Yes, that’s true but whenever I’ve gone back at him and replied in the way you’ve suggested it has ended in a full blown argument. I’m at the stage now I just tune out or grey rock or completely change the subject. To the only way I can deal with the situation now.
Walking away can be difficult if you are needed. I’d suggest asking him to stop because you don’t want to listen, and then putting in ear plugs. That’s for you.
You are also concerned for him, because he is making himself unhappy. Unfortunately this is the same as for many other dementia-related behaviors, including very different things like refusing to wear a fall alert. You can’t force them to change (or persuade, encourage, cajole etc). Treat it as just one type of anxiety issue, and talk to the doctor. Meds might help.
You say he doesn't respond to comfort. Maybe you could bring in a pastor or priest that could listen to him, offer him the gospel, give him the opportunity to ask forgiveness, and verbally affirm that forgiveness to him. Then later you can say, "Dad, that was all taken care of when you talked to Father / Pastor Jones." Just remind him of that every time and then move on to another topic of conversation.
Thanks gray grannie. Sorry to shoot your suggestions down in flames but my father is very deaf and has actually stopped going to confession because of this and because he can’t ease his guilt about past wrongs etc. we have a new priest at our church and he doesn’t want to go to him because he is young with new ideas. That’s his reason anyway. It’s very frustrating when I try to suggest some things to him so I don’t bother now.
Favegirl1 - I think you've gotten some really good feedback from others ...and really, the only comment that I could add is that I think it's just really unfortunate that people of various religions seem to use the guilt or fear factor along with it. My mother has a mindset like that too - it's terrible to bring up a child that way - or even deal with it as an adult. And I can appreciate some of the levity that others tried to express in their comments to you because it helps shift and lighten the mood, and sometimes it's necessary. It sounds like your dad has had this mindset for most of his life and it's ingrained in him...it's like a loop in his head...and like others have commented, at this point, just changing the topic..non responses..walking away.. shifting gears is what I would think is the easiest recourse...responding or engaging in the topics with him would be worse for you to deal with - in my opinion. It's more empowering to walk away.
yes I could do that but he doesn’t respond to comfort. Instead he wallows in self pity and responds with manipulation. He should consider himself lucky. He wasn’t thrown into a nursing home with strangers, he is cared for, cooked for, protected and loved and he’s still ungrateful..
When I was little, my grandmother lived with us and was a religious fanatic. She would sneak her religious friends over to the house when my mother was working part time in the afternoons. When I came home from school, they would corner me and tell me how I was so bad and going to **** for all my sins, and filled with "the devil" and all that ****. At first it frightened me, and then it angered me. It was really just more of the indoctrination I was taught in parochial school though, and wound up opening my eyes to the *. *. behind organized religion. Eventually, I'd wind up telling these religious zealots to leave me alone, I was a good person and they weren't going to convince me otherwise. God loves ALL of His children, period, that's the message folks, regardless of the dogma others are pushing.
It's sad your father is so frightened of God that it's ruining the quality of his Earthly life. It sounds like he's always been this way but dementia has magnified his fear, which is common. See about getting him medicated for anxiety.
And leave his presence when the holy rolling begins. Remind him that God loves ALL of His children each time he starts in with the nonsense about hell and the "devil".
That's all you can do.
It's not funny, it's not something you should just suck up butter cup, it's a valid complaint and something nobody should have forced down their throat all the time. It's fine to have beliefs. What's not fine is to impose them on others.
Fave, obsessively writing out his sins can be seen as a symptom. If you want to get him some relief, I would highly recommend a consult with a geri-psych.
"Rumination"-- chewing over past events, actions and wrongs--is often greatly relieved by certain antidepressant medication.
My husband won’t take a bar of preaching. dad tried it on with him only once Hubby told him it was all nonsense, confession was ** and Catholics are brainwashed. Dad has never said another word.
A friend was devastated when her devoutly Catholic grandmother told her she was going to **** for being two months' pregnant at her wedding (the wedding that happened BECAUSE my friend was two months pregnant and very religious, too).
I told her she should have told her grandmother to save her a seat -- the old bat. 😡
Just tell your dad you'll see him there and move on to another subject.
I’m an atheist from a pious Christian family. I just nod along and offer platitudes about how nobody is perfect, How their pastor might help them repent. Then redirect the conversation.
I like this:
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. ~ often attributed to Marcus Aurelius (but in question)
Bit of confusion there Barb sorry. What I mean is that he worries constantly about confessing his sins and rewrites them obsessively. Yes he does lecture me but not to the extent of when I was living under his roof. But he’s worried that he is going to hell for whatever he did when he was young, he also tells me that his mother didn’t like him, which would account for his misogynistic views on women. But I can’t be dragged into his guilt.
If there is dementia involved, even if you say, “Dad, you’re RIGHT! I’m a huge sinner, and I will do EXACTLY as you say!”, he will forget what you just said.
He will also forget any cold drink spilled on him.
He’ll also forget that you walked out of the room.
In a month or two, he may be in another loop of thoughts and questions.
You say in your profile that your father suffers from dementia, so you understand that his brain is broken and will never get better, right? What he fixates on may change as his dementia worsens, but as his child you must try and understand that he may not be able to control what keeps on going through his mind and what he says. The experts say that the best thing to do with someone with any of the dementias is to meet them right where they're at, meaning that if he starts talking about his religious beliefs and even if you don't agree with them, that you just acknowledge what's been said and not try and argue with him about it, as that will only make things worse for you both, as it sounds you've already discovered. And also just so you're aware it's very common for folks with dementia to become narcissistic especially as the disease progresses. And if they were narcissistic before it can only get worse with dementia. I'm hoping you are educating yourself about the disease as knowledge is key and it helps you better understand what your father is going through.
Yes Thanks funky grandma. I’m looking up different things all the time to find the right way to react without getting irritated, and yes his narcissism has got worse with dementia although I’m not sure what stage he is at. I was raised catholic but I’m afraid I’m not as devout as my father is. I’ll tell you this story. When my mum was dying in hospital, we had a priest come and give her the last rites and we said prayers with her. My sister in law is a non believer and was very antagonistic when my father genuinely apologized to her for the prayer service which didn’t take long in any case. Well, she abused him verbally for apologizing just because she was non Catholic and because she said he made her feel bad and why didn’t he have a go at my husband who is also non catholic. She made a complete exhibition and stormed out of the hospital and was on the phone to her mother. But whatever her reasons were for that outburst, she completely ruined the occasion for my father and all of us really. My brother of course ran after her like a scared rabbit. But he always has done. My sister and I were disgusted with her behavior but she’s always been a drama queen. I feel very sorry for my father as he is lost without Mum and they were very close.
Favegirl1, Bring a nice cold iced tea to the parent, sit down to listen. Then open your hands holding them up high, shouting "Praise the Lord!". As you lift your hands, be sure to spill the iced tea on the lap, then leave.
Like Barbs suggestion. Maybe even going as far as saying he just worry about himself and don't worry about you. Then tell him that religion and politics are not spoken about in your home because both only cause conflict.
Yes he is worrying about himself only and I try to remember that it’s his dementia that has made the narcissistic traits worse. Especially as he had been that way all his life.
😊 My answers are usually pretty inflammatory. When he says to me that he doesn’t want to go to **** all the bad things that he’s done, I say to him that I’ve accepted that I’m an ******* (or worse profanities) why can’t you? Im going to ****.
The only way I know to cope is to not participate in the conversation at all. You’ll have to change the topic, say it’s not up for discussion, leave the room, leave the house, whatever it takes to refuse the topic each and every time. I see your father lives in your home, that’s a privilege you’re allowing him and it should be a peaceful home for you. Decide not to allow conversation that makes you miserable and stick to it
I'd be asking him if he is so worried about going to **** for his 'sins', why did he commit them in the first place?
You are also concerned for him, because he is making himself unhappy. Unfortunately this is the same as for many other dementia-related behaviors, including very different things like refusing to wear a fall alert. You can’t force them to change (or persuade, encourage, cajole etc). Treat it as just one type of anxiety issue, and talk to the doctor. Meds might help.
And I can appreciate some of the levity that others tried to express in their comments to you because it helps shift and lighten the mood, and sometimes it's necessary.
It sounds like your dad has had this mindset for most of his life and it's ingrained in him...it's like a loop in his head...and like others have commented, at this point, just changing the topic..non responses..walking away.. shifting gears is what I would think is the easiest recourse...responding or engaging in the topics with him would be worse for you to deal with - in my opinion. It's more empowering to walk away.
by calling in the priest (same religion as your father).
It's sad your father is so frightened of God that it's ruining the quality of his Earthly life. It sounds like he's always been this way but dementia has magnified his fear, which is common. See about getting him medicated for anxiety.
And leave his presence when the holy rolling begins. Remind him that God loves ALL of His children each time he starts in with the nonsense about hell and the "devil".
That's all you can do.
It's not funny, it's not something you should just suck up butter cup, it's a valid complaint and something nobody should have forced down their throat all the time. It's fine to have beliefs. What's not fine is to impose them on others.
Thanks Lealonnie.😊
"Rumination"-- chewing over past events, actions and wrongs--is often greatly relieved by certain antidepressant medication.
Have fun with it! You're missing out on some comedy gold here.
Show up in a burqa next time you see them, then sit back, relax, and wait for the fun to unfold.
Get him out of your home as well if his behavior upsets you so much.
I told her she should have told her grandmother to save her a seat -- the old bat. 😡
Just tell your dad you'll see him there and move on to another subject.
I like this:
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.
~ often attributed to Marcus Aurelius (but in question)
My mom, who was very religious and devout became obsessed after she developed dementia that she was a terrible person.
Her fears centered around Hell and the IRS. Getting the chaplain to talk to her, going to confession, none of that helped.
Antidepressant medications did.
He will also forget any cold drink spilled on him.
He’ll also forget that you walked out of the room.
In a month or two, he may be in another loop of thoughts and questions.
The experts say that the best thing to do with someone with any of the dementias is to meet them right where they're at, meaning that if he starts talking about his religious beliefs and even if you don't agree with them, that you just acknowledge what's been said and not try and argue with him about it, as that will only make things worse for you both, as it sounds you've already discovered.
And also just so you're aware it's very common for folks with dementia to become narcissistic especially as the disease progresses. And if they were narcissistic before it can only get worse with dementia.
I'm hoping you are educating yourself about the disease as knowledge is key and it helps you better understand what your father is going through.
Bring a nice cold iced tea to the parent, sit down to listen.
Then open your hands holding them up high, shouting
"Praise the Lord!".
As you lift your hands, be sure to spill the iced tea on the lap, then leave.
"I'm sure glad that you're prepared for the next life, Dad".
Im going to ****.