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My mom lives in a MC facility, and we’ve recently had a problem with staff using her room for breaks. Several times we’ve walked in and a staff member will be sitting on her furniture or talking on the phone in her bathroom because it’s “quiet” there. One time Mom and I were in her room for several minutes before a staff member sheepishly came out of the bathroom and made some excuse about checking on Mom (who is very mobile and usually not in her room). We’ve told the facility director, and he says he’s aware that this is a widespread issue. Is this a normal thing? We’re thinking about putting a camera in her room. While I totally understand the staff needing regular breaks, they do have their own break room. I don’t like my mom’s room being used as the place to “hang out” just because it’s cleaner/nicer than other areas in the facility (thanks to me). I guess I’m a little irked about paying thousands of dollars for Mom to have her own space and someone else using it, potentially sleeping there. I hope this doesn’t sound selfish. I’m just wanting to know what others have experienced.

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I have heard of staff napping in resident's rooms so that isn't outside the realm of possibility. No, staff should not be using your mom's HOME as their secret break room and I'd make darned sure that you document and report every instance.

(You likely won't even have to have a camera, just a sign that says there is one😉)
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I would not want this to happen. Install cameras and keep reporting to the director. If the Director cannot do anything to help, report to facility owners and state regulators. This is your mother’s “home” now and she deserves her privacy.
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Christine44 Oct 2022
Totally agree, Becky. "Privacy" -- along with "dignity" -- are the operative words here.
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When I did my Orientation the CNAs would “hide” in a Residents room towards the end of the shift. I found that wrong on so many levels. That is the Residents rooms are not to be used for relaxing. I never did that, I wanted to be in the hallway to see the call lights.

When my mom was in Rehab, the other bed was empty and she told me that two CNAs came in on the night shift and sat on that bed to watch stuff on their phones. She didn’t want me to say anything.
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BurntCaregiver Oct 2022
That's common the end of shift hiding. No one wants to change another diaper or toilet someone. They're watching the clock at a certain hour.
At the AL I worked at, I did not do hands-on care. I was medication only. Everyone's meds were ordered and organized by me that was my job.
I'd see a call light on and literally go and get an aide myself to see what it was for. I knew all their hiding places.
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I’d be quite P.O.’d!
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This is no different than Mom renting an apartment. Your Mom is paying for a private room. As such no one should be making themselves comfortable in it. You probably have been nice so far. Next time the Director is told that he must make his aides aware that residents rooms are not their break room. I would think this is a reason for firing. Is there an RN? If so, talk to her/him. She is over the aides.
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JoAnn29 is the comments is spot on right. Your mom's room is no different than if it were an apartment or a house. It is her home and that is her personal space that she pays for. No one has a right to go in there when "she isn't home" without her permission.
I would strongly encourage you to take this up with the facility director. If the facility director ever feeds you the insulting nonsense about being 'aware that it's a widespread issue' you go higher than him. He has a boss. Or the place had a Board of Directors that he answers to. I worked in a very nice AL for a long time. If I ever saw a staff member sneaking into a client's room to chill or use the phone there would have been trouble.
Install those cameras too. Then show the footage to the facility director and insist that he make a policy that employees in a resident's room who are not assisting them in some way or not the housekeeping staff in there cleaning, will be fired immediatey.
You should make a big fuss about this because it is wrong.
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Totally unacceptable. Keep reporting it and put a nest camera in the room
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Not selfish and completely unacceptable. The director should have responded far better than saying he’s aware. I’d threaten to move mom and her $$ elsewhere if it doesn’t stop
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Lulu376 Oct 2022
They care more about reviews.
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Maybe if you ask for a substantial discount that will get management’s attention on solving the problem.
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KaleyBug Oct 2022
I like this, since her mom is sharing her room with staff she should be paying a reduced rate. Love this response
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Staff using your Mom's space should never be tolerated. Your mom pays expensive dollars for her privacy and care, and the staff are not paid to use her space for their breaks, so they should use a breakroom for that, even if it has some sounds. Contact the director's boss for to get this stopped.
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Others have shared good suggestions to try to get it stopped. There should be a resident's council and possibly a family council and I'd be sure to bring it up there. Other's family members need to be aware because if you manage to have it stopped in your mom's room, they will only be going to other resident's rooms. Perhaps there is a board of directors and maybe they should be aware.
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I have a camera in moms apartment. It has been helpful on the times mom has been confused or when she tripped and thought she hit her head (she didn’t) which saved her from going to the hospital. It also has been helpful in just seeing the routine of the staff which helped me see that I was paying for services she didn’t get. Complaining didn’t help because I was told mom declined or delayed or there were staffing shortages. I got her a private carer who comes in 4 hours a day (some are 2 hour min). She is awesome and moms advocate when I am not there and likes the camera because she wants me to know how my mom is doing. Btw, mom has 2 caregivers now for 7 day care. It is still less expensive than the AL services and they text me daily what was done. Routine is soothing to mom and she feels safe with her own person. I found my person from the private carer who was working with another resident. Mom didn’t bond with 1 person (I think it is because she is not confident-mom is sweet but can “smell” fear or lack of confidence.) That poor lady did not have a chance! ;)

Side note: find a excellent stand alone ER so you can take her if she doesn’t have to be transported. Mom tripped, 911 was called, nothing broken but because she hit her face she was required to be evaluated. I put her in my vehicle and took her to my fav standalone ER and she was evaluated, xrayed and mri’d and released. She was back in 2 hours. The AL staff were shocked. If she was taken to the local hospital they said she would have been there all day and probably admitted according to the staff. Mom was happy to be home and in her own cozy apartment.

I told mom the cameras were speakers and I didn’t ask permission from the facility. There is a sign outside her door that they eventually put up but the cameras are not hidden. I use Blink.
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Lulu376 Oct 2022
I'm assuming you mean an urgent care center? Good tips.
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My sister was in long term care for 8 years and during that time I had her in 3 different facilities for that very same thing. At her last facility I contacted Ombudsman’s, which is posted in every facility in the country, to him what was going on they invested (anonymously ) and things improved. I was told buy my lawyer if that doesn’t work well for me to contact department of health they will step in and fine the facility. Hope this helps.
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Luta65 Oct 2022
Evolove,

I think your lawyer may have given you advice that serves to bring more business his or her way and to keep you calling on this issue and racking up more billable hours. They do that. And why is a facility being fined from a State survey finding illegal violations occurring in the facility a bad thing? Imo, they should be both reported on and fined, it's the only way to force them to provide the corrective oversight to ensure that residents' rights are not being continually violated.

The means of putting a complete stop to this is a total self service type of thing. Any interested party can place a call to the state oversight agencies plus Medicare and Medicaid, for that matter, and make a formal complaint either online or via phone. This can be done anonymously and results in the agencies doing an on-site survey, aka, inspection and issuing points for the violations identified. Some of these points result in fines and there is no better way than to hit their bottom line to get these sleezeball (sry, but most all of them are) facility admins to act on a problem.

Be glad that you did a report; I believe that more people should. I've done reports on the SNF my Mom resides in and don't care who knows it, it's an issue of endangerment and standard of care. I also reported on a SNF that I worked in for endangering residents and my RN license for taking people's money and not providing proper care and staffing levels by admitting people to AL who couldn't raise a glass of water for themselves and maintaining the same staffing numbers, spreading staff dangerously thin and resulting in falls and other preventable injuries for vulnerable residents.

I was scheduled out of that non-union job for reporting because I'd raised the very same issues at the previous staff meeting. I was the sole RN on shift with only an LPN and 2 aides and spent 3 hrs of one shift getting a new AL resident admitted to the hospital and I had residents in the Nsg home building on vents and IVs that needed RN care. This person required skilled care, not an apartment in AL. Aside from the staffing issues and lack of eyes on the residents, my staff had no way of reaching me while at the AL and I was not going to be party to this theft of monies and low staffing that resulted in poor care and two preventable falls. That place was taken out of the owner's hands and properly managed until sold to a large care home chain.

Sry for the lack of relevance in unwinding my tale. My point is that most Nsg home admins are only in it for the money and won't act until the revenue stream is disrupted by fines imposed for violations of protected persons rights and only state agencies, alerted by families, can impose those fines.
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It is totally unprofessional for any staff member to use your mother's space for their own private needs. You need to put in writing your complaint to the director again. Continue to complain. You must also immediately ask to see the floor supervisor when you catch anyone doing this immediately at the time it happens. The supervisor of the floor needs to know that these workers are in your mother's room for non work reasons. The more you immediately report the situation the more of a chance it will stop. If it continues and you don't get a resolution from the director or supervisor you should have your lawyer draft a letter demanding a stop to the matter. This situation is not to be tolerated.
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You are correct and have no reason to be apologetic. Continue to report the situation at all levels of administration; if there is no resolution, most facilities have an 800 hotline to report issues.
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Nobody should be in your mother's room a) without her permission and in the case of staff b) without a legitimate purpose for being there.

I would be extremely concerned about regularly finding staff members in your mother's room and her bathroom. I would also want the facility director to be more specific about what the widespread issue is, and I hope it isn't that staff aren't prepared to use their own restroom because it's monitored.
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Check with your state's regulatory agency. This does not sound like the sort of thing they permit. I would also check with other facilities, residents' relatives too if possible. I haven't heard of this, but it sounds creepy. God knows what happens at night.
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Does it bother your mom?
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Lulu376 Oct 2022
They won't say if it bothers them. Someone was squatting in my mother's home, and she was absolutely fine with it, for a while. They don't know or are weak. Finally we her children had to gang up on this person and literally order them to LEAVE.
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This is awful! Is there an senior ombudsman in your area? Report!
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If this is the biggest problem you have to deal with...BE THANKFUL. My sister and I cannot afford to put our mom in a memory care facility, so we alternate 48 hours each at mom's house. We have almost no life outside of taking care of the woman who was a rotten mother to us. It's an endless stream of poop, pee, vomit, boogers and blank stares. I would gladly put up with a few employees in my mom's place on the phone, if we could get some relief from this horrid job.
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Lulu376 Oct 2022
Unbelievable.
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I had staff using my dad's room as a break room. I had a cna walk in the room as she was coming on shift, hang up her coat in my dad's closet, put her lunch on the table, plug her charger into the outlet and charge her phone. Then walk out of the room. Acted like I wasn't even there! Didn't acknowledge me or see me. Didn't acknowledge my dad or his roommate.
Residents pay for the room. It is their home. They are told that in cna training. They know that. You wouldn't walk in someone's home and make it yours. I didn't like it, but then thought at least he sees more people. And if he needs something maybe they will stop to help him?
She must be trusting, she left her phone right there. Wasn't worried about me or a resident taking it. Ive also had cna's walk out of the bathroom.

So as long as nothing is stolen and they acknowledge your mom, I don't think it's so bad. They wouldn't do that in a room of a person they don't like. And they will take their lunch and breaks there. So your mom gets to see more people.
Altho you could say loudly this is my mom's personal room. It is rude not to acknowledge her and I as you are using it, and walking past us. But I think there is a better way.
If you befriend them, they will probably treat your mom better. Not like a stranger. It is better knowing the people they are taking care of. If they are friends with you, and your mom, they will go the extra mile for your mom. I know being nice to them works.
Their break room is probably not comfortable to take breaks in. Or they will get harassed about work duties, while they are trying to take a break. They don't feel comfortable there.
I think since the boss didn't care, it's probably not going to stop. I'd take in a thermos of good coffee and something easy to nosh on and befriend them. They will care about your mom's well being more if you are friends with them. They work a thankless job, and a lot of the residents don't talk much. And the adult children complain a lot. I think that's better than trying to get them in trouble. I would go out of my way to befriend them. I think that is your best bet.
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GAinPA Oct 2022
I like your approach. ALWAYS better to be on friendly terms with caregivers. Extra company means a chance of extra observation. Always? No but, a better way to navigate the the current situation. My mom was never a religious person and totally not interested in church related activities. But when her hospice care in the memory unit included a weekly chaplain visit, I agreed. I arranged my daily schedule around the aide, chaplain and case manager visits and communicated with them by phone AFTER their visits. I dearly missed that 5X a week hospice when my mom moved to skilled nursing and was cut back to 3X a week with a different agency.
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It also depends on the relationships between the caregivers and residents. As I mentioned before, residents pay very expensive dollars to live there. They are vulnerable and have no choice decisions to make if they need AL or SNF. If the caregivers are using Mom's room to socialize while providing the care they are paid to do, that's OK. If the caregivers are using that room for their own safe haven desires without their assigned work, or are off the job, which is worse, that is NOT OK. Does not matter if Mom complains or not, it is the paid professional help that is supposed to be happening.
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Lulu376 Oct 2022
I have to disagree with part of this. They shouldn't be utilitizing any part of her living space for phone calls and "because it's quiet". That is an abuse of her home and that should be reserved for their breaks and break area. Also, who knows what else they're doing while they're in there.
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kmac2017: This should not be happening. Advise the head of the facility.
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That's elder abuse. They have no right to intrude into her space like that. They need to be reported.
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Christine44 Oct 2022
Lulu: I agree. I live in a senior apartment complex (independent for the most part) and residents generally guard their own private space (small apartments) quite a bit. But some people are "snoopy" here, and will use an excuse to come into your apartment just to see what it's like ("lot of 'stuff!'" as a resident recently said when she used the excuse of bringing a package into my place to get a look around.)

Privacy has to do with dignity, too, which is hard sometimes to maintain as one gets older. Maybe the mother in question is too "nice" and doesn't want to risk alienating the workers by asking them not to hang out in her place. But, for me, yeah -- this is definitely "off," and should be reported/stopped -- unless the mother genuinely doesn't mind and likes having these workers "hanging out" in her place for the company.
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If this is really such a problem for the facility as they state, you should report them to the state Department of Social Services.
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Luta65 Oct 2022
Lulu376,

The Dept of Social Services deals with issues regarding social workers. This is an issue of an Elder care facility and goes to the State Department of Aging Services or whatever it is named by any given state.
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Maybe your mother welcomes the company? I don't think they mean any harm, it may be best to let let it slide.
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KaleyBug Oct 2022
I doubt it is welcomed, if they are in her bathroom with the door shut. The toilet is for the moms bottom only.
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kmac217,

I find this absolutely unacceptable and my Mom would not stand for it. I'm sure that your mother is not speaking up out of some sense of being indebted to the people who provide for her needs there, but is barely tolerating it. My mother's estate is paying dearly for her services and while I'm deeply grateful to the staff, we are not indebted to anyone.

1. If you've not already put it into writing - always wise, btw, whenever dealing with facility problems - the write a letter and email it as an attachment to the CEO / Administrator, if already in written form, add that info. Inform that you've already spoken to her/him about this issue, date, etc., and it remains unresolved, give a few details. Cite the Residents' Rights in any care setting (you can easily find these online) and the facility has it's own, a copy of which should be in your mothers admission papers. Provide them with five days from the date of the letter in which to completely correct this problem.

2. Contact an Elder Law attorney and have them draft a warning letter to the facility, a basic cease and desist and find out what penalties can be levied for this ongoing issue. Or, skip the expense and make a formal complaint to your state department of Aging, via the Aging Services Ombudsperson, and inform that you've informed the facility admin and nothing is being done about their "wide-spread" privacy invading problem. Provide a detailed written complaint via the online form or do an over the phone formal complaint. This will result in the facility getting 'points' against them in a formal survey for this horrid laxity.

3. I personally would withhold payment until it's stopped, would place a camera and notice of same, and place a sign on her door that states NO ENTRY WITHOUT CAUSE. THIS ROOM IS BEING MONITORED.

Yes, we are in a staffing crisis and none of the RAs, CNAs are getting paid what they should be paid, ergo: the staffing crisis. But, your mother needs her privacy and it's your job to jump the hurdles to ensure that her room is her refuge; it's all that she has left to her.

You can get this done, pronto.
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that staff member should be fired. Did you complain to Nursing Director? I would file formal complaint. Also to Ombudsman
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A lot of good advice below. I worry about 2 things:
1. if you complain too loudly it may negatively affect his care from them
2. what about all her posessions. Have you done an inventory lately?
Tread cautiously.
You are in a tough spot
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It's not normal. They shouldn't do it. Perhaps she has welcomed them but a reputable facility would not allow it even if she welcomed them. And even if she once welcomed them, her feelings could have changed. I've seen time and time and time again that what a resident says to their family is not what they say to their caregivers, and what they say to one caregiver is totally different than what they say to another caregiver. I've never quite understood this, except that loved ones present issues in a different context than staff, and the resident may be responding to the context or the person inquiring, more than the issue. Many questions to residents are "leading questions" and residents want to please, to please their loved ones and the staff they depend on. But a reputable home would not allow this. I've heard workers say, "When you are hot, go care for so-and-so, her room is the coolest!" but they mean it sincerely, to provide real care, to check on her, change her brief, get her a drink, or ask if she wants to do an activity. They don't mean lounge around. If the management is cooperative, you might not need to pay for cameras.
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