Can we assume care decisions for mom if dad is not capable of proper care?

Your profile states that your mom is 89. How old is your dad? I can’t imagine how well he is capable of keeping up with her care.

I don’t know how you could speed things up as far as placement goes. Maybe if you were to show him how he could relax if they were placed in an assisted living facility.

Would he be willing to take a tour of a few of them? Most will invite prospective residents to have lunch and get a feel for what it’s like to live there permanently.

Likely this will come to a head soon enough.
You have two ill people, one failing mentally and doing more than he can/should and the other failing mentally and therefore without a voice.

I believe, if your father will not listen, it may be time to call in intervention with APS so they can assess the situation. If father is competent and they find no extreme danger or deficits in the care, you will not be able, nor will THEY to intervene.

However, you do know that the call from a hospital will come, as one came to me.
You will then have to be ready to call in social workers as soon as you can.

Sorry this is happening.

Your Dad can't see what's happening to your Mom yet you believe he "just" has some mobility issues? I think he has more impairment going on than you realize.

Does your Mom have a PoA? If so this person needs to take action on her behalf now. It may mean she goes into facility care by herself until you can assess if your Dad can live alone (probably not). He will hopefully follow her more willingly.

How about asking their primary care doctor for a recommendation that they go to the appropriate care facilities? I can't imagine that their doctor would approve of this state of affairs. If you have MPOA, great. but even if you don't, you can write a letter to their doctor and make sure doctor gets it (either through patient portal online or delivered to their office). The doctor will not reply to you - they can't - rules - but it gets the matter on the table.

A doctor long ago told me to do this about a loved one, and it worked.

Also, visit some places and have them in mind when the time comes to make the decision. It can happen really fast.

Also, I think your dad has more than mobility issues. If he doesn't see her needs, he's possibly lost some executive function. Dementia patients are reluctant to let anyone see how they really are. They can fake it - for a while.

Reminds me somewhat of my parents. Dad was still sharp as a pencil, still could do the most complex physics problem, yet could not figure out how to make a cheese sandwich. He also couldn't use the washing machine [I blame Mom for that, it was HER territory along with all the other housewife duties].

When I mentioned moving to a lovely senior community, Mom refused, Dad said he could be packed by sundown. When I mentioned having caregivers come in to help, Mom refused, Dad was ready to hold the front door open for them.

I had to wait until there was a major medical emergency before anything like moving or caregivers could be used. Then and only then could I use my Power of Attorney. Mom, due to a major fall, had to be placed in a skilled nursing home. Dad was happy to have around the clock caregivers. I would have loved to have had both parents together, but medically it was too much of a challenge. Thank goodness they saved for a rainy day, as it was now pouring!!

I would emphasize to Dad how much easier their lives would be, without cooking, dishes, grocery shopping and house cleaning. Plus a Doctor handy in case they need one.

It would be like living in a hotel. An easier life with less responsibilities and work. Meals prepared, snacks available, and activities. They can participate or not.

Emphasize they would both be safe, fed and taken care of. You would come visit often, and not have to do more work besides your own household chores.

Remind him that he is not trained, or a medical professional, and neither are you. You could mention the longer he stalls, the price may go up?

If he doesn't listen, you will have to be blunt and tell him you simply CANNOT be at their house every day, all day. You have your own responsibilities. What if you get sick or have an accident, then what will they do?? Insist he give you an answer!

Otherwise get a letter to their doctors, to have them help with this.

Good Luck!

If you dad has POA, it is time to turn responsibilities over to you or whoever is next in line for POA. If no one else, quickly go to an attorney and set that up before any emergency happens. Have your dad checked by his doctor. It may be time to place both of your parents into a facility for better care.

I’ve read the other responses. I can only add what I did. Added caregiver support immediately. Some private and some agency. It takes a while to get a cohesive team. We’ve had failures and successes. It is challenging. Be persistent if you go this route. Don’t settle and listen to your gut if you get bad feelings about an agency or cg. It costs a lot but when you are dealing with two, so does placement. And the lack of control and having to deal with their home and all the financial issues. IIf one is pretty functional and just needs oversight and the other has more care needs, I suggest investigate a home care agency. Get whoever is worse on hospice asap for that support. It has worked for us, for now. I moved back, from 2 states away, 18 months ago, to manage things. Because, no one else. They are 94 and 90. I live close by but I am not there daily. For us, home care has worked so far. I never gave them a choice. I hired them and have managed the relationships. Spent their money. I never gave them any choice and they went along. I have told the more functional parent, if this doesn’t work, you are both going to a facility. I have never wavered or spared them the details of the cost. I know we are fortunate that they can afford this. It can work, in our experience. But it does cost. But putting them both in facilities does too. I use their savings to pay for the care. I have been very frank with them about money. I can never use my money because I have to pay for my care when I’m their age. That seems to register. When we hit a certain threshold, if they are still alive, we will need to conserve and that means placement. I have toured and investigated local options. You should too. It helps to know what’s there and options. SW, if you are on hospice is huge help and very reassuring if things get bad fast, they will get respite.

Ohscrap: Involve their PCP posthaste.

I am so sorry to hear of your mom and dad. My mom had Lewy body disease along with lung cancer.We tried at first to treat the cancer as she was only 69 and had a chance.The Lewy body stole her mind so bad that she could not even handle the drive to the doctor.My stepdad was in denial. I think it is natural but its not logical.I would try to get some help in the house to help dad also contact hospice for palliative care.They will help with showers diapers creams and will do assesments.
They can also help with nutrition they can send ensure if someone isnt eating.Now is the right time to make those decisions.They will resist at first but may accept it in time.In the future there will be piece of mind for you as hospice wil help you when placement is necessary.

I would lean heavily on their doctor to help evaluate their ability to live at home. If need be, ask the doctor for an evaluation by physical therapy of your dad's mobility and ability to do the tasks needed to care for mom. Also get an evaluation of mom by physical therapy of her mobility and the needs she has for her physical care. If the evaluations point out that each can not live home alone and/or that they can not care for each other without help - then they should be persuaded to move into either ALF or SNF. Ask their doctor(s) to evaluate for mental competency. If they are mentally competent, then they make their own decisions. If they are not competent, then there is a ranking system in every state/province that determines who can make decisions. Their doctor can tell you how the ranking system works for your situation.

Sounds like you need a medical / professional intervention ASAP. This is a very unsafe situation for both of your parents to be in.

"Forcing" care likely depends on two (at least) factors:
1) medical diagnosis that they are individually unable to care for themselves and each other. Or perhaps not be able to care for the other (ie., your dad may be deemed able to care for himself) - even if he isn't / is in denial.
2) Legal authority. Are you/a family member legally responsible for their welfare, i.e., POA, managing finances, etc.
- If not who is handling these things ?
- Do you / family have an attorney to speak to about setting up things as needed? If your dad is medically deemed 'fit' it may be up to him to arrange these legal matters. If he doesn't want to, you may not have any legal recourse - although do contact an attorney if you haven't already.

No, you SHOULD NOT be at their house every day. The more you 'help,' the more dependant they are on you - which translates into:

"I don't need any more help, yet.... I / we don't have to move, yet ... we have xxx (YOU)" =

(your dad speaking, perhaps your mom too).

This is somewhat understandable, they feel they have "YOU" to do what is needed. Certainly they do not want to move (no elder does). Most everyone wants to stay in their home way beyond when it is necessary to move for their safety and well-being.

So ... the more you step back and let things 'go,' the more your dad 'may' start to understand that he can't manage it all - and certainly not his unrealistic desire / expectation that he's (they) good for another year. He is in denial. And you are being a co-dependent or co-support which is not helping.

I know this is not easy for you - you want to help and you have been. Now is the time to be clear with him / them. Set your boundaries and tell them what you will and will not do. Have options available (brochures, financial reports/costs) - perhaps you need to contact Adult Protective Services (APS) ... do what you can. While you don't want to 'gang up' on your dad, you might need to make a serious impact so he gets it: he is not in charge any longer.
You / family are making the decisions.
Do whatever you have to do for them.

The reality is it may get worse before it gets better.
It appears from what you've shared that it may be up to your dad.
I do not know if you can 'get your mom out of the home' without his consent.
(I believe) This is a medial and legal matter.

Good / similar advice /suggestions follow.

I would encourage you to start clearing out their house (garage?) as you can.
Get rid of things they do not need or use.
Otherwise, this will be a huge ordeal 'all at once' when they are in a AL facility. That will be emotionally hard enough for you, even if a relief. Your dad won't like it, of course. See if you can do some of this when he is not home / around. Have someone take him out for lunch / an afternoon.

Gena / Touch Matters