Should adult children be expected to pay for final burial costs?

What are mom's resources? Is she able to pay her way for care at your sibling's home?

If possible, mom should pre-pay her final expenses. She can go to a funeral home and arrange that. Does she have a plot? Or a plan for her cremation, and remains?

My parents preplannex and prepaid their funeral arrangements. There were some additional expenses that were paid out of a checking account that was joint with POA sibling, so not frozen upon death.

No, children should not be expected to do this.

"however (she) does have savings to cover costs needed to pre-plan her wishes."

It, therefore, is up to HER to pay for her last arrangements. There is nothing I know of, legally or otherwise, that says that her children have to pay for the cremation and internment. One of you should have access to the money in her account upon her death to pay the expenses.

If she has the money, but she wants the kids to "chip in", what would she then be doing with her money? Is she planning to give it to someone and needs to know that all her children will financially take care of her death?

This sounds fishy to me. "NO" should be the answer to your mother. That is her obligation to pay for her own arrangements. Then make sure you all have your rifles ready 'cause here comes WW3.

Be very careful when and if you select a pre-planning contract. When Mom passed in November of 2016, I went to the funeral home/cemetery to sign papers and make arrangements. That cost $2,000+. When I was done with them, I went across the parking lot to the cemetery office. I came out of there minus $5,000+, taken on payments of $350 a month. That was for several charges, including opening the grave, burial, closing the grave, and a small,
unassuming gravemarker. To this day, I don’t know what the heck my parents paid for all those years. Neither had funerals or memorial services. They did have plots, though, for which I am grateful. That would have been another $5,000. There was no inheritance and the cost all fell on us. We’re still dealing with the repercussions.

Make sure you know exactly what to expect when she passes. Get a copy of any pre-planning paperwork and memorize it, especially the fine print. I am an only lonely and couldn’t possibly shirk the responsibility I felt for my mother’s final wishes. But, my mom would be incensed if she knew how her careful preplanning all turned out and how much it cost us.

tam, funerals can be expensive... if some items are already pre-paid that is a great help, such as the cemetery plot or columbarium [to hold ashes] at the cemetery already chosen and paid. When your Mom pays for the plot she should get a Deed saying she owns that spot. Or if your Mom was with your Dad when he died, did he have a dual-plot plus a headstone?

When my Mom passed, it was my Dad who paid for everything. My parents had a family plot where 5 generations were buried. When my Dad passed, it was his estate that paid for his funeral. Otherwise, I would have needed to pay being an only child.

I realize not everyone leaves an estate where money can be pulled for such cost. When that happens, either everyone chips in as much as they can... with cremation one doesn't need to purchase a plot or metal drawer, the ashes can be spread at Mom's favorite place. That's what I want for myself.

Am I reading your post correctly--Mom's sibling thinks the kids should may for Mom's funeral? Is there a Will? Typically, the deceased person's assets are used to pay for final costs and debts and then distributed according to the Will. Does Mom's sib stand to gain if the kids pay for the funeral? i,e, the remainder of the assets go to Mom's sib?
In a perfect world (LOL) there are assets/life insurance/prepaid burial plans to take care of these things. But (as we all know)life isn't perfect. When my friend's Mom passed there literally was less than $30 in assets. NONE of the kids had financial resources to pay for the funeral. So the funeral home took all 5 kid's credit cards, divided the bill by 5 and it all got charged equally.
Lesson here for all of us.

In the OP’s case: Mom has the assets, so Mom should pay. Mom could do a pre-need/pre-paid plan. Or the adult child who is executor of Mom’s will pays for it out of the estate account (which is funded by Mom’s cash).

This presumes that Mom has a will. If she doesn’t, she needs to get one. Stat.

The sister who lives with Mom seems to have a queen bee complex. Can’t imagine where Sis got her idea about Mom’s adult children picking up the tab no matter what — or why Sis thinks that’s appropriate.

When Mom went on Medicaid we were allowed to cash in a small policy and use it to prepay her funeral. It came to about 11K. She had a plot so this included the funeral homes services, opening the plot and one viewing before services. Dad died previously so there was a stone.

Cremation her costs $2300. Some cemeteries will allow an urn to be buried on a passed relatives plot. You pay to have the hole dug. If no viewing or service that is pretty much the cost. A lot of families have a Memorial service when an important date comes up. In my Mils case, it was their wedding anniversary. A nice luncheon was held by a friend.

If Mom has the money, then I agree, no reason she can't prepay her cremation.

If Mom has the resources, she should be paying for her own funeral costs.

A Huge Thank You for all of your responses. My brother, who invited our Mom to live with him and his wife, 1700 miles away from the rest of the other siblings, feels that we should be chipping in and paying for my mother's cremation and monument, which comes up to roughly around $5000 for everything. I have warned my brother that he should not expect his sibling's to gladly open their check books to pay for Mom's final expenses, which has not deterred him. The other siblings feel that my Mother has the savings to pay for these expenses and they should not be expected to do so. Funny things are going on with my mother's depleting savings every month, which is handled by my brother with whom she lives, siblings feel the same, yet don 't proach the subject with my brother. For some reason he is co-owner with my Mom's banking accounts and will not share information with other's as to where Mom's money has gone in a matter of 3 years, like over $40,000 to now under $17,000. My older sister is the executor of my Mom's estate, but does nothing but grumble. Any thoughts, anyone?

Is mom paying for her care? Is there a caregiver contract in place? Is she paying room and board?

You're talking about 7-8K per year that's been spent, correct?

Tam, the reason your brother is co-owner of your Mom's bank account is so that he can write checks for expenses. This is very common. My Dad had me on his checking account as he didn't want to bother with writing checks.

Taking care of an elder can be expensive. Even something as simple as Depend garments can wipe out a well thought of budget. Eye glasses, and hearing aids are out of pocket expenses. Those are very expensive.

Special food items, such as Boost or Ensure is expensive. There are co-pays when it comes to doctor appointments, and believe me, elders have a lot of doctors, and co-pays on prescription medicine. New clothing as clothes do not last long with stains that are hard to get out. Plus changes in weight. Shoes are expensive.

Did your brother need to make changes to his house which would help Mom? Like putting up grab bars in the bathroom, put in a higher toilet, change the shower spray to a hand-held spray, and purchase a shower bench or chair? Did Mom need a lift-recliner? How about a rolling walker?

My own Dad had Agency caregivers, 3 shifts per day, and that was costing him $20k per month, yes per month, so having your brother be your Mom caregiver has saved the family a lot of money at this point. Then there is no telling what would happen later on. Mom might need extra care at home, or need to go onto Medicaid [which is different from Medicare] and be moved to a skilled nursing facility.

I assume Mom is still clear minded since your profile mentioned age related issues, then she can do what she wants with her money. It's not easy to direct a parent to talk about buying a grave plot or columbarium drawer.

I'm confused. If Mom has enough resources to cover her last wishes - why do you all think you must 'chip in' to pay for it?

You can contact the funeral home and ask about prepayment. I did this with my father because if he had needed a nursing home, they would not have left enough money to cover the final expenses. Thankfully it never came to that and 7 years later he passed on and everything was covered, exactly as planned.

I agree mom should pay for her own burial if she has the funds. I also agree that what you've said brother has spent doesn't sound outrageous. You need more information one way or the other to decide if your brother is taking money unnecessarily from mom. And I was also on my mom's checking accounts and investment accounts since I managed them. Mom had no capability to write checks or track her spending. I don't know how your mom's mental capacity is, but having your brother on those accounts is normal.

Yes she should pay as she has the money. Your brother can ask but you can say No! Plain and simple. If your mom is able to make her own decisions then can you speak to her about this?

Your brother and aunt can think whatever they want about what the rest of you should pay towards your mom's final expenses. Unless there is some type of legal document that you have all signed, taking on this commitment, you are under no obligation to pay anything. Period. Sure, there may be hard feelings, etc. if you stick to your guns, but just because someone thinks you should do something doesn't mean you HAVE to.
As far as him being on your mom's bank account, etc. I don't really see where that is wrong, since she does live with him and I'm sure he has additional expenses due to this fact. However the fact that he doesn't want to share any of the financial information with anyone else would make me suspicious that he is taking funneling additional monies for personal gain, not all for mom's care, additional groceries and other household items, etc. If he's got nothing to hide, then he shouldn't have a problem being open about her accounts.
Just my opinion.

tam1046, you've gotten some good answers and I agree that your mom should prepay at least most of her funeral expenses. I'll add a couple of other thoughts.

First, your sister who is your mom's estate executor has no more say in this matter than anyone else because an executor's authority and responsibility begins only after death.

Second, you said your mom has been living with your brother for three years and her savings has decreased by $23,000 -- that equates to about $640 per month, which doesn't seem like much to me. But I don't know your mom's income, which should be part of the equation. And I don't know the level of care your mom needs/gets from your brother (and his family?) or amenities she is provided (i.e. a small, shared bedroom or a large suite for herself). At a minimum, seems like room and board in your brother's home could be worth around $1,000 per month to your mom and that value increases as the level of her care increases, e.g. up to the $20,000 per month that freqflyer mentioned. Others have mentioned these things and I think your siblings and you should consider the wisdom gained in their experiences. Hope this is helpful.

$23,000 over three years comes to under $700.00 per month. This is not a huge supplement for making space for and looking after one's mom. It is entirely possible that they have an arrangement of which you are unaware. My MIL is completely unattached to her final arrangements, and views body donation as a good thing. We are working on that, now.

I assume mom still has an income, SS at the very least, so the money coming out of her savings is in addition to that. Whether this is a reasonable amt or not depends on her care needs.

Shame on mama. Since things sound kinda shady and you aren't keen on helping pay, I'd tell your brother he should look into having mom donate her body to the local medical school. Very little if any cost, and depending on the school's rules for this, brother might get her ashes back.   I mentioned Wright State University's program here before, and I'll be doing this.   My ashes will be placed in a little cemetery in the woods right on campus. Voila, no cost to anybody other than a having my name put on a brick in the sidewalk there if  I want to spring for that, which I don't, lol.  

Personally, I think any good parent should pay for their own burial in advance..

Alas some do not. Either they do not care enough to do so, or they do not have the resources

If they do not, there is always the inexpensive choice of direct cremation in which the ashes are not buried in a grave site with a head stone.

Tam1046:

You said: [[[[[[[ "Funny things are going on with my mother's depleting savings every month, which is handled by my brother with whom she lives, siblings feel the same, yet don 't proach the subject with my brother. For some reason he is co-owner with my Mom's banking accounts and will not share information with other's as to where Mom's money has gone in a matter of 3 years, like over $40,000 to now under $17,000. My older sister is the executor of my Mom's estate, but does nothing but grumble. Any thoughts, anyone?" ]]]]]]

That is definitely a lot of money to be disappearing. If she is kicking in some money from her SS check, it should NOT be costing your brother that much to take care of her.

At her age, medicare will pay for most things, with her SS check covering the rest.

The executor of the will has no say over a joint bank account. The joint account overrides the will. All that money is your brother's money, if your mother dies.

If your brother has convinced her to put money in a joint bank account, he can move money out whenever he wants, and when she dies it is his. It overrides the will and does not have to be probated.

If your brother needs to write checks, he can ask for signing privileges only for her bank account. This way when she dies the rest goes back into her estate to be shared as expressed in her will.

Again a joint bank account overrides the will.

A lot of caregivers take their parent into their home to get expense money from them and to gain "undue influence" influence over the parent by creating a state of dependency on them for the parent.

They do this under the guise of caring and concern, when they simply want help with their own expenses or an opportunity to take extra money from mom.

Can you hire an elder care attorney. Then ask all your siblings to meet with him so he can tell you the best way to handle her money.

If not, after your mother dies, you will be able to ask for an accounting of all the expenses your brothers claims he needed to take care of your mother.

Again, no matter what your brother says, He likely does not need to draw down her savings to care for her. She likely eats like a bird and medicare will cover most medical expenses. Her SS can likely cover the rest.

Your brother sounds as if he may be engaging in financial elder abuse because he is also isolating her.

You might also contact your area protective services for the elderly and ask for an investigation.

Since she has the financial means to cover her demise, it is up to her to pay for it. Adult children should save for their own futures.
Undoubtedly "funny things" are going on with her finances. Of course it's not moral, but "money should not be in a person's heart." (partial quote by Jonathan Swift)

Children are not obligated to save up for their parents, but parents are for their children.

My Mom brings in Social Security and a Retirement Plan of over $2000 monthly. My brother takes $975 out automatically and transfers to his account for rent and food. The agreement was and should still be that the rent be divided 3 ways between my brother, his wife, and my mother. I am betting the family farm that she is paying for half of a $1600/month rent. I have tried to speak with her about this and she will not have it. Part of the $975 my brother is taking is for food as well (she eats like a bird). She pays for all insurance costs for a medicare part B supplement insurance and medication plan. She pays for all personal care needs and and any thing else she wants or needs. The person who commented is correct in saying she went through between $7000-$8000 since she has been there. Where it went and where the current $975 she pays my brother monthly is a mystery. He has said, when asked, that the money situation is between my Mom and him and no one else's business. Also she pays for supplemental Boost, incontinence products, doctor co-pays, special needs, such as a wheeled walker, shower chair, and any clothes (she is very frugal when it comes to new clothes or shoes). She does not require outside help. She pays for rental of oxygen concentrator and portable O2. She remains her own decision maker and relies on my brother regarding her money affairs. As I have also said before, with checking out cremation costs, cost of a monument we are looking at just under $5000, which she still has left in savings. She bought her plot years ago as to be buried next to her Mother and Father. Someone please help me sort through this puzzle. If she pays for all funeral expenses at this time, she won't be left with much money in savings anymore.

Thank you sincerely for your feed back. I added a post which outlines her current expenses and what happened to the original $40,000 remains to be seen. When I was looking after my Mom's expenses here in MN, she gave me authority to deposit any moneys and pay her bills, I don't understand why a person has to be co-owner of my Mom's account. That said, the money in my Mom's account is essentially "co-owned" by my brother to put in or take as he pleases. I have tried to discuss this with my Mom and she does not want to discuss this as she gets upset that I am asking where all of her money has gone and is currently going. She has complete trust that my brother is on the up and up with her.

If I were part of investigating my brother, I will be cut off from seeing my Mom EVER! I don't want to risk not seeing her with the time on this earth she has left. My other siblings are aware and very unhappy about this whole situation, yet no one wants to be the one to investigate my brother and what he has been doing since he moved her from MN to FL just over 3 years ago. You are right in saying she is isolated from the rest of her family down there, though she states she is happy and at peace living down there.

One earlier reply regarding the joint bank account mentioned that your brother could be made a signer on your mother's account instead of having a joint account. Florida does not allow this arrangement, according to our FL banker. My husband and I have this in IN; but when he opened an account in FL, the bank said only joint account owners could sign checks.
Regarding your initial question, if your mom doesn't want to pre-pay for specific funeral services, then her executor will be responsible for paying for them from what's left in her estate. If there's nothing left, IMO, whoever wants to make the arrangements will need to rely on the goodwill of the rest of you to chip in.
For that reason, if your brother hopes to get money from you for a funeral, he probably better start being friendlier to you, huh?
In my experiences with funeral homes, someone's going to promise to pay on a contract before any services are provided (other than maybe picking up the body). And the FH is probably going to want $ or a life insurance policy up front if they are suspicious that there are looming financial shortcomings.
Since your brother is joint on her account, he could write that check after her demise, assuming there's money left; but, since it will be his money then, he won't be legally obligated to use it for her funeral unless he signs the contract with the funeral home.

Do a pre-paid - she then will get to pick her own hymns etc - if she is unable then have whoever is POA do it for her with someone else [what for unnecessary items] - it is the person who dies whose estate must pay for the funeral -

My sister & I went together to do mom's years ago & we still have her with us - we picked a lovely urn with butterflies on it, then a few days later when I was visiting she pointed out 2 different people wearing shirts with butterflies on them so we think we picked it right

Here the laws says the funeral directors get paid first before any other bills - I guess too many asked for lavish funerals then couldn't pay so now it is often done up front

Since mom has the funds, and cognitively able to pre-plan her funeral, then its her responsibility. Last year, my husband & I brought my mom along to a funeral home to purchase our funeral plans.
My mom wanted be with my deceased dad (vet), so she chose a casket. We all wanted graveside services-simple. Since I had saved mom's income, she could pay the $3200 herself!