How do you place an alcoholic Dad with dementia in a care home if they want him to stop drinking and he won't?

If he's in a nursing home, where's he going to get alcohol?

I think Janny is wondering how to get her dad into a facility because he has dementia but he's also an active alcoholic.

Alcoholism is a topic that's been covered here many times and there are many people here who have dealt with this situation to some degree or another. I'm sure you'll get many thoughtful and helpful responses.

Your dad has 2 hurdles to overcome. The first being giving up drinking. It's not as easy as it sounds and your dad will need medical supervision if he does quit. The second is getting him into a skilled care facility. Call me a cynic but I don't see anyone at the age of 85 and who's an alcoholic giving up the drinking so they can move into a nursing home.

You may just have to wait this one out and know that at some point you will get a call from someone telling you that your dad fell or has had a stroke. Once in the hospital he can dry out and be transferred from the hospital to a facility.

Always remember that it's not within your power to get your dad to stop drinking. He won't stop unless he wants to and you can't make him want to. It's nothing personal, it's just the addiction. It's bigger than both of you.

Totallyu agree with irishlass! his addiction is not your problem! and something will happen or not maybe just let him at it i too cannot see him stopping drinking at this stage of his life? look after you and whatever happens will happen he may fall or have a stroke OR fall asleep and never wake up? we never know? but you try and let it go as it will make you ill! my mums not a drinker but has diabetes and dementia and refuses to help herself so ive had to let her at it as the stress she put me through last year caused me to have a mini-stroke but im fine now because ive let go and try not to let her get to me as i cant help her she has to help herself and at their age they just dont care anymore and want to live their lives as they please so maybe its better to let them?

Oh and hugs i know this is hard!

An alcoholic drinking lite beer? How much beer exactly are we talking about?

Dad drinks 6 to 12, 18 on a really bad day. I'd say average is 9. I was thinking the same thing about at hiscage he wont quit. He hopes to just fall asleep and not wake up. I have decided to move in with him and care for him as long as i can. He's not abusive really. I will just take it one day
at a time.

Good luck. Have you read all of the posts in here, about people that move in? Then, the parent runs their life and wants them to pay rent. I don't know of a single case where this (moving in) has worked out.

I am sorry to sound so negative.

Dementia and alcoholism affects the brain two fold in diminished capacity. Can you realistcally do 24/7 care of your father in the very near future? You will be facing memory issues, incontenence, personality changes and so much more. He is starting to show argumentative tendencies which will only increase. Your one day at a time could end up with one minute at a time.

Well if hes not abusive then its up to you but im sorry i dont know any dementia that there isnt abuse of some kind! But i understand you want to care for him and yes do it UNTIL you can thats all we can do! and good luck youve a big heart!

If he is able to function ,just leave him alone. He seems to be just living his final days doing what he he is content to do. Love him and help him when ever you can . He is still the dad you love.treat him with the respect that you have for him.

Has your Dad done anything that would point to him being a danger to himself like having accidents with cooking(fires) or history of falls? Is he unable to care for himself, dressing or proper bathing issues etc. Just being old and ? of dementia does not make him a candidate for placement in a nursing home. Nursing home are not the solution to aging. Most people stay home and die of natural causes.

If he is truly an alcoholic, he will not stop at this point. I work in an alcohol facility. It is not the number of beers you have in a day that classifies as an alcoholic. It sounds like he could be a little lonely and/or bored on his acreage. Love him as your Dad and visit frequently. Take him on little outings to see something beyond the farm. Things change drastically when you move in. Spend time with him and let him enjoy. Once you remove them from their "home", things decline rapidly. Best of Luck to you!

I agree with a lot of the answers. You can't stop an alcoholic if he doesnt want to stop and, at his advanced age, stopping would just bring his life in to focus..something he probably would not want nor enjoy. I had a similar experience with a best friend's father. He was also in his 80's, pretty sharp but he had a cancer growth on the side of his face that advanced to where he lost vision in his eye and the wound was really horrible. He chose not to go to the doctor and he chose to live alone at home and continue drinking. He finally fell or passed out on his kitchen floor and by the time someone found him, he was nearly dead.
He did die a week or so later but he went on his own terms. It is hard not to feel grief and guilt and loss at not being able to do what YOU want to do under the circumstances but sometimes we have to LET GO and Let God. Your father lived 80+ years on his terms and if he wants to drink until his death, that is really his decision. If you intrude on his decision and sober him up to let him live out his last days in a nursing home where most times he will be neglected and forgotten, is that really the better path?

You might want to try switching his beer to Bud Select 55 (2.4% alcohol) which has less alcohol than a regular light beer such as Bud Light (4.2% alcohol). Miller also has a similar lower alcohol beer.

Please read all the previous info posted in other areas about moving in with elderly parents. Sometimes it is better to care give from afar rather than give up your life for the next several years.

24/7 care will be an emotional roller coaster for you and as Dad's disease progresses; you will suffer physically as well. Think long and hard about this decision. It is wonderful to have a big heart and want to take care of our love ones; but the reality can be stunning. Good luck!

My mom fell into alcoholism later in life. Dad says she started drinking daily in her 50s due to stress and anxiety (this was after I was moved out - I did not know). For the last 2 years she basically took to her easy chair and drank wine all day from sun up to sun down. This started when she turned 70. Last summer she fell and broke some fingers and refused therapy so now she has a partially functioning hand. By around Memorial Day of this year she spent three days in bed and could not get up, walk or eat. Over her protests, my dad and I got her to the emergency room. Long story short, the hospital kept her for a week and then sent her to a nursing home for more help. Once she got into the medical system, no access to alcohol, she was able to get out of the fog and see the damage to her body, through the tests the doctors performed. She was able to come home around 4th of July and now goes back for outpatient therapy. Just my family's story, but getting her away from her home and into the medical system both removed her from the alcohol and scared the living crap out of her....she has begun to return to normal and proudly announced this weekend that she is 2 months clean. Oh, and my dad who WAS showing signs of dementia, quit drinking too. And guess what - no more signs of dementia. It was the alcohol. He has de-aged a decade since he quit drinking! Alcohol and elderly do not mix.

Giving up control over what and when I can eat or drink is one of my biggest fears regarding going to a nursing home. I don't drink alcohol, but I'm having a diet coke with my cereal this morning because I want the caffeine.

I'm just looking for an answer---can people who live in nursing homes not have alcohol? I would understand the nursing home not wanting clients to be drunk, but if he would switch to the beer with a lower alcohol content (and isn't there some kind of fake beer with no alcohol--I don't know) and maybe cut back on the amount he drank, could the nursing home compromise? If he wasn't so tired in the afternoon and he had other activities to do, would he drink less? If he is a true alcoholic (does that means he is physically unable to stop drinking because his body is so used to the alcohol?) is he willing to talk to his doctor about getting help?

I agree--moving in with your dad is a very drastic step and you need to think very carefully before you do this.

Good uplifting story, Upstream. Thank you!

I agree that if he's reasonably content and able to function I'd leave him alone. If he does need to go into a care facility they need to know about his alcohol use/abuse because quick withdrawal after a lifetime of drinking can have horrendous effects without treatment.

As people have already said, his alcohol use isn't your doing or your problem. It's complicated now by dementia, so you may eventually get drawn into getting him into care. You'll need to be completely honest about his addiction. I'd suggest Al-Anon for you because being with others can help you cope.

Good luck,
Carol

He needs to see a psychiatric doctor to prescribed medication . I have an elderly client in the same situation when she Frist came to my home she was very agitated because of the alcohol withdraws but the help of medication and patience caregiver and my experience in handling this type of clients , she made it. Of course it will take a while because the psychiatric will keep changing medication that will work .

I agree with the other posts in regards to the fact that drinking is his decision. I had to accept that with my mom - that she was making her own decisions and living the life she chose. I only intervened when I truly believed she would likely die within days or weeks if we did not get her to the emergency room. At that point it was the only prudent thing to do. My parents were drinking to the point of being a danger to themselves and others. This included driving :( Not good. Now that they quit drinking, they can begin living life again. Also, moving in with parent(s) is a huge decision! I live close by and did my overseeing from my own home, and just hoped for the best. I knew moving in would steal my life given the self destructive behavior that was going on.

My 80yr old mom is alcoholic. Her vice is vodka. I've lived with her 3 yrs now (I'm on SSD & can't afford to live alone in CA). Mom has had a couple falls & is just wasting away. It's sad & depressing but I live one day at a time. We've exhausted trying to sober her up. She's stubborn & doctors explain how her drinking & smoking are killing her but she doesn't care. It's difficult to witness but I do the best I can, ticking off the days until she does herself in then I hate to say it we will both be in a better place. As time passes she becomes more difficult, argumentative, nightly nightmares, she's lately become very critical moody and belligerent. Mom never swore but is more than making up for that now. I never want to be like her and would never put my son through this. Hate to admit it but I wish mom would pass on so I can have my life back. The brain is an intricate thing. The brain pickled by alcohol, peppered with aging can be a very dark and twisted thing.

my dad drank daily and the only problem for me was that he was constantly falling down and I couldn't get him up. last time he drank he fell, broke his foot and his wrist and hurt his back. now he is in an ALA and craving alcohol big time, but they limit it and because of his pain he is on narcotics which alcohol wouldn't have given him except he fell....

It's sad, isn't it? Mom drinks daily-one part orange soda two parts vodka. I take her to the liquor store every time she asks (thankfully she quit driving 3 yrs ago. She claimed people kept driving into her!) and she's going through a big bottle of cheap rot gut vodka weekly. When she fell & broke her arm then was hospitalized for 2weeks she was so out of it with bad DTs. She scares me since she smokes & could start a fire so easily. She can't cook for herself because she's started fires in the kitchen. I'm just so frustrated with her. She wants to die at home, I just don't want to go with her, you know? My dad died from alcoholism in 1993. Needless to say I don't drink alcohol.

It would be tough to get him to give it up at this point.

Does he have the funds to pay for an Assisted Living or Personal Care facility? They deal with alcoholic residents all the time. It depends a lot on how the resident behaves while drunk. If they just sit and watch TV or otherwise lie about, their addiction is more likely to be tolerated than if they get belligerent or stagger around the community. In those cases, they try to ration the amount of alcohol per day.

Some facilities have the residents family bring in non-alcoholic beer or wine. That works for those who are far enough along in their dementia to be unable to tell the difference.

I have a friend whose mother drank a large bottle of wine everyday, beginning in the morning. She rarely made it through dinner before passing out. Her kids had given up and the (very pricey) AL facility was willing to indulge her. The kids signed off on acknowledging that their mother's drinking would hasten her demise and be a fall risk.

I haven't heard of a skilled nursing facility being as OK with alcohol abuse, but my guess would be that the private pay facilities would be more likely to agree to put up with it.

Money buys privilege. Wealthier people 'like their cocktails' or are called 'heavy drinkers'. Middle class and poor folks are 'alcoholics'.

As others have adequately answered the alcohol thing, I am going to weigh in on the moving in thing. I am speaking as someone who has lived with my mother for two full years now… and just to give a little picture she has serious short tem memory issues, cannot coordinate bill paying or get groceries and such, is hysterical, physically and psychologically abusive, etc; and when social workers or police come over can sound together enough to be deemed competent. My decision was probably like yours, to try to do the best possible thing. Something to keep in mind is that as things progress there, he will become increasingly dependent, and if you think you would have to leave better have something thought out so it does not appear to be abandonment. Contact social workers for example, talk to counselors, etc, as time progresses, and keep good documentation. Think now and set trigger points for when it will be too much, and when those trigger points arrive take them seriously. Some of the things said here talk about having a parent run their lives or demand rent, but you don't have to cave into that. My mother shrieked at the top of her lungs once that I was trying to kill her so the neighbors called the police. As I was talking with them, I asked if she asked to have them kick me out would they, and they said no to us you have been living here and helping, so we would not act. She would have to get a lawyer and go through due process, which she can't really coordinate. So set those trigger points. Also take good care of yourself, try to keep nourishing your own life. Myself I jog 20 miles a week, do photography, etc. Where I live it is hideous in many ways, but since she is a person of faith I just tell myself I am helping her go through the labor pains of being born into the next life. Thank you for being compassionate, and remember to accept when and if it becomes too much and not blame youself, and have a plan in mind for what to do when and if that time comes.

I had a parent that was drunk for a majority of my life. I refused to move into her house to help her, but I did help because she broke her hip. At one point because she kept calling the fire department when she fell, I told her I was not going to help her anymore if she continued to drink, and she stopped

You can call Adult Protective Services and put in a concern without using your name. Basically you have to wait until he hits rock bottom even if that means he falls and hurts himself. Until that time live your own life because once the dementia starts it is going to be h*ll.

My suggestion is that he isn't aggressive, he isn't hurting anybody other than his own body with the booze. Leave him alone and let him live out the rest of his life the way he wants. If he does become ill or have an accident then deal with it when it happens, don't borrow trouble from tomorrow. Living one day at a time can be difficult, but we have to do that, especially with elderly. A wise person ones said "Yesterday is a memory - Tomorrow may never come - Today the present so accept it as a gift."

Don't place him in a care home. If he has a home of his own, bring in a nurse and assistants to care for him and monitor his drinking habits. He will be happier at home with professional care. We brought in a nurse and some assistants to take care of my mother and she was happy because she did not have to go into a care home

The Doc and the facility need to know about Dad's drinking.
If you see Some lite beer, there might be more.

IF he has to curtail all use because of moving to a facility, he could potentially have some withdrawal.
SOME facilities [not most], actually allow residents to have small cans of beer for occasional use--medicinally, and it's listed in their chart; a few cans are kept on hand, and locked up in the nursing station, just like meds, they are accounted for.

IF he becomes more angry or combative, if taken off his beer completely, that's a problem. His Doc and the Staff at the facility must know of his habit, in order to best manage it.

YOUR part, is to make sure they know of it, and of his behaviors with it and without it.

My siblings obstructed, as Mom did, letting her Doc about her alcohol and behavior issues----which means more trouble if she's ever totally deprived of her booze,
....and Staff will have a harder time dealing with her psych.behaviors, because she and other family have blocked her getting diagnosed and treated appropriately.
She's hoping she'll die before having to go to a facility----she knows what those are like, and revolts against that idea entirely. Family is co-dependent and if there's such a thing, co-mental-facilitating.
All that does NOT make for any sort of easy ride--particularly if she must be placed in a facility.

You can write a one-page letter to enter into her medical files, about Dad's drinking habits and behaviors. That way, it's on paper, Docs and staff can read it. You might need to make a new letter for a facility file.

Docs can prescribe meds that can help him transition to non-drinking, or, if the facility allows, can write an order for him to be allowed one beer per evening, as long as that doesn't make a problem for his other meds.
There's meds for helping him keep calmer, to prevent his escalating behaviors, too--only if needed.