My aunt's drivers licence was revoked by her doctor (Alzheimer's). She told me she continues to drive. If I am her agent, am I liable if she has an accident?
By agent do you mean her durable PoA? Legally, I don't know the answer but morally you would be if you were actually in a position to stop her (as opposed to she is in CA and you are in FL). If you are anywhere local to her you MUST physically remove her car so she cannot hurt people. My personal story is my uncle killed his own wife (my aunt) of 60+ years and injured 4 people in the other car when he went through a red light because no one had the courage or moral rectitude to just do the right (albeit difficult) thing because they didn't want to be the "bad guy" or get written out of the will.
Also, I don't think a doctor has any jurisdiction over "revoking" someone's license. It's different from state to state. Your aunt's state's DMV probably oversees that, so make sure her license is actually revoked, suspended, expired, etc. And just sneak the car away and sell it if you're her financial PoA. If you are not very local to her contact any of her neighbors or maybe even the police for help. Thank you in advance for doing this!
and also contact the local city hall for info on the local office on aging that would serve her. You can't take transportation away without offering a substitute if the illness is not advanced and she has some capabilities. She may be able to get regular transportation on request.
I'm not an attorney, but I can relay this: Husb/wife reside together. Husb has dementia and refused to stop driving. Wife was advised that if he caused an accident and it can be proven that she knew about husb dementia, she could be sued for "allowing" him to drive. I think this is the question you're asking, but laws may vary and probably are not black and white. (Husb in this case does not drive anymore by the way. Wife could not accept chances of legal liability and could not live with someone else being harmed by spouse driving. )
When I personally was faced with this situation, it was an elderly lady who "refused" to stop driving. The thing was that she lacked the physical ability to even get TO the car - let alone get in it. It was a lot of grandstanding on elder's part and no real risk to her or to other drivers because it wasn't going to happen. However, had she truly had the ability to get to the car and drive it, I would have had to remove the car from her reach and park it elsewhere to avoid harm to her, other drivers, and any chance of legal liability to anyone. One more note: Hiding the keys frequently does not work as elder often has another set stashed somewhere.
I can see the wife being held responsible because she shares the same insurance company. So the company may not pay up so she has to pay out of pocket. But I don't see where a POA can be held responsible. Their responsibility is to the persons financials (making sure bills are paid) and medical going by what the principle wants. But, thats a good question.
Like said, a doctor does not revolk a licence what he does is contact DMV. With my grandson it took DMV 3 months to send a letter and ask that his licence be turned in. Did ur Aunt get a letter or the doctor just recommended it. What you can do is disable the car. Then tell her it needs to go to the shop. Store it someplace for the time being. Out of site, out of mind. If you can sell, it must be sold at Market Value if she ever needs Medicaid and placed in her acct.
Dear Shants, From what I've read, a doctor can't revoke someone's license himself but rather they can contact the DMV and let them know your aunt is unfit to drive due to Alzheimer's. In some states both the courts and the DMV are needed to revoke a license. Since laws do vary from state to state, it would be wise to find out the specific rules of your state (assuming she lives in your state - otherwise, you'd have to research the state she lives in). If she were to drive YOUR car, then yes you could be liable otherwise no, you are not responsible for another adult other than morally. Also, you might want to consider the issue of insurance. Most states require someone to have a valid driver's license in order to obtain insurance. Just with what has been mentioned, It sounds way too risky - why take the chance? When I took my mom's car key's away (and I forgot to mention I am her P.O.A.), I used a locking steering wheel device (she drove fast, got lost, ran a red light and got a couple speeding tickets and then was diagnosed with Alzheimer's). This was extremely hard for me to do as she loved driving her whole life. She was very upset and mad at me as well as my husband no matter how many reasons I gave but, I couldn't bear the thought of living with the guilt and trauma if she were to get in an accident injuring or killing herself, others or both. If she injured or killed others, I wouldn't want her to live with it either. So that being said, I asked for the keys, put the device on and locked it because I was never sure if she gave me ALL her keys since she kept spares. Then I would go to her house and do the driving and put it back on before I left. Eventually, I placed her in an assisted living facility and sold the car. The facility had a transportation bus if she wanted or needed to go somewhere (within a certain radius). You can go to the website: www.dementiacarecentral.com for some other information on dementia and driving issues. But, mostly you should try to do more research online as to when the law and liability come into play. Good luck!
When I had to renew my auto insurance policy, I told agent it was just me driving. That my husband was not allowed to drive due to A/D. But I was worried if he took keys out of my purse, and drove the car, had an accident, and if I didn't know he did that? The agent advised me to keep him on the policy, so in case he did drive and have an accident or damage other's property, that the policy would cover it. Particularly, I was concerned as one evening while I was in the bathroom, I came out and he wasnt in the house. I looked all over the house/sun room, shed, and found him in the car on the driver's side, trying to put the house key in the ignition, as he couldn't find his car keys. I told him it wouldn't work, but he said he was just going try; I took that key and wore it on my neck. Went to take a shower, got out, hubbie not in the house. He found another house key, in junk drawer, and had that going into the ignition. At that point, I took all house keys, car keys, shed keys, etc,,. and put them in the safe and each time I needed car keys, I had to open the safe. He didn't catch on that and I had no trouble after that. Hard to deal with.
It's amazing how in spite of the dementia they get so fixated and hold onto one idea. My mom is not wandering, at least not beyond the attraction of seeing a neighbor outside to chat with, but one worries...and if you try to get her back in the house...she is literally a snail, and an uncooperative one at that. We took to using the deadbolt lock. The front and side doors are feet apart and if she tries one door and it doesn't work, she'll go to the other, back and forth, not distressed, but forgetting she just tried the other. I have found her in search of dad's set of keys though, and one time she found them and was trying to get into the locked laundry room. It's tedious to keep things locked, but gets to the point of being the only answer as we try to keep our loved ones at home. I used a child safety lock on a bin in the fridge, rather than locking the whole fridge, but we're getting closer to having to lock her out of the kitchen or put one on the whole fridge...
By agent I assume you mean her health care agent or her POA? If you are paying bills for her car, her gas, and her insurance, knowingly allowing her to drive, that is an excellent question. She should at this point be reported to her insurance as having no license to drive and the keys should be removed by her agent I don't know if you could be adjudged as legally responsible, but it seems to me a possibility; and certainly you are morally liable at this point should she injure others. If you are an agent selling her car insurance, knowing she has no license to drive, I think any lawyer on earth would be thrilled to draw you into a massive liability suit for injury, possibly for lost of life.
I agree with poster Mysteryshopper on getting sued. Yes, if someone driving not licensed, or allowed to drive per letter to DMV, or demented person with license, the spouse or person living with A/D man/woman, can be sued. My husband was still driving, but I had to tell him where to turn, etc. He did pretty good. Then my brother told me if my husband and he were in an accident together, and his car or himself was injured, he'd sue ME for everything I had and more. After my 2 week visit with my brother, when I got home, I called the DMV to get my husband's license revoked, which they did. And he never drove again, but as I said earlier post, he did try to put house key in ignition so he could drive....
If you are her POA, find out her true driver status from dmv. Generally, dmv suspends, not the doctor. Most auto insurance will only cover licensed drivers. If she’s revoked, she may have no insurance if she wrecks. That’s a criminal offense to drive with no insurance and no license. All her assets, are then vulnerable and they won’t even pay for her attorneys. If she causes damages, injuries, or death, anyone who can be brought in as a liable party might be. I’d consult an attorney to see your duties and liabilities. There’s no upside for her to keep driving.
Insurance covers the car, not the driver. That's why you can let someone else use your car and still be covered in the event of an accident. That being said, if an unlicensed driver has an accident in an insured car, the insurance company CAN, in some instances, decide not to pay some/all of the damages. What they usually WILL do after an incident such as that is to cancel the policy on the car. I agree with CountryMouse. If it was the OP's car she was driving, then she would have financial responsibility should an accident occur. As POA, no, she is not financially responsible. If that were the case, no one would ever agree to ever take on POA responsibilities. To the OP: If you haven't already done so, have your aunt's doctor explain to her why she should not be driving. Or if there is someone else in the family to whom she defers authority, have them speak to her. (In some instances, for example, my mother will acquiesce to my husband rather than me, even though we are telling her the same thing). Or, as a last resort, maybe hiding the keys would work.
Your power of attorney (if that's what you mean) gives you the authority to act FOR your aunt. It in no sense gives you any authority OVER her. You do not by virtue of your POA have any more power to regulate her conduct than you do, say, her dress sense or her choice of meals.
What you might do as an informed, concerned and responsible citizen is a different question. If you know, because she has told you, that she is driving without a valid licence you can:
state forcefully to her that if she has no licence, she also has no insurance and she is driving illegally;
that being aware of the same you have no option but to bring it to the attention of the authorities, including law enforcement;
and that unless she gives you a credible undertaking that she will stop driving you will go right ahead and do that.
But first of all - research alternative transport and offer to set it up for her. She'll probably save money, all told, by the time you factor in running costs, fuel, insurance, parking, maintenance; and she should gain considerably in terms of convenience and peace of mind.
Where's she driving to? If she lives in a place where there is genuinely no alternative means of transport - no cab will go there, no bus within walking distance, no kindly neighbours or community minibuses or voluntary services - then perhaps this is also a good time to think seriously about her location and access to services in general.
And last question: what is she driving? If it has resale value, find out how much and get her to picture the cash. If it has sentimental value, is there a deserving young family member she might generously bestow it on?
To some degree I believe it varies by state and while I agree with others that the doctor can’t take your aunts license away that’s done by DMV we were to,d that’s actually where we as Mom’s family and POA can become liable. When a medical provider says and records “no driving” particularly due to ALZ “letting them drive” could come back to bite you. While it’s probably unlikely someone would put it together and come after you they could, at least in some states and more importantly if she were do go out driving, get lost, have an accident and hurt herself or someone else or worse and you knew she was driving it’s going to add an emotional burden that will be far worse that protecting yourself legally, at least it would for me. When my mom was released with “no driving” it was the one thing she couldn’t wait to do, even before moving back home but the “professionals” agreed she probably never would or should again, she still had a legal license and at one point my brother thought it was fine to let her drive while he was in the car or maybe just to the store, that’s when we were told that if she were to have an accident and hurt someone we could be held liable since we were enabling her to drive when the doctors had clearly said not to. The good news is wether probable or not explaining to her that we would be liable if she should have an accident whether or not it was her fault because she hadn’t been released from the “no driving” doctors order worked. She didn’t want to endanger us legally that way but she was also given the option of going through a special drivers test for patients who feel they are ok to drive with medical providers who don’t and she never opted to do that so we were lucky she was compliant. I do think that as long as you try everything you possibly can to prevent your aunt from driving you are better protected legally and emotionally though. Not that that is an easy task of course... Good luck.
I do not know about laws, but you have a moral obligation to report this to the driver's license bureau. You need to provide her rides/transportation needs. Driving is a privilege and not a right. Her license needs to be replaced with a permanent identification card. If she continues to drive and she kills or injures a child or herself...knowing her doctor revoked her license and you did nothing. I know I would not want that on my conscience.
Have you tried offering her rides? If she needs to go to the store, TAKE HER yourself. If she has Alzheimer's and continues to drive she may forget where she is and drive to another state or until she runs out of gas!
This is a very sticky legal situation. If she continues to do things her way, I would find ways to RELINQUISH POA because I would not want to be part of this potentially dangerous situation. Since states vary on how to resign POA, see an eldercare attorney. https://legalbeagle.com/7409714-resign-power-attorney.html
A doctor CAN say the patient is NOT MEDICALLY FIT to drive, and document it in her medical chart for legal purposes in the event she kills or injures herself or others. I do not even know if her doctor can report it to the state due to HIPAA laws; I suppose that depends on the state she lives in. I'm no lawyer what do I know.
She may need 24/7 supervision. So have her live with you, or assisted living facility which will provide transportation services. Or nursing home.
Once you offer her all her transport needs by taking her yourself, or whatever arrangement you do, if she refuses and continues to drive--I would report it to law enforcement. If she is unable to act rationally on her own, you have to make the decision for her. Isn't that what POA is all about?
Remember it just takes one accident she could be up for manslaughter charges, or she could permanently injure herself or get killed. Driving is dangerous even for young people.
If you cannot act on her behalf and safety, I suggest you resign from POA.
How about... disable the car for now until you can get to the DMV and get her licensed revoked? You can disable the car by taking the cables off the battery... or go further and take the battery out. BEFORE THAT, you can just hide the keys.... or get another key of some sort in the place of the car keys and when they go to "start the car".. that key won't work, of course and hopefully they won't figure out what you have done? Don't know where they are in their dementia. But... she should NOT be driving. Reporting it to the police? I did try that. They said they cannot do anything. Have to go to the DMV with a letter from the doctor stating that your aunt can no longer drive. They may have her come in and "take a driving test" to see if she can drive and then go from there or you can suggest to the DMV that she take a driver's test to prove herself capable of driving? And let them be "the bad guys" telling her she can no longer drive. This way, it was the doctor and the DMV who said she can no longer drive and this leaves YOU out of THAT! My heart goes out to you. I have worked in home health fro 25+ years taking care of mostly dementia patients. Had one man, he had undiagnosed dementia. I was supposed to be his passenger in his car but I refused. He ended up totaling his Cadillac out on the interstate, running into a car that was broken down. No one injured. He was 92 and he then turned around and bought another car. How he was able to do that after that, I have no idea. I wonder, can the insurance companies do anything other than refusing to give them car insurance? The man's grandson, POA. had refused to do anything so this is what happened.
You must stop her! Not just for her own sake but for others. How would she feel if she injured a child or worse. My dad drove way beyond his capabilities and was a danger on the road. He didn't think so but we knew so. Hope you get it sorted before it's too late.
I write this from the patients perspective. I was diagnosed with Early-onset ALZ four years ago. At the first appointment when I was given the results of my MRI and Neuropsych exam, I brought up the subject of driving. I have been a patient of my Neuro for 15 years and she did some testing and said, that at that point it was not necessary for me to stop driving, and at each follow up she told me she was still comfortable with me driving. I told her I'd watched both my Maternal Uncle who was a Priest die of ALZ 15 years ago, and my Stepfather also died of ALZ in 2015. Having watched their deaths, I remember them still driving when they didn't k,now who we were, where they were, and very disruptive in their behavior. In each case they were institutionalized by family, which they needed, and that put an end to the driving. Now for me, the first weekend in March I said to my DW, honey, here are the keys to the car, I'm not driving anymore. I have had no accident in the last 24 years except having been rear ended while stopped at a stop sign by an unlicensed and uninsured driven in the late 90's. When I called my Neuro and told her I decided to stop driving, she told me Ii was the first patient to hang up the keys without being told that they must stop driving in her 20 years as an MD. Yes, I've added to the burden on my DW and adult children looking for rides to do errands, but they don't mind. I'm still able to be conscious of not being a pest. I have not been able to get an appointment with the DMV to voluntarily surrender my license until late August due to Corona Virus . I have not had the slightest inclination to want to drive again, which I know at 61 years old is unusual, but the right thing to do. I encourage family members to bring up the driving issue with your Neuro at the time of diagnosis of their Dear Family Member and set the conversation about what is right for the patient and community at that time. I hope this is a helpful answer.
you have to disable the car. Tell her it is not running, actually she will tell you next time she tries to start it. move it to another location. Tell her it is in for repairs. then sell the car.
A person with Alzheimer's or any dementia will continue to follow the routine that they are used to. So having the doctor have the DMV revoke her license means nothing to her. She can be told over and over that she can not drive, that she does not have a license and she will "forget"
Do you have the legal authority to disable or remove her car and then sell it? Not sure what you mean by "Agent". If not at this point she can not sign documents making someone POA so Guardianship would be the next step. You or another member of the family would become her Guardian. Or that could be turned over to the court and a court appointed guardian. But at that point you would have so say in her care or where she lives.
I just want to add one more. Here in BC, Canada a doctor can write an order that a patient is not allowed to drive for a period of time after a medical event. When my late FIL had a seizure, his doctor wrote an order that he was not to drive until he was 6 months seizure free.
I don't know if you'd be liable or not. But, you don't want her to get in an accident and kill someone else.
My mom kept wanting to add me to the ownership of her car as a joint owner so that when she died, it would be mine. I didn't do that because I didn't want to be liable if she had an accident.
I was already her POA for both healthcare and financial. In March I had to take her car keys because she was still going to the store everyday and I didn't know what was going on with COVID-19. I probably could've waited a couple of months because it didn't really hit our area until May, but I had no way of knowing that.
Anyway, she hasn't driven at all since March, but she has no idea, which tells me not to give her keys back. She still talks as if she goes to the store each week. Also, she never knows where we are when I drive her anywhere. So, this weekend we are going to get her car. We just sold our second car to my step-daughter and we are going to take that money and buy Mom's car. I will do all the paperwork with the DMV through my POA and never tell her anything.
This will be the first time I have actually used my POA paper, so I guess I will find out how and if it works. If not, I will have to get her to sign.
Then, once the car is gone, we just hope that she doesn't call the police to report it stolen, because I know she won't remember that I have it. I will probably tell her I am putting new tires on it. Since she has no concept of time, that should work indefinitely.
I am an eldercare social worker in the community and have helped many families through this delicate situation. As people have already stated, legally you may or may not be held liable depending on where you live and your particular situation. It seems to me that this is more of an issue of moral responsibility. I could not, in good conscience, let my parent drive unsafe and be a hazard on the road to themselves and others simply because they insist on driving or because I don't want to deal with having a discussion about it with them. Hard decisions need to be made and tough discussions need to be had for their safety and for the safety of the public. In my area, a local hospital's physical and occupational therapy department has a driver's evaluation program that can be suggested and scheduled by a family member or "ordered" by the doctor. It takes into account a person's overall ability to drive, including their physical reaction time, cognitive ability, visual acuity, judgment, and safety awareness. It is performed in the person's own vehicle to get a true picture of their abilities. Your local Office on Aging or Dept. of Senior Services will have information if there is such a program in your area. Unfortunately, to my knowledge, it is not covered under any insurances. Another plan we have put in place occasionally (and this may not be the route for everyone but I have seen it work when all other avenues have been exhausted) is if an elder refuses to give up driving despite the doctor's recommendation, despite having had the discussion on how much money will be saved by not driving/selling the car and despite talking about the possibility of hurting another person, especially a child, then we have gone so far as to remove the spark plug (or other crucial car part) from the vehicle without telling them. If the elder then insists that it be fixed, the estimate is so high that it only make sense to get rid of the car. (Of course if you sell it, the money should be given back to that person). Then you need to make sure that alternate transportation arrangements have been made so that the elder is able to travel to where they need and want to go. Driving is such a bigger issue that it looks to be on the surface! Not only is the elder giving up their independence, they are also faced with the fact that they are aging and not who they used to be. It is very hard for previously independent people to rely on other people, essentially they feel they are making an announcement to the world that they are no longer able to care for themselves. This is an extremely hard conversation for family members to have with their aging loved one as well. There are care managers in your area that you can consult with and will help you through this situation. They can even act as the "bad guy" to preseve your relationship with your elderly loved one. There are also many, many articles on this subject and how to best handle it. It is definately not an easy situation. Good luck to those faced with it!
If her drivers license had been revoked and you are letting her have access to the car, if your not held liable, you should be! She had Alz! What if a child should run out in front of her and she killed said child? How would you feel then??either sell the car, telling her it's in the shop, take the keys or have a mechanic dismantle the car in such a way that it won't run. You are the one that is suppose to have it together. Get it together and most of all good luck! It won't be easy I'm sure.
Take the keys away asap! She is a danger to herself and others. If possible use Instacart or Shipt for groceries. Lyft is a good transportation if she can travel alone to the doctor or visit a friend. Her doctor has already made the decision for her not to be driving so there is no need for a senior driving evaluation.
Agreed regarding the senior driving eval. In our case, doctor said "your driving days are over" and also said not to even bother trying to take the senior driving test. He said "it's over." And he meant it. We didn't even have to ask. I applaud him. Of course, elder kept insisting that we had "set her up" ahead of time with the doctor, etc, etc, etc. We hadn't, but we probably could have. Her condition spoke for itself, quite frankly. Doc took one look at her, and KNEW what he was seeing. Even attempting the test would not have been safe by any means - she actually lacked the ability to get to the car independently and then to actually get in it. Saying she's a "fall risk" doesn't describe it nearly graphically enough. I hear some places use a simulator for the test, but even getting her to a location to do that would have been an all day project as she would have had to go by medical van. She still insisted on taking the test and was quite angry, but we never arranged it and she lacked the processing skills to even schedule the appt for the test. About a year ago, she casually mentioned she was looking into buying a Kia. Sure she is. After she gets back from her trip out west (also not going to happen).
I'd be careful taking legal advice from people who are not attorneys. Laws vary of course, but, if her insurance company refuses to engage on her behalf, because her license was revoked, then, that means she, you or whoever is sued, (anyone can sue anyone, there is no person who reviews the complaints prior to filing), will be responsible for their own defense. That means you pay your own lawyer and that's not cheap. So, even if it's determined that you aren't liable months down the road, you may have chalked up a big legal bill, that you likely won't be able to get reimbursement for.
As her "agent", you need to inform her car insurance *and* take the car away. You need to think about all the people she can injure or kill with that car because her brain is broken. You know her diagnosis. You know her doctor had her license revoked. Yet you allow her access to a car. If I were an attorney for someone she hit while driving without a license and uninsured, I would sue the both of you and see what a judge had to say. At the very least, you and your aunt will have to pay an attorney to defend her and try to get you removed from the lawsuit. That takes time and it costs money. Do you have the time? Do you have the money??
Best thing is to remove car. Even demented people have spare keys or can call auto service for help. Know some people just disable car, remove battery etc. However, out of sight out of mind. We used to tell my mother that car was being fixed. After awhile she forgot about it! It is dangerous for herself and others to allow her to drive.
Please consider. An unlicensed driver is most likely not covered by insurance. As POA you can remove the car. She can't drive it. Why give her access by keeping a car in her reach as well as keys? You're in charge. Do it for me and my relatives who might be killed or gravely injured. If she's not insured, she's responsible for injuries of others out of her pocket. So, the injured party can sue her and take her money. Then she's indigent and you'll feel guilty putting her in a facility paid by medicaid. Good luck you can do it.
Don't just take the car keys. When I had the DMV remove my father's license and later made my Mom stop driving it amazed me the number of sets of keys they had stashed though the house. I'm still finding them in her stuff. Like other's have said here, you can't play fair with this, other peoples lives on on the line. I found the doctor not to be the best ally in this. With both my parents he ask them if they thought they could drive safely. WTH. Nope I was the bad guy and wrote the DMV directly with my concerns and documentation. All they did was say that they had to come in and retake the written and driver's test. They couldn't pass either even if they had tried. It was a pain after they no longer could drive to have to drive them places but at least I know they and others were safe. Also I don't believe just because you are POA you would be legally liable if she has an accident. Now if you are legal owner or co owner of the vehicle and allowed her to drive it knowing she shouldn't then you are liable.
I removed the battery cables from Mother's car. She actually quit driving on her own for some reason -- maybe she almost had an accident and got scared, idk, but didn't want to chance her getting a wild hare and go cruising.
As PoA, you are your aunt's agent. You could disable the auto by removing a key component. She will not be able to obtain auto insurance. My mother always said "A car is a weapon" and although she may have been a little heavy handed with that comment, she was spot on!
Not heavy handed. A ton of steel hurtling down the street at a high rate of speed being driven by someone who can't remember what she did yesterday? It's a scary weapon.
Call the police. Let them see her doctor's order. They can come get her keys--- then have someone tow her car--- if she has the beginnings of Alzheimer's/dementia having it here is way too tempting. Now, you may have to wait til she is dead to sell it. OR-- you can tell her they will be locking her up in an assisted living if she does not give it up and sell it. I cannot believe how many of you all who do not read these stories and continually make me repeat myself--- that YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PLAY FAIR and it it comes to out and out lying to save a loved one's life-- why in God's Name can you not start using your heads ? Fight fire with fire ! If the devil wants to kill your loved one... and even kill someone else's loved ones--- it ain't rocket science !! Take the thing away. She prolly seriously does need to be in an assisted living facilty anyway if she justifies putting other folks in danger so she can preserve her comfort... my gosh.
OH one thing-- if you are her POA-- you will be liable and could stand to lose everything you have worked all your life for... if the right lawyer gets involved and they always do.
Do whatever you have to do....disable the vehicle, take her keys, have the police do it, whatever. My friend's daughter was hit by an elderly man who had no business driving due to cognitive decline and suffered permanent brain damage. Her life is permanently altered because his family couldn't take away his keys. When they picked up her car at the salvage yard, the man's son was heard saying, "Yeah, we figured he'd hit someone some day......"
That's one of my biggest fears. My in-laws aren't terrible drivers yet, but the time is coming soon. I am so sorry for the daughter. Brain damage is a huge fear as I've seen some pretty bad situations.
Also, I don't think a doctor has any jurisdiction over "revoking" someone's license. It's different from state to state. Your aunt's state's DMV probably oversees that, so make sure her license is actually revoked, suspended, expired, etc. And just sneak the car away and sell it if you're her financial PoA. If you are not very local to her contact any of her neighbors or maybe even the police for help. Thank you in advance for doing this!
When I personally was faced with this situation, it was an elderly lady who "refused" to stop driving. The thing was that she lacked the physical ability to even get TO the car - let alone get in it. It was a lot of grandstanding on elder's part and no real risk to her or to other drivers because it wasn't going to happen. However, had she truly had the ability to get to the car and drive it, I would have had to remove the car from her reach and park it elsewhere to avoid harm to her, other drivers, and any chance of legal liability to anyone. One more note: Hiding the keys frequently does not work as elder often has another set stashed somewhere.
Like said, a doctor does not revolk a licence what he does is contact DMV. With my grandson it took DMV 3 months to send a letter and ask that his licence be turned in. Did ur Aunt get a letter or the doctor just recommended it. What you can do is disable the car. Then tell her it needs to go to the shop. Store it someplace for the time being. Out of site, out of mind. If you can sell, it must be sold at Market Value if she ever needs Medicaid and placed in her acct.
From what I've read, a doctor can't revoke someone's license himself but rather they can contact the DMV and let them know your aunt is unfit to drive due to Alzheimer's. In some states both the courts and the DMV are needed to revoke a license.
Since laws do vary from state to state, it would be wise to find out the specific rules of your state (assuming she lives in your state - otherwise, you'd have to research the state she lives in).
If she were to drive YOUR car, then yes you could be liable otherwise no, you are not responsible for another adult other than morally.
Also, you might want to consider the issue of insurance. Most states require someone to have a valid driver's license in order to obtain insurance.
Just with what has been mentioned, It sounds way too risky - why take the chance?
When I took my mom's car key's away (and I forgot to mention I am her P.O.A.), I used a locking steering wheel device (she drove fast, got lost, ran a red light and got a couple speeding tickets and then was diagnosed with Alzheimer's). This was extremely hard for me to do as she loved driving her whole life. She was very upset and mad at me as well as my husband no matter how many reasons I gave but, I couldn't bear the thought of living with the guilt and trauma if she were to get in an accident injuring or killing herself, others or both. If she injured or killed others, I wouldn't want her to live with it either. So that being said, I asked for the keys, put the device on and locked it because I was never sure if she gave me ALL her keys since she kept spares. Then I would go to her house and do the driving and put it back on before I left. Eventually, I placed her in an assisted living facility and sold the car. The facility had a transportation bus if she wanted or needed to go somewhere (within a certain radius).
You can go to the website: www.dementiacarecentral.com for some other information on dementia and driving issues. But, mostly you should try to do more research online as to when the law and liability come into play. Good luck!
That being said, if an unlicensed driver has an accident in an insured car, the insurance company CAN, in some instances, decide not to pay some/all of the damages. What they usually WILL do after an incident such as that is to cancel the policy on the car.
I agree with CountryMouse. If it was the OP's car she was driving, then she would have financial responsibility should an accident occur. As POA, no, she is not financially responsible. If that were the case, no one would ever agree to ever take on POA responsibilities.
To the OP: If you haven't already done so, have your aunt's doctor explain to her why she should not be driving. Or if there is someone else in the family to whom she defers authority, have them speak to her. (In some instances, for example, my mother will acquiesce to my husband rather than me, even though we are telling her the same thing).
Or, as a last resort, maybe hiding the keys would work.
Your power of attorney (if that's what you mean) gives you the authority to act FOR your aunt. It in no sense gives you any authority OVER her. You do not by virtue of your POA have any more power to regulate her conduct than you do, say, her dress sense or her choice of meals.
What you might do as an informed, concerned and responsible citizen is a different question. If you know, because she has told you, that she is driving without a valid licence you can:
state forcefully to her that if she has no licence, she also has no insurance and she is driving illegally;
that being aware of the same you have no option but to bring it to the attention of the authorities, including law enforcement;
and that unless she gives you a credible undertaking that she will stop driving you will go right ahead and do that.
But first of all - research alternative transport and offer to set it up for her. She'll probably save money, all told, by the time you factor in running costs, fuel, insurance, parking, maintenance; and she should gain considerably in terms of convenience and peace of mind.
Where's she driving to? If she lives in a place where there is genuinely no alternative means of transport - no cab will go there, no bus within walking distance, no kindly neighbours or community minibuses or voluntary services - then perhaps this is also a good time to think seriously about her location and access to services in general.
And last question: what is she driving? If it has resale value, find out how much and get her to picture the cash. If it has sentimental value, is there a deserving young family member she might generously bestow it on?
Have you tried offering her rides? If she needs to go to the store, TAKE HER yourself. If she has Alzheimer's and continues to drive she may forget where she is and drive to another state or until she runs out of gas!
This is a very sticky legal situation. If she continues to do things her way, I would find ways to RELINQUISH POA because I would not want to be part of this potentially dangerous situation. Since states vary on how to resign POA, see an eldercare attorney.
https://legalbeagle.com/7409714-resign-power-attorney.html
A doctor CAN say the patient is NOT MEDICALLY FIT to drive, and document it in her medical chart for legal purposes in the event she kills or injures herself or others. I do not even know if her doctor can report it to the state due to HIPAA laws; I suppose that depends on the state she lives in. I'm no lawyer what do I know.
https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/dmv-hearing/medical-conditions/
She may need 24/7 supervision. So have her live with you, or assisted living facility which will provide transportation services. Or nursing home.
Once you offer her all her transport needs by taking her yourself, or whatever arrangement you do, if she refuses and continues to drive--I would report it to law enforcement. If she is unable to act rationally on her own, you have to make the decision for her. Isn't that what POA is all about?
Remember it just takes one accident she could be up for manslaughter charges, or she could permanently injure herself or get killed. Driving is dangerous even for young people.
If you cannot act on her behalf and safety, I suggest you resign from POA.
Having watched their deaths, I remember them still driving when they didn't k,now who we were, where they were, and very disruptive in their behavior. In each case they were institutionalized by family, which they needed, and that put an end to the driving.
Now for me, the first weekend in March I said to my DW, honey, here are the keys to the car, I'm not driving anymore. I have had no accident in the last 24 years except having been rear ended while stopped at a stop sign by an unlicensed and uninsured driven in the late 90's. When I called my Neuro and told her I decided to stop driving, she told me Ii was the first patient to hang up the keys without being told that they must stop driving in her 20 years as an MD. Yes, I've added to the burden on my DW and adult children looking for rides to do errands, but they don't mind. I'm still able to be conscious of not being a pest.
I have not been able to get an appointment with the DMV to voluntarily surrender my license until late August due to Corona Virus . I have not had the slightest inclination to want to drive again, which I know at 61 years old is unusual, but the right thing to do.
I encourage family members to bring up the driving issue with your Neuro at the time of diagnosis of their Dear Family Member and set the conversation about what is right for the patient and community at that time. I hope this is a helpful answer.
move it to another location. Tell her it is in for repairs.
then sell the car.
A person with Alzheimer's or any dementia will continue to follow the routine that they are used to. So having the doctor have the DMV revoke her license means nothing to her. She can be told over and over that she can not drive, that she does not have a license and she will "forget"
Do you have the legal authority to disable or remove her car and then sell it? Not sure what you mean by "Agent". If not at this point she can not sign documents making someone POA so Guardianship would be the next step. You or another member of the family would become her Guardian. Or that could be turned over to the court and a court appointed guardian. But at that point you would have so say in her care or where she lives.
I just want to add one more. Here in BC, Canada a doctor can write an order that a patient is not allowed to drive for a period of time after a medical event. When my late FIL had a seizure, his doctor wrote an order that he was not to drive until he was 6 months seizure free.
This can be done without having the DL revoked.
My Dad had a similar order after his stroke.
My mom kept wanting to add me to the ownership of her car as a joint owner so that when she died, it would be mine. I didn't do that because I didn't want to be liable if she had an accident.
I was already her POA for both healthcare and financial. In March I had to take her car keys because she was still going to the store everyday and I didn't know what was going on with COVID-19. I probably could've waited a couple of months because it didn't really hit our area until May, but I had no way of knowing that.
Anyway, she hasn't driven at all since March, but she has no idea, which tells me not to give her keys back. She still talks as if she goes to the store each week. Also, she never knows where we are when I drive her anywhere. So, this weekend we are going to get her car. We just sold our second car to my step-daughter and we are going to take that money and buy Mom's car. I will do all the paperwork with the DMV through my POA and never tell her anything.
This will be the first time I have actually used my POA paper, so I guess I will find out how and if it works. If not, I will have to get her to sign.
Then, once the car is gone, we just hope that she doesn't call the police to report it stolen, because I know she won't remember that I have it. I will probably tell her I am putting new tires on it. Since she has no concept of time, that should work indefinitely.
I hope this helps.