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I live and care for my grandfather. He is 83, still drives and still works full time. He has displayed increasingly odd behavior, but for right now I am focusing on his driving abilities. He has had 4 accidents in the last 12 months.
None of the accidents where serious but he told me he cannot turn his neck to look so he just doesn't. I have been in the car with him and feared for my life.
My question is how do I go about taking his license away? I don't think he's slipping enough to have him deemed incompetent, but he's headed down that road. I don't want an accident to be the determining factor. Is there a way to have him take a mandatory test to determine his driving capabilities?
I live in Louisiana if it makes a difference state to state.

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I don't know how it works in the USA but in Canada once you have a dementia diagnosis, the DMV is notified. Then the DMV calls you in and you have to go through a series of tests to determine whether or not you can safely drive. For my mom she failed these tests, so her license was taken away. She did not like this at all. We took her car keys away and sent the DMV her drivers license.
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Hello everyone, i have to apologize for the disappearing act. I really had to go mia for a while though. We've been living a nightmare over here. I was so frustrated i couldnt think about it any more then necessary. (Please excuse any typos im on my phone and its harder to type)
I wanted to catch everyone up with this situation and everything that has happened since i posted the original question.
After I posted it i reached out to his doctors and my mother and uncle to try and get something done. His doctors would not even talk to me because i am not power of attorney. My mother and uncle are both power of attorney over finances and medical. Uncle absolutely would not do anything. He refused to beleive that paw paw may not be altogether right. My mother has her own medical problems (they removed her thyroid which has left her emotionally unstable esp when dealing with stressful situations). The house we live in belongs to my paw paw. Every thing mom tried to do he would threaten to kick her out, yell at her and leave her in her bedroom crying. And i could not convince either uncle or mom that it was time to seek an elder attorney and have him deemed incompetent. Mom just thought she was overrearcting or going crazy, which of coarse my uncle didnt disaude. He just didnt want to deal with it. Despite paw paw having at least two more accidents (that we have discovered) that he hid from us and the insurance company. Ibwas so frustrated and there was nothing i could do.
Well now we have no choice. If there was any doubt that he was at the beginning stages of dementia there isnt now.
One of the girlfriends apparently is involved with a fake check scam (and has been to jail prior for exactly this). She convinced him to deposit a fake check for 200,000 dollars into his account and give her money before it cleared. Of coarse the bank found out it was fake, froze his account and he is under invetisgation for fraud. As i mentioned he is a security guard. Once his job finds out he is being investigated for a felony they will fire him. It goes against his contract. I have debated over calling them.
We spoke to the police and pretty much the only thing we can do (according to the officer we spoke to) is have him deemed incompetent. Thats the only way to keep him from being charged (because he knew that it was probably fake when he deposited it)
He had NO CLUE that it is illegal to deposit a fake check. He knew that it was probably fake BUT DEPOSITED IT ANYWAY because he thought if it was the bank would just reject it and hed pay a fine and that would be that. He was convinced for 2 days that mom was making the whole thing up. Now hes convinced that the bank messed up. He understands now that he is in legal trouble, but does not understand the gravity of it or what is going to have to happen to fix it. Hes been walking around saying hes going to sue the bank.
The only good thing is his account is frozen. He cant touch a dime of it until the investigation is over. Then they will close his account and he cannot get another one. (Hes now on the chex list). The bad thing is because my mom and uncles names where both also on the account they may suffer from this too.
We are no longer worried about him loosing everything. Now we are just terrified that he will go to jail!
We have an appointment with an elder attorney to start on the journey of declaring him incompetent.
Everyday is different with him right now. One day he seems like he understands he in trouble and the next he doesnt. One day hes compliant and the next hes telling mom hes going to throw her out on the street. This has just been awful. Hes become very child like. When we explained that we would have to take his drivers liscense he responded with "Well if yall do that ill sell the house, thriw yall out, and let myself die!"
Hes been telling mom hes going to kick her out because of grudges hes apparently held onto for years. (Its stupid stuff. Like when she was a teenager she backed into a poll. One time she got a dog he didnt like etc)
Ugh. This was not at all what we feared, it was completly unexpected. And it looks like he is going to fight us every step of the way.
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Blaster! How are you doing and how goes your project??? Keep us posted!
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Blaster, I was going to suggest that the employees with whom your GF works get together and make arrangements to pick him up and take him home for work. My thinking was that this was an active man who needed the stimulation of work as an incentive to keep going.

However, after reading your revelations about the women, I'm beginning to wonder if he should be working or out and about since apparently he's meeting these gold diggers somehow. On the other hand, I'm sure he's going to react strongly when his mobility is compromised. Your family is going to be facing some tough times when he reacts.

Since the insurance underwriter has already taken a stand, they might be the ones to contact law enforcement; they would already have copies of the police reports of the accidents. That would keep you from being the one to contact the DMV or whatever agency manages drivers' licenses.

I skimmed through your posts again but didn't see any reference to your grandfather having executed a durable power of attorney, although I could have missed it. Has he executed one?

Someone needs to act quickly to secure his funds. I don't have a lot of experience with dementia, and am not sure that the younger women episodes are a reflection of dementia or just his male ego (with apologies to any men who might be offended by that remark - it isn't intended that way).

One of these often silly reality shows features older, much older women, and their younger male friends. I wonder if they have dementia or if there are self esteem and psychological issues. Could your GF be in a similar situation? Was he always gullible with women? Does he have a need to help people? If so, the giving of money might be the only way he feels he can help someone now. Does he give to a lot of charities as well, not necessarily because they're favorite ones but because he responds to solicitations?

Not to diminish the impact and seriousness of his driving, I still maintain that distracted drivers playing with their cell or smartphones are just as much of a driving hazard as seniors. The latter can't help their decline in motor skills; the former are too obsessed with their gadgets to pay attention to their driving. Who's more to blame? Someone who can't or someone who won't drive properly?
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Blaster, yes these things do really need to be done and I'm glad you will make those calls in the morning. What is done is done and can't be undone. Thus, any guilt from that does not help. However, you will avoid feeling guilty about things by getting this dealt with.

I'm sure your mother is outreached. I'm surprised that she hasn't taken steps beyond just being beyond herself. If this is all due to dementia, she might need some help to work through her anger to see that the man is sick in his head.

I'm glad "Make it so" made you laugh. Take no prisoners in getting rrrrrrrrrr done!
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Blaster, now your grandfather is reminding me of another older man I know that has vascular dementia and bipolar disorder. He was giving a lot of money away foolishly. He has a super big ego, so he figured it was all his charm. But his children knew it was his money. He had a lot. What they did was to petition the court to appoint a conservator. The court approved the petition and now a conservator handles all the money. The man only receives a certain allowance for spending money.

If your grandfather has a good bit of money, you may want to go this route to keep him from giving it to the young woman. Even if they don't have dementia, many men are always hopeful that they appeal to younger women. This makes them vulnerable.
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cmagnum, I will start making calls in the morning. My mother is completely beside herself. She is so upset. He's started lying to us about random things. Like "Paw Paw did you leave that food on the table?" "No that wasn't me your mom left that there." But I know full well that Mom was right next to me outside in the garden.
I have been so worried about this for so long, and I'm never sure if I'm making decisions out of guilt, or if these things really do need to be done.
thank you for that! I was crying but the Star Trek quote made me laugh a little.
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Woooo! OMG You need to see if you or your mother can seek guardianship or conservatorship over him. He will be taken in and relieved of the money he will need for his future care. Try to find an elder law attorney to help you. Depending on how rural you are, you may have to travel to a larger city. Maybe you could do a phone consult with someone? Just be sure to document all the things you typed here!

You have a huge job ahead. If he is spending tens of thousands on floozies and doesnt have enough for groceries, he IS NOT competant.
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Blaster, I'd get him evaluated for dementia and incompentency first for this may well be at the heart of all of the other issues you need to address and will become mute as well as much easier to deal with if this is his health condition. All I can add is what the Star Trek captain always said, "Make it so!"
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Blaster, has he been evaluated by a doctor for dementia. His foolish decisions over these girlfriends may be coming from that. I'm sure this must upset your mother very much.

If his current doctors will not evaluate him, then you need to find another doctor and preferably one who specializes in gerontology. If he's deemed incompetent, then someone need to file for guardianship in order to take full control of his money before he gives it all away to his girlfriends. It may even be possible to get temporary guradianship once you have a diagnosis of incompetency for the sake of safe guarding his money which is also your mom's money. Please make some calls in the morning, get some appointments made and get the ball rolling.

If your mom is of sound mind, she must might be able to open a new account in her name, move all of the money there which would cut off him having money to give away.
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And on top of all this I know I'm going to have to find a way to take his license away from him!
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Mincemeat, I completely agree. I don't understand why there aren't more laws or avenues to go about relieving these kinds of situations. I can't even imagine what that must be like, I am so sorry to hear that you have to live with that type of reminder. This is exactly what I fear the most when it comes to his driving.
The driving thing is just one of the many problems we have been having to deal with. There is a whole list of things,most of which we have found out, our hands are tied on.
He recently "fell in love" with a 30 year old waitress who worked (she was fired after failing a drug test and had to go back to mandatory rehab) at the Waffle House. She is a drug addict and ex-con. She has a tear drop tattoo on her face and the state has taken her children away from her.
We have been fighting with him everyday over this woman. She has now convinced him that he needs to give her a crazy amount of money, supposedly so she can hire a lawyer and get her kids back.
We have been in contact with her sister and brother in law who now have custody of her children. They begged us to make him stop giving her money. But he insists that they are in love and she is not a drug addict.
This is his second girlfriend. The one before her was 26 and once again they where completely and totally in love. Until he gave her $17,000 and bought her a car and then never saw her again. She just recently heard about his new girlfriend and has begun calling him again for money.
We've contacted everyone we possibly can from his doctor to the council of aging here and no one can help us. We can't do anything about this but watch these women take his money and then we spend all of ours trying to buy groceries so he has something to eat.
He cannot cook alone, last time he set the microwave on fire. So now I cook for him.
I'm really stressed out and worried and I have no idea what to do, and no one can help me. My Mom is the only other family member who seems to even care.
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"All of his accidents"!! Let's get serious here. No amount of cameras is going to prevent the inevitable. He's going to hurt himself and others. You must realise that this has to end.
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4 accidents in 12 months? I'm surprised the car insurance agent has not been in touch with a ya'll. I would think his premiums have gone up if they were all his fault and the company had to pay for repairs.

Like someone else has suggested, get him to a doctor to see what he thinks. However, since elderly parents like to put on their best for the doctor, I would communicate with the doctor in advance about your concerns outside of anyone being able to hear you on the phone.
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I live in a small town, too. The woman that would have been pinned under his truck was pregnant, about to deliver. She was at the obstetrician that morning. Every time I see her beautiful son, I get goosebumps and a SICK feeling in my stomach. Therefore but the grace of God, that child is alive. Why is it that something tragic has to happen before some of these pig headed old farts hang it up.
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Mincemeat, I do not know the cop personally, but we live in a very small town and I am sure I can find him. The worst thing he can do is say no. I didn't think about that either, but it is also a good idea.
I can see why this is a touchy topic for you, and I worry every single day about him doing something exactly like that. Thank you!
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I am the daughter of a man who DROVE INTO A BANK and could have killed one of the employees if she would have been sitting at her desk. This will be the hardest thing you ever have to do.

This is a touchy topic form me as you can see. It is a flat miracle that more people are not killed on a daily basis from elderly who should not be driving.

Do you know the cop that he caused the last accident with? Could you enlist his help by him writing a letter that could be taken to the DMV? Somehow, you will have to find a way to get him off the road. I wish you luck and perseverence!
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Windyridge, He is a security gaurd.
He sits in a shack at a gate and reads western books. He presses a button and opens the gate when a truck has to deliver logs.
I also have my Mom helping, but she absolutely won't do it. She desperately doesn't want him to be mad at her, but she is also scared to death that he's going to kill someone. She asked me to figure out what to do. My Uncle will not help at all. Hence why the granddaughter is the one who is doing all the stuff.
He for some reason will not listen to her at all, but he will sometimes listen to me.
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GardenArtist Thank you so much!
I didn't even think about cameras! I think he would be way more willing to that concession then having me drive him everywhere. We can definitely look into installation and give it a try.
His insurance company has told him if he gets into another one they will drop him and put him on file. All of his accidents have occurred because he pulled out in front of someone without looking, or it's possible he just did not see them at all.
One of the most recent ones he pulled out in front a cop because he could not hear or see the sirens.
He's a tough old bird that's for sure. He has major health problems at least once every 9 to 10 months (heart attacks and most recently his colon burst) and then he bounces back fast and remains in excellent health for his age until the next occurrence.
His doctor is really amazed at how he does this.
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PS; can you get someone else to be the bad guy? His doc? A cop he knows? His boss or a co worker? If you're the caregiver try to be the innocent bystander as this thing goes down. With all due respect to other advice, it doesn't sound to me like this guy is gonna ride any bus or participate in ride sharing.
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I know a man who is in this same situation. He is 86, blind in one eye and can't see well out the other. He has no right field vision and can't turn his neck. His car has dents and bumps all over it where he bumps into things. Riding with him is terrible. He stops at stop signs by applying his brake about 10 times before he finally decides he has reached the sign. He swerves from one side of the lane to the other. One could get seasick riding with him, so I refuse to ever to it again. He almost pulled in front of a car the time I was riding with him. I said whoa! to stop him. He talks about other near accidents he has had. I have a feeling the reason that he hasn't had a serious accident is the drivers around him know how to drive.

Still it's like waiting for it to happen. I hope no one else is hurt. This man won't stay home. He goes all day long, looking for company and meals. The only thing that keeps him in is the dark, since he can't see at night. I have talked to him about moving to AL, where he could be around people without having to drive. He thinks he drives fine and wants to stay in his house. (Of course, I wonder why if he wants to stay in his house why he spends the day trying to not be there.)

I don't think his family has addressed the issue at all. They all live in other cities. I'm sure they've noticed the dents all over his car, though. Maybe they have addressed it with him, but he doesn't talk about it to others.

Yes, you can alert the DMV (public safety) about him re-testing. Chances are that he will know that you did it, but what is a family to do when it comes time to stop driving? I feel for the elder, since it is a major loss of freedom. But there are milestones in life that have to be faced. This is one we will all ultimately face if we live long enough. (It will be no problem for me, since I don't like to drive, anyway. I wish I could afford a chauffeur.)
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This is gonna be a tough one. What kind of work does paw paw do? He's 83 and might be getting dementia. I'm sure it's never his fault, he's just fine, it all those other dumb shits etc. This is only going to get worse.

Most states have a system whereby most anyone can report a dangerous elderly driver to the state DMV and have them tested and their license revoked. Good luck with that in Louisiana. Many states don't enforce it. My experience is in WV and the politics there have rendered the statute void.

Do you have anyone to enlist in this issue. Other family, friends etc? I'm sorry to say but it might take some rough and tumble to deal with this. I'm dreading that day with my Dad but it's coming soon. I'll have to physically take the keys, disable the car and hope I have found all the guns in the house.

You can't screw around with this. If he can still reason tell him how bad he'd feel if he killed someone. If he has no idea that he is a danger to himself and others, do what has to be done.
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Blaster, thanks for the update and clarifications. Depending on the age and model of his car, you might want to see if it can get retrofitted with the backup video cameras with monitors in the front between the 2 seats. I personally thought they were cumbersome, but it might be helpful for your GF.

For someone who still works at 83...well, you gotta give him credit for not giving up!

An option for his work commute might be one of the medical transports, although that would be very expensive and it doesn't really sound as if he needs it. There are also the dial-a-ride door to door small bus services of major transit authorities. If his area has any ride-sharing, that's another option, which would also give him the benefit of companionship and conversation during the car pools that would take him to and from work.
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Thank you! And yes I actually quit my job and moved back here from New York to care for him when he was sick for several months after major surgery. My entire life is now all about taking care of him.
He recovered and went back to work, but I cannot justify leaving just to have to quit and move again the next time he gets sick.
He is already being treated for his neck stiffness, which was cause by one of his accidents. And we have already replace his mirrors with different types to help him see better.
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Anonymously contact the state department responsible for motor vehicle licensing and raise the issue with them; they might agree to send him a letter requiring him to appear for a driver's test based on the recent accident(s).

Or contact the insurance company for the people involved in the accidents.
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If he still works full time, are you prepared to drive him to and from work every day?

Before you do anything drastic, why don't you have him see his doctor about his neck stiffness and see if physical therapy could be prescribed. That might help. Also check into different rear view mirrors. I think I've seen fisheye mirrors or something like that.

Good luck!
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He doesn't believe me when I express concern for his driving. He truly believes that he is just fine. He threatens to call the police if we try to take his keys. He is an incredibly stubborn little man. I'm really not sure if he did call the police and we didn't have paperwork proving he is not capable of driving, that they wouldn't just give his keys back to him. He appears most of the time to have his wits about him. But he cannot hear, see or turn his neck at all.
This is why I am asking, to see if anyone knows a legal way to go about it in the state of Louisiana, so that without a doubt his license can be taken and that's the end of it. No calling police or messy arguments.
Can we have him tested by the DMV? Or if we report him anonymously will they make him take a test?? or have his doctor request a test???
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Just be assertive and tell him that he can't drive anymore, that the accidents prove it. The next one might be serious and kill innocent people. Just do it.
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