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He is in an Alzheimers unit of an assistated living home. his wife lives in an apt in the Assisted living and has the POA. However, Dad wants to move 4 hrs. away to be near me, his 50 yr old daughter. Does the the POA decision to have him in an Alzheimers unit override my Dads wishes?? He is lonely, she doesn't visit much says it makes her feel bad.?? He needs some loving family to visit and bring him home for visits, care rides, etc. He is at the point of refusing to eat or take meds he is so lonely and depressed.

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Who determines when a person is incompetent.
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He can have memory problems but not be incompetent. My advice is to have the DPOA changed to you and get him close to you. Dementia is a very lonely disease. I have had my mom living with me over 6 years and I cant express all the times she needed her hand held or her legs or forehead rubbed just to stop her crying or confusion. Lots of touching and music get us through it. Medically speaking its worth the move too. Whos the health care proxy? Good luck
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peaches1901 You did not mention if you are employed, if you have children and/or husband. Also what is the chance of your skyping with him? Would the AL work with you to set this up? I agree with those who said for you to consult with a geriatric physician. Each case of dementia is so unique. I could tell you my experiences but it may not come to fruition with yours. And I so relate with your sense of panic of finding a solution for him since he is not eating. I do know from experience that when this happens, the AL will give him nutritional drinks. Is he strong willed?

Be sure that if you move him, if that occurs,, that you are doing it for him for medical improvement and not for yourself. Dementia patients are foolers. They cleverly mask their condition. When loved ones only are able to visit every now and then, dementia folks can keep one from seeing how advanced the disease is.

Also remember that your father willfully chose his wife and willfully chose her to be his POA. If he is still competent, perhaps conversation among the three of you could help decide who best should handle the remaining decisions of their lives. I like Reverseroles comment about "she was forgetful but not stupid."

Keep in touch. Fear of change for all of us is so individualized and difficult. I'm so sorry you are going through this.
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I agree with the above comments, being incompetent depends of where his deficits lay. Speak with his physician and caregivers. Is he able to state his wants, likes and dislikes? Can he tell you what kind of medical care he would want, in a rational way that makes sense? Some people with mild impairment are not necessarily incompetent. A physician can write a capable/incapable statement, in order to be deemed incompetent two physicians must state the person is not capable of managing his affairs, then a Judge must make the determination if the person is incompetent or not. You can obtain more information at your local Area Agency on Aging or Department of Social Services/Department of Health and Human services, adult protection division. I'm guessing his wife is not your mother, how long ago did he sign the POA giving her power to manage his affairs? If he was compromised then the POA may not be valid. This would be a legal issue. I know it is difficult to see a loved one suffering, sad and depressed; don't give up hope. continue to be supportive and visit as often as you can.
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PStern, assuming that you have all records concerning your father's physical and mental health up until that last crisis, I shouldn't think you'll have much trouble rebutting the first impressions of a hard-pressed junior in some random ER. Or not unless he wrote his new will in the ambulance on his way there with you holding the pen in his hand! Not that I wish to be macabre, but after a few of the stories on the Forum I'm beginning to think that nothing will amaze me again...
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You wouldn't believe it but I have a brother who is trying to have our father declared incompetitant after his passing inorder to take back changes he made to his will. His biggest aid is the ER report from our father's final visit to the hospital, when after not taking his meds for 2 days they reported that he had advanced stage dementia, when in fact just prior to stopping his meds he was pretty good.
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many good answers here
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There are good days and bad days with dementia. My mother has been diagnosed with dementia, there are days we cannot discuss things with her financially and there are other days she is sharp as a tack. I have POA and working on getting guardianship. As long as I have her full attention, we discuss what she wants done, if I feel she is not, then I make decisions on her behalf or if it can wait until she is sharp again. I had it explained to me that a dementia brain in like having a computer that goes down. The wiring misfires and the brain does not function as it should, but when the misfiring is over, then you have clarity.
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My Dr said that when Mom started with her dementia that it didnt mean she couldnt make decisions. She was forgetful but not stupid.( I mean that nicely) and we had paperwork done with her decisions. You know, as his daughter, how he really is. Does he know things like who the president is, etc things like that. Good luck, I had tears reading this, poor guy, I hope you get his to eat again and near you.
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You do need to speak directly with his physicians. Mild dementia generally would not yet make one incompetent, and you want to be sure, that this POA and this unit he is in, isn't some kind of sneaky act on him. I take it that his wife is NOT your mother? And a person can have the POA but it's not active yet or only partially active. My Dad had diagnosed dementia for nearly 10 years before it started interfering with abilities to the point where a POA had to be put into place. And even then, to start with, I, as that POA, only handled the bills because he was forgetting. After 9 months he got worse and we did have to have him declared incompetent. I also have POA for my Mom who still lives home alone, but I pay bills and run other decisions past her...get her input because with her mild dementia she is still 'pretty OK'...just somewhat forgetful So is it possible that his wife, who finds it depressing in the memory care unit and does not visit him much, had anything to do with placing him there by giving out not quite accurate info? It may be possible to get someone admitted to Memory Care without a doctor seeing them and saying they are incompetent, but they would, for sure, be followed by a doctor after the admission. The best facilities, in my opinion, have geri-psych MDs and a psychiatrist who specializes in geriatric medicine or memory issues too. You need the doctor's input. And you need the wife's input...re: whether she is fully implementing the POA and why. IF he's not competent, then he cannot make a decision about moving, but if his wife agrees, then she can make the decision to move him near you. It appears that you are as far away as I am from my parents, and that does make it VERY difficult to be an involved daughter. I have all the phone numbers, including the home # of one of the LPNS at Dad's facility. I call, and write to him, and visit about twice a month. I am not happy totally with the set up because Mom goes to visit for about an hour/day and she does not know how to communicate with him. When I visit, he is so animated and enjoys discussing things from the past or telling stories. He is confused much of the time, but I just go along with his story and we have fun together. When mom visits alone, she will not eat with him there although he wants her to almost daily. On other days, he wants to 'take her out to dinner' but she's afraid to take him out to a restaurant alone. He wants her to stay longer and listen to him, but she doesn't know how to deal with him. So I feel bad that he is there, and I am actually considering hiring someone to go daily and just visit with him. I think you need to advocate for him, BUT you must know his current state of dementia and competency first.
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I would talk to his doctor before doing anything. I would make sure the doctor is a geriatric specialist and has done testing on your Dad. My dad has Alzheimer's but is not in the Memory care unit yet because he can still do all but one activities of daily living. The only thing they do for him is dispense his medicine. He can dress himself, toilet, eat, knows where the dining room is, etc. I do not plan on moving him until he is unable to do all those things. I do agree it is not good to move someone with Alzheimer's if they don't want to move, but if your Dad is telling you he wants to move closer to you I would take his wishes into consideration. If he actually talks to you about being unhappy there and wanting to be with you I don't think he is as far gone as the others are saying.
Good luck.
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My MIL goes from one obsession to another, very frustrating! They are not capable of making rational decisions so in my mind I feel they are not competent.If we could put my MIL in a nursing home I would. It is very difficult living with them and I think as hard as it is that is probably for the best. Good luck and God Bless.
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I think it's important to know what your dad's deficits are and which cognitive functions are impaired. When was he diagnosed? Look at these factors and the big picture of what is in his best interest. Families often are at odds with one another when they each feel they are doing their best for their loved one on their own. If you can try to work together as a team with your father's input to do what is in his best interest, a safe environment, and meets his wishes.
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Based on experiences with my 95-year-old mother and from observing others, I think it's not unusual for a dementia patient to obsess over something they want. Maybe it's a side effect of having lost control over so much of their life.

Whatever the cause, it isn’t going to help to give in to your father's demands. Even if you do, he's likely to come up with something else to obsess over.

Assuming the Alzheimer’s unit where he has been placed takes good care of residents, the most reasonable remedy is to help him settle where he is. He should accept the company and support of those around him. Do they have activities for the patients? If so, does he participate? Does he interact with staff and fellow residents?

If not, perhaps he would benefit from medication to calm his anxiety. The behavior you describe surely can't be pleasant for him. If he's moved, those agitated behaviors will go right along with him. Attention needs to be given to the quality of his life right where he is.

Good luck and God bless.
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Has he been legally deemed incompetent? If not, he can go where he wants. If he has mild dementia you say. He could not be eating because he is depressed not necessarily because he is in final stages of alzheimers, that is a long stretch from early to end imo. I would talk to mom and see what is what, she is the POA.
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Agree with PS that moving AD sufferers is almost always a lousy idea. I'd add, though, that if your father is still capable of expressing loneliness and depression, and if you're thinking with a straight face of visits and care rides, that doesn't seem to tie in with his failure to eat indicating he's reached the terminal stage - how far gone is he, would you say?

You can visit more.
You can encourage his wife to get over her squeamishness and visit him more (unless that gets a bad reaction from him, for example, which would make it unhelpful for him as well as miserable for her).
You can get to know the staff on the Alzheimers unit and share your worries with them.
You could see if there is an equally good ALF, with the same standard of Memory Care in it, near you that they could BOTH move to - but, seriously, what are the odds of the wife's agreeing to that? And you'd still have the hïatus problem with your father.

I further agree with PS that 'mild dementia' does not usually get people admitted to specialist Alzheimer's units. Has there been a bit of a gap between the psychiatrist's assessment that you're referring to and now?

To answer your question directly: "mild dementia" does not automatically equate to "incompetent", no. You may want to find out if your father's competence has been assessed or not. If it hasn't (I'd be surprised) it should be. If it has been assessed, and he hasn't been declared incompetent, then the POA is not in force. If it has been assessed, and he has been declared incompetent, then the POA is in force and yes, assuming it's the right kind of POA, his wife not only can but must decide - i.e. is responsible for deciding - on the best place for him to live.
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If he is not incompetent, he can rescind the POA and make you his POA. If however, his doctor says he is incompetent, his wife will continue with the POA guidelines. Ask her if she minds him moving? You never know unless you ask, and since she finds it too depressing to visit, she might welcome the change.
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He is in an Alzheimer unit with doctor recommendation, you don't just move someone in there. If he is not eating, he is in the final stages of Alzheimer's. Do not take him out of the unit, bad things will happen. Moving makes Alzheimer's worse. He may try to get out of a moving vehicle. He will certainly wander away from your house. His wife will be upset if he is moved. Have a long chat with his doctor and nurses. I know you want to fix the situation, but there is no fix for Alzheimer's. Make him comfortable, visit weekly, but do not attempt to move him, you will regret it horribly.
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