I asked for joint POA but she has decided it is best for mom to only have one POA. I am out of state and I do not feel like any of this is appropriate. My sister is not a licensed caregiver and I know that she does not know what she is getting herself into...
Where is Mom now? Hopefully sister is not using Moms money to buy a bigger house because this is a Medicaid no no if your Mom needs it in the next five years. Medicaid does not see it as beneficial to Mom but to your sister. Mom will be penalized and her care would need to be paid privately until Medicaid will foot the bill.
Sister is right that one POA is enough. Especially since she is going to be the caregiver. Very few of us are licensed caregivers on this forum or can afford to pay one. A lot of us have taken on the responsibility because our parent/s can't afford care but need it. We learn as we go. Some good at it, others not but it has to be done. Yes, ur sister is probably looking at this with Rose colored glasses. Early stages of Dementas are not too bad but Mom may not be able to be reasoned with. Will have a problem processing and of course short term memory. As she progresses she will have incontinence and need help toileting and bathing. Her sleep patterns will become erratic. It will come a time when she will need more care than sister can give. Oh, she will be giving up her life to do this because Mom can't be left alone. All you can do is be supportive. Help went you can. Believe me, she will see your point eventually.
Then tell her she has fair warning and not to blame you for not being part of the future misery.
Tell her in writing in BIG BOLD LETTERS so that she won't miss it.
If Sis, for whatever reason, is determined to put her life on hold for Mom, nothing anyone says will change her mind and may even reinforce her determination. If she has no ulterior motives, she is trying to do her best for your mother. Offer help, visit, do what you can to make their lives easier.
When you say you want joint POA, what do you mean? I am my mother's POA and my brother is second, if I cannot act, but we do not act at the same time. You could think of my brother being a back up POA. I live in the same town as our mother, my brother lives 5+ hours away. Having to have two people agree or sign as POA, especially if one is out of state could lead to complications.
Joann has mentioned potential Medicaid problems down the road. This is a really important issue in the USA, and your family needs to sit down and discuss the ramifications of this with a lawyer. If proceeds form the sale of Mum's house are used to pay for your sister's larger house, will she be willing to sell it, to release Mum's funds to pay for a placement in the future?
What does Mum want? Does she want to live with your sister? Is she happy living where she is? Is her current housing, safe and accessible? Is her neighbourhood safe? Does she have a daily routine there? We had an elderly Aunt who was of sound mind, and lived in her home until her death at 96. The neighbourhood had gotten a bit seedy in the 60+ years she lived there, but she had a daily routine, the house was accessible and safe and she was happy.
Not knowing your ages, are there still children living with your sister? Does she have grandchildren that she minds? If yes, she needs to think about the impact of Granny moving in on them. But that is not a decision for you to make for her.
Lastly, what do you think is appropriate for Mum's care? Yes, I put you last, as you are not in the same state, you cannot provide daily care, but you want your say.
No idea what the caregiving will entail, no idea what impact it will have on her and her family and - maybe this will shake her up if nothing else does - probably no idea how to make sure that the spending on the new house is watertight when it comes to her POA responsibilities.
Caregiving for an elder in a shared family home can be done. I did it. I had no idea what I was letting myself in for, either. And without AgingCare and some other key people I would have lost my mind as well as my partner, my career and much of my family.
I promise her through you that if she has it planned out and she is properly prepared and she still wants to do it, then she will have our full support. But to quote my hero Sir Humphrey Appleby: "if you must do this damn'd silly thing, don't do it in this damn'd silly way."
Tell her that if she does nothing else, she must come and join us. PLEASE.
The care plan was 7am-7pm — who knew Mom didn’t sleep at night? Sister who controlled the purse strings refused to pay for care “while Mom was sleeping”, ignoring the fact that Mom slept in 20-30 minute increments throughout the day. 2 months we tried & then moved Mom to AL with 24-hr supervision. This forum helped me realize what was really needed for Mom, forcing me to take off the rose-colored glasses.
Mom is currently in an independent living facility. She had a falling incident and my sister found her the next day. Nobody checks on them, as it was not the facilities responsibility...I believe that it freaked my sister out and since then she has decided that nobody will care for my mom unless it is personally her. From what little I know my mom and sister have a strained relationship, but my sister says that the only thing that makes my mom happy now is my nephews and my sister's husband and my mom is depressed so my sister thinks that this will be good for my mom and the family..she says she has to "stay positive right?". Ever since that incident, it has been full steam ahead with buying a large house and moving an hour from where they are currently.
1) I don't think that this was thought out that much and is a knee jerk reaction. I have done research and there are many things that I would hope she thought about before making this huge decision. When I brought those questions up the answer was "I didn't know how to take care of kids when I had them. I will figure this out"
2) If they need to purchase a new house to accommodate my mother I do not feel that the house they bought is appropriate. It is too big for them and my sister is not willing to plan out what would happen if they needed more money.I inquired would she be willing to re-mortgage the house if money is needed and I got yelled at. I am of the opinion that you should buy only what you need and no more....that is not the case with this house. My sister has already decided how she is going to fund it with part money from my mom and I do not believe that the wording of the trust documents allow my mother to do this. But no one will listen to me!
2) I only want joint POA, as I would like to know what is going on medically and financially. It was agreed on about a week ago, but since I voiced my serious objections it has been decided that "it wouldn't be appropriate"
I am going to meet with an elder law attorney where I am to go over the documents.
While my mom is of sound mind I believe that my sister is telling her what is best and will do that. I don't think that my sister has thought about what would happen if they need more money and don't have it....
I think that I cried more last night then I have for a long time. I really am trying to understand what is going on with my mom but this has taken a life of its own and I feel utterly helpless in this situation.
My mom has dementia and we just took her car from her.
I see where u are going but sister needs to check with a lawyer before touching any money. Like I said, using Moms money for a house for all of them is a Medicaid no no.
It would be a shame if she and her husband had to sell their big, new house in a year or two to get your Mom the money she needs for a nursing home situation. Maybe they would like to set things up so they won't lose their big house if (when?) things go "t*ts up" with their current plan.
i like the suggestion of everyone meeting with an attorney but I already have been made to feel like the bully and at this point I don’t want to feel worse than I do. I think that nothing I say will make any difference and I hate to see things happen but I don’t have much of a choice.
Intersting that no one has said “. It is the best.. take care of your mom in your house” it is hard and stressful and I know when things get tough it will be hard to hold my tongue from saying “ I told you so”. I love my mom but when deductions are just made for her without telling me it makes me soooo angry.
If your sister has been supervising Mom, even if you were calling every day, she has to feel somewhat cast adrift. She may be doing what she thinks is right. We don’t know her side of the story. It’s been assumed that she has ulterior motives, but you say you have no proof.
My husband needs to be in a facility. He is bedridden and I do everything for him but feed him. My health is deteriorating and I’ve had to go back to work at the age of 65 to help pay bills. My children never offer help. They don’t call to see how their dad is. They choose to ignore what they know I go through with him. My son more or less tells me to suck it up. I get no respite from my husband from them. But I know they’d have something to say if it was feasible for me to place their father. We have no assets, but it would be said I put their dad in a facility just to make things easier on myself. Would that be fair? Nope. I would reserve judgement until I saw the whole picture. Not siding with anyone here. I sympathize with everyone involved especially your Mom. But IMHO, which granted isn’t worth much, I’d have to say sit back and see what happens, especially since you don’t have POA. Things may not be as awful as you think they will be.
Okay. Deep breaths.
#1 It is best to have one POA at a time. Joint POA becomes a flaming nuisance in the practical day-to-day if both have to act together. But your mother can opt for joint-and-several POAs, which means that you are free to act individually but must keep the other informed. If your sister is wise she will at the very least allow you to have sight of her POA documents so that you can discuss with her the authority she does have and, critically, the responsibilities it imposes.
#2 I have a good mind to send you a picture of my white hair to show your sister. I thought I could stop my mother falling if I only tried hard enough, too. Falls prevention, quite literally, has books written about it. It is a long hard road for skilled people. And even then, the rule is: "falls happen."
Actually. This list could easily stretch to #∞ and we'll all get very bored. I sympathise with your sister, I understand her anxieties, and being *at least* as guilty of groundless optimism God knows I am in no position to criticise. I'm not even sure that if somebody who knew what they were talking about had got hold of me in time and warned me about the pitfalls I would have made different choices. But for one thing nobody did, and for another at least I could have avoided some of the most damaging mistakes.
If you can reassure your sister that you're not trying to stand in her way and that you *both* have your mother's welfare as your chief object, I hope she'll open her ears again. Right now I can hardly bear to look.
I quote verbatim:
"We're all in this together!"
"It's not like you'll be doing it alone."
"We're a team."
"I like your mother."
And the dear man - my exSO I'm quoting there - meant every word at the time. He didn't know what he was doing, either.
As for your sister not being a licensed caregiver, that doesn’t mean she can’t/won’t provide good care. My immobile mom is taken care of 24/7 by unlicensed caregivers. She gets excellent care.
If if you feel that your sister is taking advantage of or stealing from your mom, there’s APS.
What does your mom think of loosing her independence?
If her and your sister have a strained relationship, being under sisters 24/7 care may not be on her bucket list.
Moms wishes and wants need to be considered above all else, she doesn't have bad dementia or she would not be living independently.
Falls happen and if your sister thinks she can stop them she is fixing to get injured, here I'll catch her and the catcher is injured worse then the person falling. Good intentions do not always make right decisions.
I would encourage you to talk to mom, leave any mention of sister out, to find out how she wants to move forward. It is her life and I have seen no mention of her, just you and sister. Please change gears and get with your mom to understand what she wants.
Regardless of where the care comes from, inheritances will be spent for the elders wellbeing and care. It is expensive to be old and in need of help, but isn't that why we work and save, to ensure we are not a financial burden on our loved ones?
I know, I keep bringing up Medicaid but people don't consider it till they need it then it maybe too late.
Medicaid has a look back of 5 years looking at bankstatements from that far back. If u have sold a house, it better have been at Market Value. Large amounts withdrawn will be questioned. If found it was a gift, there will be a penalty placed. I had a shower put in a powder room for Mom. Found out I couldn't recoup it while Mom was alive if I sold the house. Because, that increased the worth of "my house". Now if done in her house different story.
I agree, sister needs to sit down and think this thru. My daughter the RN also says "they will fall". Even in an AL, they will fall.
No one really realizes to amount of care another needs esp with this desease.
With lots of hands on deck my friend ended up moving her back into memory care and then they couldn’t afford home and had to move themselves! This really can end up being a catospropic decision, please warn sister but be present to see yourself how things are. Your vote won’t change her decision necessarily. Btw, caregivers don’t have to be skilled to provide great care.
The part no one thinks about is this is a progressive decease and does not conform to any schedule.
I am not a "licensed caregiver" (was not a paid one either) and I cared very well for my Husband for 12 year journey with Alzheimer's as well as probably Vascular Dementia.
He did very well, I did very well. But I had help.
I would not have been able to do what I did without the VA and later on with the joint help of the VA and Journey Care Hospice.
I hired caregivers.
I got the supplies I needed from the VA as well as Hospice.
I got equipment I needed.
I am living in a house that was built Handicap accessible.
My Husband was cooperative, non combative and for the most part other than the Dementia he was healthy.
Bottom line one does not NEED to be a professional caregiver.
Does your mom require extra help with ADL at this time (Activities of Daily Living)? If not she could do well on her own if sister has a job and will be leaving her alone.
If your mom has dementia she may begin to wander, not a matter of if but when.
Just know your mom WILL fall again not a matter of if but when
Your mom will need accessible bathroom, house on one level or at least her bedroom and accessible bathroom on first floor.
Your sister and her family will loose privacy, freedom, their friends and if she has a job she will give up that job.
And if there is a need to apply for Medicaid they may have to sell the house if the need is within the "look back period". Because that money will have to be repaid or the time that Medicaid kicks in will be delayed considerably.
If they are up for all this and they are going into this with eyes open there is not much to say to them.
I would make sure that legally everything is on the "up and up"
When mom's house is sold make sure it is for "market value" so there is no problem again with the look back.
And be prepared to have your sister angry with you for ..
not helping out more, not visiting, not calling, not sending money to "help out" for not...what ever the reason.
She will be stressed, tired, angry and she will not get the help she thinks she will get from her family (husband and children if any are close)
One of the reasons for the stress were listed above but another one is..it is hard to see a loved one decline day after day. Knowing last week mom could get to the bathroom on her own and this week sister had to do 8 loads of laundry in one day. Last month mom could recognize her and this month she is calling her by "aunt Betty's" name. Next month mom will not be able to eat solid food.....and on and on for the next 2 years, 4 years, or ? years......
I am a sister with a fairly big family (I have four children), who has made the decision to take our mother in, and start a care home. I am not doing this blindly, and it has been taking a lot of time, research, finding mentors,going to classes at night and on the weekends to become a nurse and become licensed. Yes, it is a huge undertaking, and a huge sacrifice and will take a toll on my own family. But, after seeing my mother passed from care home to care home (because she is a difficult client and does not want anyone to touch or assist her) and now finding out she has not been receiving the kind of care all these years that she should have been receiving in these different homes, it is a no-brainer that we need to step up, make the move to change our lives to take care of her the way she wants to be cared for in a home that is suited for her and where she will be surrounded by family. My sister is out of state as well, and only offered complaints about why we didn't take mother over night out of her care home more often, but I had to explain many times, that our house was not ideal or handicap accessible so caring for her even overnight for special holidays was a struggle. So, starting the care home was a good solution for all of us. It has taken a toll on me, and my own family, but we love grandma, and she is much happier out of the care home situation.
Why start a care home? It's a business that can allow me to make my mother my full time job AND also earn an income to support our family where I will not lose work time or have an angry boss wondering why I have to leave all the time to care for my aging mother. And I love the work! It is a 24 hour/7-day a week business, but with the right preparations, the right education, the adequate support (that includes you, sister - not necessarily monetary, not necessarily in terms of working at the care home unless you want to also get certified as a nurse aid, but SUPPORTIVE AS A SISTER) and a lot of hard work and correct business practices, it can work. Your sister will be an entrepreneur - her business will take time, attention to detail, focus, mentor guidance, strategy in planning schedules and hiring help, and again, a lot of education. There are thousands of care homes across the U.S. run by "sisters" and "brothers" that are successful. Maybe you could work with her?
If you do not agree because she isn't being open about how she is going about it, not communicating with you or sharing about what needs to be done - and it is an enormous amount of work just to get licensed and research a home - make an effort, for your mother's sake, to talk with her about it. While she may deny it, she probably does need the faith and sisterly support, even if you don't really get along - now is the time to try. Make an effort to go visit your sister and mother to see the homes she is thinking of buying and ask how you can help. The decision to sell and buy a new home is probably due to the fact that it is more costly to renovate to accommodate your mother, than to buy a home that is already handicapped accessible. If you are truly and solely so concerned about your losing the stake in the home (which many people have assumed your sister is doing), get advice from your family attorney. A joint POA is not ideal especially if you will not be able to make hard decisions together well. Try to imagine yourself in your mother's shoes, and your sister's.
My best advice to you is is simply to spend time regularly speaking with your mom and see what she wants. Most people would rather be with family than in an AL facility. Your sister already told you why she wants to care for your mom at home - lack of care. If you haven’t already gone into an AL to check one out, take some time to do so. Many are sad, depressing places without the resources to spend any real time with residents. Your mom is already in one. Won’t she tell you if she wants to stay or if she wants to try living with family?
If your objections to your sister’s plan are worries about your mom’s safety or health, then don’t hesitate to get an attorney. If the financial concerns are more pressing, find an expert and tell your sister you are worried about her future and you found someone objective who can help. You could tell her you think she might end up losing her home and that is why you are being so persistent.
Good luck!
However, this is simply a question of financial resources. If mom is well off, let your sister have her way. If it becomes too much for sis, you can simply move mom into memory care then. How to divvy up the proceeds from mom's house that sister used to buy her new place will probably be sticky, but that's up to the two of you and an attorney to deal with after she's gone.
But, if mom does not have assets other than her house and running out of money is a concern, Medicaid comes into the picture and your sister very proceed very carefully. Insist that you and your sister sit down with an elder law attorney to talk it out. It will be well worth the investment in the consultation fee.
Ain't nothing simple about it. And the damage done in the process of discovering that it's too much can be horrific.
I agree with you that detailed, professional advice is absolutely key.
What I'm leading up to is this. You are not there. You have not been dealing with this on a daily basis. You have suspicions and feelings, but no evidence. However, you do have a strained relationship with your sister. I think you and her need to put those issues aside and work together. Can't you have a calm conversation about all of this without sounding accusatory?
Pleae take heed, Delta.❤️
You really can't do anything. Just let her do as she pleases. What you will most likely have happen is that your sister will find this so life consuming and overwhelming that she will be mad at you for not helping more.
Each person has to decide for themselves what they will do. One sibling making a decision does not create an obligation for anyone else. This usually creates so much resentment and even fractures families to the point that when the elder dies, that is the end of any contact.
I would try to let my sister know that I admire her for wanting to take this all on solo and that I wish her the best and I hope that it all works for everyone.
I would not tell her that her current choices have future consequences and if you are not good enough to help make decisions you surely aren't good enough to bail the situation out. But that's me, I am not willing to be used in that way one more time.
I hope that your mom is being consulted in this situation.