My dad is 92 and it's time to make some hard decisions. I am his guardian but he refuses to move. His doctors say he is not safe in his house. His memory is getting worse and he has dementia. The best fix would be to move him out of his house and put him in assisted living or memory care (we're getting to that point). He really needs socialization and loves having coffee and chatting with seniors, like he does at the senior center several times a week. The house is depressing, it is dark, memories of his wife everywhere, and he constantly has his caregivers take him places (usually their entire shift) just to get out of there but he is refusing to move. I feel like I will be taking on too much by moving someone in to his house. I'm not sure I would trust someone and the cost would be horrendous. I am told I need to have grab bars and ramps installed too. I'm already trying to manage him (with the help of daily caregivers), his house maintenance and his 2 cars. I am at the point where I want to give up this guardianship and hand this off to someone else. I'm under a lot of pressure to 'do something'.

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Stop asking his permission just move him - use the theraputic fib that it is temporary until the ramp, grab bars etc are installed - if his dementia is deep enough he won't realize how long he is there - but fore armed with 'delay excuses' the electrician found bad wiring, a storm damaged the roof/sewer/driveway should he ask to go back

Stay his advocate because from how much you are worried about him then I think he will need you in his corner - good luck & I went through this with both of mine at same time so I can say this with experience behind me
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Reply to moecam
BlackHole Mar 16, 2019
I went through something similar with my mom. I hired people to stay from 7:00 a.m. until 8:00 to watch her for falls and make sure she took her meds on schedule and ate regular meals. I also came over every day to help with hygiene. She complained constantly about the caregivers, unhappy with having anyone else in her house and refusing over night assistance. I was paying over $6000 a month for help and she hated every minute of it. I finally got her admitted to an ALF and although she complained constantly for several months she eventually accepted the placement. She is slightly more content than she was before, I am saving her thousands of dollars a month and I no longer have to worry about her falling while at home alone. She will never be completely happy, but she has never been a happy person and it was the best solution for both of us.
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Reply to LaBlueEyes
Babs75 Mar 15, 2019
I'm going to talk to him tomorrow about stepping up to 8 hours per day. He has had a really bad day today and I've been 'on call' with the caregivers until they sort this out. The care service also sent out their nurse to check on his med management (which he will NOT change. He INSISTS on doing it himself). I'll be interested to hear how that went. Feel like we're always living on the edge here.
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I don’t have the answers, but just wanted to say I support you in whatever decisions you need to make. Your father is so fortunate to have such a caring daughter!
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Reply to Girlsaylor

Would it be possible to enlist the help of some of his Senior friends at the center to convince him moving might not be a bad idea? If some of them already live in Independent Living or an apartment, maybe they could talk it up to him.
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Reply to Ahmijoy

Folks on this site know your frustration. Moecams idea is most excellent!
But more importantly you know what the next step is (he needs to move to AL and house needs to be reset) and you’re frozen in taking that step. Your his guardian so legally, you have total ability to do whatever whether or not he makes a peep. Being named guardian is a huge, huge, deal, there are oodles on this site who are in the “just a DPOA” rut who can’t legally get crap done with beyond obstinate elder as they legally don’t have the power & authority of guardianship and don’t have the ..... ahem.... bigger personality with just a DPOA to make the elder move out and into a IL, AL or NH whatever’s.

To me there’s a bigger issue on “what to do” and it’s your inability to move forward, so what is it about the situation that needs to happen to get you to your (not your dads) tipping point?
I’m guessing that you still have not dealt your mom’s death. The house still is very much “mom & dads” house for you. She’s still there in your subconscious. What needs to happen to free yourself on this?

Your dad has come to terms with her death, it’s why he wants those paid caregivers to get him out & about. Your dad is a social creature, he goes out for coffee, has set regular conversations with others. Btw that in & of itself is beyond huge plus for his totally transitioning to AL or a NH, he’s likely to get a totally new lease on life once moved.

Perhaps your dad may well be not wanting to move cause he feels your not ready to move away from what the house represents to you. Again what needs to be your tipping point in moving on from the property?
I’d suggest you as a first step call it dads property and not mom & dads home / house.... it will over time create distancing of the emotional draw that it has for you, I’d also suggest you clear 1 room and totally reset it.... if there’s a extra bedroom start there and flat throw stuff out, load your car and take it all to a Goodwill and get rid of whatever draperies in that room as step 1. Load up your Spotify or iTunes or whatever to music motives you. Create a new space as that room is going to be your base & work space for the next 3-6 months as you find a place for him to move to and edit out & to relax in for both you & dad as you jettison stuff in the rest of the property. Good luck.

Also if mom’s clothing is still there, unless your mom had something truly unique about her wardrobe, bag it and take it enmasee to goodwill.
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Reply to igloo572
Babs75 Mar 17, 2019
She was not my mom. It was my dad's second wife. It was her house before they got married. I never liked her and I walked away from him for 30 years because of her. She hated us kids and did not want him to have anything to do with us. He used to have to sneak around to see us. A mean woman she was. I got pulled back in early 2015 when she was totally bedridden with Parkinson's and he was unable to drive so I had to start going there on Saturday's to get him out of the house while the caregiver was there. She passed away in late 2015. He has not dealt with her death even though he sees a geriatric psych every month. He has not allowed me to get rid of anything. Most of it has no meaning to me because it was hers when he moved in there back in 1985. Fast forward 4 years.................Still there every Saturday and now I'm legally responsible for him too.
If you hire someone off the don't know what you are getting. They can also claim to slip and fall, get injured in some other way in your home and SUE the estate. IF you keep the same person after a certain dollar amount (I think it's $2,000 a year), you are legally their employer and you MUST file their income taxes--it's called a nanny tax. Look it up. They can also sue you for unemployment if you decide to drop them. If you go by legitimate agency that is insured, they can't sue your estate but will claim the company's workman's compensation. A legitimate licensed and insured agency is the only safe way to go..but he has to be very well off. Further, they will take care of the tax end. However, a sitter (who does nothing but sit and watch) is $20 an hour; a hands-on assistant (helps with bathing, bathroom, feeding), costs about double that. Your only choices are spending down the money for his care or house until he has no more than $2,000 in his banking account (check with your state laws), put him on Medicaid and nursing home OR have him live with you. If he is dying you can put him on hospice. Do not use Granny Nannies because they are not insured..all they do is organize the employment. So someone sent to you by Granny Nannies claims to get hurt on his estate can sue your father.

Also noted a Certified Nursing Assistant or any sitter cannot legally dispense and administer medication of any kind, not even tylenol. That is practicing nursing without a license. Only a close family member can administer medications; or licensed practical nurse or registered nurse (working under a doctor) can do so.

GO SEE AN ELDERCARE ATTORNEY TO DISCUSS ESTATE PLANNING. Do it now. If he's still "with it" -- cognizant be sure to get a Power of Attorney.

A note about assisted living: If he is able to control his bowel and bladder, and do basic care like make his own meals, assisted living is ideal. Once they lose bowel and bladder control it's off to the nursing home.
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Reply to cetude
Isthisrealyreal Mar 16, 2019
You can set up all the coverage so you are protected, no need to use an agency to avoid that.

You can also use a payroll service and they provide all the coverage so the estate can not be sued.
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Not that it can't be true, but I have found medical field people at all levels might make a statement like he can't be home alone to cover themselves. They have no idea the impact on families and caregivers or the expense.

In-home care 24/7 is VERY expensive, and I can understand your concerns. Maybe the center where your dad goes provides other services, including social work, that could help sway dad as well. Or is that where the pressure is coming from?

good luck with it all...maybe it would be best to pass on the guardianship, if you're sure...
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Reply to gdaughter

Not an easy situation for you. I think you are right about memory care or an AL that has MC unit for future use. We moved MIL in with us and it's been a rollercoaster ride ever since. She did not want to leave her home of 92years (it was the house she was born in) her childhood memories and those of raising her own children too. We explained to her that HER house could no longer take care of her, that she was going to move here and that it's her home now too. Med dispensing was a tough fight. She would take pills from the wrong day, tell me she didn't need that one, she felt fine, etc., put containers where she couldn't reach it so I can make sure of correct times and doses. Just told her that I'm responsible for making sure she has her meds and that I was not going to get in trouble if she didn't take them correctly. The other thing that worked out to my advantage was I told her that if she didn't take them when she was suppose to, she would end up in the hospital again with another heart attack, more than happy to let me dispense them now. Don't know how much of a decline your father is in now but the sooner the better for AL. Daily interaction with others may help him. It will also give you peace of mind because he will have 24 hour care. The doc already gave you his opinion, did he also tell dad? I feel sorry that you are in this position, it's heartbreaking when loved ones are to a point in their lives that we need to make the best choices for them because they no longer can. May you find peace on your journey and may you come to the best solution for all of you.
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Reply to Takincare
JesusLove1976 Mar 16, 2019
That is sad to get in trouble with for a parent or elder not taking medicine when they choose not to. If you were able to prove she refuses meds, you ought to be let off the hook, because you are smaller than the elder, they will always see you as smaller instead of, hey, this one younger than me is my caregiver: As long as I am not abused, I should listen.
Now, If you refused to give meds, that is understandable to get in trouble, but so sorry for you in MIL doing this to you. Also, she putting it where you are having to getting it, when many people wish they can get their own medicine without help.
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My husband has Parkinson's and was constantly worried about taking his meds. He would take them all at one time, or forget a dose or two...a nightmare! I finally bought a battery operated device that I can program to dispense his pills (up to six doses a day, if needed) and it has a lock so he can't tamper with it. It was about $75-$80 on Amazon. Cheaply made, but if not abused it will last. I've had this one about 2 years and meds are no longer an issue. If I happen to be out of the house when a scheduled dose dispenses and he doesn't take it, at least I am aware of it, and no chance of overdosing. It has an alarm sound (not very loud) and a blinking light that stays on for 30 minutes. I have also set his cell phone alarm to ring 3 minutes after the pill box alarm goes off to help remind him to take his meds. This has helped him keep a small bit of independence. Prayers to you on your journey, and very sorry for your loss
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Reply to crzyhorseldy

Hi, LoneStarGuy. ALF = Assisted Living Facility.
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Reply to DesertGrl53

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