Why are NH staff so disrespectful?

ADCaregivers: as far as gifts go; a person might want to check with the head people first, some places are not allowed to accept gifts, so unless you do it "under the table" and no one else knows. And as far as education even people with college degrees are having a hard time finding jobs, it also probably even depends on what city location you are in, even though that should not make a difference.

They are disrespectful because our society does not place a high value on their work. Their supervisors are often poor role models. Their employers do not offer adequate training. They are often poorly educated and VickiRuff and Christine 73 stated, they often lack other job opportunities.
Our economy has changed so that persons without training beyond high school face very limited employment opportunities. Plus they know they are doing work that few want to do.
Last question: Do you thank them for the help they provide your loved one? Do you occasionally provide intermittent rewards to those who help you loved one? Such as a gift card from a local food or drug or discount store, i.e. $5 or $10.
You need to get into the game and see if your behavior can make a difference.

to Mcurran - well said. We visited my father on fathers day, took the grandkids and a man that only nodded when I waved to him every time I go, he smiled. Older people love to see children. And I make it a habit when I go to see my dad to wave to the other ones that might be sitting waiting for a meal, or I say hello. I know that I am visiting after my work and have no idea how many of these elders get visitors during the day, but I hardly see anyone in my time of visit for these people. They don't want to be there, but like you said, some families for various reasons cannot take care of them. Sure these people would rather be at home, their home, but sometimes it just won't work. Everyone should try to smile at the other residents when they are visiting their loved one, wave to them or say hi. even if they don't answer you still probably brightened their day.

Christine 73: I generally stay away from getting too involved with discussions that get rather heated, but I must respond to your comment. Be careful of absolutes in your statements. It is not true that the medical personnel who "end up" working at low-paying nursing homes are "bottom-of -the-classers." Or that every nursing home leaves people soiled until they are "good and ready to change them." If you really believe this, why would you ever place your loved one there? I chose to work in a nursing home after a long and productive carreer in the US Army medical field. I was an officer. And I graduated fourth in my class. I worked hard in school and I resent your comments.

I chose to work with the older population after I thought I never would want to. I found the work hard, but very gratifying. I loved my patients, I cried everytime one of them died. I loved listening to their stories and I cherished everyone, even those who could not communicate with me. I found the people I worked with to be very caring and capable and overworked. Yes, there were "bad apples" infrequently, but they did not last. This population of people (the nursing home residents) are there because they need care their families can not provide for a variety of reasons, but generally these people are very ill with numerous medical issues. They require a lot of care. Yes, the wages can be low, but that is because of the value we as a society place on the elderly. If nursing homes paid their workers what they deserved and staffed the facilities the way we would all like them to be staffed, only the very wealthy would be able to afford to be there.

So, please do not make blanket statements about everyone in a profession that most would not or could not do. The saddest thing to me working in a nursing home is how many residents never have family or friends visit. That is sad.

I know I am a bit off topic, but I felt I had to reply.

I will add that every nursing home leaves ppl soiled until they're good and ready to change them...or not oo busy. the only difference is how long that is. When you move your mom, move her to the highest patient-to-staff ratio place you can find!

To further answer your question, the medical personel who end up working at low-paying nursing homes are "bottom-of-the-classers." No overachievers here. Their ugly behavior falls right in line with someone who couldn't be bothered to work hard in school.

I feel sorry for anyone in this tough decision, but I know that so far where my father is they haven't treated him any differently from private pay when he first went in to being covered under Medicaid, and IF I notice a difference, you bet I will be on someone's case immediately. they won't like me and I will be able to tell if anything is looking fishey. its a shame that politics runs things.

Re: Private pay vs. Medicaid. The facilities won't tell you this, but they do use finances to determine whether or not they will accept you. Not all, but most. You know that's true when the "admissions" application is 6 pages financial and 2 pages everything else. If all they want is a PRI, they're not bent that way. I visited a facility that wanted to make sure my mom was at least "medicaid pending," or they wouldn't accept her. The truth is, in NY the nursing homes are $405 a day or roughly $12,000 a month. I don't know any older person who can maintain that long-term, and facilities want to make sure they will be getting paid. People look down their noses at medicaid and medicaid patients, but guess what? Medicaid pays for each patient $17,000 a month...that's more than the "private pay" rate! So I don't know if it's about shaming people on medicaid, making them feel they don't have a voice so they don't feel they have a right to complain. But facilities know if a patient stays long-term, eventually medicaid will be footing the bill. What they look for to discriminate...I mean, distinguish...is the size of your social security check and pension check because they know once you're on medicaid, they will be receiving those checks, less a $50 a month "personal needs allowance."

Contact someone in your local State official, take any documentation (pictures,etc), file some kind of law suit if you have to. Can you imagine the other residents there and how their families feel, maybe you could somehow get in contact with other families and form a group complaint (of course not to the bozos that are working for/at that facility). Find another place for your loved one ASAP. good luck

Then there are the people with Alzheimer's who have this obsession with playing with poop, or this compulsion to undress, or who become overly sexual. I think if you're in a dementia unit, its best to have a private room. If you're there because you broke a hip and are old without friends or family who care, it might be nice to have a roommate. If you're a morr social person.

I know there was a person in a shared room in a nursing home who had both dementia and cancer. She died a terrible death with substandard care. Her roommate who also had dementia would scream and talk all night. And that's the sound she died to. Talk about the horror.

mmills0313...You asked why they would stay, and I responded that people without money don't have a lot of choice as to where they are placed. As Christine 73 stated, in NY you don't have much choice. I also live in NY and agree with that statement. It's not as simple as leaving because you don't like it. JoAnn29... I'm sure patients are treated the same within each facility whether or not they are on Medicaid. But the facilities that do not require private pay up front (for people without money) are not usually the good ones.

VickiRuff I KNOW that. So is your remark also directed at everyone else who advised looking for a new LTC facility?

But Christine that's what I find baffling about it - the development of good practice in care for older people is at least as advanced in America as it is in Europe, if not more so in many respects. On the other hand, I suppose there is more emphasis on commercial freedom of action, too, and hence more resistance to state regulation.

I also take Partsmom's point about the potential benefits of having built-in company - as Piglet would say, "it's friendlier with two" - but that seems to me like a two-edged sword at best. Vegetative and snoring is one thing; what about moaning or humming or garrulous? Or attached to a "distinctive" brand of perfume? The horror, the horror...

Shared rooms have upsides and downsides. Sometimes it is helpful to have another person to call for help or just be company. I recall visiting a friend in a rehab facility in a shared room, and the family of her roommate kept an eye on her as well and were very nice. If the roommate is almost vegatative and snores, that's not so nice.

I agree with ALL of the above! Unless this is the only facility in your area get your loved one out of there. At the very least form a committee/action group and watch/write down EVERYthing. Report to all authorities, State, Senator, TV station. If you have to get action group to go in on an attorney. You'd be surprised what a letter will do from an attorney's letter head. Good Luck and God Bless

Countrymouse, absolutely not! Why, if everyone had their own room, the homes would lose money. God forbid! Who cares if an older person lives an undignified existance? They're just an old person, on their way out anyway. That's the attitude. So if you have a private room, even if you have to put up with all this other crap...that's as good as it gets. I wish we as a culture felt differently about the elderly. After all, a lot of us will be old someday.

It continues to shock me that shared rooms in nursing homes and ALFs seem to be quite common in the States - is anyone working on that? Are the regulatory authorities trying to phase them out?

A lot of ppl have recommended finding a new nh. It's not always that easy. In NY, you have to be "accepted"; you can't just "enroll." I hate the fact that in some ways they have the upper hand. I would document all your complaints and take them to the nh administrator. You should get some action that way. If that person does not help, I would report everything to the department of health and Medicare/Medicaid. My mom is in a pretty decent nh, but they are understaffed at state minimums. The powers that be are on a terrible power trip. And in some ways it just sucks! My friends mom is in one of the best nhs in her county and she'll tell you the exact same thing. However, both our mothers have private rooms. We would lose that if we went somewhere else, and the care would not necessarily be better. So before you move your mom, do a lot of research to find the best place you can. Go on several tours. Talk to other family members with residents similar to your mom about their experience. Be aware that in most nursing homes, the long term unit is different than the short term unit. Make sure you see exactly where your mom would be living, including her room and roommate before accepting any opening. Good luck.

This is probably true. The best thing is picking a AL that has a long term nursing section. When needed, you just transfer over. But a medicaid patient should not be treated any differrent than a private pay. My daughteris not allowed to distinguish between the two.

mmills0313... People on Medicaid don't have a whole lot of choice as to where they are placed. The better homes require private pay the first years to get in.

If you were treated this way in any other place, why would you stay/go back for more?

You need to report this to the State. Help is hard to come by in these homes and the management probably is fearful of loosing help. One thing I noticed is that the staff is only as good as the management. If the management is nasty and hard core, then that sort of runs thru the population of the help. Any group is only as good as its leader. I just think it is horrible for the elderly to have to pay SO much and be treated so poorly. What is wrong in our generation that we cannot show respect for the elderly. I told one worker once...That she had better show better care as it will come back at her and told her SHE would be old someday. Would she like to be treated that way?

As Medicare? Medical, pays your loved one's bill, and you paid all the years for that, you have the right to speak up. For them it is a business, so hit where it hurts. Call Medicare/ Medical, ask for a transfer to a better caring facility. This will prompt questions by Medicare as for what is wrong, they want to know of those deficiencies, since they do have contracts with the facilities, and rate and pay them based on the clients satisfaction( provided by you). This will not benefit you directly, but the people coming into that facility after you, r drive them out of business. So do your loved one a favor, and move elsewhere.

In my opinion they are all bad... it's just a matter of how bad. The system is broken; not enough help, low-paid aides, and big money going to the top. Your mom is lucky you are watching, think of those who have no one. Take pictures and videos so you have proof. I don't know how to change things but the Department of Health supposedly but they're swamped.

Satisfactory (at the most) nursing homes are few and far between. My husband was in a rehab facility/nursing home adjacent to one of the most expensive retirement homes in DuPage County. In other words, he was in the "assisted living facility" to which residents of this exclusive retirement home are transferred when they can no longer care for themselves. It was the pits! As his advocate, to get things done and properly, I had to stand out in the hallway and yell! One of the nurses said to me, "Yelling isn't going to resolve anything." I said, "You wanna bet???" I demanded to see the head of the whole shebang, and within minutes she was at my side. When she saw what my husband and I had to put up with, she cracked the whip pronto, and everybody came running from every which way. After that, the service improved considerably. As your loved one's advocate, don't be afraid to raise the roof! They don't expect that and when it happens, boy do they hustle their bustle! Good luck! I was very glad when the day came that my husband could be dismissed from there and came home where he would get stellar care.

There is no excuse for this kind of behavior. How do they treat your mother? If you can, get her out of there as soon as possible.

I have often spent 24 hours at bedside of my wife and believe me the staff is on their toes when I am there. Also I find that the social worker, when confronted with problems and complaints tend to be more responsive than staff or doctor. Social worker can be a good interface with facility. AND be sure to write everything up and send to everyone concerned.

Contact your county's AREA AGENCY ON AGING or whatever it may be called. Tell them and ask them for an OMBUDS-PERSON to visit and tell complain to the facility. Believe me, these OMBUDS people can put the SCARE into these places really quickly.

Start looking for a new facility immediately. I find that my nose is a good guide to many things, If it smells clean or not at all, then make it candidate for your mother's next home. Also look at the appearance of those living there, do their clothes look clean and their hair and nails. Look at the corner of the rooms to see if they are really clean.
Sloppy management often means unhealthy situations for those living there. Just move, don't fight the good fight. Your wellbeing and your mother's are the most important things in this situation. Sometimes you can't fight city hall. Good luck and tell us how it works out.