... But back to the subject at hand… I am going to say something regarding a few of the comments that I'm reading here about our elders who suffer dementia and the things they say. Each sufferer can own very different levels and degrees of dementia… For instance, some dementia sufferers, their minds might take them into a story book type of reality from where they are pulling the information from in their brain, somewhere in the depths of their life and their memory, experiences that include reality, thoughts, visuals, even perhaps scenes from a movie that they've seen… But in no way just because a person suffers dementia are you to not believe what they are saying if what they are saying sounds at all plausible...and, even if it doesn't. Another thing to mention, suffers can and do tell the truth in "stages and/or "Thru a story" if you will, even in segments that may come to them in short spurts during days or weeks. I'll give you an example; my mother suffers from dementia, one of the every day stories she was telling me that would not cease, and I would constantly reassure her never happened that she is safe and to try to relax about… First story was this, that a man would come into her apartment, lay her on a metal table, turn a very bright light on,and put wires in her legs and that she could feel them ... for a couple months I thought she was crazy… Until ... while discussing with her doctor this very odd story and he was beginning to think her dementia had gone to another level… Which would've been on her records if I had not suddenly remembered she had a heart catheter test where they ran the dye through her leg and it was naturally done in the surgical room. The doc supported the story of that being done while one of her stays in the hospital. And believe it or not as soon as she knew I believed her that particular story ended… so again, although the stories may have added color texture or strange visuals… I believe there's some truth to a lot of let many dementia suffers say… You just have to take the time to find and pull the truth out of the discombobulated accounts, if you wish to.
......so you have to go back to the person's profile page to read in depth about the short little sentence they posted out on the forum?? I don't get it... or are you telling me that everyone can go get more information off of the posters own profile info even tho the poster only "posted specific words… Because if that's the case then why ask a question at all but rather just say something like "go to my page and talk about everything and anything that's on it" ...not trying to change a subject here, but I'm A little confused at the thought of an "op (original poster) can type only a few words… And then all of you race to their profile page to start gathering collected information in order to go back and then respond on their posted question ?....
.. Thanks Country mouse, ... but hold on ..so what you're telling me is there are more parts to the stories or these posts that people post, on their own profile page?...
There's an outline on the OP's profile, Tired. Plus, the subject hits a nerve: how to be sure your loved one is safe when you can't be sure her own account is reliable.
Thank you mom2mom. My mother was in rehab for a few weeks. I was going to visit her on my way home everyday. One afternoon, one of the nurses asked me if she could speak to me. She mentioned that my Mom had been telling the staff that her daughter(me) and my husband had told her Doctor to give her a shot to kill her. She has also told other family members that I am abusive and that I steal from her on a daily basis. Up until that point no one wanted to evaluate her for dementia. They finally gave in and did their job when she started telling the ER doc that she had fallen at home because I was practicing voodoo on her.
People suffering from dementia aren't going to be able to keep the lies straight, even if it is deemed an untruth. Their fabricated stories are just that-untruths because of their outrageous factor.
My mum says things that I know cannot be true! She is in a Nursing Home with dementia and I have witnessed my mum being verbally and physically abusive! Later she tells me they HIT HER! She is confused! I have learnt to have more discernment but I do visit her every day and check she has all her needs!
Midkid58 - good for you for seeing your brother's pain/stress - even acknowledging it makes a difference as so many caregivers feel all alone - I hope you & sibs come take care of mom when he needs a holiday which it sounds like he could use - keep supporting him as much as possible -
I like your comment on sister-in-law as a saint - so nice to hear & I hope you tell her too -
I myself take care of my husband's gram and we USED to get money out of the bank and give to her so she could shop with us, well money kept coming up missing and she would blame my stepson so I would as much as it sucks search her room and low and behold I would die d money tucked into folded clothes u set her mattress etc BUT I did not find ALL the money he "stole" so I had to concede that he had taken what I couldn't find plus there was an incident where he was made to search for it after I already checked the room myself well needless to say he "found" it u see her bed(I had looked there already) so all said and done I did not recover close to 100 and found about the same hidden so don't write anything off till you have done some research
Your BROTHER is the caregiver she's accusing? Wow, I'd tread very lightly on installing a recording device. What's the term we hear here? Boots on the ground! Spell your brother for a while, don't spy on him first. My mother lives with my brother. He can have quite the temper, and Mother interprets him yelling (at anything or anyone) as a personal attack. At one point she asked if she could live with me, she was so scared. I just went right to brother and told him--and he confessed he was under a lot of stresses and was in, fact, lashing out, but never AT mother. I believed him. I also offered more help, which for a while he accepted. Caregiving is very stressful. Brother is regretting moving mom & dad in with him, but he is determined to stick with the commitment. When I found he was so stressed, I emailed and called all the other sibs. Some $$ went his way, to alleviate the financial stress he was experiencing, and more help came, until he no longer felt he needed help with mother. This was some years back. Mother now has early stages of dementia, fairly mild, and she can only talk about things that happened 80 years ago or yesterday. That's the new norm for us. I take all she says with a grain of salt, and if she complains about brother or his wife (who is a saint!!) I am sure to relay that to them in a kind way. If I put a listening device in my brother's home....he'd be so upset. IF mother was under the care of "caregivers" and complaining, I'd think long and hard about it. If you take over mom's care for a week, you might well find yourself being not-quite-so sweet as you think you'd be. I last about 3 hours and I can't take it. Brother has mother 24/7. I just admire him.
I strongly agree about given someone else's condition, vultures as I call them often take advantage. I saw a very sad documentary about an adopted child aggressively coercing money from her adopted mom and she kept bailing her adopted daughter out each time she got in trouble. I think they most likely made a monster without realizing it or intending to. Sometimes people take advantage of people who have certain types of vulnerabilities, as I highly suspect in the case with my bio dad. If you have a nagging feeling something is wrong in any type of situation regarding an elder, don't ignore that feeling. If you feel something is wrong and you can't get it out of your mind and you think it's all in your head, this allows whatever the problem is to continue or even worsen, and you may not even know anything at all is even going on or that anything is wrong. All you have is just that nagging feeling you can't get rid of until you eventually find out atthat nagging feeling was actually right all along. If you have that nagging feeling somethings just not right, a little off or downright wrong, you're probably right. You may not know exactly what it is, but trust your gut instinct as they call it, you'll find that feeling is usually right
For her safety get a nanny cam. People with dementia go through episodes when they are confused but commonly not all day everyday. I found out that a care giver was taunting my Father about going to a nursing home and they were arguing. Your Mother is helpless and given the chance some people take advantage.
Of course, investigating any claims of mistreatment against a person with dementia is appropriate. I'd get legal advice on the use of electronic recordings, though, as there are federal and state laws that dictate just what is allowed. I'd make sure I was within my bounds.
I would assure myself that the person with dementia is not being harmed, taking into account that their statements can be part of something in their mind that they believe, but, is not actually true. At least for a little while. I think we run a risk if we describe it as lying. There is no intent to deceive by the person with dementia. They really do believe what they are saying. That's why reassuring them and not calling them liars is more important than blaming them, imo. Blame on a person with dementia due to something they say, is no more accurate than describing a person who is paralyzed with being lazy for not not walking. Their abilities are curtailed. It's not a moral issue, imo.
The best way to get to the bottom of this is to start by setting up a hidden camera with audio. Play it back later and find out what's really going on.
I also agree about having her evaluated by a specialist. I know from experience how scary it can be when your love one starts falsely accusing you of stuff. My foster dad developed dementia and I had no clue on how to spot it or how to handle it once it became too obvious to miss. He added me on his bank account and I made sure to set up all the bills for online bill pay from our end to save him the legwork of having to go around paying cash, check, or money order. He appreciated it very much but when he got bad, that's when the false accusations started. I was a co-owner on the account, but I guess sometimes it can be a mistake when you have someone who is doing their best to make sure the bills are paid and trying to also help someone else, only for them to start accusing you of stealing when you are rightfully a co-owner on the bank account. They say couples fight over money and often split, but I guess this can happen in any family, especially when money is tight for everyone and you're trying to do your best to keep you and your loved one afloat. When it gets a little too scary, sometimes the only relief is when someone who knows how to handle these types of people steps in and takes over their care. Beware though, they can go to far and separate you from your love one if they happen to be a big shot and get guardianship
You need to assess the whole situation. Has your mother shown any other signs of dementia? If your brother blames these accusations of the caregiver on dementia, yet, there are no other symptoms, such as memory-loss, forgetting simple things like turning off the stove or what she had for breakfast, being disoriented, confused, personality changes etc. then I would be concerned that your mother may be telling the truth.
In the case of claims of abuse or actual evidence of it, I think the only real solution is to install survelience equipment if possible that can be monitored from another location such as work. As far as stealing is concerned the best idea seems to be to lock any valuables in a secure location. It may mean putting things away that you love having on display but in this case better safe than sorry. As far as a loved one's jewellery is concerned if it would be missed have cheap replicas made and hopefully the loved one will not know the difference. This is specially a good idea in an institutional setting. Have a lock box to store medications securely attached to a wall. Leave out only the day's medications for the caregiver to give. You can put a coded padlock on the door so that in an emergency you could give the code to a caregiver to retrieve a certain medication. Change the code immediately you get home. This is a hassle for someone stretched to the limit anyway but once the system is set up it should be easy.
On another note nothing to do with caregiving it is always a good idea to check the number of pills in any prescription you receive especially if they are very expensive or controlled substances. No one is above suspicion these days.
My mom is starting into mid-stage Alzheimer's...she is narcissistic and has always blamed others for any shortcomings. She tells everyone how she drives to the store, etc., when in fact, her caregivers take her where she needs to go. She is very paranoid: when the repairman came to fix a lock on the front door, she came down the hall and demanded to know what he was doing to 'her door'.... get used to it. Doesn't mean not to watch caregivers, etc., but people with dementia are in their own little world.
It is possible, but at the same time, I would be very careful with what she says without evidence. My mom has dementia and has accused my niece at stealing her underwears and her books. She hides her silvers because she thinks people are stealing them. She has made other accusations and is very paranoid. I have discussed it with her neurologist who mentions that it is normal. I would recommend installing a camera to monitor her care-workers to be more certain because it could all really be true.
People with dementia can't formulate a lie but they can mix up incidents with each other & combine it into a new 1 [I call it Chinese menu memory] - they also tend to make mountains out of a molehill
However I agree you should investigate all incidents in case it is true - then deal with it appropriately -
We thought mom & dad were having things stolen but later found a lot of items in very odd spots [like money in towels, jewelry under mom's seat in car, etc] most items were found but a few never were -
Always check the garbage pails/recycles/piles of papers for hidden items - we believe that's where a lot of things disappeared out of house - they think they are being robbed when they can't find something then start hiding [& forgetting where] items that then become the new thing stolen - self pretetuating
Countrymouse, I did send painter a letter to apologize, but that was several months later after we had sold our house and moved to be closer to our kids. My husband died of a stroke (he had vascular dementia) about 15 months after our move.
My father did not have dementia but we thought he did as he would complain that he was being constrained in the hospital at night and was very uncomfortable because of it. I inquired several times of the nurses if that were true and they insisted that nobody was constrained. When my sister from out of state arrived at 10 p.m. and wanted to see Dad, we went to his room and found him tethered to the bed, just as he had reported so I would add my voice to those who suggested some sort of surveillance for the mother.
Before I realized that my husband was in the early stages of dementia, he accused the man who was painting our house of stealing his medications (Xanax). I fired the painter, who was clearly very upset at this accusation. Then when he got a refill, he accused the pharmacist of shorting him on the # of pills. That's when I decided to have him evaluated and he got a diagnosis of "mild cognitive impairment," but within a few months that had progressed to people "visiting" whenever I was out of the house, and I realized that he had dementia.
Always take a complaint of abuse of any kind with an elderly person as Gospel until proven otherwise. Remove them from the "threat" until you do. I know this can be extremely inconvenient but even a Nursing Home will suspend staff while they investigate... Most seniors are afraid to "tell on" their aides, helpers or "girl" because they think they won't have anyone to care for them. I'm extremely familar with Elderly folk; RN 30 yrs, certified in Geriatrics, worked as a Consultant to the largest nursing home chain for many years but forget that...I damn near cared for my for my father in law single handedly from first sign of illness to death and lost my mind. When his wife started down the same path I arranged a Reverse Mortgage and hired 24 hour care. Also make her sons fill holes in the schedule. Not this time...I'm still battling depression. God bless the Caretakers they need it.
I agree with what everyone has said so far and don't have a lot to add. My mother lives with me and my family full time. She has later stage dementia, though. She is really prone to throwing things away that shouldn't be thrown away and saying really outrageous things that just aren't true. In reference to all the comments about theft, something that we did that helped us was to install a code handle on our bedroom (our bedroom now being a remodeled, attached one car garage that used to be the "junk room" with attached laundry room. We gave our Master suite to mom when she moved in.). We installed the handle backwards with the code side facing the kitchen. We can simply type in the code as we enter the laundry room/ our room now, but Mom can't manage it. It lets us lock up chemicals (ever had a load of laundry ruined by your elder dumping bleach in it or your elder leaving Drano where the toddler can access it??), we are no longer surprised by the light coming on in the middle of the night accompanied by a shout of "WHO'S HERE" (no worries, I get up multiple times a night to check on her, plus we have a baby monitor to listen for her), and we put all our valuables and personal items in there that we don't want to go missing or be thrown away. Life. Saver.
My mom said similar things. I questioned it all. I took things in my own hands and went to spend time with mom and her caregiver. I found out caregiver was smoking on mom's porch after she fed her, etc. This isn't what I paid for! Before mom moved into assisted living, her caregiver stole a small wooden table from her garage - only 3 people there - mom, me and caregiver. She, of course, denied it but I knew then that mom was right about many things she said. Because of this, I have a hard time trusting anyone. Some do take advantage of the situation so be very careful and check in without letting anyone know you are coming. You may be surprised at what you find!
I like your comment on sister-in-law as a saint - so nice to hear & I hope you tell her too -
My mother lives with my brother. He can have quite the temper, and Mother interprets him yelling (at anything or anyone) as a personal attack. At one point she asked if she could live with me, she was so scared. I just went right to brother and told him--and he confessed he was under a lot of stresses and was in, fact, lashing out, but never AT mother. I believed him. I also offered more help, which for a while he accepted.
Caregiving is very stressful. Brother is regretting moving mom & dad in with him, but he is determined to stick with the commitment. When I found he was so stressed, I emailed and called all the other sibs. Some $$ went his way, to alleviate the financial stress he was experiencing, and more help came, until he no longer felt he needed help with mother.
This was some years back. Mother now has early stages of dementia, fairly mild, and she can only talk about things that happened 80 years ago or yesterday. That's the new norm for us. I take all she says with a grain of salt, and if she complains about brother or his wife (who is a saint!!) I am sure to relay that to them in a kind way.
If I put a listening device in my brother's home....he'd be so upset. IF mother was under the care of "caregivers" and complaining, I'd think long and hard about it.
If you take over mom's care for a week, you might well find yourself being not-quite-so sweet as you think you'd be. I last about 3 hours and I can't take it. Brother has mother 24/7. I just admire him.
I would assure myself that the person with dementia is not being harmed, taking into account that their statements can be part of something in their mind that they believe, but, is not actually true. At least for a little while. I think we run a risk if we describe it as lying. There is no intent to deceive by the person with dementia. They really do believe what they are saying. That's why reassuring them and not calling them liars is more important than blaming them, imo. Blame on a person with dementia due to something they say, is no more accurate than describing a person who is paralyzed with being lazy for not not walking. Their abilities are curtailed. It's not a moral issue, imo.
I also agree about having her evaluated by a specialist. I know from experience how scary it can be when your love one starts falsely accusing you of stuff. My foster dad developed dementia and I had no clue on how to spot it or how to handle it once it became too obvious to miss. He added me on his bank account and I made sure to set up all the bills for online bill pay from our end to save him the legwork of having to go around paying cash, check, or money order. He appreciated it very much but when he got bad, that's when the false accusations started. I was a co-owner on the account, but I guess sometimes it can be a mistake when you have someone who is doing their best to make sure the bills are paid and trying to also help someone else, only for them to start accusing you of stealing when you are rightfully a co-owner on the bank account. They say couples fight over money and often split, but I guess this can happen in any family, especially when money is tight for everyone and you're trying to do your best to keep you and your loved one afloat. When it gets a little too scary, sometimes the only relief is when someone who knows how to handle these types of people steps in and takes over their care. Beware though, they can go to far and separate you from your love one if they happen to be a big shot and get guardianship
As far as stealing is concerned the best idea seems to be to lock any valuables in a secure location. It may mean putting things away that you love having on display but in this case better safe than sorry. As far as a loved one's jewellery is concerned if it would be missed have cheap replicas made and hopefully the loved one will not know the difference. This is specially a good idea in an institutional setting.
Have a lock box to store medications securely attached to a wall. Leave out only the day's medications for the caregiver to give. You can put a coded padlock on the door so that in an emergency you could give the code to a caregiver to retrieve a certain medication. Change the code immediately you get home. This is a hassle for someone stretched to the limit anyway but once the system is set up it should be easy.
On another note nothing to do with caregiving it is always a good idea to check the number of pills in any prescription you receive especially if they are very expensive or controlled substances. No one is above suspicion these days.
However I agree you should investigate all incidents in case it is true - then deal with it appropriately -
We thought mom & dad were having things stolen but later found a lot of items in very odd spots [like money in towels, jewelry under mom's seat in car, etc] most items were found but a few never were -
Always check the garbage pails/recycles/piles of papers for hidden items - we believe that's where a lot of things disappeared out of house - they think they are being robbed when they can't find something then start hiding [& forgetting where] items that then become the new thing stolen - self pretetuating