91 year old aunt keeps overflowing her bathtub. She refuses to change her routine and is resisting having someone come in to help.

My strategy with my mom is to solve the small things so I can address the big things. Call a plumber to have a outflow pipe installed, or change the fixture entirely so a shower is the only option.

I am not one who thinks these smaller things mean everything in someone's life must change. I know physical and cognitive decline is inevitable (I'm a cognitive neuroscientist). But, so many things can be solved with technology or old fashioned thinking outside the box.

When you do bring someone into her home, consider the way she would have invited someone in. How would she have welcomed someone or hosted a friend. Do those small rituals - tidy up, have refreshments, plan to sit and talk. Give her the opportunity to know someone who will be in her home when you are not there - especially someone charged with monitoring her bathing. Sometimes, we get so busy we forget to slow down and include those we are caring for in their care needs.

I wish you peace in your journey.

This isn't rocket science...solutions have already been invented....the one you want is a mechanism that shuts off the water at a specified level, usually that of the overflow drain; "flowban", for example, works on magnets and doesn't require any electricity or person present (as would an alarm, which I would consider useless). A good plumber will be able to explain the options.

First I would call her insurance company to see if can fix the water damage issue, and a plumber.

is she doing other self harm?

If she's having short term memory problems then she needs to have an aide coming in daily. Even if it's just for an hour or two. Your aunt must be made to understand this. Show her the ceiling and explain why it's in the state it is. Then tell her that because you live two hours away, it's impossible for you to be there if something happens. If you let her meet with several potential aide/companions first she might take a shine to one and then get comfortable with them. It will also ease her mind to know that she has someone local who can help her with things.

Gosh...and we're at the opposite end of the spectrum with my mother who refuses to bathe or shower....what a mess.
This is mean....but I'm going to assume there's more than one bathroom. What if you put a locking handset on the bathroom with the bathtub/shower...and she can only access it when an aide or someone is in the house. They don't have to stay with her...but they can be on guard.
ANd if anyone by chance knows how to deal with my mother constantly turning on the bathroom exhaust fan, please let me know. They are in windowless bathrooms and I tried to get a timer switch installed, but the house/wiring is too old without a major re do.

Imho, you could have a plumber install a sensor. Herein lies a question - is it still safe for her to actually get in a bath tub at her age? Prayers sent.

Have an experienced plumber install a sensor and mechanism to shut off the water when the tub reaches a specified level (already mentioned).

PS...tubs should never overflow even without such a sensor due to the overflow drain; unless it is too small (or the water pressure too high). You can modify either of those too.

Face the fact - she is a problem and will get worse and more water will overflow causing more and more problems. You cannot make her change. Go and find a place to put her and get her out of the home. She is causing horrible damages mentally and physically to you and the home. There is one thought, is there was a way to TURN OFF THE WATER so she can't fill the tub unless someone secretly can turn the water on long enough for a bath. Don't put up with this. She will never, ever allow a caretaker and the damages she has caused are insane. Get her out of that house at once.

I don't know the answer to over flowing tub, but you can install cameras around the house to watch her from afar. This way you can do some monitoring of her activities throughout the day. You can also have silent alarms above the bathroom door that goes off when she enters the bathroom alerting you that she may be taking a bath soon. My husband and I took care of his mom inside our house for over 4 years till she passed away at 93 years old. We tried to give her independence but were able to watch her on our phones when she was in other parts of the house. She suffered from dementia. She was fiesty and didn't want to be told what to do. We didnt tell her their were cameras in the house, we told her they were smoke detectors. The cameras were very effective as she had several falls over the years. We were even able to show the paramedics the video of how she fell which was very helpful. I was only a few feet from her when she fell that time. Good luck, I know how hard and frustrating it can be. I hope you find what works best for all of you.

Figure out where shut off valves are for tub and turn water off. Then tell her something must be broken and you’ll have to call a plumber. But he’s busy till next week, or next month... in the meantime, why don’t you try shower?

btw, she might do the same thing with shower.

Gosh, I thought 'this could be my MIL!'

Except, she was filling a huge, deep jetted tub. It takes about 1/2 hr to fill to the point she'd like.

It didn't overflow, it made the water heater empty too fast and then there would be condensation on the WH and it would run down the sides and eventually put the pilot light out.

A real bizarre mess. Every week Dh was getting frantic calls that her WH was broken. It took him about a year to figure out what she was doing--as she was so embarrassed!! She'd let that water run for a full day or more before she remembered she'd started the tub filling up.

Once DH ascertained her 'problem' he read her the riot act. She's just LUCKY it didn't flood and ruin the floors. Of course, she has carpeted bathrooms. (Gross, so gross)...


He tried everything he could think of--the obvious answer being to stay in the room, but she wouldn't. She also cannot hear, so the noise of the running water was not a factor.

I think finally she was so upset by the incredible COST of all that wasted water (we live in a desert!) she quit taking baths in that tub. She had a 2nd bath, a regular sized tub and she uses that now, exclusively. She refused to modify the tub to be also a shower because she thinks showers are low-class ??? so she tub baths and always has. DH installed grab bars for her, so, while it's not as safe as a shower, it's ok.

DH was beside himself trying to come up with ways to keep her from running the big tub for hours and hours--he did make the drain unusable, but she just stuffed a towel down there and continued her ways. I think it was when he got mad at her for wasting his time that she 'got it'. He told her he wouldn't turn her water heater back on and she could figure it out on her own that she gave in.

I went once to relight her pilot light and she practically had a stroke--women shouldn't be doing men's jobs!! That probably also figured in to the equation too.

She would no more take a bath when ANYONE was in her house than fly to the moon. Incredibly private and such a worrier--she won't even bathe when DD is there.

The mold issue you mentioned is truly dangerous--and the floor can also become so weakened by water damage, it can fall through to the floor below. (Anybody remember the movie "Money Pit"?) As funny as that bathtub scene was, it was also kind of a scary warning.

So, isn't there a way to show she needs help with two ADL's - especially if you add the bathing problem to the mix as needing assistance or dementia issue.

Maybe you could get someone to install some sort of nut/washer to the water handles so they cannot be opened full blast. If it filled more slowly, the overflow drain would probably be able to handle it before it spills on to the floor.
She already has someone coming in for cleaning. Bath time needs to be when that person is there - and she is already familiar with that person. Get that person to come every day or bath day to help keep aunt on track. Bath is preferred over shower for many older folks because you get cold in the shower. Plus private parts are going to get a better soaking.

I'm actually impressed that she can still get herself in and out of the bath without assistance, she must be doing amazingly well for her age!

I think what you can do really depends on your relationship with her and whether or not you are able to sit with her and have "the talk". Someone eventually needs to ask her about her hopes, fears and plans and I would approach it as brainstorming together how to best help her achieve them, this should also be a prelude to end of life planning and powers of attorney. In this instance spending the money to open up walls and add drains or swap out the tub for a shower unit (probably the wisest choice for the long term) should be presented as an investment in her ability to remain as independent as possible.

Might need to go a more expensive route. Have a plumber install a drain in the bathroom floor.

MCI will soon become dementia. Your aunt is already at the point where it is not safe for her to live alone - even if she believes that she "can" do so.

I only see two solutions: (1) do the expense of changing the plumbing to have a shutoff sensor or (2) completely rip out the bathtub and replace it with a non-slip shower base so that she cannot take a bath. (We did #2, BTW, and my husband is 70 and I am 67 - as we are thinking ahead!)

If you are her nearest living relative, you really should consider obtaining a DPOA for her.

Unsupervised baths are unsafe for seniors her age, as if they should feel faint or dizzy, they will slip underneath the water and drown.

I cannot be absolutely sure; however, I do drink only Evian water and i am hoping it is as pure as advertised. I raise my own veggies and oranges in my backyard. Now that i am 86, i do raised bed gardening. However, I think organic produce from HEB are very healthy.i also drink a quqrt a day of HEB milk from pasture fed hormone free cows.I eat at least one whole egg every day. Egglands Best are delicious.Finally, I cook my own delicious healthy food mostly veggie beef soup and or chicken noodle soup, all kinds of enchilladas, and lots of beans, and calabasito. Truly healthy food including home made cakes, cookies, etc. are much more tasty, healthier, and cheaper than unhealthy things.Wonderful home made beans, soups, stews, etc. cost les than half what steaks andor processed foods or bakery goods cost.Preserve health, enjoy, life, and save a lot of money by eating good food.

As a home health nurse this was always a difficult situation to witness. Imperative to get POA while Aunt is cognitively intact enough to do so legally. If she declines anymore, family will have to go to court to get a guardian appointed. Next, Adult Protective Services have two parts: Elder Abuse (which is not what I am reading) and Elder at Risk which is the situation here. They will send a social worker to the home to evaluate. They never divulge who made the report to protect family relationships! (nor mine as the nurse so I could continue caring for the fragile senior). A case is then on record, first step. Have you enlisted the assistance of her PCP to get in home care? As I read your note, it is not IF something happens, it is it WILL. These are some of the most difficult times for the person going through these mental status changes and the loved ones watching. My Gran used to say it was like a fog that would roll in and she didn't know what was happening, then the fog would roll out and all was clear again. She filled the tub and left her 5th floor apt to go shopping. The building manager on the 1st floor saw the water all the way down there. That was when the tough decision was made in our family. Gran was 90. She had 9 more years!
Best of luck, hope this helped.

If she is still able to make decisions and is safe otherwise sit her down and give her 3 options.
1. Shower / bath aid
2. you will disable the tub closure so her only option is a shower. Or submit to the renovation for the timer at her expense.
3. Assisted Living.

Doing a timer at this point even if it would mean a renovation might be an option since the ceiling, possibly the floor of the bathroom would need repairs. You have to check for any mold as well and the longer that goes unchecked the worse it can be.

Gotta Start Getting Tough & Start Enforcing Some Rules ... Do What U Gotta Do to Keep Her Safe & You

Dont Explain Yourself They Dont Understand Just Do It

Very often so called meds are involved in cognitive impairment. i am 86, strong, healthy mentally and physically, med free, and pain free.i firmly believe that if I had taken the lipitor, thiazide, and fosomax prescribed for me when I was 62, I would be either dead or very ill.I also believe that so called antidepressants are very dangerous.I believe so called meds have damaged my poor daughter.I am not against all medicine or science; not at all. Antibiotics are wonderful and some vaccines are essential. I just want to advise everyone to research very very carefully before ingesting nd or injecting anything. Also, real true pure clean food and drink are the best medicines.

So will this not be a big enough problem until the bathtub crashes through the ceiling onto the first floor?

Sounds like she can't live alone. Today she forgets to turn the bathtub water off, why won't she forget to turn the stove off tomorrow and burn the whole house down? Or leave the gas on and blow it up?

I must ask, did you have the water thoroughly extracted very shortly after each overflow/ If not, the "mildew' smell you mention might be a serious health problem.Mytragically ill and cognitively impaired 65 year old daughter overflowed her bathroom sink and flooded her home. I had the water extracted right away and all the carpet and baseboards disinfected. I am keeping damp rids in all the affected areas. no mold or mildew has developed. obviously, neither my daughter nor anyone who floods their home should be allowed to live unsupervised.Certainly, if they allow ongoing "overflows", they could also not handle finances.Your aunt needs someone to supervise her.

If she is experiencing short-term memory at her age you should come together with her family, Talk away from her. Does your Aunt have children? Then agree she should see a neurologist, if she has the beginning stages of dementia, they can give medicine to slow it down from becoming alzheimers. I am no lawyer if she doesn't have a Living WILL stamped by the law to designate someone who she wants to have Durable Power Of Attorney to have power to pay her bills using her finances. My 90 year old Grandma started getting short-term memory in her middle 80s, after seeing the Doctor she had brain cell shrinkage. Last year my grandma didnt know where she lived, how to sign checks, pay bills. We just had to ask the Doctor to write a letter telling what was happening with her, know I can pay her bills for her. Because I am her Durable Power Of Attorney.

Work with her and/or her homemaker to suggest that with the right support she can maintain her independence. One way to do this would be to bathe independently when the homemaker is there. The homemaker can either run the bath or your Aunt could, but there would be oversight of the homemaker.
Include your Aunt in resolving the issue, consider her preferences and offer her choices.

What does your aunt think the solution is? How does she respond when this happens? - deny that it was anything to do with her, blame somebody else ("the cat distracted me"), insist that it was a simple oversight that could happen to anybody?

But if she herself is annoyed about what happened, that's good and you're at least at the right starting point. Okay, auntie, how can we make sure you can continue to enjoy your baths without this trouble?

Unless someone is with her 24/7, no telling when she will decide to bathe. Hire an aide and my guess is she will work around their arrival. Best thing would be to get inspection of bathroom. If subfloor is going, that could be excuse to shut bathroom for repairs and have her move to independent living. I agree with others that say this is tip
of iceberg and you will find more issues as you prove. I don’t think you said if you are POA but if you are not, hopefully you can get her to sign that too. Managing her is not going to get easier going forward.

A shower aide would be the best, if she would agree to it. Will she understand that the overflowing tub is damaging her home? You will have to elder-proof the house as she declines. Talk to a social worker who specializes in elder care to get advice and find out about the things you can do to make the house easier to handle for her. You may have to disable the drain so it won't close. Maybe if you put a shower seat in the shower so she has a place to sit it would be more comfortable for her to take a shower. There are plastic medical style seats that will be OK in the shower.

Do not wait any longer. There are issues of health and danger at hand and there's no reason to wait any longer.

The real truth is that your aunt is no longer safe living by herself. An overflowing bathtub is not maybe going to lead to an accident, it IS going to lead to an accident, and it's just a matter of time until 'something happens'. You and everyone else in your aunt's life can keep pretending that that's not happening, but it is. It is happening.

When our elderly parents' memory starts to go, we realize that all these things we take for granted are actually dangerous. They can start fires on stoves or in microwaves; have accidents when they continue to drive; forget to take medication or forget any of the other many things we just do, automatically. When brains starts to change, these automatic behaviors go awry, and this is only one thing that happens when the brain changes.

If you spend some time on AgingCare.com you'll see that one of the themes is how do we help our elderly family members transition from being autonomous adults to being adults who accept the fact that they need help. Some people are better at accepting this than others and some of our family members are stubborn, angry, proud and do not want to give up their autonomy.

If we don't intercede at these junctions when we see a huge red flag such as overflowing bathtubs, well, that's a huge ticking time bomb. Don't ignore it. Face it, help them face it with dignity.

Your aunt is no longer able to learn new behaviors, most likely, and simple things such as remembering to set a timer or turn off a bathtub are not something you can in any way expect her to do.

As you can see this is going to be really difficult, but it's better to do something now than wait for a tragic accident to occur. Take action now.

You state "she has completely ruined the ceiling in her family room and I am now starting to notice a mildew smell."

I think that a even BIGGER problem is developing --MOLD-- in the subfloor of the bathroom and the ceiling of the family room. Mold can be deadly and harmful to a person's health. You need to get someone to inspect the tub and the bathroom floor and family room ceiling for mold ASAP. If there is mold, then you need to do whatever needs to be done to get rid of that mold--even if it means remodeling the bathroom!!!