Any advice for dealing with a narcissistic Mother (89) who is often very mean and has always had ever-changing moods/personalities?

Reminds me of a brother-in-law who would endlessly argue about everything. I figured out that the best way to deal with it was to not get drawn into it, but politely say what I had to say and shut up; walk away if necessary. I found that sometimes weeks later he would be quoting what I had said to someone else. Not being able to get a retort would be more likely to get through to him.

njny, wow, that sounds like Joan Collins in Mommie Dearest. NO MORE WIRE HANGERS!

We put up with so much that I wonder why we think it is okay for them to do, but we have to be forever nice back the other direction. One time I would like to tell my mother what I really thought of her. Mine wouldn't pay any attention, though, since what I say goes right through her and disappears like the wind.

I hope next time your mother acts like she did for Mother's Day, you are strong enough not to let her continue to rant at you. If she says you won't have another Mother's Day with her, just say, "I am sorry you feel that way", and change the subject. It stops them cold, no argument, and you may really be sorry.

When she calls you screaming, just say, "I have to go now mom, love you" Then hang up. Don't try to reason, argue, whatever. If you answer you are just feeding the monster

Don't answer the phone if she calls you back. These are suggestions from my therapist. My Mother is gone, but I have a daughter who sometimes tries this.

You are doing great, we are a work in progress and we keep working on it. It helped me to learn that my mother had a defect that did not allow her to love me. It was nothing about me, it was about her. Sort of like she had no sense of smell, she just didn't have it in her to love me.

Isn't it great that you have found a wonderful community of people who DO care about you. I am also so very glad you took the dog. Dogs are people too and shouldn't be subject to abuse.

Hi Everyone--my mother is now 90 and still treating me like dirt whenever she feels like she has been slighted. It is so hard to deal with her, but I am so much better than I was a year ago. The other day we were discussing Mother's Day and I said how I missed my children who live in other parts fo the country. She replied that I had my mother. I said yes, but I still miss my children. Silly me, I had thought she might be able to understand that, but she took it to mean that I tossed her away "like garbage." She wanted me to say that she was enough for me and that I was thrilled to be having Mother's Day with her. I explained that I was truly so happy to have her on Mother's Day, but I still missed my children. Well... she thinks about everything over and over and twists things and the next thing I knew, she called me and told me I would never have another Mother's Day with her. She said she didn't want to socialize with me any more, but it would be okay if I still came over and helped her like I do five days a week. I tried to explain, but her fury escalated. The next day I called her like I always do and she didn't answer, so I went over to check on her and she was in the shower. She began screaming at me to "GET OUT! GET OUT! You do not have a mother--you have killed me twice! When you were 16 you brought home that awful man...". (He wasn't awful--she was in a state of depression and felt I should have been taking care of her and not bringing home a man who was older and "no good.") So... I tried to talk to her, but she was screaming, so I left. Then she called and continued her screaming at me and how I had no more mother, she had no daughter, etc. etc. Anyhow... she called later and was more reasonable and said she wanted things to go back the way they were. That she would go to Mother's Day brunch after all. I told her that I forgave her but I could not forget what happened. She said she thought I would forget. There is no way I could forget something like that, but I said that we should just move past it and not discuss it anymore. If she hadn't done things like this to me throughout my life I would assume it was dementia, but she has been like this for as far back as I can remember. So hateful at times, loving at others. Perhaps she is a little worse now, but not much--she still drives, manages her finances, cooks, etc. I am hanging in there, but it is NOT EASY! She is so mean-spirited at times; hateful actually. I am sure she is like she is for a reason but we can all choose to be at least civil, don't you think?!

I also have a NPD mother with the beginnings of dementia. I had to live with her for a year and it was H*ll. Now that I have moved out and have created ironclad boundaries she is excessively nice to me. It I will not let my guard down as I know the cruelty is still there. If I show any sign of weakness she won't hesitate to be mean. She uses her money to control us and it works with my sister. I have realized that she was incapable of being a mom and now she is becoming the child.

Someone mentioned over-availability. I noticed with my foster dad that he was mean and hateful if I was too available, but nice when I became more scarce and came around less. I never knew this might be a connection to some kind of mental decline or condition. I guess after joining the site I learned quite a bit. I have more than just my experience, I have better insight as to why certain things happen as they did. I'm grateful to those who unknowingly shared details that were similar to some of the details from my own experience and helped me connect the dots I could never otherwise connect without the support group from people who dealt with very similar issues as mine

Hello there--I was just rereading all the posts and felt like updating. You might remember that my mother got a dog but it was too much for her, so I took the little dog and now have a new "baby." Thank goodness I am so in love with this puppy! My mother now has a bird, and although they are harder to take care of than I thought, (I have to clean the cage, etc. )it is easier than her having a dog. I have been making small but steady progress In Terms of dealing with her narcissism. Today she received a lot of grand attention from the physical therapist, and was thrilled, and she needed me to match her mood of happiness, but she wore me out with things I needed to do until I just about burst into tears. But instead of trying to smooth things over, like I used to do, I will go out with a friend tonight. It is getting easier to just let it go and try and have some fun for myself. I wish I was less sensitive and a "tougher cookie," but I am moving right along. My next challenge is leaving for four days to visit my grandsons in July. I get so shaky when I leave town because in the past she has given me such a hard time. I can do it! Thanks for everyone's input on this thread.

Mary Kathleen--thank you for your kind words. I read them over and over when I was visiting my daughter. In fact, I read over all the posts. I gain inspiration, direction and hope from everyone's input. I hope more of you post, but maybe this discussion is running its course. I feel like I have so much work yet ahead of me, but that my progress is, indeed, becoming major. But, I also feel as though if I am not ever-vigilant, I will go backwards, at least to some extent. I truly do hope some of you will share more of what is happening with you. Thank you, 1RareFind, for taking so much time to give me specific suggestions. Take care, everyone!

JesseBelle--checking in. How are you feeling?

In addition to what others are saying, I was thinking of a few tricks of my own.

Change your number

This is an option that you can explore with your phone provider. If this isn't an option, what you can do if this number is a landline is to let her calls go to an answering machine, but keep the answering machine volume down or muted. The answering machine would still be on and take the call but you wouldn't hear it. Another related trick you can try is your ringer volume down or muted. If you have one of those cordless phones with a light up window, you would be able to see you whenever the phone has an incoming call. If you have caller ID, you can actually cut off the call by just hitting the answer and the end buttons simultaneously. As soon as you see her number come up, you can just cut the call right off.

If this number happens to be a cell phone number, you can pretty much do the same similar thing except cell phones usually have voicemail. If you can have your provider help you to have your mom's number goes straight to voicemail, this would definitely be in your favor because other people who need you more will be able to get a hold of you more easily. You can also have your mom's number completely blocked. If this is not an option, you can get another phone and give that number to all of your close contacts except for your mom. She would still have the old number but everyone else would have the new number. In fact, what you can do is to carry the new phone with you and leave the other one at home so that your mom can call all she wants and she can never get a hold of you because the phone is at home and not on you. Therefore, she wouldn't know you actually have a new phone with a new number.

Distancing yourself from her would definitely be a very smart move on your part. I would definitely leave as soon as she started. As for her being possessive of you and becoming angry because you interact with other family members, do it anyway. You have every right to interact with others. The world doesn't revolve around just one person, there are others in this world. This is something your mom is just going to have to learn to accept whether she likes it or not. You may be an only child, but remember, you're also an adult. Therefore, she has no more control over you other than what you allow. You can regain your life if you really want to. If you distance your self and take a nice long two-week vacation or even a month vacation, see if you don't feel better right away. If you decide to go on vacation, remember to take a phone with a number that she cannot call, definitely leave the other phone at home. When do you listen to your voicemails, just delete the ones with no priority. Also, don't go over there alone if you still decide to go over there, take a support network with you who is on your side. They would be able to speak up on your behalf if they're really a very good support network. You don't have to live close to your mom if you really don't want to, you can choose to move away. Your mom has no legal custody of you since you're an adult. You have adult freedoms. You don't have to tolerate any form of abuse. In fact I found that in the case of my elderly friend, the spreading out my visits by making them feel were and further between was actually very advantageous. That's because I made myself more scarce as he started acting crazy, causing me to have no other choice but to distance myself. I can say from personal experience that taking that first step to freedom is actually the hardest, but it does get easier with each and every time you distance yourself from toxicity because each step to freedom will get easier. Remember that things will backfire on a narcissist at some point or another. This kind of thing just won't continue forever, trust me on this because the tables will turn in your favor. All you have to do is just sit back and watch things happen as they happen.

As for running errands for shelter dogs for her, I strongly agree with others that you should never have to do this, and I support those who mentioned it. If one of her trial dogs poops on the floor again, just don't clean it up. Let her clean up the mess herself. If she doesn't like the dog and you choose to bring her one and return it to the shelter, just don't clean up the mess. Just remind her that if she wants a dog that bad, then cleaning up after the dog is part of the territory that she's just going to have to accept. Another thing to tell her is that if she's not going to take responsibility, then you're just not going to bring her a dog. Stick to that rule.

What I'm sensing is your mom is enslaving you. You may not realize it, but slavery was long ago done away with. Therefore, it's still legal to own slaves. However, people find ways around that, and what you're describing sounds like one of those ways because what she wants is a slave. In fact, someone I know has very wrong ideas about women and he thinks women should do all of the household chores including all of the child rearing duties all day every day and have his dinner ready when he gets home from work. He thinks that just because he works outside the home that he doesn't have to share responsibilities inside the home. In other words, what he was saying that he's looking for a slave and not a wife. What he doesn't seem to understand is that expectations and reality are two totally different things because it's just not possible to do it all and not burn out sometime. There are also illnesses as well as injuries and disabilities. This is why reality speaks much louder than unreasonable expectations. Lots of women just aren't going to do all of the all of the household duties all of the time because many just won't fall for that. There are very clever ways of enslaving people, and if you're wise enough to catch it without being sucked in your can prevent it from happening to you. If you ever find yourself being ordered around or being ordered to jump on demand, just do what a friend of mine and myself dead in the case of my elderly friend:

Just don't do what you're being ordered to do. As long as you're being ordered around, just don't do anything being ordered of you. It's one thing to ask nicely and another thing to be demanding. Remind your mom that she can catch more flies with honey than she can with salt or vinegar.

Another big red flag to look for in your situation is if you notice your mom getting mad if you don't immediately do what she wants. In the case of my elderly friend who did this, there were various situations where he got mad when he didn't get his way right away. At least once he trying to start trouble with a restaurant when his order was not on time and it happened to be one of those nights when the restaurant had a very high order volume. My elderly friend could not legally drive, and at the time I was not in a position to have access to a vehicle though I was able to drive if I had one. Therefore, pick up of the order was not possible. There were also times when by elderly friend would get mad for some reason and at least once or twice I actually saw him throw an item and break it. I'm just glad he threw it away from me and not at me because he would've had a fight on his hands because I would've definitely defended myself and he would've been in jail. Another time he threw an open bag of pork rinds across the room, making a big mess on the floor. He expected me to clean it up because he asked me if I'm going to clean it up and I very firmly said no. When he asked me if I would at least bring him the broom since he was nearly blind, I did agree to that and I brought him the broom. He cleaned up his own mess that he rightfully made.

Another red flag you should notice in your situation is if the toxic person happens to damage or destroy something that means something to you. Be aware of the possibility that if they really wanted to, they could do bodily harm to you.

If anything sounds familiar, take this very seriously and take the initiative to leave the toxic and dangerous environment. If there are any children hanging around the house where this problem is, definitely remove them along with any other vulnerable person as well as animals.

Well, I am at the airport ready to go back home to my wonderful husband and complaining mother. I had a beautiful time with my daughter and son-in-law! My mother was very content without me nearby as long as someone stopped by (arranged by me), but the last day she had a hard time. She chose to go shopping and bought a ton of stuff. She had to carry in 12 bags and take care of shoveling the new dog's poops and said she had no one to help her. The dog also got into her gum and ate 5 sticks! I guess puppy will have blue poops! I reminded her that she could call my husband or friend who are more than willing to help, but NO, she would never bother them. She said she was on her own. I reminded her I would have been glad to have a caregiver come, but NO. So I just quit discussing it and got off the phone. On her good days--the first two days--, when she had company, she was so happy I had gone to see my daughter. I just will never get used to her differing personalities/mood swings but I no longer feel responsible. My daughter said, "Mom--you have changed. You came to visit me and you are not always talking about Nannie." I considered that a triumph. I am proud of myself for every gain. You are all helping more than you know.

Thank you, MaryKathleen! I need all the encouragement I can get. Your post made my day!

Yea, look at the major and I mean MAJOR progress you have made. Don't worry about a small step back, if that is what you mean about driving her to the shelter. Look at the MAJOR progress you have made. I am so proud of you. Keep up the great work.

Hi Friends--well today was a mixed bag. I told my mother, a couple of weeks ago, I would no longer look for dogs for her, call about dogs for her, help pay for their needs, nor drive to find one any farther than a town 30 miles away. I told her she would have to do the looking but I would take her, upon her request, to look at local shelters. Well, today, we went to a shelter and they had the cutest ever chihuahua. So here we go again, BUT I didn't pay for anything, and I left her alone with it quickly after I took her home. Prior to this, I devoted days on end to helping her. I just hope this one works out. It would be a miracle, but we might be due for one! She complained about the money all day, but I did not budge. A month ago, I would have done triple somersaults to try and make her happy and helped pay for everything. I feel stronger, but also like I gave In a bit. I sincerely hope this dog works out. On the bright side, my husband, my daughter and my counselor see me as getting stronger. I feel it, just still a work in progress. This site helps me more than anyone knows. Please keep in contact and sharing your perspectives and your own stories. I am scheduled to leave to visit my daughter on Friday--I will be so glad when I get there and am hugging my darling 27 year old baby. Think positive thoughts for me.

Great--you are lucky you at least have a little back up. I thought so--you and I are the same age and so are our mothers.

I'm 63 and she is 89. She doesn't have my symptoms. They would be hard to fake and I've been careful not to infect her. I don't think she'll catch what I have. I'm one of these people who are never really sick, so this has been a wake-up call for me. I am probably under too much stress. With the VaD, she doesn't realize she needs to do less stress, instead of escalate. I'll call in my SIL if it gets too bad.

Oh my. JessieBelle--no hijacking worries. We are all in this together! I would guess your mother is trying to top your sickness, so she could gain the "most sickly" award, unless she caught what you had or something. It is hard to know--but you are right--just focus on getting yourself well. Sounds like you were really pretty sick! A fountain of youth pull would be nice, wouldn't it? I forget--how old are you and how old is your mom?

wonder? Should be no matter how you badger.

Sorry if I hijacked the thread about my mother. Today is Day 3 of antibiotic therapy for me. My lungs seems better, but the antibiotic is having the normal side effects. I am feeling tired, so am not doing anything but sanitizing my bedding today. Well, anyway... Mom is near the point of death at the moment. She's in her bed with her head wrapped in a handkerchief. This is her "real sick" look. I knew that she would have to be sicker than me. I'm still waiting for her to fake my symptoms, and I'll be able to tell if they are fake.

It's hard to be sick when they one you're caring for is even sicker. Actually I want to kick her bottom and tell her to knock off the stupid thing she's doing. But then, what if she really is that sick? I would feel terrible. I'll just leave her to her misery and concentrate on getting better myself. Life just really stinks when it's like this.

One thing that really bothers me with my mother is she thinks there's a pill out there that will fix everything and erase 20 years of age. She doesn't realize the "pill" exists within herself in watching what she eats and getting exercise. At a certain point, that ship has sailed and no wonder how you badger your hapless daughter, it can't be fixed. There is no magic.

JessieBelle--such fun we are having! 😁 Seriously, glad you do not do all the work around the house for your mother. Thrilled you found !000 bucks! I used to have a house keeper come for my mother twice a month, which cost me over $100 a month. I was working then and the only reason I had someone come was so that my mother could possibly bond with someone so that when I want to go out of town, I could hire this person to come and spend some time with her. But my mother would have none of the visiting when I left town. She felt as though it was an intrusion. Then she started complaining that the housekeeper (actually a caregiver) didn't such a great job. So... I cancelled the caregiver/housekeeper and I do some cleaning about once a month. I don't mind. Cleaning is easy for me but cooking is my greatest fear! I am happy to save the $100 a month. I know, I know... You are probably all wondering why I would pay for this instead of her. Well, she has a tight and fixed income so I pick up some of the slack, BUT I am truly stopping much of it. I saw my counselor today and it was so helpful. The best news was that I wrote a long synopsis of what my fears and limitations were regarding my mother about a month ago, and I have made a ton of progress in just one month. NOT THERE YET, but it was so reassuring to see some real gains. I am super excited because I just bought tickets to visit my daughter across the country and I am not shivering in my boots. My mother has given me such a hard time in the past when I left town, but I am just starting to feel a little sense of freedom. I pray it will last. I am progressing slowly but I am progressing!!! Happy tonight!

njny, I haven't been working around the house. I've just been doing a few things that have to be done, like cooking and taking out garbage. The rest of the time I've been catching up on my own work on the computer. It had gone to nothing this past month. The nice thing about that was that I found almost $1000 that I had forgotten to transfer. It was like finding treasure. :)

One thing that was a problem is that Mom thought I should be well already. It has only been two days, but she was thinking it had been a week or more. She's lost her concept of time. She's also lost memory of going to the doctor not long ago for the same problem she wants to see him for now. I know what the outcome will be, so it makes no sense to go.

Emotional weaponry--great phrase. It was an awful visual that you wrote--you being sick and doing all the work. How do things get so out of whack? Never mind--I think we all know why. Hang in there--take care of yourself!

I am glad that I turned down the offer for breakfast. I cooked dinner this evening. I've been wearing gloves and mask when I cook because I'm contagious. When dinner was ready, Mom started talking about how she needed to go to the doctor for the balance/gait problem she is having. I know it is most likely the vascular dementia. She's been having trouble since 2012 and we've seen people, but she doesn't remember. So hear I am with gloves and a mask dangling, getting over a mild case of pneumonia, and she's talking about making an appointment for her tomorrow. I pointed these things out to her, but she really didn't click on it. She just got upset.

We've been down this road a few times before and I know there is no pill to cure age or the damage done by vascular dementia... except maybe PT, which she won't follow through on. Personally I am going to take it easy until I'm not contagious anymore. It is a Mycoplasma infection, so I don't want to spread it around doctor offices. (I do feel better already, but still infectious.) I was glad I didn't accept her offer of breakfast, though, since it would have been a handy emotional weapon for her to use.

After I wrote this morning, I thought about the wall I put up. I realized that my internal agreement was that I would help her, but want her to stay out of my life. There's really not much she can do for me other than introduce chaos.

I really can relate to reluctance to accept gifts from my mother because, even though she wants to give them to me, and is often really nice about it, she eventually does something that is so upsetting, I end up putting, for example, all the jewelry gifts away in a box. When things get better, I sometimes wear a piece, but more often than not, back it goes. I want to "feel the love," but it just doesn't stick and I don't want to be reminded of painful things so I put it away. I will eventually give them all to my daughter. On occasion, over the years, she has held gifts over my head. For example, she gave me a monetary gift, but expected me to use it to improve my home for when she came to visit. Conditional gifts are not gifts at all.

It has actually been a pretty good week, but I know it won't last. I AM GLAD I KNOW THIS! I didn't know it for years and now I do. I have lesser, more realistic expectations, but I have to remind myself daily how I need to manage myself in order to take care of myself. I swear this boundary setting is hard work!

The sad thing is that is often makes you suspicious of people who really ARE trying to do something good for you because you are so used to having strings attached to everything. My mother seems to think that giving me money will instantly fix everything up.

I had a new experience this morning. I've been sick for a few days. Today my mother was so sweet and asked me if I wanted her to fix me breakfast. I told her no, but thanks for asking.

The idea of her doing something for me didn't set well. After I thought about it, I knew why. It was too little too late, and what my mother does can come with long-term strings attached. I grew up to be so cautious about her, knowing to keep all forms of emotional ammunition out of her reach. Guess I'll never trust her. Boundaries can become like walls after a while.

Handled like a pro, MidKid. No hostility or accepting of guilt. Big thumbs up.

Wow, reading through these just made a light bulb go off in my head! I have stopped going to Mothers to clean as she made it abundantly clear she doesn't want me "bothering and smothering" her. I HAD to drop a gift off to her for her friend that I had gone and purchased and while I was quickly wrapping the gift, Mother made a big deal about how she had spent the entire morning cleaning up a dead plant she had in the bathroom (I always water and replace the plants as needed) this was a fern that should have been replaced months ago but she thought she could bring it to life. The dirt was ancient (20 years) and dry and I guess she dropped it or something, so it went everywhere. I said "That's too bad.". She said "well, I hope you're happy, it took two hours to clean up". I didn't give a lot of thought to the comment--but suddenly it hits me that she EXPECTS me to still do all these grotty chores and I'm not going to. Probably the first time in 2 years she's cleaned up after herself.
I also got chastised by not running out and buying the gift on Saturday when she called me. I said "I told you I was done running around on Sat and would take care of this Mon." "But, W's birthday was YESTERDAY". (How am I supposed to know that? " Did you see "W" yesterday?" "No, not until tomorrow, but I talked to her an apologized that you hadn't gotten her gift". Gritted teeth. "Well, you have it now. Gotta run". And I am out of there.
This setting boundaries will get easier, right??

Hi everyone--i love Living South's suggestion that I need to be a tough chick. I can definitely be too tender hearted. It is sometimes tough to weigh what is kind and appropriate to do for my mother and what is over the top. Aargh--I just didn't have the heart to demand that my mother clean up her own mess--I am in town and available, and it would have truly been hard for her to do. It wasn't pee if you get my drift. And it was a mess. Honestly, I don't love doing that, but I am glad I did. What I do mind is her nasty treatment of me and her expectations that she and her needs are more important than anything else. This week I have held firm and feel stronger, and she is behaving in a nicer manner (but we will see how long that lasts). I am actually planning a trip to visit my daughter and she is actually happy for me! But again, time will tell. I know how fortunate I am that I am not living with her --it would not be manageable--and that I have a supportive husband. I do have much to be grateful for. P.S. I also love the behavior modification technique suggested by partsmom. Being an educator, that makes perfect sense to me!

One thing to note about care facilities: they do not have the history with your LO, and so don't react the way you do. It would be good for some of these folks to have to deal with real people whom they did not spend a lifetime manipulating. I have a few people in my life who are difficult, but fortunately I have been able pretty much to just ignore them when they go off on me. (I once left a niece on the phone laying on my desk ranting insults for an hour while I went on with my own work.) I hope no one is upset by the comparison, but I figured out something with my daughter's dogs (three yippy cockapoo mixes) who bark their heads off whenever some one comes into the house. I decided that I was not going to react to them (daughter yells at them to shut up) and so I ignore them and pet them only when they are quiet. Two of them figured this out in about a day, and whenever they see it's me they stop barking. The third one keeps barking, and keeps getting ignored until she quiets down. It's much harder to do that with people, but all we can do is try to break our conditioning and be clear about what we will cooperate with.