How do I make sure mother bathes COMPLETELY?
Mother has a myriad of health issues, mobility (or the lack thereof) being topmost.
She lives with YB, he chose this path and we other sibs jump in where we can and help. Still, 80% of her care falls to him.
I have been driving her to her beloved BINGO days at the Sr Center which is literally less than 5 minutes from her house. Just from 10 minutes in my car, her body odor is so profound and nasty I have to air out my car and practically saturate the seats with Febreze. Still, the odor lingers. (It comes primarily from her 'strap on' catheter bag which she is too cheap to replace.) She cannot clean them appropriately and so they always have a few ounces of old urine in them. Her apartment smells so bad if I go to visit her I won't sit in the apt for more than a few minutes. The smell is in deeply imbedded in everything.
OK--I can live with that--and her lies that she is showering 4 times a week when I know she hasn't showered in a month or more. (She refuses aides).
The other day she said she's had such a nice hot shower that morning..and so I went into the bathroom and there was a stone dry shower and towels. When you have COBWEBS in the shower, you know it's not being used.
This week is my niece's wedding. It will take place in a very small room--and mom's overhwhelming smell is GOING to be noticed. After the ceremony there is a family dinner, also in a smallish-room.
I'm not wanting to offend her in any way--but her smell is so bad---old urine, primarily. I KNOW she's not washing her privates,, she can't reach. Sometimes she has bowel incontinence and the depends just doesn't contain the smell.
What to do? Brother has 'spit bathed' her many times, but never done an 'undercarriage' wash, to my knowledge.
I do not see myself doing this--or even approaching her about it--but I think of my darling niece and I KNOW the smell will be very powerful and I do not want this long awaited wedding to be ruined b/c mom can't/won't wash.
Luckily she has a new dress to wear, so the smell has not permeated that.
She's nose-blind and so she cannot smell herself.
This is the first time in 2 years she has gone 'out' into the world and she is so excited. I am pre-embarassed for her.
I'm going to take her to a beauty shop on Tues to get a 'woman's haircut', YB has been taking her to a barber shop and her haircuts are awful. That I can do---this other...IDK.
Help! It may seem silly, but very likely the last time she'll see all the family in her life and I don't want it to be remembered that she smelled awful.
I wonder if you could find a SPA of some sort? YMCAs around here sometimes have special days, SilverFoxes, that kind of thing?
I’m sitting here thinking about how nice it would be to have a simple reasonably priced place with some elegant (but low priced) touches, where our elderly could be both pampered AND also cared for in terms of bathing needs.
Could you possibly sell her on the idea of someone coming in especially for the BIG DAY to help her bathe, dress, do her makeup …? Someone beautifully dressed herself, savvy to the needs of the elderly, who could encourage a lovely steamy shower…..
Wish I could come up with something better, hope YOU are feeling top notch, and hope the wedding is a lovely, special, perfect day for all involved.
Probably it will all fall on my sisters and myself.
I think I will hand it off to my OS, who cannot be offended and can just get down and do what needs doing.
Bride/niece? One of your daughters? Anyone?
Someone needs to draw a line in the sand and tell mom she can't come to the wedding unless she bathes completely and has a new cath bag. That should be the bare minimum in terms of hygiene for coming into a crowded venue.
I agree that a lovely "spa day" would be a great idea. Just don't know if you have something like that near you.
Might the Adult Day Care director have some ideas?
My mother, too, wouldn't bathe properly, but I ended up doing it. You just get some gloves, close your eyes, and think of England. It made a world of difference.
If your mom isn't cognitively aware of her smell, it's a kindness to make her aware of it and fix the issue before she's embarrassed at the wedding.
You've left it a bit late, though. What day is the wedding..?
You might also find that her skin, as well as her clothing, is pretty saturated and one shower won't do the trick. Be prepared to fall back on a philosophical attitude.
I didn't 'leave it'---it didn't become an issue until Friday and I am a tad frantic.
If u can get her to shower use a shower chair with a handheld shower head. Rinse her down and then suds her up good. I had My Mom stand up facing the wall holding on to the bar, and wash her behind then spread her legs and use the shower head to get up there.
I actually get nauseated around people with bad BO problems.
I would tell her that she smells of old urine and BO and that she needs to let someone help her so she doesn't ruin her granddaughters big day. Make it about her loving her GD enough to suck it up and get this done. Tell her that you can see by the cobwebs that she is not taking care of this.
I would not take her anywhere without a bath, period, end of discussion mother. You WILL NOT do this to your granddaughter and while we are talking about it, I won't be giving you a ride to bingo anymore because you are ruining my car.
All of this can be handled gently with no upset but, no compromise, bath aid weekly or she doesn't get to be hauled around.
My dad had bad teeth and didn't do any oral hygiene. I hated having to be the one to tell him that he was gross. It hurt his feelings but, I told him that I couldn't stand being embarrassed for him and I saw that people would not talk with him because it was so terrible. Once he realized that it was effecting his quality of life, he started brushing 2x daily and ended up getting his teeth fixed.
Sometimes things need to be put bluntly because we love the person and we are willing to say the hard stuff that nobody want to address. She obviously has low self esteem to think her personal hygiene is okay! Someone needs to care enough to go toe to toe with her about this.
Unless it is not at her place that new dress probably smells to since the odors latch onto everything. I had totes with clothes and blankets prior to a move and there was a leak under the house that the landlord refused to fix so there was a constant odor of must and mildew and mold in the air when we got to our new place sure enough everything in those totes smelled like that house even though things were washed and clean that were put in the totes.
She's doing the best she can--and COVID didn't help. She went NOWHERE for over a solid year, not even outside. I know it made her mentally very off.
THANKS to all of you for some great ideas. I need to either grow up or hand this off to sister.
The take away from this memory is that my grandmother got to come to my wedding. And I even remember the gown she wore & the color. Not that she smelled the place up or that she peed herself.
She passed away not long after that.
Hopefully, the take away from your niece's wedding will be that your mother was in attendance. And the entire family's take away is the same; that the woman was able to attend in SPITE of her ongoing health issues, catheter bag, and everything else she's dealing with, odors and all.
I know it's not pleasant to smell urine on another person, but sometimes it's impossible NOT to. This may be one of those situations. If it were me, I'd get over to your brother's house & get mom in to the shower for a nice long, leisurely wash on Wednesday, right before the wedding, so even if she does have a lingering odor, it won't be THAT strong. Don't give her any other option, if she wants to go to this wedding, it's into the shower she goes, with you helping her. How else can it get done if you don't do it yourself? You can't get her to a spa for obvious reasons, and she won't accept an outsider coming in, so you're IT. If you want to fix this situation, then put on a disposable mask covered with toothpaste (on the outside), another one over it, and get 'er done. That's an old trick from my DD the RN who's cleaned up way worse messes than this.
However this turns out with the bathing operation, I hope you all have a good time.
For the sake of your car seats, try placing a drycleaner's bag over the seat beforehand.
Perhaps mother's apartment is due for a 'blitz' where everybody chips in to clean every square inch (with mother otherwise distracted elsewhere), remove clutter (harbourers or odour also), replace fabric lounges with vinyl, carpet deep clean (or replace with washable surface) wash all bedding, etc. (possibly not the most appropriate timing, but a nice gesture if you could all manage it).
I wonder if some of it is an person’s individual body chemistry. Perfume smells differently on different people. Some people who smoke cigarettes don’t smell badly and other people reek of smoke and smell horribly.
I think covering car seats is an excellent idea!
Since mom likes bingo so much. I would let her do an all day or all night bingo and clean her house then.
I don’t know what’s up with opposing someone else coming in to clean but if she isn’t home, how would she know? Send the brother off on an all day adventure too. Let them think that the sisters cleaned alone.
I have a friend that NEVER cooks. She orders catered food and brings her own casserole dishes for them to use before hand. In the 30 years that she has been married. Her husband has no clue that she hates cooking! She says that what he doesn’t know won’t hurt him. Where there’s a will, there’s a way!
Your mom may be against it, but have you all considered hiring aids for her (using her funds). She needs an aide to come in a couple times a week, at least to get her get her undercarriage bathed and change out her catheter bag or properly clean it. When my father was on hospice it provided a bath aide which he initially hated, but later appreciated and he was so fond of the bath aid. It also sounds as if your mother's home could use a good cleaning and airing and the aides could also assist with those chores.
From your description, it also sounds as if your mother lives on her own, she might benefit from being in AL or LTC where she can get regular assistance with bathing, incontinence and catheter related assistance.
I hope your mother enjoys her outing.
Midkid has tried VALIENTLY for years to get her mother the care she needs (which her mom doesn't want) and has been blockaded, at times violently, by YB, who has issues.
Midkid has been through cancer and some other serious health and heart issues this year; her DH is also ill and HIS mom is the wicked witch of the west.
The fact that she is involved at all in this enterprise is surprising. The REST of the family should take care of this horrendous hygeine issue.
Has your niece been in contact with her grandmother? Is she aware of what is going on? Are they close?
I am like JoAnn, I will get nauseous around someone who smells really bad. I worked with a woman who smelled absolutely horrible and I felt like I was going to vomit every time I was near her. It was that bad. No one told her anything. How do you tell a coworker that they stink? LOL 😝
My grandmother was in good health until she died of natural causes. Her heart simply stopped beating one day. I was extremely close to my grandmother. She was so sweet, so kind and had a wonderful sense of humor! She was always very clean. I can’t imagine what this is like. I would hate to have to tell someone that they smell.
This is such an awkward situation. Best of luck finding what works best for everyone. I do feel that the bride and groom come first. Its their special wedding day that they will remember for the rest of their lives.
Mid, tell your sister that can handle the situation to take over. She will figure it out. You are kind by taking your mom to bingo, which you have said is just a short errand.
I know someone who has a son with severe autism. His mom has a tool that she uses to wipe him with after using the bathroom. Her son is in his 20’s and he lives with her. She claims that he can’t wipe himself. She does everything for him, brushing his teeth, bathing him, combs his hair, shaves his face, wipes his butt, basically anything he needs. He does feed himself.
Could you order one of the tools to help reach to wipe for your mom since she can’t reach areas on her body?
She has one of those 'long reach' wipers. Can't really make it work.
I'm concerned ONLY about the actual ceremony, honestly. The room is so small and we will be packed in there.
FWIW-both my grandmothers were impeccably groomed and smelled like I expect Heaven smells. Showers every single day. Clean clothes. And they both lived independently for over 90 years.
And to put to rest the concept of cleaning for mom---tried and tried and it's always been an epic fail. I've given up on that.
Thanks to all of you who weighed in. It has taken a lot of anxiety off my shoulders.
I'll figure something out.
It seems like her only joy is from attending her bingo games that you bring her to.
Best wishes.
Praying that you all have a wonderful time at the wedding.
You are a dang trooper, and an inspiration on this forum!
Took a deep breath and called YB yesterday and had a straightforward discussion with him.
End result ( and we'll see how this plays out) he is going to get mom in the shower on Wed night and make sure she scrubs EVERYWHERE. He also told me that he had let the cath bags replacment just 'go' b/c his own health is so poor. He is definitely a character--and HAS to be in charge. Yes, there are some mental health issues afoot, but I can't dx him and I sure as heck don't get why he's SO opposed to letting mother have help that is 'not him'.
He SAID he ordered 2 new bags and will be sure she's wearing a brand new one. And that she would have a 'double shower' meaning wash, rinse & repeat. He agreed that she is now incapable of doing for herself what needs doing. Whether that means we can now hire some help for her or not is going to be the next thing.
I am taking a bar of LUME soap up to her. I know I've mentioned this fabulous product before, but it really does keep odors 'down there' at bay for up tp 72 hrs.
I also talked to OS, & she will throw money at ANYTHING but won't go hands on, so she just said "so she stinks, big deal"...and I knew she didn't care.
I feel I have done everything I can and I just pray that YB follows through.
I appreciate the place to vent and get ideas. If we had a normal family, mom would have help and her apt and she wouldn't smell so awful. My other YB is a total Dr No Shot and will not step in for anything. YS will not be at the wedding, so she won't be aware of any drama.
Mom did refuse the hair stylist, so it is what it is. I won't fuss that.
Thanks for all your support.
Keep us posted!
That’s fantastic! Will say a prayer that it all works out. Hope that everyone has a fabulous time at your nieces wedding. I am one who cries at weddings!
I have never heard of LUME soap. It’s wonderful to see these tips. I am sure lots of people are placing this item on their shopping lists.
My mom and grandmother were meticulous about cleanliness. I know that is where I got my OCD from with hand washing!
My daughters made me giggle when they told me that they didn’t have any concerns about me washing my hands during COVID because I have always been a thorough hand washer.
Anyway, for those who missed your earlier posts on LUME like I did, please tell the forum where you purchase it. In a store, catalog, online?
Please give us an update on your beloved niece’s wedding. I am sure that she will be a beautiful bride. It doesn’t seem like either of my girls are in a rush to marry, which is fine with me. I just want them to be happy. The younger one is in a serious relationship. The older one isn’t interested in settling down with anyone at the moment.
I giggled when I read your statement about not having a “normal” family. Geeeeez, does anyone have that? LOL Every family has their issues. Hopefully, we grow and learn. At least, the family members who are interested in moving forward, right?
Wishing your family all the best. Take care, Mid. Always a joy to read your postings.
Will mother be bathed appropriately? Who knows? I can't worry about it and I won't.
To answer about YB's weird relationship with mother: she was a very hands off mother and was barely present for our lives--we kind of raised each other. YB felt esp ignored, and he was, so that is probably the core of his 'abusive/loving' care of mother. She drives him absolutely bonkers and when it came time to downsize her and daddy (daddy had Parkinsons) he built on to his home and took them in. The family vote was for them to live in an AL condo type facility, but YB talked them into moving in with him. It's a decision he has regretted everyday since.
People think he and his wife are angels. Truth is, they are kind of neglectful AND backdoor mean. Mom HATES SIL and SIL just ignores mom. YB is just checked out as far as mom's care the last 5+ years and does the minimum, but nothing more and WILL NOT allow outsiders in. Mom complains incessantly about both of them, but she never follows through with anything. I'm not going to the mat for her ever again as far as her needs not being met. Both YB and myself were seriously abused by an OB whom mother defends to this day. Not enough therapy in the world to make that be OK, but I'm functional now and not in a constant anxiety spiral. (OB died 10 years ago--no closure on that).
I HATE HATE HATE family drama, but it's there, isn't it? I feel like often I am the only one who 'cares' and I 'care' very little. TBH.
As far as this amazing deodorant--LUME is sold online, just google it and try out a couple of scents, or no scent. Comes in soap, deodorant and now freshening wipes. It's AMAZING stuff. For elders who simply cannot clean themselves everyday--it is a godsend. I do wish it were a spray also--but part of it being so natural means it probably will never be an aerosol. (Warning--the ads are a hoot, but maybe a bit much for older people.) I'm addicted to this stuff. While I still shower daily, I take a few meds that make my urine smell strongly and this stuff cuts down the smell like 90%. (I"m probably overly sensitive to smells). It's said to last 72 hrs--though I've never gone that long w/o washing.
I should get paid for the word of mouth advertising!
Off to the races--and thanks to all of you who weighed in on this weird dilemma. Once the wedding stuff settles down we ARE meeting as sibs. Mom cannot go on with the half-hearted care and she has money for aides. If she refuses them one more time, then I'm done.
The reception/dinner was at a venue about 45 minutes away---I left early b/c it's a notoriously bad stretch of freeway and brother left as late as possible so mom didn't have to stay 'up' any longer than necessary. They missed the ring/vow ceremony and were over an hour late to the dinner, but they made it. Mom was furious about the lateness, but there was a bad accident on the freeway and everything was shut down for 45 minutes.
As much as she wanted to be front and center at the ring ceremony, she missed it completely and, well, it is what it is. OS and I were 'singles' and sat together, which was nice b/c I never see her...the whole thing was lovely and LONG and we both commented that we were so glad we're both through with weddings for our own kids.
All in all--tho mom was very disappointed in the fact she missed a big part of the day-- she probably did as much as she possibly could. SIL said she complained the entire drive---so I was very glad I had not offered to take her. The room where the dinner was, was big and the doors were open---so my over concern was not a real worry. It could have been, but wasn't. YB said it did open his eyes to the fact her hygiene is failing and he might be amenable to some aides--we'll see.
Sigh of relief. And possibly a change in how YB lets others help. He is now on oxygen, post COVID and will be for life. His health is as bad or worse than mother's.
Thanks for the support! It was a small thing, but it's these small things that make us crazy in elder care, isn't it?!
You guys are great :)
And, good to hear that your brother might be amenable to some help!
I guess at one point, while stuck in traffic, she got so mad at him she reached over and slapped him, hard. SIL was irate..and with good cause. YB wasn't the reason they were so late--I am positive mother was dawdling around. It was what it was. Had she been ready on time they would have made the ceremony. She wasn't and they didn't. End of story.
I'll give it a couple weeks and in the meantime talk to mom about letting some help in. Brother is now on oxygen 24/7 due to being a covid long hauler and basically in really bad health, overall. Mom is just one more thing he has to do, but he doesn't HAVE to do it.
(As a funny side note: the YS who went in and did a little cleaning a month or so ago got ripped up for 'losing' something mother treasured. YS threw it out and was completely unapologetic about it--said "Mom, it was broken, it was garbage"...mom was furious, but YS just walked away from her.)
It was good for all us sibs to see her up close and personal at the same event and to be able to see her decline and make some plans. YB simply cannot care for her anymore, he can barely care for himself. I fully expect him to die before she does---and SIL will NOT allow mom to live with her if that happens.
If you do not shower you will not go to the wedding. No negotiations...
Before you take her anyplace call her in the morning and if it has been more than a day since the last shower TELL her that you will pick her up and if she has not showered she will stay home.
Contact the doctors office and get whatever supplies she needs to maintain a clean and SAFE catheter supplies. This can be paid for by her funds or charged to her insurance. (Or if the cost is not outrageous it can be a "gift" all the holidays buy new supplies rather than a card or flowers)
The other option to put forward is if she is not willing to comply you will bring in Aides and or begin looking for Assisted Living for her.
Now all of the above is based upon the idea that your mom does NOT have dementia. If she does ...all bets are off and she has lost the ability to choose to say no to a shower, clean clothes or other ADL's
Posted all this THEN I read the updates...glad it all went well...