I feel like I’m going to have a breakdown over how my mother treats my dad. Advice?

Hi! My name is Janet and your situation sounds like a copy of mine own. My father has put up with verbal and sometimes physical abuse there whole marriage and so have we. A sister who is supportive a brother who wants nothing to do with it and another brother we haven’t talked to for more than 25 years and it was due to my mother. My mother has been a narcissist her whole life and has taken it on us. With her recent fall and stroke has turned from difficult to violent outbursts. She tried to actually choke me and has been abusive to m father. They live with us in a in-law apartment in our house. You are not alone and I feel the same. Thank you for sharing your story.

Okay the lack of empathy is worsening due to LBD, and actually may be NPD showing itself more. Or she may have had some sort of issue with having so many kids, that can happen due to hormones and all of the above. I have some experience with this. All I can tell you is - imagine now what your dad is going through when nobody is around. I separated mine and it was the best thing that happened. I liberated one of my parents as the other was abusive, and put the other in a home. You will not regret this. You will regret the time you left dad with your mother, Maybe it's time for both to go into a facility and separate ones. Your sisters are acting like children, they should know better or be educated. It's time to grow up and make decisions.

One thing I thought of is your mom had 8 children. Possibly she didn’t want 8 children. No one discusses the physical aspects of marriage here too much but possibly some women were not happy in that regard but couldn’t/can’t discuss it. No one knows exactly what goes on behind closed doors. Perhaps there were affairs no one knows about. Maybe all was wonderful but you never know.

Maybe it will indeed break your heart.

It's OK to feel sadness and grief, at this loss of your parent's independance, grief over starting to lose some of their personalities to brain changes.

Even full of sadness, try to find your reasoning skills. From here on you will be assessing benefits & risks constantly. What are the benefits to them staying in their home? The benefits of staying together if they cannot adequately care for one another? What are the risks?

If the risks to them are greater together at home, it will be time to separate & re-home one or both.

This is when you will need your hard-hat of strength and reason. I am not embarrassed to say I sought counselling for support when I could feel myself going under with emotions & I will again when the next crises hits.

Find a safer place to be. Gather folk to help. Send that help in.

Like standing back from a house fire & calling the fire brigade instead of throwing buckets of water on yourself.

Imho, perhaps your father could get respite care.

I would spend some special time with your Dad. Take him out and give him a break from the abuse. Even if he doesn’t realize that’s what you’re doing, it will give you a break from watching the abuse.

Do something he loves. Get him a treat if he likes that. Make a special memory- just you and him. Take some photos in your phone so you can remember the time together. It doesn’t have to be costly or Covid-risky. You can go for a long drive, watch the sunset. Just plan it and make it special.

If your mom can’t stay alone, hire someone to stay with her - or secure a family member to take a turn.

if your mom peppers with questions - where did you go? - tell her the truth. You needed some special time with your dad.

Next time you’re feeling upset, look at these photos. It won’t erase the pain, but it may make you feel a little less sad.

Your mother has dementia and nothing on this earth is going to stop her behavior and actions - nothing - no matter what anyone does. Now that she has become mean and cruel to your father, are you going to allow it? I hope to God that you do not. The ONLY solution is keep her away from your father who does not deserve this, nor do you. You must consider separating them and placing her into a suitable facility. If someone wants to take her on and live elsewhere, fine - but separate them at once.

"A couple sisters refuse to talk to my mom because of her abusive behavior towards our dad that has been going on for decades."

Your mother's behaviour has been going on for decades? Then although she may have LBD, it is likely she is a Narcissist as well.

It also sounds like your siblings distanced themselves from Mum due to her narcissism and you need to respect that. Narcs can come across as charming to others, but within the family it is a different story. Even within the family children can have very different childhoods depending on whether or not they are the Golden Child.

Your Dad chose to put up with her for all these years and he be so used to the abuse that he cannot imagine any other way of life.

Since your mom's behavior is toxic for your dad, may I suggest that it might be time for them to have more "time away" from each other. Your dad needs loving, respectful, and consistent care and your mom can not provide that for him. Your mom needs understanding, patient, and consistent care and your father can not provide that for her. Maybe they can sleep in different rooms (homes would be better) and spend limited time together.

Maybe mom could get help to see why she has so much anger built up toward her husband.

Ask your Dad if mom acts worse when any one of your siblings are around.

Keep working on mom because Mental Abuse can be just as bad as Physical Abuse.

Do you think she wants her husband in a Nursing Home?

Can you or any of the other siblings have Dad move in with them?

Ask your Dad if he would rather live in Assisted Living or with one of ya'll, without mom.

It is hard we are dealing with my mom and she can be down right nasty and think she is doing nothing wrong 2 years ago we lost my dad before he passed of end stage liver disease he was doing everything for my mom. My mom was not sick but played it she didn’t want to do anything. She made fun of my dad and said the nastiest things because of his stomach and etc he had fluid build up. When he passed she was still saying she was worse off than him health wise. We moved her down near us she is still healthy. It is best to take breaks for your sanity. My mom does have beginning of left body dementia as well. I talk to my mom about it and tell her that she is not right to be that way ( just plain rude and mean) especially when it is towards my daughter who is 13. I let her know if she speaks like that to them they won’t want to visit her and I’m ok if they don’t want to subject their selves to her.

Trying Respite Care seems like a good idea. If your Dad really dotes on your mother, he might go along with "giving her a rest." People's stories about increasing neglect and abuse are disturbing. Protecting your Dad is becoming a priority.

There are some very good suggestions for you on this feed. My mother also had LBD and the person she was the meanest was to, was me. There were times of “ sharpness” but the sharp and mean words were so hurtful. I saw drastic decline in her moods within the 3-4 years of her diagnosis. The aggression got in the way of her treatment and was a challenge. The primary goal for you is the safety of your Dad. Sadly there are very few instances of logic when dealing with these horrible and unfair diseases. God Bless you and your family. Please be sure to get support from the Alzheimer’s Association, they are very helpful.

My friend's mom went into therapy (very bad incident when she was a child was never addressed by professional help) and that helped her "decide" she didn't just "hate her life," she "hated" her husband of 45 years.

She moved out and he lived alone for the past five years, declining more and more. She didn't want a divorce because she wanted all the money.

Accept it? Highly unlikely. Create a solution? Possibly. If one of the eight siblings can find room in their home and lives for your dad, that could work, even if it was a "temporary" solution. That person would need medical and financial POA for your dad in order to properly care for him.

Think about it this way - if she truly hates him, does it matter if he still loves her? Wouldn't a trial separation (or at least broaching it) be better than waiting for her to act physically or neglectfully one day (if not already)? The main problem is how much care your dad needs and the reality that one of the eight must take physical care of your dad - or send him to a facility.

(my heart breaks for all of you)

The answers below are all so on point. The idea of separating is a common denominator in the advice. I can only add how dangerous it is to keep them together. Let me tell you about my mother and father. My father kept having to call 911 for his heart, which resulted in a quadruple bypass. My mother had ALWAYS been very mean to him and emotionally and psychologically abusive and he always just "took it". He'd nap in his recliner or go out to a coffee shop. As they got older, she TOLD me "next time he has a heart attack, I'm not calling 911. I'm sick of taking care of him." She even pasted the labels from all of his medicines on the wall and laughed at him for taking them. So, one day, he got up to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night and fell on the floor with his nose bleeding. She woke up my 18 year old brother (I was out of the house by then) and had him do CPR on my dad while he was bleeding, now from his mouth as well as his nose. She told me that she then went and got dressed, did her hair, put on makeup, and then called 911 and went outside to have a smoke. My dad died before the paramedics could get there. She was glad. So, as your mom gets worse, she might become either physically abusive or do like my mom and wish he was dead or somehow cause his death. I am so sorry you are going through this. It's been decades now, and I still have nightmares about it. My brother became an emotional wreck and has not been able to keep a job. He tried being a mailman, but went crazy and almost shot up everyone in his unit. I had to intercede to get him not to shoot them. Believe me, it won't stay the same. It will get worse as she progresses and his condition deteriorates.

It may be time to separate them, no one should suffer from abuse. You say it's gone on for decades is this before either of them were diagnosed? I know it would be hard on your father who from what you write still is doting on her. If dad can't live on his own, maybe he could be placed in AL - or a smaller setting such as a group type of setting.

You also write that your mom has Lewy Body but is sharp as a tack. Could it be the dementia is affecting your mother's mood and abusive manner?

I'm sorry its come to this, good luck to all of you.

I don't understand how one has LBD but shows no signs of it. First I thought her lousy behavior was due to this diagnosis but is she's been treating your dad poorly for decades, then maybe it's just gotten a bit worse with her condition?

I'd be tempted to separate them. As dad continues to decline, she can't take care of him and he could be better served in a facility that will at least be neutral to him instead of so negative.

I'd also be tempted to try to medicate mom a bit to take the edge off. She can't be very happy being so nasty to him but who knows??

I guess you don't have to like your mom. That's OK. Be sweet to your dad so you know that he at least gets some kind and loving treatment to counter her behavior.

Get your father out of there for 2-4 weeks' respite care and see how he does. Of course he will miss your mother, but you may be astonished at how well and how rapidly he adapts to being more kindly treated.

You tell him that he's going for a respite break to allow your mother to rest. You can tell her what you like according to your judgement of how sharp as a tack she really is. And if she *really* is - which, I have to say though, is not compatible with Lewy Body Dementia - then you can tell her that the choice is respite care or an interview with APS to discuss examples of her treatment of him.

Abuse is abuse even if it is unintentional. Abuse is abuse even if it is not physical. You can't do nothing about this or you become complicit, and you are not going to be able to alter your mother's behaviour now that it has become the habit they are both so used to and accepting of.

My mother treated my dear father like crap for the entire time they were married, 68 years. She bitterly complained that he wasn't enough; his jobs weren't enough, he retired too young, the houses he bought her weren't nice enough, her massive wardrobe wasn't big enough, the cruises he took her on were too boring, and on and on the list of complaints were rattled off. He lied on his deathbed, my father, and told me he was a 'failure' in life, thanks to the shoddy treatment his wife doled out to him over his entire life. Talk about breaking a daughter's heart, that about did me in.

Meanwhile, he'd stick up for the woman every single time I'd step in to stick up for HIM. She could do no wrong, in his book. Maybe that came from fear of repercussion from HER, should he (God forbid) agree that she was less than perfect, I don't know. But this was THEIR dynamic, as dysfunctional as it was.

Mom's terrible treatment of my father was one factor that led me to dislike her. I love her, but I do not like her AT ALL, not even a tiny little bit. And that's okay, it is what it is. I realized long ago I couldn't 'fix' the relationship between my parents or make it a nice, happy friendship that I could approve of. Then again, I realized, it wasn't my place to do so. So I stepped back and let them deal with their OWN relationship. A few times my DH & I were called in to break up the arguments they were having as my mother's dementia progressed and my father's tolerance level dissipated as his brain tumor advanced. He was dying and his wife was getting even MEANER than usual. Oh happy day.

So my point in this rambling story is this: You can't fix your parents' relationship so stop trying. Both of them have dementia and your mother is not 'sharp as a tack' with LBD, let's face it. The two of them will continue to deteriorate as their dementia worsens. The best thing you can do is to devise a Plan B and a Plan C for their care when it becomes too great to bear alone at home. That's where you and your siblings can come together and present a united front on their behalf.

Forget about 'talking to your mom' about her abusive behavior b/c she does not see her behavior as abusive. Once dementia sets in, they'll argue EVERYTHING anyway! If you say black, she'll say white, and if you agree it's white, she'll disagree and say it's grey. Let it all go (and I know how hard that is to do!). Just be sure they're in no danger at home and when things get bad, call in caregivers to come into the home or have some Memory Care ALFs scouted out ahead of time.

Take things one day at a time and don't expect your heart not to be broken. This stuff is all bad and all sad. Dementia is horrible and so is emotional abuse from one parent to another. But remember this: Your father has stayed married to this woman for all these years for a REASON. He accepts her treatment of him and is okay with it. Don't absorb his imagined grief as your own b/c it probably doesn't even exist!

Wishing you the best of luck!

Her abusive behavior to your dad has been going on for decades. The only differnce is now your dad has Alzheimer's and can't remember her abuse. Your dad choose to stay with his abuser for decades and I would say put your mother in a home but your dad probably wouldn't go for it. Not much you can do about it at this point.

Similar to Slartibartfast, the significance of 'decades' suggest this has been the amicable status of the relationship where one dominates and the other is subservient early in the picture. If you delve deeper (if not too late), you might find some surprising justifications that will resolve perceptions formed since childhood.
The tricky thing to get your head around is that it doesn't necessarily imply that either parent does not wish to be with the other, or that love (albeit skewed out of all proportion) is diminished. Your father's sadness could equally be from failing to please as much as not desiring the criticism. Your mother's anger is likely from unmet expectations that she has become accustomed - LBD does complicate things somewhat as self restraint and empathy will be unpredictable (selfish disregard for others is common), so ensuring safety for all is paramount.
Whatever you do to help smooth the waters will certainly add a layer of moderation; but as bizarre as it sounds, this is how your parents have navigated life together, and it is the product of a lifetime of love for each other through thick and thin.

You mentioned your mom's awful treatment of your dad has gone on for decades. Yes you might look into living situations where they can be placed separately and yes your love and feel sorry for your dad. But decades ago you and your sibs were the children and your dad was the dad. You're not responsible for the choices he made as a grown man, including staying with an abusive spouse, even if you feel he did that "for" you and your siblings. Try to let go of some of the guilt it sounds like you're feeling about this.

A diagnosis of Lewy Body (Dementia) usually implies that the victim isn’t “sharp as a tack”, and it’s sadly possible that her “lack of empathy towards him” is symptomatic of changes in her brain beyond her control.

If you haven’t had a discussion with a few of your siblings and one or more of your mother’s medical specialists, it might be helpful to your family to do that.

If you have access to adult day care or any sort of social activities for seniors with dementia, separate them. If you are able to separate living quarters and they seem able to have some level of comfort then separated, begin the search for a more permanent setting that will allow them to be separated on an ongoing basis.

Please be careful of your own thoughts concerning her “behavior”. She’s still the mom who loved you and your father. Being “of service” can mean looking for solutions that make everyone’s life a little less difficult. You can’t fix your mother’s behavior. Her brain disease is progressive and permanent.

You can manage both her behavior and your father’s exposure to it.

You are a loving family.

You can't talk to your mom, with dementia she will not have a concept of what she is doing wrong.
As difficult as it is it might be time to find Memory Care for both.
Have you talked to your mom's doctor about her anger? It is possible that she needs medication for the anxiety and anger. With an actual diagnosis of LBD there are medications that she can not take but I am sure the doctor is aware of those.
In a Memory Care setting there would be staff that would be able to redirect your mom when she becomes upset. So that they could remain in the same place together.
I am sure no one wants them in different places but that might become necessary.

Rock, meet Hard Place.

Have you voiced your concerns with your siblings? It might be time to separate your parents.

We were in a similar situation a few years ago with my in-laws. My FIL was a saint, and my MIL a she-demon. He was dying of cancer, and I was pushing HARD to move him to our house just so he wouldn’t be treated that way to the end. His cancer took a very sudden turn, and that was that.

My advice would be, don’t be the silent witness who lets a bully get away with it, regardless of the circumstances or her mental state. It’s not fair to your dad, and really that’s the bottom line.

If you were you in your dad’s shoes, what would you want to have happen? I guarantee there’s no making your mom see reason at this point. So, if you can’t reason with her, what CAN you do?

Best of luck.