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My mother recently signed over POA to both me and my brother. My brother and his wife have taken charge without asking me if this was ok. They've removed her from her home and have taken her to live with them in a cramped home. Whereas I have space and are being told you can't take her. She is due for surgery and would like to use her old doctor yet my brother and his wife have taken it upon themselves to find her a new doctor. She's in the beginning stages of Alzheimers, she has clear moments in between. When I talk to her it's all fine she tells me her wishes and when I say I will help, suddenly I get pushed away and they take over. What are my rights and is a POA valid in every state? They are not abusing her but persuading her to think like them. We are not children we are in our 50's and I am the oldest. I want to know legally can I do something against my brothers actions? or do I have to sit back in another state and wait till it all falls apart. I am very torn right now.

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If bro had POA's changed he could be charged with un due influence or coercion of an at risk adult.
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Pita ,This isnt just sibling squabbles, this is serious stuff.
Your poor Mom is stuck in the middle. Your brother could steal or mismanage her bank accounts you could be liable! Yes, as POA you have legal responsibilities. As a POA, if you feel your mother is incompetent and you dont report it, then you can potentially be responsible for mismanaging your Mothers estate. You have a right to her accounts, etc if she is imcompetent and an obligation as POA to report this legally. I would call a lawyer now! Good Luck to you.
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I'm not doing it to be cruel, it's just that sometimes I'd like my husband to hear what I have to listen to for 3 hours at a time. I know she's afraid to be alone for long hours at a time, and my brother and his wife work and leave her there with tv running. I don't find this constructive. I wanted her here in Fl. to spend time in the garden with me, enjoying the sun and wildlife we have here, and to be able to walk and do for herself. they in turn prepare everything for her , breakfast, lunch dinner.. I'd like to keep her doing for herself even if she messes up..but I'd be here for her like she was for me when I was little..
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I'd tape them!
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hi all, this is Fl D under a new name... I had the strangest situation this morning. my mom called me from my brothers house in NY. We talked for about an hour or more and all the while she was getting more and more confused. She began telling me things like she felt like she signed something, and was bad talking about my sister in law and why my brother is so interested in her house etc. Then she asked me for a phone number so I had to look it up and 4 times she wrote the wrong number down.. Well in that time because she asked she said call me back..so I did several times and the 3rd time I hung up because I refuse to be recorded on an answering machine. So we talked again for a few minutes and hung up... about 15 minutes later, my brother comes home from work and calls me back and says I see you called mom a hundred times and my son says you kept calling and hanging up..geesh like at 54 I have nothing better to do than play funny phone calls. Then suddenly my mom says to my brother I don't know why she called here when I proceeded to tell my brother that she needed a phone number she said, she didn't and doesn't remember calling me, etc.. well now I'm left holding the bag as the bad guy.. Now I say if my nephew was home all the while why didn't he talk to me when she was crying and all confused? weird... I'm now going to get a tape recorder and inform my mom that the calls will be taped from now on. I do a daily protocol of all info that I get and remember so I don't have think back what was said. This week I will call a lawyer, because it seems like my mom is afraid to talk direct to my brother. Being so many miles away I can't go back and forth like she wants me to.Am I wrong to tape these conversations. I want proof down the line as my brother and wife say she's clear when they talk to her, that' s because they talk B:S with her. with me she is also clear about talking about her finances and what should be done etc.. and boom she conveniently forgets when they are around. Now I really don't want to talk to her anymore.. Today shot me down
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With bickering siblings an impartial third party is necessary. I would consult with a geriatric care manager they can often assist the siblings to work together and can also take lead in communications.
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Totoally agree with Carolyn my sister wants joint POA with me if im going to care for mum alone then I have sole POA or she goes into a home even before mums dementia Ive had nothing but issues with her and as one post says sometimes the caring is easier than dealing with siblings how true!
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This is so heartbreaking, fat people who care more about the money from the caretaking can end up in charge.

The really difficult thing right now is, since there wasn't a clear demarcation and your moms mind prior to her probable impairment, because those worthless lawyers made you and your brother "CO" responsible, if you try to sort it out legally with a lawyer now, it will most likely end up as a conservatorship battle in court and when there are feuding siblings, the judge is likely to appoint an outside party who could, and it has happened many times, prevent you or your brother from having anything to say about your mom.

A travesti for sure...
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thank you all for your insight. Unfortunately I've lost this battle,my mother says whatever my brother wants her to say. And if a Doctor cannot realize the situation ,sadly there isn't anything I can do. As I said mom has some clear moments and tells me one thing and then when my brother is around she does and says another. For instance last week I asked everyone if its ok if I do her bills and set up a file where we can all access it via the internet and email.All were in agreeance so I changed her mail to come to my house in Florida and called her on Friday to tell her all the bills for October had been paid. Saturday my brother takes her to her home in Ct and she gets a letter that the post was confired changed and those 2 blew up through the phone. I was TOLD CHANGE THE ADDRESS NOW!!! When I asked my mom why she acted like she did, she said she didn't give permission yet we all heard that conversation, and suddenly I was left holding the bag like a liar. So after another sleepless night feeling so left out and depressed, I don't want to know anything anymore. I will contact a lawyer to find out how to deem her incompetent because this is tragic what is going on, and my brother and his greedy $$ wife will get theirs all on their own. Somehow I will have to find a way to either get her here for a little visit or have a Case worker converse with her on their own without my brother being allowed to interfere. You've all been great in listening. I truly appreciate it.
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No, as Co-POA, you have just as much rights as your brother. Consult a family elder attorney in your state. Yes, the POA is legal in all states. Don't take this sitting down because legally if you do nothing, it is as if you agreed to your brother's actions. Make as much legal rattle until your brother complies with your mother's intended wishes before she was coerced. If you can prove he coerced her into signing documents or made any threats if she did not comply with his intentions, he can be prosecuted. Go get him legally!
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I believe your Mother's POA is valid in the state of Florida (I assume that is where you live). The POA is not the problem it is the lack of respect you are receiving from your brother. I would also want to monitor all financial dealings because they are so disrespectful.

I live in Florida, my mother and bother live in another state. He is her only POA. I feel there is some resentment because he is there, working full time and the only one who can do anything for her legally. I also feel I am being left out for "some" reason.

All in all it comes down to respect and communication. You, unlike me, have all legal rights to know everything that is going on with your mother. I would consult an attorney just in case you suspect fraud. But before you do that, try having a serious discussion with your brother about the issues.

I agree with the person who said they will be more than happy to call on you when things get tough. I am just sitting back waiting for the day my mother really needs me. Unlike your mother, I have been insulted, lied about and disrespected. We will see how things change when the rubber meets the road.
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If she could no longer live on her own, she is well beyond the early stages. As POA, the brother does not have to ask for permission. Trust in his judgment and work with him by calling often and visiting frequently. If you make it a battle, the doctors will refuse to deal with conflicting POA's and your mother will be the one to suffer. Surgery on the elderly is always risky, and I would expect she will spend some time in rehab (nursing home) afterward.
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This is such a shame that siblings let their egos and greed take over. My sister who is primary on mom's DPOA can get controlling at times, but she backs down because she needs me to help. I am secondary and we share responsibilities with me taking care of the medical and she does the financial.She did get where she was trying to force our mom to dress that my mom would not chose for herself so I tactfully stepped in and arranged for a shopping day with mom, meself, and sis. That way mom could pick out the clothes she liked...mom dresses very plain and usually in pinks and blues. My sister loves reds and sis thinks she is a fashionista...which she isn't IMO. I think she should leave mom alone on how she dresses and for now she is. Because we share responsibilities since sis lives out of town, I take mom to all her dr. appts. and keep her supplies up to date. My mom has Alz and is living in a memory care unit at an AL. So far it is working for us and I pray it continues. You are all in my thoughts and prayers as you deal with difficult siblings.
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I agree on the no surgery, unless absolutely necessary. The anesthesia will have more profound effects on her. Anesthesia is very hard on older people, even those that do not have dementia. It was following a surgery that we all noticed profound changes in mom cognition. And after dad had a surgery 2 years ago, it took 4-5 weeks for his cognition to return, I suppose the effects of the anesthesia could have been permanent, thank goodness it wasn't.
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Floridadee----PS Do Not let your Mom have surgery with alzheimers starting , she will be 100x worse from the anethesia !!!!!!!
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Floridadee, I would get a lawyer so you can at least watch all her banking online that they do. As for her care, if they will give good care, believe me, give them time, they will want help! They have a very long journey ahead of them and will be envious you are free from 24/7. Think about this, its a huge task !
Once your Mom cant walk or talk, or becomes incontinent, they will be begging you to take her and then you can, to prevent a NH. Good luck
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It maybe too late to find this out in your circumstances but years ago an attorney advised me NEVER to allow myself to become a "CO-" anything (whether POA, agent, conservator, trustee or executor), even if that was the wish of the principal. She said walk away and do not subject yourself to the infighting that occurs when more than one person had the final authority.

She sat on the ethics board of a large Southern California hospital. Based on the problems I've read about here and on other sites regarding legal authority, she really knew what she was talking about. The moral of the story is don't agree to take on any of the responsibility if you don't have all the authority.
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My MIL insisted on this and it was endless grief with my brother in law for my husband and me. She had a pie-in-the-sky hope that they would just get along. They were always different in approach and my husband was by far much kinder with BIL being a real bully. I can't say he didn't love her (she recently passed away ay 93) but he had some deep seated jealousy for my husband, is a control freak and lived closer. We talked several times to a lawyer about what to do but this was her wish. When she complained to us about his treatment and his wholesale bossiness and meanness she would back off and tell us it 'wasn't that bad'. So, what can you do? Well, you COULD exercise your own rights as POA and it is a matter of taking action whether or not your sibling likes it. My husband decided not to do that. She wanted it this way, for better or worse. Really, it just amounts to how far you are willing to go and how bad you think the situation is for your parent. If it 'could be a lot better' but not abusive, you probably don't like to hear this, but you probably will need to leave it alone, visit her, do what you can, etc. Or you will end up beating your head against a wall. Almost any attorney will say dual POA is a very bad idea. We just learned from this and when we set up our own trust and estate matters, chose wisely which of our six kids would really do what we'd want them to do, and also, what kind of support that one has with his own spouse. Best of luck and God bless you.
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I wish you all the best , dealing with my dad with his dementia is sometimes easier than dealing with all the family members
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I didn't find out that my sister had dad sign a power of with both our names on it until we were at the funeral home making arrangements and she thought she could make all the arrangements since "she" had POA. But I was his executrix. Then I founf out she had taken over $30,000.00 from Dad over a 3 year period!
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I have almost the exact same situation except that dad already lives in a nursing home - a decent one where he volunteered for many years. There are different kinds of POAs and it sounds like your brother has more of a guardianship level. GET YOUR OWN ATTORNEY! My sister lives in the same town as my dad - and I am half a continent away trying to care for a terminally ill sister. Sister is also quite mentally ill and has lived off our parents for most of her life. Our relationship has been horrible (until I went "no contact" for a while). When he has still at home and knowing we didn't "get along" dad gave his financial POA to his very kind next door neighbor and got his own attorney - whom he knew socially. MS Wonderful acted so bad and caused so much trouble that both of them resigned on the same day -leaving me as the default financial POA. Well, MS Wonderful went out and got dad a new attorney - really a law clerk in a large firm - and has proceeded to influence him by nagging him for several hours every day into engaging this law firm (at $195/hr) for financial POA AND estate planning. It's a straight money grab, since, not wanting to be responsible for her after our parents were deceased, my sister and I had quit-claimed our interest in their house and in some federal land my mother had. Now she's moved into his (actually her own) house and dad is paying all the expenses - because he doesn't realize he doesn't have to and even if he did it would be "oh poor daughter." Please, please run - don't walk - to an attorney specializing in elder care. Another thing you can do is contact your state board on aging and file a complaint about your borther taking advantage of a vulnerable adult. I've found that this route isn't very promising, though, because it's usually handled at the county level and, like my dad, the vulnerable person has already been so brainwashed that they really are no longer able to make their own decisions, even though they are perfectly capable of doing so when AWAY from their brainwashers. Also, this route can sometimes lead to the state appointing a guardian - who has decision-making powers over EVERYTHING - financial, medical, everything. It really is a heart-shredding experience, Floridadee. If you're really in Florida, there should be plenty of attoorneys who specialize in elder matter. Spend the money. It's SO worth it. And please let me know how this situation develops cuz I'm right there with you.
Gretta and Rufus's mom (Not my offical aging care name - which I've forgotten)
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