My uncle has reached out to me, telling me things that sound like elder abuse, financial exploitation, withholding treatment and comfort care.

I have referred them all to this forum to educate themselves.
My sister and I may take this public to the media because the next step would be a public guardian, a big fight. There are other family but they too have been banned, and do not know the truth.
Should the family be contacted?

Isn't it sad enough that his wife led my uncle to believe he was to go to her son's home and she would join him later, when in fact, her other son told me she would never live with her husband again? That this was the plan.

Through default, claiming ignorance, these five people have perpetrated a scam on this elderly man, who still loves his wife and wants to live near her.

When he is again sent away, too far to visit.....too far to help......against his will.......he is 86, in case any "family" are reading this and cannot see their own father in this scenario.

He is LIVING with cancer, and a broken heart. A very broken heart.

He has lost capacity and has said "Yes" under pressure, but he does not want to move again, further from his wife.

Has there been any follow up from APS since he was moved?
What is your status with the family now, are you still persona non grata? If so, how are you getting news about his situation?
Does he have any children, or is it just his step family? And has he been a parent to those children, or is he merely their mother's spouse to them?

Cwillie, my answers have not posted.

My uncle phoned me...my number was in his phone previously. He cannot dial my sisters number, I had her call him. We have phone contact-he cannot talk freely when someone is there.

I know you already know this, but sometimes people with dementia get things muddled up. How certain are you about what he has been telling you?

He says APS did nothing.
His stepson where he lives now said he is like a father to him, he loves him, he can live there forever. That may have changed, I don't know, will not ask for more lies. There are five, in total, moving him around against his will.
It appears, looking in from the outside, and from what I can determine is credible coming from an 86 y.o. with (dementia/alzheimers?), that there is elder financial abuse. He is also a fall risk.
My guess is that uncle's wife won't free up enough money for caregivers to come in to help my uncle to not be alone 10-12 hours.
His son and daughter plan to move him to son's home, farther away. Son's wife (they have a child) will caregive for free, putting a burden on her bad back.

I am certain of most facts that I can confirm 1) over careful observation over a period of six months, 2) by what he says reluctantly, not wanting to make waves, but still has said things,3) confirmed things to me, and when the truth has been tracked down, confirmed by others, I see what has been going on.
Except for being alone, lacking his glasses and a brace, his own daughter upsetting him, his family planning/forcing another move, he is in no immediate danger.

Given that his wife won't - or can't - care for him it seems as though they are trying to make the best of things. If the stepsons really care for him they will be trying to do what is right, even if their choices are not ones you agree with or understand. Sometimes there are no perfect answers. As for him not getting glasses, or being given his brace, or even being alone all day... those things may be totally untrue or only partially true or there may be a logical explanation for them (for example if he has cataracts or AMD and new glasses won't help).

The financial abuse is real. Hence, the threats and yelling by his daughter and son.

No one will admit to his diagnosis, it was stated, then retracted, not acknowleged. Then, it's "I don't know". Of course it is that they "don't know", because he could not be competently signing his pension check over to his wife, they -all five of them under control of the very ill wife-if he was incompetent. He has not been declared incompetent, does not know if anyone has POA, his step-son said my uncle has control over his own money. Their motivation is to keep it the same, using his money, with family having full access to his income and bank accounts for their own use. Then, denying him care.

Yes, I agree with some of what you have said, Cwillie. He has a new Rx.  But you may be right.  We no longer have any way to follow up with any facts.  But when we followed up before, the truth was-they are denying him care.  Even through default, being busy, working, etc.  Being unaware, defensive if asked.
Uncle has stated, going unwillingly to his stepson's home in January, it is not ideal, but his wife was supposed to live there too. She is not coming. If she knew that, he could have stayed in their home, brought in caregivers, instead of her bully son who verbally abused my uncle (and other things observed by me and a visiting nurse), they fired her and told me he did not need food prepared.
Only the stepson living off his Mom is a bully. Not feeding her as she goes to the hospital the next day, blaming my uncle for not changing her diaper, when her son is supposed to be the caregiver and was not even home that night.
That is a whole another story, my uncle was removed from slovenly conditions by the other stepson who loves him. omg, this is hard, very personal. Was it okay to try and expose the truth? Is this okay?  I am sure it is not okay with them.  I saw this stepson swipe an 18 y.o. cat off the counter and a week later complain on facebook he has to get money to have the cat put down-will ask his mother in the hospital.....That is in the past.

I was told he sat there for four years, and he is an a**hole.

Send...

Could you compile a list of questions you would ask if you were Queen Social Worker, and take it to the police, and just get their advice? Things like:

Is he or is he not attending medical appointments relevant to his cancer?
What palliative care is he receiving, and by whom is it being delivered?
What one person is taking responsibility for his ADL/everyday welfare?
What one person is taking responsibility for his finances, and where are these being accounted for?

Unless these questions can be answered satisfactorily, I don't see how the safeguarding authorities can just walk away from it. But I realise that you can hardly contact APS yourself. It's a bummer.

Who did your sister arrange the meals-on-wheels through? What about the agency whose nurse was dismissed? There must be a lot of people thinking questions but not asking them.

It *could* be that a very difficult situation is being handled, but messily. But that's not good enough just to turn a blind eye to. Of course you're right to speak up!

What is left is that he is being moved in a week or so, again, against his will, as all five lie to him to persuade him, pressure him.

1) Should hospice come in?
2) It appears he has no more rights, even to choose his own residence.
3) It was reported by his wife that there was a time he gave up about two years ago and refused to eat.

Since this has all been too much family dysfunction for me (toxic); and I cannot sleep or get this out of my mind and heart, that prior to these past 4-6 months I was an occasional visitor to their home.....

I advised my uncle to call APS himself first.

I am slow posting...catching up to read....

All good questions CM, and asked of social workers on the periphery.

Uncle told me he refused a lung biopsy and they will treat it palliatively.
A man who is the silent type, never cries, taken care of everyone, he cried.

Please be patient as I read back a ways, so I can answer properly.

Where he lives may be nonnegotiable, unless the choice were made to have him move to AL/NH he must go where there is someone willing to have him. It sucks, but it is something faced by many elders.

The on again off again cancer diagnosis... well it's confusing, but one would think that untreated lung cancer would be progressing, perhaps it was a false diagnosis? (Not unheard of, I know of someone it happened to)

Since you were seemingly unjustly blamed and banished for calling APS the first time around what harm can come from asking them for a follow up, listing all your concerns?

The stepson's home, in which Uncle now resides, comes home from work, cooks for uncle, bandages his cut forehead from his latest fall, is up all night with him tending to his injuries, loves him, and cares for him to the best of his abilities. He asks his Mom to reimburse for "allowed expenses".

My uncle is not a complainer, is not histrionic. As an example to not tell or out his wife for spending a whole lot of money on the adult children, he explains to my sister: "She has always been very generous to her children".

When she moved in her adult son, Uncle was so very against this, and the 3 adults using one toilet etc. (other major problems), uncle said: "It is what she wants"; "We will just ignore him".....That stepson banned me from the family-uncle called me and said come over anyway, now, just come over.
Let yourself in. Then, stepson started locking the door, asking, what are you doing here? We have food. Don't come over, etc.
Then Uncle was removed from his home, the abusive bully staying.
Should a 50 y.o. man be changing his mother's diapers when he will not even change the cat litter boxes for 5 cats? (Sorry, that sounded judgmental).
Her response? "He has never been very good at that".

Looks like it was a takeover by the son who had everything to gain, even if his mother had died, he would have her house. They already sold my uncle's home 3 years ago, where this son was living, and the money is gone.

My aunt, and my friend.....I could do nothing to protect her....have very sadly lost that relationship. She may not be making rational decisions, was very ill, almost died.
I would like to see both her and my uncle live comfortably in assisted living...
living out their last days comfortable.

And to please give up this "save the money" , we cannot afford it...etc.
while supporting two households, and a derelict son.

Uncle receives home delivered meals free, I am told. His separate income is at least $5000/ mo.

I apologize if this must be making everyone uncomfortable.

Now you know part of why I have been so, well, so very.....Very.

Yes, Tacy, I am the "religious" outcast of the entire family, Lol.

Cwillie, The Ca diagnosis has just been given, Uncle agrees to no treatment, and did not want even the lung biopsy. Six months to live, he was told. Six months is the time given by doctors when they do not understand that there will be a family member praying for his comfort, and many non-denominational and catholic church members praying for him and his wife.
As well as other believers.....loving people even on this forum, please.

I was making reference to the confusion over the past 4 years of whether he is competent, has or does not have alzheimers/dementia. He forgets, falls, has agitation that family describes as "he is an a**hole".
He is the nicest man I have ever known, was there for my mother after she divorced, and was there for all three of us siblings as we were growing.
My aunt was great too!  Under pressure from his daughter:  "don't spend my inheritance" trust plans were made.

So, there, I have said too much.

OK, lets see if I have this right.
APS investigated, causing the move away from his wife and a**hole stepson.
Good stepson is overwhelmed with care and responsibilities and they won't cough up the funds for outside caregivers.
Bio family proposes another move to bio son and DIL's home.
Auntie is ill and maybe is being manipulated by her son, or maybe is just enmeshed with his scheming, dysfunctional ways.
You are angry, sad, and basically powerless.

((HUGS)) I think your role has to be to play cheerful and stupid... You need glasses, well I'm sure stepson will take care of it soon! Moving in with son and DIL will be SO nice! Reassure him, cheer him, do whatever it takes to bolster his spirit, even if it is a bold faced lie. Sorry, but I can't see anything else that won't just stir the pot and get you nowhere.

The real thing, is that this hard-working man, who has supported so many, for so long, does not care about the money, has allowed his wife to manage it all these years.
But to not have basic needs met...to by default allow her bully stepson to in fact be in control of their money, would never be Uncle's choice.

My uncle just is not up for a fight, a legal battle, and neither am I, wanting him to have as peaceful a life as possible with his remaining years.

Thanks for listening.....and I apologize to family reading this....identified only by their hurtful selfish behaviors....similar to so many others....you could be mistaken for just any predator.

If the diagnosis is six months you should encourage Hospice, point out that it won't cost them anything for this service.

Yes, Cwillie, that is basically it.
With the exception that all 5 were believing that Uncle was the a**hole, lol.

Will not have a problem playing dumb, if it is in Uncle's best interests.
It is my sister who's role has always been to accept the role of being the bad guy. She also cannot continue this role after his son threatened her with bodily harm. We are now just the miserable nieces.

It is not what I would wish on anyone, what has happened to my uncle.
I can, however, put this in a perspective that will no longer hurt me, and I thank you for your advice!
And you too, CM, and Tacy.

About a year after we brought mthr to my area to treat her cancer and severe blood loss, I found a letter mthr wrote to her friends back home but never mailed. She had pretty much lost her mind to hypoxia and mild dementia, but seemed ok if you did not know her. She accused me and even hubby (whom she adores) of slipping her a "mickey" to drug her and bring her to some unknown place where we were locking her in a room and not feeding her. The reality is that we placed her in a memory care and they brought her down to meals. She also told the staff every morning that she was waiting for the bus to take her to school, and in the evenings that she had papers to grade (she'd been a teacher). She had no idea she'd had surgery! So you really can't trust what the uncle saying as Gospel truth.

When cancer starts bleeding, Cancer patients get low hemaglobin numbers, which affects their thinking in a similar way to how dementia works. Our oncologist explained that some people die from getting very very sleepy from the blood loss and that they just go to sleep and don't wake up. Low hemoglobin is a peaceful way to go.

I was surprised when mthr's friends did not want to do anything but send cards, but since I found that unmailed letter, I understand better. No one enjoys the drama of a scared elder. No one knows what's really going on. I was an abused child, so I knew the best place for mthr was in an institutional setting where no one could accuse me of abusing her. I'm glad I did - her attorney's brother stopped in for an unexpected visit some time before I found the letter, and was surprised she was still in the memory care unit. He went out and found her clean, dry, and 50 lbs heavier than the last time he'd seen her, in a lovely suite with new furniture I'd bought her. He had no complaints to take home!

I'm sorry your uncle stressing you. I think the best advice is from cwillie above - put on a happy face and have a positive outlook on life. Don't get drawn in. And if you need to, set more firm boundaries and step back from the situation. Send cards. And pray.

Yes, that was a very difficult part to reconcile in my heart and mind, as time passed, knowing if it were anyone else's story I would be railing against the injustice of it all.....urging them to report to APS. And here I was, waiting, not reporting, in my mind still a mandated reporter, trying to sort out their diversionary lies, wanting to believe it will change......then I went to a therapist, and I have shared bits and pieces of my pain and frustration on here. Wondering why I would ever give the bully the benefit of the doubt.
Why I kept trying. What was the truth. How is it that they chose to live that way.
No longer waiting for them to explain, or do something about anything, I am not going to wait, or pin any hopes that they will do what's right. Deep breath. Tough love.
Thanks for asking, Tacy.

Surprise, And thank you for your contribution also. My father died of lung cancer, one year after diagnosis; , then my mother's next husband died of
lung cancer in 3 months.

Cwillie, So relieved you were here to walk me through this today. For me, it was 4-5 hours of posting-did not eat until tonight. But your views closely resemble mine and yes, encouraging and explaining hospice has been done. He may need reminding, but then, how can he get signed up if it is the slippery family plan on moving him again in two weeks? No wonder APS could not keep up. Lies.
We will lose touch once he is moved.
Goodbye dear Uncle.....it's not over yet.....as I am writing this, the loudest thunder happened out of nowhere, sun was there, now cloudy, grey, rain or hail. For those who may believe that God speaks through His creation,
it is really hailing now. Thundershowers were forecast.
Godspeed dear Uncle....

IT'S NOT OVER YET
For King & Country

They are inside your head
You got a voice that says
You won't get past this one
You won't win your freedom
It's like a constant war
And you want to settle that score
But you're bruised and beaten
And you feel defeated
This goes out to the heaviest heart
[Chorus:]
Oh, to everyone who's hit their limit
It's not over yet
It's not over ye-et
And even when you think you're finished
It's not over yet
It's not over ye-et
Keep on fighting
Out of the dark
Into the light
It's not over
Hope is rising
Never give in
Never give up
It's not over
Yea-et-et, woah
Yea-et-et, woah
Oh, game set match
It's time to put it in your past, oh
Feel the winter leavin'
It's redemption season
Long live the young at heart (Here we are)
Cheers to a brand new start (Here we are)
We're revived and breathing
To live a life of freedom
[Chorus:]
Oh, to everyone who's hit their limit
It's not over yet
It's not over ye-et
And even when you think you're finished
It's not over yet
It's not over ye-et
Life is a race we run
So run till the race is won
Don't you ever give up (Here we are)
Oh no never give up (Here we are)
Life is a race we run
So run till the race is won
Don't you ever give up (Here we are)
We will never give up (Here we are)
[Chorus:]
Oh, to everyone who's hit their limit
And even when you think you're finished
It's not over yet
Oh, to everyone who's hit their limit
It's not over yet
It's not over ye-et
And even when you think you're finished
It's not over yet
It's not over ye-et
Keep on fighting
Out of the dark
Into the light
It's not over
Hope is rising
Never give in
Never give up
It's not over
Yea-et-et, woah

The best thing about taking the nuclear option is that everything blows up, and after the dust clears, something has been accomplished.

Then there is the tortoise and the hare, slow and steady wins the race.

My sister promised him, "Stick to the plan". She would help.

Not sure what he is asking, except for help because he doesn't want to leave Southern California. He went with stepson to his home last time, after saying he would not go. Signed a paper with his wishes written.

I feel like we failed.
I am not the tortoise and the hare scene. I am pro the nuclear option personality.

Downloaded the APS form for reporting.

I should let this go?