My parents are living independently in a 55+ community. What rights does management have in judging their medical situation?

If your parents, at 87 and 91 years old, are not medically fit to live in an Independent Living situation, then the management can ask them to leave. They are within their rights to do so if they feel ill equipped to deal with them, and in a situation where their liability is through the roof! Furthermore, why would you want your parents living in such a situation if they're not equipped to do so?? If they require visits from you 5x a week, that begs the question if they ARE 'able to take care of themselves' or not. 


What many people don't understand is that when elders are renting apartments, the management DOES have a right to inspect the property; if there is hoarding going on, the management has the right to know it and to get the situation remedied. Same goes for bug infestations. Or sick elders living in IL units. Same goes for Assisted Living; if the elder requires TOO much help in AL, that situation is reviewed and in some cases, the elder is asked to leave and go to a Skilled Nursing Facility (or similar) where more care is offered. This is not to 'punish' the elder, but to make sure the elder is kept safe and given the best possible lifestyle for his or her situation.

The management has the right to check on your parents to see how they are living inside their unit and to make the determination if they're fit to stay there, in their estimation.

Also check their lease to see what the parameters are for their continued renewal of the rental term. There may be specific language that discusses such matters in detail.

Good luck.

What does their lease agreement say? Is the management seeing worrisome signs? It may be a good idea for your parents' MPoA to also be at this meeting, even if the authority isn't yet activated. If your sister, the nurse, has to visit them 4-5 times a week, maybe your parents aren't as "independent" as you are leading us to believe? There seems to be a lot of family orbiting around them, which doesn't say "able to take care of themselves" to me. If they are truly able to take care of themselves and their ADLs then I would think they wouldn't need all those regular visits.

I would read their lease. I've read from others on this forum that they can have some pretty strict rules about people staying overnight (like if your parent is recovering from a health incident or is requiring an increasing amount of hands-on management). You don't want to get blind-sided by anything at a time of crisis.

I am going to toss some ideas out.
How long have they lived in this Independent Living facility?
Are they asking for updated medical information? Like current vaccination status (on any or all vaccinations). Does your area require updated TB testing or a signed document that they have no symptoms?
Have either of your parents, that you are aware of, had any falls? any confusion? (If one is having problems the other may be covering when you or other members of the family visit.)

Did the management request that a family member attend the meeting?
If there is someone that is POA for Health and another for finances I would have them both attend the meeting. If there is any question that one or both should transition to Assisted Living that may involve input form the POA's.

Attend the meeting with an open mind. Keep your cool. Listen first, talk after you have processed what is said.

At their age they may be at the level of care to move in AL the home may see things that you and others do not see or possibly accept. They may see a downward turn heading your parents' way.

AL is not the end of the world, it is just another step to improving their quality of life, more chores done by others, more activities and bonding with seniors of their own age.

Sometimes children do not want to embrace the obvious, clinically trained or not, if they are now unable to really be independent because others are making up for their slack that may be a sign.

As has already been mentioned you need to read the lease, there are place in my area that are pretty strict about kicking out people who they deem no longer capable of living independently.

"When I pressed the issue"...with whom?

With your parents or with management?

Are there perhaps issues cropping up up when you folks aren't around?

Be aware that your parents are legally entitled to reasonable accomodations if their difficulty living there is caused by a disability, such as dementia or physical limitations.

That will be in the contracts the resident signed on entry. Clearly, it would be negligent to allow a senior to stay when they are no longer safe. I would check with the facility as they vary and they do not have to do things according to "state" and Federal law in most instances. Check with the Community itself.
If there is a POA they should attend this meeting with the couple.

We experienced this when we were applying for an apartment for my in-laws at an independent living 55+ senior community. It is a *private* building and they have the right to ask residents to leave when they determine that it no longer is safe for them to live there. Read the lease.

Some independent living communities offer extra help such as a shower visit at night. But your parents may require a lot more than that. And your parents may be putting on a good charade of independence in front of family.

Remember that when it comes to our own loved ones, we are often willingly blind or in denial.

These facilities are licensed only at certain levels which means that the patients may receive care up to a certain extent. When their health deteriorates to over the level, they are asked to leave so they won't lose their license.

This could be a routine procedure done from time to time to assure the safety of all their residents. Management and residents see your loved one a lot more often during the 24/7 week and observe behaviors the family would never be aware of no matter how often you visit. I would look on a medical check as a good thing especially if it is done routinely routine.

I have lived in a 55+ facility and if the contract is for independent living, it means just that! Residents are not legally entitled to accommodations beyond what is offered under the contract. Yes, the building is required to be designed to accommodate the disabled, but facilities legally can not provide special services beyond what they are licensed for. Where we lived, residents were allowed to hire private outside help to come in and provide any special services needed to keep them living independently just as would be done in a private home.

That being said, we saw many families hire services such as medicine reminders, help going to bed and getting up and dressed, etc. which was all that was needed for a while. However since this was only for 2-4 hours a day, gradually neighbors or management began to receive requests for additional help during the other 20 hours a day. An elderly resident helping another elderly resident can lead to unfortunate results.

Keep a very open mind in the meeting especially if it is being called due to concerns. As a visitor, families often miss signs that physical, emotional, mental, or even financial concerns are beginning to develop or progress. Yes, financial too even though you may be managing everything. Residents often give away items or money a bit too freely to others, while others are accepting these "gifts" not realizing when they are inappropriate. While these may never be a concern in your parents case, there are so many signs of decline only those living close to them will notice in the early stages. IF something is going on, it may only require a good physical checkup to diagnose a new problem and treat it properly to help them live there independently for many more years. Think... medication, eyeglass, hearing aid, mobility aids, etc. which may be a simple fix.

it can be just a check .. totally agree . But is this check being done because of a complaint or they are checking everyone. Your parents are having an isolated check ..time to find an attorney. Because what happens if they determine they cannot live there . Then they would be eligible for Medicaid Assistance or then placed in a nursing home.
But the management are not doctors and can’t make that determination. Where are they going ? Who is going to help them move and take that on . Management.??? No have the lawyer protect you . Social services are the only ones that can actually remove them if they are in danger . They pay their rent or own whichever the case . They are being taken care of by the family . If you have representation , then management has to explain themselves and I’m sure they won’t like that . Especially when they are disrupting the lifestyle of the elderly.. it’s worth the peace of mind .

My Mom started falling and going into rehabs . She was also hoarding - at some point she fell and they moved her to another apartment with medical equipment suited for a disabled person . She was upset but they said “ her old apartment was a fire Hazard.” I noticed in her new apartment the stove had been shut off . She no longer had a deck to sit outside . Looking back on the situation she was lucky they did let her stay .

My guess is that not all residents have such attentive and skilled family checking on them regularly so the management does this with all residents both to make sure they are ok and cover their liability should family decide they should have known something. I agree it’s likely just a regular check in maybe they will even ask if there are complains, concerns or suggestions from your parents about the community.

I would make sure someone accompanies them and perhaps records the encounter. It could be for safety or insurance reasons ..such as needing to be sure they can evacuate their home if necessary in an emergency. One home I explored for my parents required that - otherwise they need to be somewhere with sufficient staff to accomplish that. ,

I would say they may have some insight on how well they are doing. Even though you go by several times a week, how long are the visits? It could be possible they are calling for more help these days than when they got there. It's also possible they just need to talk with them (and you) to find out if there are any problems, if they need more help, if meds have changed, physical abilities, etc. Maybe they've noticed mom not participating in things she used to or dad has fallen.

Go with an open mind - could be just a check up and information gathering. More than likely this sort of meeting is mentioned in the lease/contract.

It might be best if you or your sister (the nurse) are there with with your parents for the medical check so that you can monitor what's happening. You might want to ask the residence for more details about what will be checked medically and why they think it's necessary. I am assuming that your parents have their own primary care physicans and go for regular checkups. Staff at senior residences do observe the residents to make sure that they are appropriate for the residence. My 96 year old aunt lived in a senior residence (a HUD facility) in Chicago, I was her POA, but lived far away and couldn't visit often. Staff noticed that she wasn't taking good care of herself and seemed undernurished. They insisted that she go to rehab and wasn't allowed to return unless she had 24/7 caregiving. It turns out that they were right that she needed more care at that time. When my mother was in a continuing care facility they also monitored her capabilities, and they let me know when they thought it was time for her to move to assisted living/memory care. Once in assisted living, there were required annual medical checkups.

My mom moved into a senior facility in the IL apartments a few years ago. They do have a wellness center, and they do require that medical information be kept up to date and they have their nurse perform wellness checks. They also get most health records from outside facilities. Their nurse (who isn't so sharp IMO) may be the first responder in an emergency because she is onsite, and must use informed judgement when calling for outside intervention. So no, this isn't unusual at all, especially if Mom and Dad have not kept their wellness center up to date on their medical condition and needs.

You've gotten good answers and insights from more than a few viewpoints. The only thing I would add is to prepare your own checklist of questions and be prepared to ensure that your concerns are answered. I ALWAYS take notes at meetings; then I have for myself a good record of the topics discussed.

And I would inquire as to the medical issues they might raise, and the foundation for those concerns. It's been my experience that lay people think they know more than they do, so it always pays to focus on any area which might be outside the purview of the managers.

I also would emphasize rereading the By-laws and other documents of the complex, and be prepared to ask your own questions. Sometimes you have to do this to balance out issues of focus by the management.

Something else I learned about meetings that could possibly be confrontational or put you on the spot is for you and your siblings NOT to sit together, but to place yourselves around the meeting table so that each of you can watch the Admins, or whoever's conducting the meeting. You'd be amazed how effective that can be in controlling the gist of the meeting, especially if they become hostile.

jkkcew, is this just a 55+ community with no care or continuum of care?

I would read their lease and verify this is allowed if it is just a 55+ community. I would require the signed lease by your parents if you can't find their copy. I live in a retirement city and we have many 55+ communities that have very disabled seniors living quietly in their own homes, getting outside services to prop up their independence without a word from "management".

However, a continuum of care community has an obligation to ensure the proper level of care is in place if it is a safety issue. I would make them bear the burden of proving a move is required by contract, an independent licensed medical professional and the state laws. (My friends mom paid 250k and monthly to a continuum of care facility and they tried to force a higher level of care, that included a move and higher monthly pmt, because they had a waiting list for her apartment in AL. Needless to say, it didn't happen.)

Best of luck.

It appears intrusive on the surface. My mother lived in an assisted living campus. There was housing for independent living, and facilities for more care. The management would annually check on the needs to see if more care was needed. I also had a situation where she was commanding more assistance, by pressing here medical alert button. She would call several times a day to adjust air conditioning/heating. (She was legally blind, so could not see to adjust). The management wanted to perform a needs assessment.

I would not prejudge the meeting request.

I agree with the others. In order to keep their license, they have to provide at least an annual review of the person/people plus get a doctor's signature saying what their condition is and a review of medication. Depending upon the care given and the license of the facility, the review could be quarterly.

Go to the appointment with your sister who is a nurse. Let them ask the questions. Then afterwards ask them why they requested the meeting.

Then contact your state or county Office of Aging and try to find the agency that reviews licenses. Find out what is minimally required for them to retain their license. See if their answers correlate with what is required.

I think the meeting is a "wellness" check and an opening to ensure that there are no problems from your side or theirs and for them to answer/discuss any questions that might have come up.

A 55+ community is a business that wants to attract fit active people in their late 50s (often to lose their young and noisy neighbors). That makes for an enjoyable ‘community’. It doesn’t work if too many residents are very elderly, house bound, and in need of care, no matter how good their care is. It may be that you have to accept that the rules are not ‘unfair’, just what you signed up to.

Ask for a copy of the rental agreement. If management is concerned about condition of the property or adequate care for the residents, they are most likely within their rights.

jkkcew: It makes perfect sense that the IL, age 55 and up facility performs routine wellness checks in order to keep their business model viable.

My SO works in a Senior condo Ccrc that’s mostly independent living. They have to get increasingly involved the more alarms go off.

Ask them if that is the purpose of the meeting.