What do I do when my husband with Alzheimer's doesn't want the medication?

Truffles, you haven't filled out your profile. Can you explain what your caregiving role is?

Hi Im really not a scientologist I work with the elderly and see every day how people deteriorate on these antipsychotics . They become very withdrawn or aggressive and frequently lose their appetites . Many doctors also agree that antipsychotics are dangerous for the old and frail . People need to wise up and stop putting their loved ones in the hands of psychiatrists There are lots of GOOD doctors out there if you look

Well said Sandwich, glad I am not the only one with these views. Dealing with the teachings of an organisations whoose primary purpose is to create wealth for it's leaders. Wise up Truffles you have been brainwashed.
Electric shocks and lobectomy went out of use many years ago

*CoS not COF.

Well, Truffles what can I say but that I think you'll have better results spreading that 1950s sci-fi manure on the flower garden than here. You are out of your depth, saying such ridiculous things to those of us who work and live in the world of dementia patients.

Scientology isn't exactly known for it's compassionate treatment of the elderly or infirm. Quite the opposite. Offloading (sudden abandonment) of the sick & elderly is common. Funny how you never hear of any CoF nursing homes & memory care centers!

Nobody electrocutes the elderly. Electrocution is nowhere in the standards of care for dementia. ECT is not even a recognized medical practice by the FDA. That practice died out ages ago unless you go to some private quack doctor.

I won't waste my time explaining how medication studies work, causation and correllation not being the same thing, and what potential side effects means. Potential means it's not certain.

Here's a news flash - people with dementia die all the time anyway. You can't stop that. It is utterly inhumane to withhold any means for comfort and respite for these folks during their days on this earth.

Recent studies have shown that the risks of antipsychotics in the elderly outweigh any benefits . You cannot compare them to chemotherapy . A dementia patient will not die without these harsh deadly drugs Nearly 2000 elderly patients die each year from the side effects they cause . They can worsen memory loss, cause hallucinations and they frequently cause fatal falls in the elderly . They also cause irreversable tardive dyskinesia and neuroleptic malignant syndrome. These poor frail old people deserve much better care than this. The drugs cause incontinence and confusion. I personally do not think they are fit for human consumption and should be banned for the elderly. Im sorry to say this but many psychiatrists have a vested interest in the pharmaceutical companies and they do over prescribe . We all need to check out our parents medication and watch out for side effects after all we are the people who love them most . Sometimes the kindest thing is to ween an old person off these toxic drugs and concentrate on a very healthy diet . Aggression is a major side effect of antipsychotics and should not always be attributed to the dementia . This is my opinion Sorry but I dont think doctors should be prescribing these drugs to dementia patients at all

Truffles - Yes, anti-psychotics have serious side effects. So does chemotherapy and radiation therapies. So do HIV drugs. A lot of medication has potentially serious side effects but they aren't ruled out as a reasonable option because the benefits outweigh the risk. There are many anti-psychotics to choose from, and they are different from each other. This has to be a conversation with a psychiatrist and a medical doctor to determine the best path. Side effects are potentials, not promises. Sometimes doing nothing is the worst option.

Living with and try to caregive anyone who has psychosis and dementia at the same time is not something most people can comprehend, so it's easy to just write-off meds as bad because they're only looking at one set of factors. The alternative to meds is to restrain with straps, and that is actually truly cruel (not to mention illegal outside a hospital setting).

Intentional sedation has nothing whatsoever to do with it. Mom is not sleepy or passive on her meds. Dosage has to be very carefully monitored because side effects are very, very serious.

She's not just grumpy or cranky and negative off the meds. She is DANGEROUS. Withholding medication from her on some moral high ground is negligent. Otherwise, she would have to be restrained in a room all alone, indefinitely.

With her anti-psychotics, she can live in a home-like community with other people, participate in activities, and have some kind of life. Would I take that away from her? Absolutely not ever.

It's not a chemical lobotomy - that sounds like scaremongering from a sci-fi movie. She is not a drooling vegetable on the meds. She's still herself, but she isn't having psychotic rages that go on for days & days, hallucinations, spitting on the care workers, trying to claw them and make them bleed with her fingernails, and slapping/kicking them. She's not grabbing their fingers and trying to break them. She doesn't pick at her skin until she has bloody sores all over her arms & legs. She doesn't pull out her hair. She doesn't scream and rage at invisible people and animals. She isn't trying to find sharp things to stab her care workers with.

This is why I let the doctors do the doctoring. Her sisters would have her totally unmedicated, sitting in her house alone 24/7/365, crazy as a bedbug. They "just don't like the idea of medication" but at the same time were not willing to go in that house and deal with the realness, nastiness, and ugliness at all. She scares them and everybody else with her wild behaviors. It can't be both ways. Cruel is abandoning a person to their psychosis because the medications sound scary, and then hiding from the consequences because the person is weird, gross, and out of control.

Many people do feel very strongly about a general trend in overusing prescription drugs in the American culture. Then dealing with an elder with advanced dementia is like nothing you could imagine without experiencing it. I have friends who tell me, 'oh, yes, my mother is very difficult too' and I just have to remind myself that they have no idea how the level of difficulty is escalated by dementia. We went through the whole daily pill box routine, even the electronic one, (that hit the wall really fast) then distributing the pills, with the endless demands of returning her medicines, when she would dump all on the counter and start an endless counting game, etc. She wants her medicines, just can't manage things anymore. I think she always had delusions, but now the hallucinations have started. She insists on searching the house for the little boy even though she cannot manage the stairs. The mania she experiences is dangerous. Turns out she is not taking her pills routinely, some days yes, other days no. Intermittent use is probably the worst choice. I don't think apple sauce would work for her, she is very wary. So I empathize with this problem.

I am happy to tell you I am already old.
Our mental health system is failing everyone.
Perhaps you would like to work in an institution for the elderly where no drugs were permitted.
When your shift ended hopefully there would be a shower provided to get off all the s**t that had been thrown over you, your socks soaked in urine,food rubbed into your hair. No hazmat suits provided! Maybe there would be a dr on staff to suture the cuts and x-ray any broken bones. Maybe some ice for that big bruise on your head wher your head was banged on the bath taps. Thank goodness for Workmens Comp at least that would cover your medical expenses till you could find a different job. Oh and I forgot to mention the foul language and sexual harasement. demented old men just love the chance to "Feel up" a young or even not so young caretaker. You can't hit them, that is elder abuse. This is real life Truffles

Well You will be old one day Lets hope you are not incarcerated and drugged against your will or even electric shocked ! Our so called mental health system is failing the elderly who deserve more than stigmatising labels and brain damaging drugs. Dementia patients should not be given harsh antipsychotics They can cause premature death FACT

Well Truffles I am going to go out on a limb and face the wrath of other members of this forum.
Why are you here? Who are you caring for?
What is your background in the care of the mentally ill?
How much do you actually know about psychotrophic drugs.
Why are you promoting a not for profit arm of the Church of Scientology? I did look that up.
I will report your post so you know who did it.
If you really think anyone here is stupid enough to fill in that form about our mental illness,treatment and side effects of our medications you are sadly mistaken. Once they have our names and addresses no doubt the requests for money will follow.
Doctors are perfectly free to invest their money anywhere they hope to make a profit just like you and me. Don't forget they have to provide for their families when they treat such things as Ebola.
Now think about this which would you rather see. your grandmother running down the hallways of a nursing home stark naked pooping as she goes screaming at the top of her lungs lashing out at anyone she comes into contact with or dozing in her chair fully clothed in her own clothes suitably sedated.
Not a hard question to answer is it.

Of course there is abuse of the elderly (and the young and middle aged) and at times it does involve the use of unsuitable medications

I would usually give it about 10 minutes and try again. That worked about 80 % of the time as long as i didn't argue at the firsf refusal.

Yes but many dementia patients are given antipsychotic drugs which can cause premature death . They act like a chemical labotomy. Not nice for a frail old person. Infact I think it is cruel . These drugs can cause incontinence and hallucinations plus tardive dyskinesia (look it up) Many doctors and especially psychiatrists have shares in drug companies. Old people cannot tolerate such harsh drugs It is unfair and things need to change. Our elders deserve more respect.

Truffles - What is too many pills? My mom is on a number of meds prescribed for specific conditions - all life threatening if untreated. They aren't candy she picked up at the corner store she should cut back on because of cavities.

She is not competent to make decisions about her own care anymore. That ship sailed a long time ago. If it were up to her, she'd be sitting in her own waste, filthy, dirty, and malnourished, yelling at hallucinations.

People with early dementia can help make decisions, but eventually - and sooner than later with some - that is just not appropriate, possible, or adviseable.

The doctor & I talked and decided the side effect risks were less than the consequences of NOT taking meds.

My mom thinks she's taking vitamins. She won't take drugs, but the facility can get her to take vitamins. Whatever works today.

If my mom doesn't get her Risperdol and Prozac, she turns into a mean, fighting, biting, spitting and hitting maniac. The blood pressure, blood sugar, cholesterol, constipation, and whatever else are second in priority to the mental health pills.

Oddly enough, she would never have been caught with a vitamin pre-dementia.

I know how you feel about medicines. My husband would never ever take a single pill if I didn't urge him to. It is very hard giving out meds three times a day, with quite a few pills each time. But they do help. It just makes it hard on me feeling like The Big Bad Wolf.......marymember

My husband went thru that, their are times they think different things. Try and put in her ice cream, putting it in anything she may like to eat or drink. It isn't easy. A different person may help also.

My mom has dementia and ALS. We have a 'care package' of liquid medications to administer as needed. She also has a few medications in lotion form (halperidol, diazepam, & lorazepam.) Plus, she has a pain patch (change every 3 days) and Exelon patch changed daily. The high blood pressure pill and glipizide are only in pill form. I just leave on the table next to her plate of food for her to take. I never even announce there next to her plate of food. When I come back, mostly the little cup is empty & all pills are gone. Btw, I've tried to scare her into taking them and it doesn't work. She just digs her heels in more.

It seems to me that the question is not why, but how to get him to take the meds. Mom's NH crushes them and sprinkles them on the food. There are liquid versions and patches to try. We don't need to know why. Why is b/c they have AD.

Has anyone thought that maybe he is feeling side effects from these pills and has made his own decision that he doesnt want to take them ? Many psychotropic drugs have horrendous side effects yet they are being forced upon elderly people like candy. I do not agree with it at all. The effects of these harsh drugs can be fatal in the elderly. It is time people diagnosed with dementia and mental illness had more of a say in their own care . Some of these drugs create symptoms worse than the initial complaint !! Elderly people deserve more respect than this . Most are given far too many pills !

My Dad will REFUSE if pills are crushed in anything. He still has enough working in his brain that he wants to SEE the pills and count them and remembers how many he supposed to have. He knows nothing else about them anymore. I guess it's the mathematician in him! Anyhow, even while at home, he would insist he had already taken them. We used to dish meds into one of those weekly containers, because when doing for self, he could no longer remember if he did or didn't take them. Then, even using the container, he would just dump out a cubicle and not pay attention to the day, so I started phoning him to 'visit' and in that process would ask if he'd taken his meds. Frequently he would say yes, and I would ask him just to check the day and tell me if 'Mondays were still there' for ex. With Mom's help, we knew if he had or had not. Sometimes, that would be enough for him to agree to take them. Sometimes he would argue and not want to. I would just keep 'visiting' and then ask all over again. Most of the time with some redirection and coming back to the pills again, he would easily take them....already not remembering the previous discussion. At his facility, on a refusal, they simply say OK...and go to the next person or two and then come back. Occasionally, if he still doesn't want to take them, they tell him, or Mom will tell him, that the doctor ordered them to 'help his brain work better'.....for him....that phrase...'to make your brain work better' is entrenched into him....and he will agree to most anything! He was so upset about having dementia when first diagnosed....and really really worked to do all he could to keep his brain functioning as well as possible....that it still clicks with him that he wants to cooperate with this! Try the diversion and walk away and then reapproach about taking meds again....and see if that works first.

I used to just put the pill on a plastic baggie and take a hammer and smash it.

It helped with two problems: Got the pill into her and two, the smashing of the pill helped with my stress levels :)

Seriously, just crush the pill and put it in her food. She won't even know because I'm betting her taste is also gone.

yes daughter, that's what I agreed with, the essential comfort meds, anti anxiety, sleeping pills, are a must, I have stopped his Statin, Pradaxa (internal bleeding is much worse the small chance of a stroke) I did keep up the Exelon Patch & Namenda, but they could really go soon also. the patches really irritate my husbands skin, and I know how to move them daily, still irritates him.

Reminds me of the time my FIL wouldn't take his meds. The nursing home called and said had them in his clenched fist and they couldn't walk away from him. I shot down there with my 6 year old daughter. We walked in his room and she went to him and sweetly said, "Pa, you need to take your medicine." He said OK and popped them in his mouth. You never know why, you just have to be patient and creative. Crush them with pudding or apple sauce. Some meds make their stomach hurt and need to be taken with food and a tums. Sometimes they are just being cranky. Sometimes they think you are poisoning them. This disease really sucks!

Twopupsmom, I think ferris1 is talking about blood pressure meds and/or statins, etc., NOT the comfort meds, such as antidepressants, anti-anxiety, bowel meds, sleep aids, etc. The blood pressure, cholesterol, and maintenance antibiotics are life-sustaining medications of a sort. Palliative care is most important in a terminal illness, especially with people over 90, in my humble opinion.

Mom went through this. Rather than refuse pills, she hid them. The solution was to get everything in crushable or liquid form and mix with something she likes.

Yes, definitely hide them in his food. They become like children and children don't like to take medicine so they can act up. So do what you would do for children. We did this for my mom - it always worked.

Then hide them in applesauce or yogurt. Maybe he has no gag reflex and it is difficult to swallow. Ask the doctor to check. Again, he has a terminal illness.

Ferris, "don't lose sleep over this", if my husband does not have his essential meds I would have the devil at my door, and what about night meds for sleeping, a little tough staying awake 24/7 waiting for the next shoe to drop. Romelie Get the meds into him someway, for your own sanity.

I run into this problem with my husband, its always I have never had to take a pill my entire life, I just don't get involved in his discussion, and he will finally take them. After discussion with Dr I was able to eliminate some meds (hes 83) which really helped, and if it becomes a real issue I only have him take the essential, calming pills. I have to keep an eye out as every once in awhile he pours the juice on the pills (in a shot glass.) Mashing up pills is really for those with swallowing problems, I think your situation is more like he feels he doesn't need them.