and a way for a final farewell to close loved ones. However, a huge, religious, expensive event is not the same as a respectful and heartfelt memorial. He may have had many prominent or affluent "friends", but he obviously didn't care about their wishes...

Many other posts seem to assume there is no will or "trust" which documents Dad's instructions? Why? If the sister is named executrix, and by some means obviously knows what Dad wanted (" She says she can do this as it is a better idea than liquidation and distributing cash") there may very well be a will expressing last wishes and arrangements? Unless there is a legal challenge, who would insist Dad's wishes be followed? As far as why sister was chosen to be executrix, it's possible her affect toward her father reflected her plans for the future (estate) more than sincere affection and agreement with his own plans. Is she paying the huge expenses of the unwanted funeral from her own inheritance? Hah!
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Hi Silas. I could sence from Your Post that Your Father adored and trusted You the most as this is why He made His wishes known to You but Families have a habit of ruining things. I feel Your Sister in Law is a right b.... but there is no point in fighting amongst Yourselves as You did make Your Dads wishes known to the Family and there is nothing more that You could have done with out their cooperation.
Do attend Your Fathers Funeral but skip the big splash meal and drinks afterwards.
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Go to the funeral. You're already out of the "circle of trust" so finish it.
Get an attorney NOW, you have a right to see the Will. If your sibling is not following his directives she is committing fraud and looking for financial gain.
No one can change a Will to benefit themself or anyone else. Not liquidating the stocks is not her right to do if your Dad stated they are to be liquidated.
The attorney will petition the Court to restrict all accounts and property. You will then go to Court to force your sister to do EXACTLY what Dad wanted. IF Dad stated in his Will that he did not want a funeral, she has already illegaly changed it. NOT GOOD FOR HER. This will be part of the action presented to the Court. Your attorney can request a Representative be appointed NOW and/or remove your sister if she is the Representative.
As for not caring for the trophy girlfriends and what siblings are doing, you will be showing them that YOU ARE DOING WHAT DAD WANTED and too bad so sad. They're not going to like you, but it appears they don't any way. Take CONTROL for Dad, NOT FOR YOU, for Dad.
My Mom is still alive, but suffers from Alzheimer's. I'm Guardian/conservator. I have step-siblings I'm basically going thu part of this right now. Like you, the oldest step-sister "stole" close to $70.000 from Mom. Mom has the money, their Dad (I love him so much) is a meek/humble man. Never really had a penny to his name so to speak. His kids know, having found financial statements in the house, how much my Mom is worth. Let's get what we can as soon as we can! I'm meeting with her attorney/my attorney to "discuss" monatary issue i.e. money she took illegally phase 1, $30.000. She doesn't want Dad to pay 50% of bills i.e. utilities because Dad does not own the house with Mom. AZ is a total Community Property State and debts are based on the Spanish marriage Laws. I've researched as far back as the 1800s he's responsible because he is Mom's spouse. I believe that my step-sister has been informed about her fraudulent actions because the 1st of a few Pow Wows I'm sure will will happen next week. She is college educated but she doesn't have the banking background I have and learned over 38+ yrs, as well as having my spouse who is Sr Chief Compliance bank officer as a go to regarding bank regulations/law. Yes, I'm and will fight for my Mom and that includes with both step-siblings right now and my siblings later.
Your can show your disdain for issues you're facing now in many ways. You don't need to verbalize, they'll get the picture especially taking them to Court for your Dad.
Helpful Answer (8)
Report
anonymous594015 Dec 2018
I think this is a trust which is slightly different than a will. But good for you protecting your Mom.
(2)
Report
See 1 more reply
I have a similar situation, and we had to be VERY clear in a will drawn up by an attorney and notarized so there would be no mistake. That's really what it all comes down to in this litigious society - what will the law uphold? I was earlier screwed out of more than a quarter million dollars because the verbal agreement among us was completely ignored once the relative with this money died and her closest next of kin lied about it and kept it. I hate to say but if your sister is legally the executor, she most likely has the say in these matters.
Helpful Answer (7)
Report
dkentz72 Dec 2018
I'm sorry to read you were "screwed" out of all that money BUT even though you're a relative close or distant, does not actually make you an "heir". It sounds to me like your hand shake relatives may have known you were not in the Will and just played along with it. You should still be able to get a copy of the Will to see if you were taken to the cleaners. You should be able to get assistance from the legal eagles at the Court to help research how Wills/Trusts are handled. There are only 9 States that are Community Law as well as Probate. I will have to deal with a sibling who will only receive a very minimal amount of money and she'll go ballistic. I'm conservator and will request appointment as Representative when the time comes. I can ONLY do what Mom stated in her Will. It will be up to the 3 of us to decide if we will share more with our 4th sibling. I don't doubt we won't, but Mom was going to leave this sibling out altogether. I convinced Mom not to, so she has left basicaly a mere here ya go don't spend it all in 1 place.
So is it worth your time to find out if you were "screwed" or you weren't due anything at all. One way or another, you may feel screwed again or you can get your just desserts taking them to Court.
(2)
Report
$5M isn't peanuts. Why are you relying on your sister (even if she's a lawyer or a tax accountant) for the decision making? Hire your own attorney and accountant to represent your interests in the estate. This isn't a question for the internet.

As for your other question - funerals are for the living. It's sad when the wishes of the deceased aren't followed, but sometimes they're not fair nor reasonable. I had an uncle who wanted no obituary, no funeral, no viewing, no burial. His children considered his wishes along with their need to grieve and had a handful of family members at the funeral home and we held a 'do-it-yourself- style remembrance before he was cremated. Sounds like your family wants something more elaborate and that doesn't match what your dad told you about his wishes. You don't know what he told your sister. Choosing not to go to the funeral would not be honoring your dad, it would be spiting your sister. Is that what your dad would want?
Helpful Answer (9)
Report

No you’re not over reacting. You know what your father said and how his wishes are being ignored. I have seen this before. It’s unbelievable how people will stomp all over others. I wouldn’t go and I wouldn’t explain it either. My dad died 2 months ago and the funeral was held without my knowledge. My mother wouldn’t stand up to my brother who hates me. I’m not saying don’t go because of what happened to me. I just believe that when family is do disrespectful, we need to protect ourselves
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Hi, I hear ya! But by you trying to do what you know your dad wanted, holding on tight to that, will do nothing but scar his memory. Every time you think back of dads last days and the way he was interned will be this resentful, bitter pill for the rest of YOUR life. I come from a family where I now have a saying " the fight starts at the wake" . From the funeral director, to the clothes, to who showed up, who didnt show up, who wore what, who talked to who, who didnt talk to who, who did the most , who didnt do enough...then the family money fight, complete with lawyer and screaming matches. I sit there in amazement watching them rip at each other, turning into small animals biting at each other. This is about your dad and the way you feel about his passing. YOUR memories, YOUR feelings. Dont let it go, keep them. Its about your relationship with him and his passing. Let them have their way, as petty as it may seem to you. Its not worth disgracing dad or yourself to go to that level of human nature.

When the money gets distributed, do the same. I had 4 aunts and uncles- totally divided the family. Never to speak again. Their mother told one kid this,another on that and when she died THE FIGHT STARTED AT THE WAKE and after they all got their lawyers, the estate was gobbled up, and they ended up splitting $ 13K. after a 3 year battle....which should have been about 280K to split in the beginning.

Maintain your composer and dignity, keep your dads memories close to your heart, because they are between HIM AND YOU, thats one thing no one can control. I know you must just want to scream, but your dads gone, move into the phase of missing him, loving him and still respect him. There are 2 roads for a reason, take the higher road. Im sorry you lost your dad, take care of yourself. Best.
Helpful Answer (10)
Report

Sounds like you need a good lawyer ASAP because they’re going against your father‘s wishes in more than one area. And expensively. It’s none of my business but I’m curious how the sister-in-law has the authority to do this. So don’t answer that please, but go get a lawyer ASAP
Helpful Answer (5)
Report
Lizhappens Dec 2018
Footnote, to answer your question, if the funeral is going to happen, Fight for it not to be a huge religious event, but go. Funerals are for family & friends to say goodbye. And besides, you can keep your eyes on what’s going on. stand up for your dad and at least don’t have that person you mentioned sitting in the front row. If they’re going to be a bull in the china shop, try to be the wall they hit.
(1)
Report
See 1 more reply
I'm a physician. For what I know about Legal Consent issues (and, an attorney SHOULD be consulted here) it's what Dad said while he was Lucid that counts. Of course, it helps if things were in writing. I know folks who didn't want Funerals, because they didn't have many contacts, and those wishes Must be respected.
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Yes you should attend your father's funeral. It proves that you care. Allow others to extend their sympathy to you. You will probably see some old friends of the family. You may even be asked to say a few words. This is when you can simply say your father didn't want a fuss made on his behalf.

An obituary is a news item, not a eulogy. As your father was well known in his community, it is an important record. It is also a chance to list the causes and charities he may have favored.
Helpful Answer (5)
Report
anonymous594015 Dec 2018
Attending a funeral doesn't prove you care and not attending doesn't mean you didn't care. How you treated someone when they lived proves if you cared about them or not.
Otherwise I agree with your statement.
(5)
Report
Its difficult for you. I tried to uphold my father's way of life and my sister agreed.
But your dad should have spoken to his executor about it too.

If I were you I would just go along, to get along. You have no choice because you have no way to enforce his wishes he did not express to his executor as well.

No need for lavish funerals. If your hands are tied, then just let him go peacefully and make peace with that. All the best.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report

The funeral is for the family left behind, not the person who has passed away. Since it seems your father had the assets to pay for it, I would let it slide. The decision to hold the assets until the estate gets through probate is actually how it is supposed to work anyway. The executor really can't just liquidate everything immediately and distribute it. There is a legal process.

Go to the funeral. Be civil. Be kind. Smile and be gracious. Nothing to be gained from being otherwise. Take the high road.
Helpful Answer (9)
Report

I was the executor of my mother's estate. She told me she did not want an open casket. She said she didn't want anyone looking at her when she couldn't look back. I honored her request. The casket was closed with a large spray of roses across the top with her picture in the middle. One of my sisters was not pleased about this, said she had wanted to see mother one last time. If she wanted to see her mother one last time perhaps she could have come to visit her while she was still alive but clearly in her last days.

If your father wanted his wishes followed regarding a funeral he should have made you executor instead of your sister. But he did not, so perhaps you should just accept what is and act accordingly.
Helpful Answer (7)
Report
busymom Dec 2018
For those of you who "deal" with a closed casket request, but have family who feel the need to view the deceased, you can do what my family did. My dad didn't want mom's casket open to the public. When I reminded him that there would be children and grandchildren making very long-distant trips to mom's funeral and would need the "closure" of seeing her one more time, he agreed to a private viewing by the family only. The funeral director was so kind and gracious to accommodate this. We had a private viewing before the public visitation. This was especially helpful to my daughter who was away at college and couldn't come to say her last "good night" to her grandma. My nephew, who had moved across country (but always visited when he could), personally thanked me for getting Dad to agree to this. I'm glad we made Dad happy and ministered to the rest of the family in this manner.

Ann, I fully understand your thoughts on siblings (and even grandchildren) who refused to visit the loved one while they were living. My adult children will tell anyone what a delight it was to really know their grandparents in their healthy days and in their aging, and dying days! They never used the excuse, "I want to remember them like I knew them in the past." Every stage of life is good (even when it's hard). My children were so loving and my parents responded so well to their kindness and attention. We have no regrets for spending time with my parents (or friends, or elderly loved ones) who were dying. I know there are times when this is impossible to do, but I also know that many people choose not to visit those who are in their latter days. Sadly, they're the losers, and so is their loved one who truly wanted at least a visit from their child, grandchild, relative, or friend.
(6)
Report
See 1 more reply
This is horrible and very disrespectful to your father. Who is paying for the funeral? If I were you, I wouldn't go, distance yourself from this travesty.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

Sounds like your father did not document his “no funeral” wishes.

Even if it’s not legally binding, a notarized document (authored by Dad) tucked in with Dad’s POA/DNR/will/5 Wishes would have sent an unequivocal statement to the immediate family.

As for the trust, the parameters of disbursement can be written into the trust paperwork. For whatever reason, your father did not do that.

You are stuck with word-against-word during a highly emotional time. And it sucks.

I’m not attacking. Just applying the exhausting, miserable (and at times, insulting) lessons I learned from my own journey with elders who talked out of both sides of their mouth.

Who assigned fiscal/legal responsibility to a certain family member for “political reasons,” but expressed different wishes to the trusted(?) confidant..... the softie..... the listener.

Who perhaps thought they were flattering the “chore-minder” relatives(s) by using words that were magically (?) supposed to supersede what the elder already legally committed to according to.

Good intentions or not, the end result is clashing expectations — that surface at a highly emotional time.

I wish you peace, Silas.

You are not alone in your frustration.

Over the past 5 years, the elders in my life set off so much “wouldda-couldda-shouldda” with their decisions AND their non-decisions. It was an end I never saw coming. More than once.

For many of us, our inheritance includes memories that are colored by hypocrisy.

It’s very difficult to reset from an experience like this. Be kind to yourself. (((big hugs)))
Helpful Answer (14)
Report
janeinspain Dec 2018
This is great advice and oh how it resonates with me BlackHole. I’ve heard a lifetime of complaints about my brother, received the distress calls during his outbursts, observed his antisocial behavior and bad dealings, but when it finally got so bad that I needed to take action suddenly I am the troublemaker. I l’ve learned (too late it seems) that I should have kept a polite distance from it all much sooner and urged my parents to take action on their concerns themselves. Very hard lessons and yes very hard to “reset” as you said. I hope you are finding some peace.
Jane
(1)
Report
Dear Silas,
Sometimes we focus our energies on details when we want to avoid pain. I believe this may be what is happening right now. Losing a parent, especially when you are close, is devastating. It shakes us to the core at so many levels. Our own mortality comes to question. We are, after all, next in line. Sometimes we must take that grief a "bite at a time" It is just too much to accept all at once.
Take deep breathes, long showers (great place to cry btw) and don't over complicate this. Your dad is gone. A small funeral or a big, showy Catholic funeral with all the bells and whistles is not going to really affect your dad. You were there for him, that is what is important. If you feel keeping your word to him is necessary, refrain from attending. But, most importantly, take care of yourself. It is what he would want. I'm sorry for your loss.
Helpful Answer (19)
Report

Funeral s are really for the living not the deceased. That said I think in this case I would be not my circus not my monkey and beg off. Looks like drama waiting to happen. The executor should follow the deceased's wishes. That is the point of a will.
Helpful Answer (5)
Report

Wow...is it possible you can talk the family into holding him a "Remembrance" get together? Or perhaps you can skip the funeral and hold your own get together after the funeral to honor your father's wishes. If your sister in law is lying about his "Encounter" on his death bed, then that is a lie they will have to live with going against your father's wishes. Be the good daughter..skip the funeral and honor him in your own way, the way he would want you to...and the way he told you he wanted it. Tell your sister in law to get Over Herself, and learn to honor what your father wanted. Good Luck....
Helpful Answer (5)
Report

This question has been closed for answers. Ask a New Question.
Ask a Question
Subscribe to
Our Newsletter