You may "help" her vote by requesting a mail-in ballot. You may not fill it in for her If she can not fill it in or is mentally incompetent, then it is better that she doesn't vote. If she has vision problems or problems with her hands, talk with the nursing home about having a worker from the polling place come to help the residents. If you "help" too much, the government may see it as you voting twice - which is a federal crime of voting fraud.
You may consider this a "picky" semantic point, but it applies to casting a vote for someone other than yourself.
"In behalf of" generally means literally and legally "as a representative of" or "in the place of" another person..
It's a fine distinction from "on behalf of", which is what a lawyer does when he argues in support of his client. He is not speaking in place of the client, but is speaking, as he is obliged to do, in support of his client's viewpoint.
Neither of these are legally acceptable ways for casting votes in a U.S. election. If you are interested (which is probably unlikely) consult both American and British English Dictionaries.
So actually, there is at least a partial breakdown of semantics here.
For my part, I feel that my original comment represents what I believe, considering both legal obligations in my state as well as my own personal sense of ethics regarding my LO, that what I described in my original comment, would be correct in our situation.
Presently, it is likely that I would be unable to have conversation that would allow me to consider the fairness of allowing LO to express her wishes concerning her vote, because of the logistics of our meetings, still outside, social distancing, masking, typically on a patio surrounded by other families, residents, and guests.
As stated in my original post, I would never attempt to persuade any person one way or another. I am willing to bend the truth in innocuous situations regarding her care and comfort, but the sacredness of the vote is by no means subject to that tempering of judgement, and my own conduct dictates that I would act accordingly.
Summing up- “on behalf”? NO. As objective assistant in indicating OL’s choice? In consideration.
If you want to vote "absentee" (as it is called in most states) or help someone else do this, there is a specific and usually quite detailed, procedure to be followed. It must be applied for in advance. There is a deadline to apply and there are safeguards to prevent voter fraud. Consult your own city and state requirements.
Even if you are certain how another person, even a very close relative or spouse, would vote, it is still ILLEGAL to cast a vote on their behalf. (And please don't vote on behalf of the deceased...the graveyard is full of "registered voters" who somehow are resurrected to vote in every election!) Sorry mymomsthebest has such an awful experience at the polls. It should not have happened. I did not mean to minimize her discomfort in any way by a previous post.
For Dosmo13 ..not sure why you tell me that they worker can explain mechanics and paper voting but not be present , and yeah I get that they need to watch for family member or others telling folks how to vote( although one response here indicated that in their polling place it was allowed with a group of mentally handicapped persons) HOWEVER as I said my mom had had a stroke and clearly needed assistance with mobility so I walked her to the booth and as I SAID I remained outside but since as I SAID she had weakness on one side it was difficult for her to close the curtain so I said to use her other strong hand ..which the worker was close enough to hear and (also as I said ) HE ..very loudly berated me ..causing everyone to look over, embarrassing my mom who was all ready self conscious enough, and although I did not say so his demeanor and language and body language was clearly RUDE..not just taking responsibility seriously. There was no reason to yell, he was close enough to touch me . I do believe that poll workers are supposed to be courteous and he continued to yell at me even though the curtain was closed with my mother inside it at that point and I had not said a word , being frankly shocked at his behavior. I said ..sir there is no need to yell, my mom just needs help walking. And he then tried to make me leave the room, despite that I said I needed to help her out...plus turns out she was having issues with strength needed to open the booth and we couldn’t hear her due to his screaming . Luckily another worker came over and spoke with him , and indicated it was fine for me to assist my mom with leaving . I have no idea what set this man off as I was polite and quiet the entire time. Also, his treatment of the black woman just emphasized that he was not competent in his job there. He almost attacked her as soon as she stepped into the room and prior to her getting to the sign in table where they normally make sure you are registered to vote in that area. Also, their neighborhood is by far majority white. I do know dude when I see it ,
Pollworker can explain how voting process is carried out, since some people are not sure how to do it. But they can't (unless rules have changed) actually participate in the voting. May be some accomidations are now made for physically disabled.
For worried in Cali...( they should really have a way to respond to relies on here) what I meant in my answer as to on behalf of ..was for them to fill out an absentee ballot according to the mother’s directions NOT just fill it out themselves or go vote for her ..reading the rest of my answer that should be clear and just an interpretation of “on behalf of” as filling out the paper
My father was mentally competent, but frail. Legally blind and in a wheelchair. I lived with him in an independent, age-restricted community. As I recall, I was allowed to enter the voting booth with him and assist in any way - but he cast his own vote. Never told him how to vote or who to vote for. I was his POA - cant remember if that mattered. He wasn’t in a nursing home, however (was in home-hospice care, though).
You can’t vote on your mother’s behalf. It’s illegal in YOUR state. https://elections.wi.gov/node/95 you can however request an absentee ballot for her & have it sent to her at the nursing home & assist her with filling it out. She has to sign the envelope.
This is considered voter fraud and is a felony in this state. We do all voting by mail in this state and a signature is required. Several years back it was discovered a widow was voting for years on behalf of her very dead husband. Her excuse was he was a lifelong Democrat and she knew how he would have voted. ARGHH! Use your brain people. You know it is wrong.
I would be VERY careful. If your mom's address is a NH and there are fights over ballots, I would suspect hers will get questioned. If she is not mentally competent, do not do this.
In the polling booth itself a voter if unsure of what to do in the booth a rep. Board worker 1 from Dem. 1 from Rep. (There must be one of each at each table ) and both should be in the booth to explain how to use, not tell who to vote for.
That certainly is not true in California. A poll worker is sworn not to discuss politics or help a voter needing assistance choose a candidate, but there is nothing that says poll workers must represent certain parties.
Dementia diagnosis DOES NOT MEAN INCOMPETENT. I am appalled at how many people state that it does. Mild Cognitive Decline/Early Dementia means that the person cannot transfer ALL MEMORIES or UNABLE TO RETRIEVE those memories. It is still debatable in the professional field as to how the Memory is impaired BUT if that person can still voice their opinion and has historically voted, then they should be assisted with voting.
ADVANCED DEMENTIA is another story. And NO...they should not vote because that is serious impairment.
"Can a POA vote on behalf of another person in a federal election?"
That indicates voting FOR the person, not assisting the person.
As to dementia, yes, early stages one might still be okay voting, but but but, that person would have to do it - someone can assist by requesting an absentee ballot and returning it and the actual ballot, and may assist if the person needs help filling it out and ensuring it is signed properly, but that help should NOT include "helping" them decide who/what to vote for. The person assisting would also have to sign the ballot, legally.
I gave an example where we had to update/add some legal documents when mom was in the early stages. The EC atty was able to take her aside, and question her, and in his opinion, she was capable of signing at that point. She would have been able to vote, most likely, but I did not assist her to get to a polling place, nor did I assist in getting anything mailed. She's beyond that point now. But, the point is that in early stages one may still be able to get through the voting process, however, again, the question was can a POA vote FOR the person - the answer to that is a resounding NO.
On the other hand, when I took my mother to vote after her stroke..which left her weak on one side but fully mentally competent. The poll worker was very abrupt and rude when all I did was walk her over to the booth and tell her how to close the curtain ..not even stepping inside with her. ( although I also saw him ask a black woman for her ID, which was the only person he asked the entire time I was there waiting with mom in the line). So consider he was not well informed with actual allowable behavior
Don't know about your state, but in my state poll workers (I've served as one) could and often did, explain the mechanics of both computer and paper voting. But they were not allowed to be present when the voter actually made their choices on the ballot. I think the "rude" poll worker may have feared that as a family member, you might attempt to direct your mothers preferences on the ballot, which would be illegal. She was taking her responsibility very seriously!
would say that if she is aware and knowledgeable about the election and expresses a wish for you to vote ON HER BeHALF and as she directs you to, THEN it is okay. If you have to talk her into it, then no. Not even if you feel that you know how she would vote if she were able. And of course, not if she has no idea there is even an election nor the current issues and is even occasionally lucid. I do know absolutely who my dad would want to vote for..but i would not presume to vote for him , despite his being mostly lucid and able to express opinions, he mostly is withdrawn and sits and sleeps all day.
You don’t get to decide what is “ok”. You just advised the OP to break the law. Great way to get her mother’s ballot thrown own. https://elections.wi.gov/node/95
Assist, yes - vote on behalf of, no. If your mother can make a decision as to how she wants to vote and can sign her name on an absentee ballot, you may assist her. Your bio lists Chicago as home. You will need to sign your name and address on the certification envelope. For more complete info check out the following from the Illinois State Board of Elections:
The way you stated it, absolutely not. Voting on "behalf" of another person is voter fraud. In some states, that is a felony. If your mother is competent and able to make her own choices, but needs help filling out the ballot, you may assist her, but it must be her choice, her vote. Call your election board if you have any doubt.
My mom has been able to understand what she's voting for, read the ballot and explanations on all choices, ask questions before making her marks, and sign her name. I'm not sure about this year, though, because the virus restrictions have resulted in further cognitive decline. Since I can't sit with her yet and figure out if she knows what she is doing, I will probably not have her vote this year. I would never presume to simply vote on her behalf, to know what she would want, even though she and I have always had the exact same political views. And I do know that she has been in other elections, with dementia, perfectly capable of deciding what she thinks is right, moral, and the best path for people of this country. But what has happened in the last 4 years just might be too much for her to comprehend.
You should verify the rules and regulations with your local elections office for you city before the next election. In my state, you can assist an elderly person with voting but, you can't complete the ballot without the input of the primary voter. Once the ballot is completed, signatures of the voter and the person assisting are required and if the primary voter can't sign, an (X) is accepted. If an elder has dementia, that does not mean they are legally incompetent. Legal incompetency is determined by a court of law. If a court has not found your mother legally incompetent, it may be possible for you to take the ballot to the nursing home and assist her with voting. In November, I plan to do that for my mother who is in assisted living.
You should always check directly with your county or state elections office for any voting guidance. period. People posting here are well-intentioned but, honestly, I would not accept any answer you see on the internet, TV, radio or newspaper, including here.
If she is competent you can assist her with the ballot and there would be a place to fill out saying you were the person who assisted. If she's not competent, you cannot vote for her - that would be like you getting to vote twice and illegal in any state.
Exactly. Assisting someone doesn't mean you make their vote for them, AND doesn't require POA. One thing (there are others) a POA does NOT grant you is the capability to vote FOR the person.
From lawhelp.org: "Some powers cannot be given to an agent. Those include: * the power to vote in public elections;"
One should contact their local election office to ask these kinds of questions. Assisting might include getting an absentee ballot request form for the person, explaining how to fill it out (assumption here is that they are competent enough to do this, and only need a little prompting), having them sign in all appropriate areas, AND signing it yourself as the assistant. You could then take it to the local election office or mail it for the person. Once the actual ballot comes, the same process would be used to complete that and submit it. If someone doesn't really understand current events, or what they are really doing with this ballot, then it probably isn't a good idea to continue.
A few years ago, I might have considered helping my mother this way, but she never asked, so I didn't bother assisting her with voting. She's 97 now, in MC and recently had a stroke. Even before the stroke, I can tell by things she talks about that she is living her life about 40+ years ago. She'd probably want to be voting for Reagan or Kennedy at this point!
Once cognitive declines start, it will be very difficult to determine what they really know/understand about current events and what they really want to do as far as placing a vote, even in the early stages.
Do be very careful treading in these waters. Election fraud, which this would fall under, is a felony. Whether you might be considered guilty or not, do you really want to be charged and then have to defend yourself? Is it worth it?
No. She can vote for herself if she requests an absentee ballot. It must be signed by her to be valid. Request one from your state election commision (i think). But the deadline is soon.
From https://www.lawhelp.org/dc/resource/frequently-asked-questions-about-general-powe
"Some powers cannot be given to an agent. Those include: * the power to vote in public elections;"
Since not everyone in a facility including NH has cognitive issues, then it is possible for them to request an absentee ballot - you should contact your local authorities to be absolutely sure. Search for your local election office to make inquiries and find out how to request an absentee ballot.
If anyone has cognitive issues, it may depend on how compromised they are, but it is probably best not to go there. When my mother was in the early stages of dementia, we needed to update/add some legal documents. The EC atty took her aside and through questions and discussion determined she was still capable of signing these documents. She likely would have been okay to vote at that time, but I have not assisted her in voting at any time since then and certainly wouldn't now.
Look into your state laws. I can only answer for NC. You are allowed to assist someone if they are blind or need assistance. Your name will be included on the ballot as the assistant. If your mother is not coherent, there is nothing to assist with. Your roll as the assistant to the voter is to read the ballot, and the voter tell you who they vote for, you mark it in for them. If the voter isn’t coherent to tell you who they want, then they are not voting. If you make the decision of who to vote, and mark it in as them, it’s voter fraud.
"In behalf of" generally means literally and legally "as a representative of" or "in the place of" another person..
It's a fine distinction from "on behalf of", which is what a lawyer does when he argues in support of his client. He is not speaking in place of the client, but is speaking, as he is obliged to do, in support of his client's viewpoint.
Neither of these are legally acceptable ways for casting votes in a U.S. election. If you are interested (which is probably unlikely) consult both American and British English Dictionaries.
For my part, I feel that my original comment represents what I believe, considering both legal obligations in my state as well as my own personal sense of ethics regarding my LO, that what I described in my original comment, would be correct in our situation.
Presently, it is likely that I would be unable to have conversation that would allow me to consider the fairness of allowing LO to express her wishes concerning her vote, because of the logistics of our meetings, still outside, social distancing, masking, typically on a patio surrounded by other families, residents, and guests.
As stated in my original post, I would never attempt to persuade any person one way or another. I am willing to bend the truth in innocuous situations regarding her care and comfort, but the sacredness of the vote is by no means subject to that tempering of judgement, and my own conduct dictates that I would act accordingly.
Summing up- “on behalf”? NO. As objective assistant in indicating OL’s choice? In consideration.
Sorry mymomsthebest has such an awful experience at the polls. It should not have happened. I did not mean to minimize her discomfort in any way by a previous post.
But they can't (unless rules have changed) actually participate in the voting. May be some accomidations are now made for physically disabled.
The USA is wonderful accommodating people that can not see, yours is a perfect example of how our country accommodates the visually impaired.
you can however request an absentee ballot for her & have it sent to her at the nursing home & assist her with filling it out. She has to sign the envelope.
ADVANCED DEMENTIA is another story. And NO...they should not vote because that is serious impairment.
"Can a POA vote on behalf of another person in a federal election?"
That indicates voting FOR the person, not assisting the person.
As to dementia, yes, early stages one might still be okay voting, but but but, that person would have to do it - someone can assist by requesting an absentee ballot and returning it and the actual ballot, and may assist if the person needs help filling it out and ensuring it is signed properly, but that help should NOT include "helping" them decide who/what to vote for. The person assisting would also have to sign the ballot, legally.
I gave an example where we had to update/add some legal documents when mom was in the early stages. The EC atty was able to take her aside, and question her, and in his opinion, she was capable of signing at that point. She would have been able to vote, most likely, but I did not assist her to get to a polling place, nor did I assist in getting anything mailed. She's beyond that point now. But, the point is that in early stages one may still be able to get through the voting process, however, again, the question was can a POA vote FOR the person - the answer to that is a resounding NO.
I think the "rude" poll worker may have feared that as a family member, you might attempt to direct your mothers preferences on the ballot, which would be illegal. She was taking her responsibility very seriously!
https://www.elections.il.gov/DocDisplay.aspx?Doc=Downloads/ElectionOperations/PDF/VoteByMail.pdf
Only just saw this - it's a bit much for me to comprehend, and I don't have dementia!
People posting here are well-intentioned but, honestly, I would not accept any answer you see on the internet, TV, radio or newspaper, including here.
From lawhelp.org:
"Some powers cannot be given to an agent. Those include:
* the power to vote in public elections;"
One should contact their local election office to ask these kinds of questions. Assisting might include getting an absentee ballot request form for the person, explaining how to fill it out (assumption here is that they are competent enough to do this, and only need a little prompting), having them sign in all appropriate areas, AND signing it yourself as the assistant. You could then take it to the local election office or mail it for the person. Once the actual ballot comes, the same process would be used to complete that and submit it. If someone doesn't really understand current events, or what they are really doing with this ballot, then it probably isn't a good idea to continue.
A few years ago, I might have considered helping my mother this way, but she never asked, so I didn't bother assisting her with voting. She's 97 now, in MC and recently had a stroke. Even before the stroke, I can tell by things she talks about that she is living her life about 40+ years ago. She'd probably want to be voting for Reagan or Kennedy at this point!
Once cognitive declines start, it will be very difficult to determine what they really know/understand about current events and what they really want to do as far as placing a vote, even in the early stages.
Do be very careful treading in these waters. Election fraud, which this would fall under, is a felony. Whether you might be considered guilty or not, do you really want to be charged and then have to defend yourself? Is it worth it?
"Some powers cannot be given to an agent. Those include:
* the power to vote in public elections;"
Since not everyone in a facility including NH has cognitive issues, then it is possible for them to request an absentee ballot - you should contact your local authorities to be absolutely sure. Search for your local election office to make inquiries and find out how to request an absentee ballot.
If anyone has cognitive issues, it may depend on how compromised they are, but it is probably best not to go there. When my mother was in the early stages of dementia, we needed to update/add some legal documents. The EC atty took her aside and through questions and discussion determined she was still capable of signing these documents. She likely would have been okay to vote at that time, but I have not assisted her in voting at any time since then and certainly wouldn't now.