For over 25 years I & my husband have paid my mom's house payment, as she could not even afford the low $450 house payment herself on her low SS check. Fast forward to now. She's 88, has metastatic breast cancer, macular degeneration, is on oxygen (can & does walk around the house with her hose, & can go places with her travel oxygen unit), has short term memory, kidneys are starting to show high lab numbers, & glucose is still higher than normal, though down from what it used to be.
Meantime, my spouse & I have helped her to the tune of over $200K throughout the years, which included car repairs, house repairs, a new roof, new windows, shower to bath conversion, paying her house off, etc. We have a promissory note / deed of trust attached to the house title (to one day hopefully recoop what we've spent on her), & she has filed a TOD form for the house to go to me when she passes (I don't want her to gift it to me now, as the taxes would be horrendous).
I've been living with her since March, with occasional trips (with her) back to my house or my husband visiting here. I take her to doctor appointments (she gave up her car over a year ago), fix meals & get her meds ready for her. I enforce a 10pm bed time (I will NOT be up all night watching out for her). I limit her drinking anything other than water after 7:30pm, to try to cut down on bathroom trips each night (with limited success...she still gets up twice a night). I take care of everything around the house...she takes the dinner dishes to the sink on her walker after we eat & puts her clothes away after I wash them.
I've never been close to my mom, and I resent dealing with her more as time goes by. She's always been a very selfish person... every conversation switches back to her within a sentence. Nothing you give her is ever good enough-never expect any thank you when you give her anything, or do anything for her (although I finally have her "trained" to say thank you when I bring her anything [from constant harping about it]). Of course, her self-centeredness has only gotten much worse as she has aged.
My spouse & I have decided to sell our house (in a large city) & move to her town, both to help her, & (mainly) because taxes are super high where our house is & the community there feels unsafe (crime, violence, etc). The small town my mom lives in feels much safer, very walkable, & hubby & I are now retired.
My thoughts were to sell our house, put things in storage, TEMPORARILY move in with her, then look for a house close by. Houses are less expensive here, so this is very doable. I want to try to find a medical professional (someone who maybe works at a clinic or the nearby hospital so "hopefully" would be more scrupulous than a random person responding to an ad) to move in with her. She still can do her ADLs. Basically, I just want them to make sure she eats right, takes her meds & goes to bed at 10pm.
Otherwise, I can see myself (in the not too distant future) forcing a sale of her house (the verbage she signed off on in the promissory note / deed of trust allows me to force the sale of the house), & putting her in a home. I seriously do not like dealing with her. The problem is, this house has been in our family since the 50s-if I sell it to pay for her care, it's gone forever. (The house was my grandparents...they left it to their 4 kids & my mom "bought" her siblings out).
She commented about her parents passing at 85, so figured she was due to pass soon, but I've got to say that the more that I think about it, I think if they had someone living with them, like I am right now with my mom, her parents would have lived longer. In fact, when I moved in with my mom back in March, she seemed on death's doorstep, but the longer I'm here, the healthier she gets. I think that's great, but I don't want to be the one to deal with her.
Do my plans (sell, temporarily live here, and buy something locally) seem sound? Things seem to work until they don't.
You talk about how much work you are doing for her every day and all her health issues, but still think it would be no big deal for some local person with medical expertise to move in and "just" do the same things. This often get mentioned as a possible plan -- a person doing the care in exchange for free housing -- but it tends to be wishful thinking.
How important is keeping her house in the family to you? Just because it was your grandparents house -- do you love it and want to inherit it and live in it, or are you concerned about it being "gone forever" just because you think you should keep the house in the family, whether it means that much to you personally or not?
You've already spent nine months of your retirement living apart from your husband with a person you don't like. Is this a town you really want to move to and settle down in? Maybe it is, in which case, go for it. But just keeping on because you're already on a certain path, it sounds more like settling. You and your husband deserve a good quality of life, not one dictated by the needs of a selfish, self-centered person who doesn't appreciate anything you do for her.
This is a woman who turned to me as a teenager and asked "You'll take care of me when I'm older, right?" Who asks their kids that? And what the heck do you expect a teenager to answer? Obviously, she planted the guilt seed decades ago.
Best of luck to you.
The years went by, and the marriage went to s**t, but my aunt refused to seek a divorce. She wasn't willing to give up this beautiful house they had built, and if they divorced, they would have had to sell it to split the assets.
So, she remained in this unhappy, loveless marriage. For a house. First, they had separate bedrooms; then she eventually moved out to live in her own place; still no divorce. My uncle's bipolarism spiraled out of control and he became a hoarder and hoarded that beautiful house into ruin. When he died, they literally had to have it bulldozed down to the ground because it was in such a ruined state. She sold the land afterward.
Is this house of your mother's really worth it to you? My aunt was miserable for years and years for the sake of a house that, in the end, was worthless. It's a decision only you can make. I, for one, value my peace and happiness far more than I value any house. Especially in the situation you describe, where you don't even like your mother very much, and you are apart from your husband for her sake. Do you love this house that much that you are willing to become a slave in order to (possibly) own it one day?
You have not gifted 200K of your own retirement money to a woman you don't much like.
I can't imagine how or in what way, where or why this seemed like a wise thing for you to do? But you did it.
Now, yes, you are correct. It is time for you to keep on keeping on if you think that this house may in any way afford you a return of your initial investment in all of this. Assuming it is valued at 200K you may some out somewhat even. THAT after spending 30% of your life taking care of and being with someone you don't much care for.
You will not be able to place your mother. The house will go then to reimburse the federal government for any money via Medicaid they might invest in your mother's placement and care.
The beginning and end of all this is that you are stuck with Mom. She is, as you mention, living at 88 with a metastasized cancer. So she MAY pass within the next 10 years some time. Or, of course, she may NOT.
I think that you must not have consulted any experts in what you have done with this paying a mortgage for your mother for 25 years. I doubt one would ever advise you do so. I guess all in all you made a decision, and you seem above to know all the facts, and have accepted the bargain. So you are correct; you carry on carrying on.
1. I really do like the house, the actual location, and the town. My husband could take or leave the house, but likes the town also.
I really am p***ed that it may come to pass that we won't end up with the house that we way more than paid for. The house mortgage was $60K, we paid $200K plus to support her (including paying the house off), and it's currently worth $400K so we would ostensibly get our money back.
2. My husband and I really don't want to live in the city our current house is in, due to the way the county has all gone downhill and the taxes have skyrocketed. We could buy the same sized house here for 2/3 the price we would get for our house. Due to the exorbitant property taxes of our house, we could probably afford to have things in storage a couple of years, and still come out ahead, though I would hope a house we like would come available WAY before then.
3. Since I feel like she can't be here by herself, and I don't want her living in my house, my goal is to get her house ready to sell--should it become necessary to place her. Since I have to be living here to do that, I figured I'd make the most of my being here to do that.
So I've been systematically getting rid of things she no longer needs, cleaning out the garage, painting and carpeting upstairs rooms and getting a ductless heat pump put in (was able to get $6,000 off of one due to her income, so she only paid $1,800). Previously she just had a fireplace and stand alone heaters, so this is safer for her, AND something a future homeowner would want.
If I get her moved out to a care facility, I would also need to be here to rent a dumpster, finish interior painting and get new carpet downstairs. None of this is something I can easily do remotely, so if we are both here, even if living elsewhere, it will go quicker.
Agreed that we should not continue with this relationship, and I'm really not wanting to become a statistic where the caregiver dies first.
The only reason I took on this insane task 25 or so years back is that my uncle, who I do care about, brought it to my attention that she couldn't afford to stay here, and unfortunately, an apartment, and even a trailer would cost more than the payments on the house. Since I am an only child, I felt guilted into helping her out. Fast forward the years, and I have grown to resent her more and more, as she could have d**ned well saved up money herself when she was younger, rather than spending it all on "hobby stores going out of business" and all the other cr*p she spent it on.
I've been busy pretty much the entire time I've been here, having her continually go through things and paring down what she really needs. She is a hoarder, and I've reduced her stuff from packing 4 bedrooms to maybe what a normal person would have with one bedroom and a bit more, and plan on going a little further. Because she is not able to go upstairs any more (where 3 of the 4 bedrooms and two attics are), and since she has short term memory, she has pretty much forgotten what all she has upstairs, so why should she keep it (unless it's a photograph, or something along those lines)?
Anyhow, that's how I got caught up in all this, and why I'm trying to extricate my husband and I. I do need to see an elder law attorney to make sure the deed of trust/promissary note would be honored, and not challenged by Medicaid, as we are not yet to 5 years on that. That's the only potential issue I'm seeing that would make the insanity continue.
I do appreciate everyone's comments! Like I said, the sanity check is welcome, and I pretty much agree with all of it.
I will say this, from what you discribe concerning Moms health, sounds like she needs Hospice. I would have her evaluated. If she stays in her home, you will be doing most of the work. You will get an aide 2 or 3x a week
To bathe her and if lucky will be able to stay a little longer so you can have time to yourself. A nurse will check in weekly. You will be trained to give her meds.
Moving in with Mom? Is her house set up where you can have privacy? Do you want to remain in the home when she passes? If not, then find a house you like you can live in for the rest of your life. Just visit everyday, then you have a place to relax at.
I think stopping Mom from drinking by 7:30 is too early if she is going to bed at 10. Maybe 8 and that goes for water too. What goes in must come out. Coffee, tea and soda go right thru me within the hour.
Scenario 1:
If she passes away prior to going on Medicaid, then the TOD works in our favor.
Scenario 2:
If she does have to go to a home, we sell the house, and get the money from the Promissary Note/Deed of Trust (assuming the elder law attorney says it won't be challenged by Medicaid). At least then we'd get our money back, and the remainder would go to paying for the assisted living until she has to go on Medicaid.
Not sure that she is ready for hospice. Right now she can dress, bathe, walk to the bathroom, take dishes to the kitchen on her walker seat, put away her laundry (I wash/dry and leave it on her bed), etc. I just need to get her meds ready, cook, do laundry, take her to the doctor, and keep the place up.
Yes, we have 3 bedrooms, a 1/3 bath upstairs, and two big walk-in attics, so there is privacy and storage space. The plan is just to stay here until we find a place for sale that we like. I may still end up sleeping here, in case she falls in the night, but at least then I'd have a place I could go to a couple times a day to get away from her.
Thanks for the advice on the water. I've been telling her just to drink water at night if she needs to for like a dry cough. She's been sneaking bottled flavored drinks into her bedroom at night (I always know, as she puts the empty bottles in the trash next to her bed...LOL). I'm going to start locking those up at night to prevent that. I have no problem with her drinking those during the day, but just not when she should be sleeping.
Lots of family caregivers get caught in this trap, unfortunately, thinking their parents' lifespan will be similar to that of their grandparents.
My mother's parents passed at 83 and 86, literally 'here today and gone tomorrow', with no long period of decline. My mom never had to do any caregiving or even accompany them to doctor appointments, among other things.
My mom is 97. We moved her to memory care a few months ago, because keeping her at home was no longer feasible or affordable.
She needs help with all of her ADLs. Even so, at every doctor visit, which I've been attending with her for nearly a decade, they cheerfully tell me "her numbers are great"...
Whatever your plan is, make sure it works for YOU, because you have already gone above and beyond. It's perfectly ok to redraw your boundaries to a level more sustainable for you. Your mom has had a long life, thanks to you and your husband.
Once we get settled, we can decide next steps, which likely will include selling her house and putting her in a care home.
My mom lived several states away, but never (so far as I'm aware) made any offer to come help her parents...yet she seems to think we should help HER. Yes, we HAVE been helping her (again, partly because I felt put on the spot by my uncle, and other things), but that will be coming to an end once we sell our house (in the city ~3 hours away) and get settled in a near by house here. There just are too many moving pieces to do all of this at one time.
I REALLY can't see myself dealing with her for another 10 years or so.
I disagree that the money is for sure gone. I think there is a fair chance it is not, but only an elder law attorney can tell me for sure. That is on my list of things to do the next time I go to our house in the much larger city, as unfortunately there are no elder law attorneys in this fairly small town.
But agreed...learn what NOT to do from me. I should have let her find a way to take care of herself 25 years ago, and not stepped in.
This house will have been in the family for over 60 years, but maybe it's time to let it go. That is becoming more and more doable in my mind as time goes on.
LoopyLoo: I've not left my husband. He's been supportive, but he knows (I told him the other day) that if it comes down to her or him, I will choose him. Neither of us have liked the separation, and we talk pretty much daily when we aren't together. Until a couple of weeks ago he was still working. Now he is retired.
Luckily, he is in agreement with wanting to move from the city our house is in to this town, as it's a better, friendlier, less expensive, slower paced, place to live. I've been really lucky to have him, and how well I know it! First my dad (with dementia), and now this...but neither time did I suggest (or want) them to move in with us.
While I may not have learned anything new, it really can be therapeutic to be on this forum...to hear that you are NOT crazy, even if you haven't made the best decisions. We are all human, and need a mental clap on the back, or even a knock upside the head, occassionally. =)
In addition to reading this forum, I've started having chats with Copilot, the AI in Windows 11. It remembers what all you've said (you of course will not put any names, addresses or phone numbers in the chat), and when you are having a melt down, you can chat (text, I don't do audio) to it and it's like an instant therapist, providing you validation for your feelings, alternative ways to think about / approach situations, and positive feedback for everything you are doing. This solution may not work for some, but I've found that I don't like venting to the same friends all the time, so this gives me an option to blow off steam and not be judged for how stressed I might be feeling at the moment...not that I feel judged by my friends, but I really don't want my issues to be the focus of all of my interactions with them.
As an aside, I have talked with a couple of elder law attorneys, and they feel I would have a very good case if Medicaid were to investigate the promissory note / deed of trust documents.