How do I enforce the no driving rule and the no guns rule?

Scared, you poor thing having to tell your husband he must give up two things he really loves. I'm sure it'll make him angry to hear these things but you have no choice because of the danger. The verbal assaults are going to come, for sure. Do you anticipate physical assaults as well? You may have to be prepared to call the police, as sad as it seems. My ex husband had a severe diabetic low and threatened me with bodily harm, he was a large man, I'm a small woman, so I went upstairs and called the police. They had to take him to the hospital for observation. It was scary and sad. I know you don't want it to come to that but realistically, it'll probably happen. Just be emotionally prepared.
Now about the guns, another subject your husband is not going to like or understand. Let me tell you about an event in my family. My relative had mental illness. His docs told his wife to remove all guns. She boo-hooed, dragged her feet, wrung her hands and never did it. An argument occurred and the worst of tragedies happened. She now visits two graves. Please don't let this happen to you. Can the doctor help you find a way to break the news to your husband? Do you have a supportive person who could be with you so you don't have to do it alone? I'm worried for you. Please, please take care. I'm saying a prayer for you.

These are probably two of the most difficult issues someone who's caregiving has to handle! Is there anyone else, family member, friend, adult children, a sibling, that your husband might be more likely to listen to about these two issues? Sometimes if it comes from someone outside the home....AND someone else takes the actual ACTION of removing guns and getting rid of a car....the "blame" can be shifted away from you. It could allow you to appear to "align" with your husband. "I'm sorry "husband". I know you're upset about this. I would be to when I really liked/valued something and all of a sudden I could no longer have it. But the doctor said...and so-and-so took them/it away. I know this is really hard on you and I can see how it would make you angry." It may be that the police could come in and remove the weapons at your request without your husband knowing you made the request????

While you are at the appointment when the doctor is going to tell him the rules, can you arrange to have someone remove the guns at that time? So when you come back they are gone?

I also like the idea of asking the police to remove them, if they can do that.

But here is my fundamental concern. You are afraid that he may harm you. You know you will get verbal abuse, but you are also worried about what he will do when no one is around to defend you. Caregivers put up with a lot, but should not risk their safety.

Once he even told you to leave if you wouldn't give the guns back. Well, it may come down to someone leaving. It may be that he is beyond the point where you can care for him alone in your home. Tell his doctor your fears -- all of them -- before this appointment.

We do a lot for love, and also in obligation. We should not have to put our safety and our lives at risk. That is going too far. You can love him in an appropriate long-term care facility.

Hugs and hugs to you - this is truly so difficult and scary. But, you have to protect yourself - you have been given very helpful advice in above posts. Taking away driving is one of the most difficult losses for a person - and when they have alz/dementia; they truly don't understand.

And the guns have to go. Is your husband on any kind of medication for agitation, etc.? Maybe talk to his doctor about this. We had extreme difficulty taking away my MIL car before she came to live with us. The verbal abuse, constant anger, etc. The doctor put it in writing to her and called her several times to reiterate. Also we asked him to notify the DMV and he agreed and did so. We disabled her car, took keys away - finally with help from neighbors, we succeeded, but hardest thing to accomplish. I consulted with the local elder affairs office and they said that if need be, a police office could be sent to the home to tell her about the driving. The counselor said they had to use this method many times.

Might be a good idea to call the local elder services in your town and ask them for advice - they deal with these things all the time. Thinking of you and keeping you in my prayers.....blessings and take care.

Thank you all for your comments, reassurance, concern and prayers. There is no telling what to expect, but if he does get physically abusive, I am out of here in a heartbeat. Unfortunately, I have no one who can help me do anything....there is no family anywhere near here, and his sons wouldn't help even if they were. They don't even call their Dad although I have told them what is going on. We don't have any real friends here, either, just some acquaintances who are all old. I fear I am going to have to rely on the police which is very, very embarrassing and just makes me feel like I'm in some alternate reality. I know my safety is important, and I have no intentions of taking any physical abuse should it come to that, but he has a very sharp tongue and has become very nasty as a result of this disease. Again, thank you. Hugs to all.

I agree that it might be helpful to see if your husband's doctor can prescribe any medication to help calm your husband. The anger, agitation, irritabilty, and NO filter on what they say is not unusual when someone has dementia, The part of the brain that provides a social filter is one part that is destroyed as part of the disease progression. If he refuses meds in pill form....try crushing them and concealing them in foods or drink....or sometimes you can get some anti-anxiety medications in a cream form that you just rub on the person's inner arms, legs and/or back. Make sure YOU wear surgical gloves, however, when applying it or you'll get the medication effects, too!

Interesting...never heard of an anti-anxiety cream. I have tried to make it clear to the doctor, neuro-psychologist and the OT-ist that my husband get very agitated and that I am very concerned about what is going to happen when they tell him he can't have the things he values so much. I think the OT-ist senses it because he gave her something of a hard time when she tried to talk to him about it before. I am hoping the team meets before his appointment so the doctor will know the latest.

My suggestion is to go to the woman's shelter place and ask their advice. Maybe they could shelter you during this difficult time and give you advice as to what to do next. But you must take care of yourself and society (the driving). I would even go to the police and ask their advice esp about the car and about the potential physical harm. If you don't have friends then the woman's shelter could be a good source for you.

jfryhospice is right about dementia often reducing the normal filters we expect of adults, and that is why we are so worried about your physical safety. Not only is someone with dementia likely to say awful things, but they can also do awful things, and they very often are not aware of their own strength. The lack of ability to link actions to consequences is a fearful factor here, too.

You say that if the abuse crosses into physical you will take action. My huge concern is that the very first time could be too late.

I know this is just repeating what we have all been saying. I am just very concerned about you. Please keep in touch and let us know how this is working out.

Thank you for your suggestion about the woman's shelter. This might be a viable choice. Thank you all for your concern about my safety. I couldn't do anything yesterday because I am so worried; I couldn't sleep last night because I am so worried. I have to try to find a way to cope. I know you all understand how hard this is. Thank you for caring.

Absolutely contact the women's domestic abuse shelter. They will most likely be very helpful in advising a plan of safety and/or escape and give you parameters to think in, so that you have concrete direction. You clearly love your husband and want to be supportive of him, but one of those ways is by being healthy and available for the long-term journey he is on. Keeping yourself safe and protected is a form of loving him. Praying for you and the wisdom and strength you need today.

I'm sorry for your situation. I don't have an answer for you, but I had the same situation with my dad. Three totalled cars and one demolished garage later (yes really) the state sent him a letter that he had to retest. I told him to go on his own and retest. Never happened. I prayed and prayed that no one, including dad would get hurt and no one did. I thank God for that.
The gun issue. I snuck one gun to a gunsmith who disabled the firing mechanism even when loaded. I snuck it back into the house. "Dad, you only need one gun handy - here - I cleaned this and loaded it for you - it's ready to rock! How about we lock up those other ones for safe-keeping?" I locked them up and later secretly disposed of them.
I'm so sorry about this.....

Many above have made some good suggestions. And it sounds like "Scared" you have your head in the right place...you won't put up with threats to your safety. Is there a possibility that the fact the info/orders are coming from the doctor will help calm his anger? I know there are many men out there, including my husband, that let what I say go in one ear and out the other, ignore what I say or get mad about it. But, if a friend or boss (male) says the same thing, he/they accept it. Does the Doctor know what you anticipate with your husband? I think the Doc could do a lot in calming the choppy waters. At least, it's a possibility. Good luck.

My dad went to the same doctor for 35 years. The minute he started telling him these things, things went sour. "He's gay! I think he wants to put a move on me!"..... Then he stopped going to him.
I hope this man is receptive to 'doctor's orders'

Driving-I had to have the doctor notify DMV that his license was suspended. He continued to drive so I had to impound the cars in his garage disabling them by removing the battery cables and placing locking clubs on them.
Guns- At the psycologists request I had the sheriff go to the house to get the guns out .
It is not fun yet necessary.

While we are dealing with other issues with my mother I spoke to my husband about your concerns as his is both an avid sporting gun enthusiast and really couldn't imagine not being able to drive his car/trucks/backhoe etc. His take on the matter is that both the car and the guns are basically a visual issue. If the car is still there but "for some reason" is not driveable (ignition/battery etc.) and similarly the bullets are not available or guns missing firing pins they are still there - he can see them - but they cannot harm you or anyone else. If you are not a mechanic or familiar with guns he would most likely believe that you are not capable of fixing either one. Just a thought which he said would not infuriate him should he be in the same position.

I agree with what many have said. You MUST be very cautious in the way you proceed with this. Remove yourself from the actual delivery of the news to your husband. A great suggestion, already made, is to have someone take the guns from your house while you are at the doctor's office (make sure they get every one). Then, simply tell your husband that the police took them. As for the driving, once again, DON'T BE THE MESSENGER. Have the doctor deliver the news and tell your husband that the doctor has reported the suspension of his license to the police. Your husband will likely pull out all the stops to manipulate and bully you, so you need to get in front of the situation with some pre-planned manipulation of your own. If you're going to continue to live with him, you have to protect yourself - not just from the possibility of violence, but your emotional well-being, too. Try not to engage in discussion or argument with him about it. There will be no logical reasoning anyway. Walk out of the room or even out of the house when he tries.

I don't know what the cream is called specifically, but we have patients on hospice who can get very agitated as a part of their dementia or when they're actively dying. They can't or won't take medication by mouth. There are a couple of different medications that come in cream form (in addition to pill form) used for the agitation /aggression. One medication is Ativan. The other one that is sometimes used is a combination of Ativan and Haldol in the cream. You might ask your doctor about this. Sorry I can't be anymore specific. I'm not a nurse or doctor. But this cream form of medication has been a lifesaver for many situations, so I wanted to at least mention it.

Without knowing/seeing the situation it is difficult to respond accurately; however if ones abilities are so compromised a sit down with your local sherriff or police chief (if they are accessible) or a representative (that gives a damn) might come up with some solutions.
& When does the DL expire.
IS the driving a concern it might harm others, isthere a danger of not reacting or getting lost.
can the firarms be altered so as to be rendered harmless?

Hello Scared, I am also concerned for your safety. When we reported my Mother to the DMV we blamed the doctor. Maybe not the most honest response but at least then my Moms anger was directed at the doctor and not her children who actually did the reporting. She forgets on a regular basis that she cannot drive so there are times when I hide the keys. It is heartbreaking but we need to protect society from elderly drivers. I do not know why this does not get more attention when I always see in the paper confused drivers going into buildings, running over people ect... We have to wait until 16 for drivers licenses, we should be retested at 70 for heavens sake. Scared - do the best you can and when it is time for you to leave for your safety or place him in a facility for his safety do so. Please continue to let us know how it is going. Many hugs and prayer to you.

Your safety is #1. As for the driving (I was a professional truckdriver so I do understand how hard it would be to give up driving) If after his Lisc is suspended- and if he gets the keys(my dad had a set we didn't know about) and goes driving call the police asap, that's what my Nephew(who is a PO) said to do- we did and they stopped Dad and drove him home- never did it again, but his anger lasted for months. His thinking was that "he knows his capabilities" better than anyone and he's the one who decides when to stop. It's everyone else's fault if there is an accident as they were on phone, or some other thing.I as a professional told him that driving is "a privledge and not a god given right). He also failed 2 driver evaluations in 2yrs(dr ordered) fought the state when they suspended his privledges and cost himself about $2000 in legal and testing fee's.
Why not call his sons and see if they can help with the guns-
Please be careful and stay safe.

There is absolutely no reason for you to feel embarrassed for calling the police for any reason. I'm sure they would rather have you call as a preventative measure instead of someone else reporting a tragic event with you as the victim. Until the police are called, they can't protect you. All events need to be documented by the authorities before they can act for your well being. He may need to be moved to a facility that cares for people with dementia. My mom wasn't physical yet, bet she was pretty vicious. A combination of Abilify and Zoloft have adjusted her behavior/mood pretty close to what it was prior to the onset. She is almost pleasant to be around. Please seek out professional counsel. We can give you ideas, but you need support locally. I am keeping you in my prayers.

My father has dementia and his doctor told him he could no longer drive.. I contacted the DMV and had them fax my dad's doctor a form to fill out... The form basiclly states he was no longer able / safe to drive.. The state then sent my dad a letter stating his liscense has been revoked and that he needed to come in and turn it in and have a photo ID made.... This makes the doctor the "bad guy" and not you...

I completely understand how difficult this is. I care for a husband, Steve Sr, with a heart condition who is an alcoholic. He did know that he shouldn't drive and most of the time did not want to drive, but after two or four beers he'd get in the car and drive down to the store for packs of cigarettes in the morning when I was asleep. We fought over it constantly. I'd try to limit beers, take away his keys and hide them, and he made my life a living hell moaning, griping, whining, and fighting with me over it. Heck, he fought with me about everything. After my last child hit 18 I began looking for a place of my own. We amicably separated with the understanding that I'd still be in charge of budgeting, shopping, and providing beers and smokes. I took the truck, I told Brian that I'd buy a car he could use but he said he didn't want one because of the cost of insurance and gas. Several months after I moved out we had a father's day BBQ for Steve; Steve Jr and his girlfriend came, we brought many gifts and we all cooked for him on the new grill I gave him. Steve Sr was drunk and passed out before the meal was served and that was the last straw for me. I told all the kids, we're done, we've seen this too many times, I will not waste anymore money on beer everyday for him. Brian pointed out that I had promised to, but he knew that I was right and he really was tired of a drunk father. Everyone agreed that it needed to be stopped, but no one wanted to be part of it. So I marched into the bedroom and told Steve. He acknowledged me in a drunken haze. I called him up the next day and reiterated. He felt bad, said he was sorry, and said I was right.

The ONLY reason I could cut him off of his case of beer a day was because I DID NOT LIVE WITH HIM. I didn't have to listen to him complain, he could not fight with me. After a month dry, I let him have a six pack and chips/dip, makings for burgers, etc for a baseball game that my son and his gf were coming over to his house to spend the day with him for. And that's how it goes now. He gets one once in a while for special occasions. I wish I had had the courage to do this many many years earlier, but some men will make life hell when you do. Getting out was the best gift I ever gave myself.

Let the doctor tell him, let the police take the guns out, and go to a woman's shelter. Feel free to leave and have a life without stress and fear.

This is a hard one. But you have to be strong.It is not just his life that you have to protect. Think of the quilt that you will have if someone is hurt or dies if he is still allowed to drive or own guns. I know that this is a pat answer but you must help him understand it is an issue of safety. My family had the same problem. He had suffered from memory loss and was living in an assisted living home with at lot of freedom. My uncles would take his keys and sell his car but he would just go purchase a new car. The verbal lashing was horrible but it must be done. My prayers are with you and your dad.

The gun problem has a couple of options. One way is to render the guns inactive and the other to render the bullets inactive. This is a way to prevent arguements - and disasters.
With the guns you can take them to a gunsmith and have them reduce the firing pin so it will no longer allow a bullet to fire. This they can do and the gun looks intact.
With the bullets, take a quantyity to the gunsmith and have them pull the projectiles from the cartridge and remove the propellent (powder). Then boil the cartridges to render the primer (the little detonator in the center of the base of the cartridge) inactive. Replace the propellent with sand and put the bullet back. You may need a little dab of superglue but be sure it does not show.
Both these things are done with display items and they look like they are OK but are in fact useless.
Hope this helps. The car keys is another matter...
Good luck

You do not have a choice you need to remove yourself from the home and call social services and tell them what is going on and the police from a safe place-give the police and social services your son's phone number and street address and let them handle it-they are the professionals-let us know how it goes -many others are in the same situation.

Ask your parent's doctor to write a note/fill our form, for the driver licensing bureau for your parent to be tested immediately. When they fail, their license is taken. Call the licensing bureau and tell them your parent is no longer competent for driving and has Alzheimer's. For guns, just take them away. Call the police and ask them to take them. Call the registration organization...if there is one, and ask them to take them. Just get them out of the house. And get your parent off the road before tragedy strikes. It was really hard for my mom, she was driving and getting lost. Wasn't looking to the sides, and was not concentrating. She was still pretty high functioning, but it was clear it was not safe for her to be on the road, for herself, or others. My father sold her car. End of driving. So you have Power of Attorney yet? Most important to have this so you can take charge of these difficult issues.

Generally, I think it is best for the senior to reach his own decision regarding when not to drive. My father decided to stop driving on his own and I never "took the keys" or his license. He just stopped driving because other younger drivers began to scare him (in NJ drivers cut you off regularly and if you are a senior you fear you can't slam on the brakes fast enough to save yourself). At least that is why my father at about age 88 chose not to drive. He was a great driver and always drove over 100 miles a day round trip to and from work. He used to enjoy driving but with age some things have to stop. He was never angry about it because it was his decision. Next, if you don't allow him to drive, he needs someone to drive him so he doesn't miss driving. Being stuck in the house and no one available to take him out will certainly bring out a temper.

I never had a gun issue,my father opposed having guns in our home. He said if you need a gun to be safe at home you don't need the gun you need to move to a safer neighborhood. Thus I am out of ideas on prohibiting guns. If he isn't a hunter, perhaps just quietly move the guns to a son's home or something. You haven't sold them and he still owns them but he can't harm himself with them.

Good luck. But I think playing these changes off as small changes probably is the best way to go. Seniors are bound to get their back up if they feel they are being told what to do. Best if they think they have relinquished control not lost control of their life.

Elizabeth

I will keep these conversations in my head for a long time. I am a nurse and my gonna be 79 year old mom with advancing dementia has lived with my husband and myself for going on 3 years. The state took her license after she had to see a neurologist for dizzy spells. She understood the BIG SIGNS in the office that stated the physician was required by law to report it. But 6 years later she still blaims my sister that took her to the doctor's. Let law enforcement help. Disengage the car.Guns can inflict pain without being loaded. And remember that it's the disease talking, not him. Unless...... unless he's always been mean-spirited to you. If that is the case I fear for you. The anger can come from no where. and no reason. Our logic and their logic is not on in the same book, let alone same page. Has he ever hit you? Have you been scared of him, in the past?
If he's a danger to himself or to others you can have him IVCed. Involuntarily committed. to a hospital with a PSY unit. He could get a psy consult and let the professionals give you their opinion. I will remember you in my prayers.