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I'm so sorry that mom is reading hospice care.

For your own sake, you need to step back and let this take its course.
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I went to the store to pick up some things for mom, water filter, some jogging pants (all her pants were swimming on her since she lost so much weight), things for the house etc & stopped home to check in my doggies.
So I called mom & told her I'd like to come over & bring her stuff & also one of my pups so I did & I wasn't there an hour & she got pretty upset when we were talking about the earlier visit during the afternoon w/the nurse.

Mom says "I don't like Lorraine"..
"Do you like her?".
I answered "yes, she was very nice, she was very thorough & took her time examining you, explaining everything & answering our questions".

Mom says "no, I don't like her, she kept pushing that hospice & I don't need that.. not yet, I don't need that".

But she DOES need some help, she continues to call me at work & screams at me that she's in pain, to go pick up her pain patch @ the Walgreens, she says "it's ready, go get it right now".
I call the Walgreens & they say "no, it's not ready because we need a doctor to prescribe the prescription it has expired & we don't see a primary doctor listed for your mom..

My mom never went to meet her new doctor after her old one left the staff & the hospital so she's basically w/out a primary doctor..every time I told her she needed to get in to see the new doctor, it would turn into an argument & she say "you're upsetting me, I don't want to talk about it".

I told her "mom, I'm at work & will go as soon as I'm finished, and also told her they can't fill it yet because she doesn't have a doctor"..

She screams at me again & says "my God, I'm dying, can't you handle that, tell them I need the prescription!!"

She screams back & says "your mother is dying over here & you're telling me to wait!!"..

This has happened a few times now since she's been home for the hospital..


So back to the nurses visit.
I said "mom, she's not trying to push anything on you, she's suggesting based on her professional medical knowledge of what she feels you are going to have a better quality of life with, and that entails have nurses who can be called anytime of the day or night, a doctor who will come to the house to make visits"..

So mom gets really angry & says to me "YOU planned this whole thing right?
You scheduled her to come here & push the hospice didn't you?"

I said "no mom, the doctors & the social workers suggested it when you were discharged from the hospital"..they gave me the brochures & contact numbers to call".
She said ""but you knew it was for hospice didn't you"?
She kept saying "are you on my side or what!"

I knew what she was trying to do, my mom is constantly shaming me & wanting me to feel guilty and I don't know why she's doing this..

Is this a common thing when people get sick?

I told her "all I'm trying to do is help you & get help for you the best way I can, I'm not plotting anything, why am I a villain??"

She didn't answer & I was getting pretty upset so I told her I'm was tired & was going to go home..
Should I just make the sign of the cross & make peace w/the idea that my mom doesn't want any outside help, no one there to monitor her health or anything, only me & when she's alone in the house, in her weakened state if she should fall or have an emergency I may not be able to get to her in time & she can die.

How can a person psychologically be "ok" w/that & not feel "guilty".??
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You have done the best you could. You do not need to forgive yourself because you have done nothing wrong. You cannot blame yourself for what has happened to your mother. You are not to blame for surviving, living, and taking care of yourself. Just because your mother cannot do it does not mean you should blame yourself for carrying on with your life. What is happening to your mother is beyond your control. Acknowledge and honor your right to protect yourself and your own interests especially standing up for yourself and setting healthy boundaries. For whatever reason, your mother is being very oppressive and domineering and that isn't your fault and you cannot give her the care she needs.

You have been doing great trying to get our very dysfunctional health care non-system to give proper care to your mother. The outcome is not your fault. Your mother is very ill. Make peace with that fact and be kind to yourself.
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Hangingon61, to some degree I think that "blaming"/accusing is relatively normal. My grandparents often "didn't like" people (e.g. dr who said gpa had to stop driving.) A lot of people turn their feelings outward when they get overwhelmed. You (and now Lorraine) are the closest to her, so you unfortunately get the brunt.

Your mom must be panicking and possibly feeling some regret; is there anyway she could talk to a counselor even once or twice? Even something like Catholic Charities or the American Cancer Society might offer low-cost or free counseling in your area. The ACS also has this on their website in the "Treatment and Support" section: "the American Psychosocial Oncology Society (APOS), can connect you to someone within 2 business days through their toll-free service at 1-866-276-7443." Even if your mom won't talk to someone, it might help if you could talk to somebody.

I don't think your mom is the first person to approach her health problems this way. A lot of people are in denial when they get a serious diagnosis. There have to be medical professionals (doctors, hospice staff, social workers) who've encountered people who are in your mom's boat. Has her primary dr (or whoever it was you dealt with at the hospital) offered for her to speak to an oncologist? She probably needs to talk to someone who can tell her in a gentle but objective manner how other people have handled things. Maybe not having someone say "This is going to happen to you" but instead "This is what most other people have the best outcome with" might be helpful. (Even if Lorraine or another hospice nurse came back out it might help clarify things for your mom.)

Your mom having hospice in place I think will be relief to you and to her. She needs to be at peace with the decision though. But don't forget that as much as this is about your mom, you are also are experiencing this as her daughter -- it is too much for you to also need to be her medical manager, therapist, errand girl, housekeeper and nurse too. That would be too much for anyone. You have a right to tell your mom that you need help too.
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Lindy, the mom is not on Hospice. She is resisting signing up.

Hanging, they have told you that the cancer has spread certainly to her lungs and possibly to her brain. The fact that the cancer has spread to her brain could be the reason for her illogical thinking. Or maybe she's never been a logical person.

If she doesn't go on hospice, who is going to be prescribing and managing her pain meds? Does she have a doctor yet?

Can you ask her why she fears hospice? Does she understand that without hospice, it's going to be very very difficult for YOU?
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Ooooh my hangingon,
you have had sooo much patience

Keep crawling or running here for
help!!!!

Still kinda in same d*mn boat as you and learning from your journey with your mom...I can sympathize with you but have no correct or wise answers, yet. That's why i come here
😍
My mind is like in a mixing bowl everyday...1 stubborn, difficult, dysfunctional parent, and a whole lotta luv...throw in whatever ya want and see what ya get...ugh for me...but that word "love", which is the main
ingredient in my bowl, is changing to a "tough" ❤️ love


This is sooo hard....thinking of you and still watching and listening how
you and your mom get through this.

Come here everyday for your dose of strength and courage hanging on 💕
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My thought that was because she's not on hospice yet, Medicaid/Medicare will still cover doctor's visits. Maybe talking to an oncologist might be beneficial; there are other people who do not receive treatment so it seems like there must be some protocol. The specialist might be able to refer Hangingon's mom to a counseling service or some other support that is offered to cancer patients. Even talking to someone once might help her reframe this a little. And maybe one of those professional's would be able to tell Hangingon and her mom whether the illness could be affecting her cognition (it really seems like it would have to be, as you said.)

Maybe her mom already rejected a consult. If that's the case, I was thinking that the hospice nurse could come out and talk to her mom again, and answer questions the mom might have since it is a difficult decision and the nurses know that.

The thing I don't understand, Hangingon, is that your mom already chose the scariest aspect of hospice (choosing not to treat the illness) but she is refusing all the beneficial aspects that would make that choice less scary for both of you: visiting help, comfort measures, pain relief, spiritual support. Do you think she is just in denial or has social anxiety and doesn't want people around? I wonder if her primary care dr could give her something for anxiety -- sometimes drs will Rx something for the short term when people are going through an episode of accute stress. I really hope for both of you that she comes around quickly on this.
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Yes, she does have some social anxiety & is saying she's not "ready for hospice, I'm not there yet".
But at the same time she's experiencing a LOT of pain in her hip (osteoarthritis) and I & the palliative nurse (Lorraine) explained to her that since she has never been to see her new primary doctor (old doc left the staff & new one took over her patients), mom would need A doctor (presumably the hospice doc) to prescribe pain meds if/when mom needs them but my mom still doesn't want to "officially" sign up for hospice so we're stuck..
She'll scream & complain about the pain to me & I tell her "mom, I can't do anything for the pain, I'm. Not a doc", but then she gets very upset w/me & says "I hope you don't have to go thru this when you get old"..
I'm thinking mom just hopes & prays that she goes in her sleep (major heart attack) before it gets really bad.
I don't know.:(
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Hugs hangingon!!
I hope someone comes here soon to respond and give you some wise advice
Thinking of you dear 💜
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Hangingon,
This may be a question for Lorraine. If your Mom does agree to sign on with Hospice does there have to be a caregiver with her 24/7 to monitor the medications and be responsible for your Mom. I know you don't need anything else to worry about but it is something you need an answer to so you can prepare or get a plan together.

My Stepdad signed up for Hospice thinking they would provide all needed support. Hospice would not allow my Mom to be the required caregiver because she had the beginnings of dementia. I assumed the required caregiver role.

I don't know what the Hospice requirements are in different states/areas. That was just my experience.
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Hopefully there is an inpatient Hospice facility nearby that you can utilize.
(Hugggs)
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Hanging On,
Your Mom has signs of a mental illness which prevents her from getting the help she needs. imo.
There is NO definitive diagnosis yet on the metastasis to lungs and brain. She needed that MRI.
Both you and your Mom are viewing this from a hopeless perspective, and your mother's thinking cannot be trusted.

Say this: "Mom, you will see a doctor for treatment, OR
have hospice come in."
"I am going home now, don't call me until you have a doctor's appointment. If you want to die, you are doing a good job of it, and you cannot take me with you."

"There is hope and you are not accepting it."
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Tina, ask Lorraine to put you in touch with the social worker for Hospice or palliative care. Explain that you cannot be your mom's caregiver and that mom is refusing even pain relief.

Explain that the doctors have told you that there may be brain Mets and THAT may be what is causing your mother's disordered thinking.

Find out what they suggest. Your mother is very ill and deserves pain relief even if she can't request it herself.
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I have spoken w/the social worker a few times since Lorraine has seen mom & the only thing she recommends is to try to convince my mom that having a "team" of helpers (nurses, visiting docs, etc) is going to benefit her & not harm her in anyway.
She also said to tell mom that she is STILL in control of her life..
If for any reason she doesn't think that hospice is working for her, she can stop it.
Also Lorraine did mention that there have been occasions where the patient was doing so well with hospice (they were eating regularly, managing pain, maintained their weight, etc) that they've actually have been discharged from hospice by the agency.
So if my mom thinks that she CAN make those decisions, she may be more accepting of trying it..
We shall see.
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Hangingon, I'm so sorry. I am praying to St. Jude for you and your mom.

Just saw your new message!  That sounds like reasonable advice -- maybe it will resonate with your mom.  It sounds like Lorraine "gets" where your mom is coming from.  I hope you are doing ok.
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Yes, mom is in control of her life; you just need to remind her that YOU are in control of YOURS, and not hers.

If she doesn't understand that YOU are not in charge of getting her pain control meds, then you need Lorraine to understand that.
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