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When my father wanted to move here after my mom passed, I told him I had no problem with it but, I would need to close my daycare (after 32 years) and wouldnt be able to work outside the house as I would need to take care of him. He agreed it fair to pay me what I would make if i had 2 children in care full time. As POA on his account, I went ahead and wrote 2 checks a month, once on the 1st, once on the 16th. I paid for all food out of this for him, and some other small items. If/when he needed clothes, supplements, his cigs, meds, etc I wrote checks from his account directly to the store so there is a paper trail.

Fast forward to now. I have no money set aside because as utilities went up and food costs, some expenses out of pocket I didnt take from his account to cover extra expenses. Once all bills were paid no extra money set aside because there wasnt any extra. Scares the heck out of me because we almost lost our house last summer and worried about what I am going to do the day my dad will no longer be with us and the time it will take to restart my daycare and/or find a job outside the house. I cant risk losing my house again!

I am considering taking enough money to cover 3 months of mortgage and utilities from his account, which adds up to what he said was fair to him in the beginning, and setting it aside in another account to be sure i can pay those bills until I reopen my daycare, which may not happen until beginning of September (going to take that long to attend an orientation beginning of August and go through the app and process which they said could take 6 weeks!). Then to find the kids. I am good for this month, so the money would carry me at least until October.

Does anyone know if i can get in trouble for that? I have a friend who is a paralegal who has told me to do it, but then I have someone else telling me I could be hit with a lien against my house.

If it matters, the only ones left will be myself and my sister and there is a will. So it is spelled out who gets what. I honestly dont care about the money, but i worry about almost losing my house again!

I am looking for an elder law attorney today to talk to.

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my cousin had POA over my uncle...who lost his eye sight the last couple years. i was to inherit a some money...and i asked attorney for statements for the last year of his life...all i got was the last few months after he died. she was using his money for her personal use...and had deposits and withdrawals ... even a macy's charge which she said was done in error! right! the attorney didn't seem to care about any of my concerns! and to hire my own attorney would have cost me a fortune!! but...for peace of mind...i would get an attorney, get it on paper and take everything you need to care for your dad AND THEN SOME!! I DID...NO ONE WANTED TO HELP ME!!
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See Elder attorney... I do not know where you are located? But YES you would get in trouble if you took a lump sum out of your Father's money. Was your Father in the military? What diagnosis's does your Father have. in Florida we can get an Equity loan your Elder attorney can direct you on that. And direct you on what other services are available to help you and your family.
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As long as you are taking care of him to the end (not depleting his estate to put him in medicade), you are allowed to have him gift you and your sister at least $13,000 a year each.
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I would ask an elder law attorney in the area as laws vary. If you are in the USA, explain what money you've taken, when,and why, and see if you're eligible to be gifted the legal amount you can receive without being taxed on it.Has he been declared incapacitated? They will want to know this.Hoping you can get a few complimentary meet and greets with elder lawyers over the phone to find someone knowledgeable who seems to care about your family's best interests.
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Cowpatti12: Spending money on sweepstakes that promise big windfalls are scams! I know one (now deceased) elder whose husband caught onto the wife's sweepstakes entries who were OCD. He had to set up a Post Office Box so she could no longer get her hands on the mail.They were going in debt fast!
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Oops didn't finish. Cowpatti, unless your parents are quite wealthy, $500 weekly spending on sweepstakes is quite alarming. So yes, as POA you must act in your dementia diagnosed parents best interests and stop their imprudent spending. Explain to them, along with your sister's support, that their spending this way is not sustainable given their future health needs. If they say it's their money or they don't care, then you need to act as POA or give it up and let the chips fall where they may. And you sound quite responsible and concerned for your parents, so I know you don't want to give it up. Sometimes the best decisions are the hardest decisions when caregiving our elderly parents. My journey is half over as my parents are now deceased but my very elderly in laws are still alive. Hang in there.
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Cowpatti12 -- As I mentioned above, a trusted elder law attorney is worth their weight in gold. Speak to one today. You do not want to commingle funds. Your parents have dementia and previously designated you as POA.
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Mwyatt -- please heed Igloo572's advice. Dad will incur BIG look back penalties should he ever need Medicaid, which most elderly end up on when residing in a nursing home. As POA, you are obligated to act in your Dad's best interest, not your own. Dad future custodial needs take precedent. Contact an elder law attorney if you are unsure the duties of a POA.

You don't say where dad is going to live in September when you plan to reopen your daycare. Would this be in your home with Dad also living there? All monies he gave you to live with you will count as a gift, if you didn't have a proper caregivers contract written up by an attorney. A paralegal is NOT an attorney. Get advice from a top elder law attorney before you write anymore checks out to yourself.

Lastly, Dad's care will get more complicated as he ages. Good luck and let us know what your attorney advises.
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Both parents have dementia. On 7-20-16 my Mother was told she was and that I should handle her finances. She has agreed to let me in our family meeting. My mother spends about 300.00 to 500.00 in the sweepstakes either by checks or CASH WEEKLY. My sister and I are jt. on their accounts and I am the POA. I don't want them to feel that I want their money taken away from them. But I feel like I must do something to protect it for their care.
Is it possible to open a new account FOR THE BENIFIT OF THEM? Not doing a trust? They have one and did not want this money in the trust?
Mean while I have opened a post office box for them-which will help in the scams? Unless they change it back which they can.?
Sounds like I need an Elder law attorney also.
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Wyatt - not to sound harsh but your saying "honestly i dont care about the money" is a bit disingenuous as your post is really all about money. So what exactly is changing this summer with dad & you that is enabling you to reopen your daycare center this coming fall??

Is dad somehow better that he doesn't need caregiving OR has moved to stay with Sissy OR is it that dad is /has moved into a facility?

If its the latter & dad is now at a facility and is applying or has applied for medicaid to pay for his NH.....all that $ dad gave you will trigger a transfer penalty inquiry by medicaid which totally will effect his eligibility for medicaid which in turn places a bill by the facility to you or whomever is on file at the NH for dads financial responsibility. I'd bet this is what your friend was getting at by their telling you that you face having a lien placed on your home (by the facility for nonpayment of dads care).

Really your situation has many red flags, you need an eldercare atty advise & ASAP. I'd be concerned that your personal financial situation - business closed & being at the edge of foreclosure recently - and using dads $ to keep your household afloat may pose APS /or POA fiduciary issues in addition to Medicaid transfer penalty issues.

What's in a will only matters if deceased had assets that becomes his estate.
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Medicaid, if he ever needs it, will look back five years. Check with an attorney like suggested.
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I just got to thinking after reviewing this thread again. I don't see how someone can put a lien on a house that already has a lien by the bank if you're paying a mortgage, the bank already owns the house until it's paid. If the bank already owns the house, I would think the only one who could take the house is the person buying it by paying it off.

As for the day care, I think it would've been a better idea to keep the day care open and just hire staff to run the place. I don't know what your set up at the daycare was, I've never dealt with a daycare business before. However, it would've been a far better idea to keep it open, and nearly losing your home to the bank should be a lesson learned as to why you should keep other income coming in. Never ever ever give up your day job, and nearly losing one's home is only one example of why do you keep your day job. What I would've done instead is have the elder hire me part-time instead of full-time, especially if I had a daycare to run. Let this be a lesson learned why not to quit your day job, it could cost you dearly in the end
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Mywatt1214: Personally, I don't think you should have closed your daycare business, but that's a moot point now. What happens when the funds run out?
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I don't really understand your situation. When it comes to elders and money, I usually don't.

However, your mother passed away & your dad wanted to come live with you. Why did you have to shut down the day care, and why couldn't you work outside the house? What kind of "care" did your father need? It sounds odd that you bought his food separately from your own food, and paid for it separately as well. I don't know how much money he was giving you, but it couldn't have been that much if all you used it for was food and some other small items.

You speak in one paragraph as if you want to take 3 months of money to pay for expenses "just in case" your father isn't living there anymore & until you re-start the daycare----then you say that you ARE re-starting the daycare in September. Where is your father? Is he still living with you? Is he in a LTC facility now? If he went into a LTC facility, all of his expenses and expenditures must be able to be tracked, or it will be considered "gifts" and the LTC facility could definitely put a lien on your house to get that money back. If he is not in a LTC facility, he doesn't need room/board at your house anymore, and I would be very careful about writing yourself checks for a 3 month advance. It really has nothing to do with a will---the LTC facility wants their money before he goes on Medicaid & they'll do whatever it takes to get it, including suing you for the money.

I know hindsight is 20/20, but from the very beginning, finances should have been more distinctly divided and recorded in a legal fashion. He was paying you what you would have made taking care of 2 kids at the day care. However, he is not 2 kids----he is one elderly adult that requires much different care. He also lived in your house 24/7, so some sort of "rent" should have been figured in there as well. I find your post to be a bit confusing.
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Definitely go see the attorney. Unfortunately some lines may have already been crossed. For instance - I'm assuming your father is still alive, are you planning on placing him in a care facility and restarting you business now? If so and it becomes necessary to apply for Medicaid for your dad - if there was not a written agreement in place regarding him paying "rent" any checks written to you might be viewed as gifts and throw a wrench into things. Hopefully an attorney can help tidy things up. If I have learned one thing regarding adult children caring for a loved one at home, it is - do not take a penny without getting everything into a contract - how much you will be compensated for your work, how much money will be paid toward rent, expenses etc. This is all so important for the caregivers future after the loved one passes but also for the living loved one should Medicaid become necessary. Too many caregivers find themselves broke and homeless after giving so much of themselves - they deserve better.
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I agree with Churchmouse. You need to see and Elder Lawyer. I did when my parents first moved in with me to care for them. There are so many little things you don't know. You will need to make up a contract stating everything you do for your dad, food, living expense...I don't believe he can pay your mortgage unless the amount you charge him to live with you is the mortgage amount but it has to come from you. It is very complicated as I just lived it. I got an elder lawyer 5 yrs ago when they moved in, dad passed 5 months later and I cared for mom up until May as she is now in a Nursing Home Long Term Care with Alzheimer. There are certain amounts that can be taken but only and elder lawyer could tell you what that is and when you can take it and how often. I have just applied for Medicaid with the Elder Attorney and I'm glad I had all my i's dotted and t's crossed. Everything must be documented legally. I would never undertake some one else money as POA and do as I please, even if it is to help pay the mortgage..it's not legal. Ex: My parents said they would pay for a housecleaning. I was going to write the check to the housecleaner from their account but the lawyer said "no" it comes out whatever amount you have your contract with your parents. I would have made a big mistake especially now applying for Medicaid as they go back 5 yrs. Hope this was helpful to you.
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As long as he actually agreed to this kind of arrangement, I really don't see where there would be a problem as long as it's in writing and you both signed it in a written contract. However, it's up to the both of you to uphold the agreement. As for taking three months worth of money out of his account, I would discuss this with him and make sure he agrees with it. I wouldn't just go in without him knowing and take the money because you never know what kind of plans he may have or whether or not you may cut him short
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Agree that seeking attorney help is the right path. POA powers differ, and so it impossible to say whether you have authority to transfer the funds to you under its terms. Based on what you have said, the arrangement should be fine if there is a written agreement that you will return the money if it turns out there is no interuprtion before your business gets started again. Depending on your father's resources, another option is to make an equal transfer to your sister, again provided that the POA gives the authority for that. Good luck!
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A caregiver agreement need to be in place. Go to an elder law attorney.
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My mom's elder care attorney drew up a very simple healthcare contract about two years ago for me that all parties (my siblings and mom) have seen and agree to that reads so much per hour 7 days per week. We can dissolve it at any time. (My coworkers and I were let go from our home transcription hospital account jobs we thought we'd have forever. Long story short, I sold my house and paid cash for another, and we manage just fine). The lawyer did charge $1000 but assured me he has never been challenged by anyone about contracts like these. It helped me even tax-wise, which I was not expecting. Frankly, my plan is to retire at the end of this year and dissolve the contract, but it's enabled me to take care of mom in my home at this point and not have to look for another job plus have an outside service come into my home (who'd charge probably double what I've agreed to be paid), and to avoid placing her just yet. It also will enable me to be able to choose whether or not we want to place mom in memory care after this year should we decide that way. She's not quite to the unmanageable state just yet. It's been a win-win for us.
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Take your own advice! :) Go and see that elder law attorney. Please let us know what s/he says. Did you get anything down on paper about what your father agreed to pay? And take the paper trail too, ideally summarised on some kind of spreadsheet. It should be reasonable for your father to have been paying what his actual care costs and living expenses were, so it sounds as if *he* may be in arrears on that score - in which case perhaps you may be able to recoup something there?
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