She is at the 30 day point and they are rushing. I overheard the nurse and aid discussing how the hospital is not getting paid much. My thing is so transfer her to LTAC which I have contacted. They are hesitant and don’t really want to put in the tube. They say she is snatching out. Somehow they have lost her dentures and can’t see how that seriously affects consuming food. I can’t help thinking that they are hell bent on DNR and since I’m refusing…they are trying to force her on out. Any advice would be helpful. TyThey are scary too. So when she initially woke up the young doctor assigned thought she had brain damage. She doesn’t per the doctor on yesterday after an MRI. I was there when the respiratory guy took tests and came rushing back saying she had high levels of carbon dioxide. He explained that it causes you to act out of your head. The doctor had no idea about this. That’s just one example of this facility and the incompetence.
There truly is very little medical history given here , Unless I missed something. I could not even find why your mother was in a nursing home to begin with .
That being said , as another old retired nurse who’s seen a lot , I would not want CPR if I was in your mother’s condition . Someone as sick as your mother has been will not bounce back . She will most likely have a bunch of cracked ribs and be ventilator dependent forever , IF by chance she even survived .
People do not realize that CPR is not like it is on TV , nor is it that successful . Your mother was lucky it saved her in the past . But she is now even more ill and frail . But I do understand you feeling the need to honor her request for CPR and tube feeding if she wants .
Again , I have not seen the reason she was in a nursing home or her underlying medical history . They have diagnosed with COPD which causes hypercapnia . This can lead to cachexia ( wasting disease ) as well . No amount of food or tube feeding will help if she has cachexia . Cachexia will eventually cause death .
Go to another hospital , but also realize that you don’t trust the medical community , yet you expect advice from a bunch of strangers who have very little info really about Mom .
Your Mom is dying. The high levels of carbon monoxide in her system shows that. Oxygen isn't being processed correctly and giving oxygen to her does not change that. Her pause ox and hemoglobin numbers are probably drastically low. The doctors cannot do anything for her. Her body is shutting down.
I saw no sarcasm in what Alva said, just honesty from a woman who is a retired nurse of many years. My daughter, RN, would be telling you the same thing. And believe me, Nurses do not always agree with the Doctors.
I pray that your Mom dies peacefully in her sleep. And I pray that you except her death and can let go of everything else.
Alva has her own problems and is in surgery today for cancer, yet takes time to help YOU come to terms with the truth! There is no sarcasm in her words, only truth which you refuse to embrace.
Pull your mother OUT of this dreadful hospital and get her admitted into another one which won't likely meet your standards either bc mother is at the end of her life now. You can fight that or you can accept that, but ultimately, all of our parents die at some point no matter which facility they're at or how many life saving techniques are used. It's the cycle of life.
When my mother was in a horrible SNF for rehab, I stumped the pavement myself to find a better one for her and had her transferred out of the dump and into the good one. What are YOU doing to change the circumstances for your mother?
When mother passes, it will be through no fault of yours or anyone else's. It will be God's will and as a "religious" woman, I'd think your mother should be fine with death, realizing life is eternal.
Good luck getting mom transferred to a new facility pronto.
Her mental state is the issue. She is in and out of it. This new doc said he did a mri which showed no issues. How can you be completely in your right mind and say you are eating with no food in her mouth when I’m trying to give her food? She ate French fries for me and drank all her ensure and ate some corn. She seems depressed not wanting to pass. But yeah she watched her roommate who asked for a DNR prior to getting very sick, basically wither away and starve. I don’t know her medical issues but she stopped eating and just drank water. It wasn’t instant or over a few weeks. It was months of literally starving to less than 90 lbs. Her brother could not intervene cause that was her wish. This is what my mom wants. I need to get her moved. They haven’t mentioned her going back to the nursing home or anything. He has called back (after consulting with surgeon who called this morning and mentioned a dabhoff if they couldn’t do ng tube), stated there is no such thing as a dabhoff and that the surgeon says no not a good idea. I also asked what about the oxygen mask at night and he said he didn’t know. Also not a good idea as she may take off. I mean they said she could not come off the vent but she did. They said she is would not come out of the confused mental state but she did after the oxygen therapy. So no it is not me, we have one of the worst hospitals in my state and I would feel a lot better if it were someone else saying she can’t do it. Some family members stay all night with their relatives but I can’t due to work and proximity to hospital. They even mess up younger people at this place if you are not careful or have someone looking out for you. Thank y’all for responding.
We all die. Whether all measures are taken or not, we will not live forever, and if we are ill we will not live past the life expectancy. Even 2 year olds die, every day.
You say that your mother eats fries. Then you say that she is pushing food away. So, given how you feel about all this, then when she wishes to eat, encourage her and when she doesn't allow her not to eat.
Tube feedings not only won't PREVENT death, they in some few cases CAUSE death by the things I already mentioned.
If your mother was a believer, then her god had a rewarding place for her; I am sad she seems fearful of getting there.
As a nurse, I seldom saw death come as anything other than a blessed deliverance.
I wish you the best of luck.
"High levels of carbon monoxide (CO) in the body mean that the CO is displacing oxygen in the bloodstream, leading to a lack of oxygen delivery to vital organs like the heart and brain, potentially causing serious health problems or death".
"In some cases, supplemental oxygen can worsen hypercapnia (high carbon dioxide levels) in people with conditions like COPD, potentially leading to the release of more CO2 into the blood due to the Haldane effect, rather than improving the situation."
Your Moms body is shutting down. A feeding tube at this point will not help her. It may actually be harmful. Her doctors are trying to tell you she is at the end of her life. And she is probably tired, worn out and ready. Time to let go. I am so sorry.
I see from last note that mom is 78? Is that true.
In prior notes to us you have not been back to comment on our advice, or to provide answers to your mother's history.
Normally the lack of dentures would have really ZERO to do with a patient pushing away food. Your mother no longer wants nor can "handle" food. I believe she is trying to indicate that to you, and I fear you have denial that is not allowing you to receive what she is saying.
We have asked if you mother is at all rational and competent. We have asked if she has indicated her own wishes. You have not replied to these queries.
Does she speak to say "I don't want food".
What advance directive has mother made out dictating her wishes for end of life care. Does she want all heroic measures, or is this a choice that YOU have made for her despite her wishes? Again, we are pleading with you to provide us with information.
If there is no directive and you two have not talked, then what are your own feelings about heroic measures at the end of life? My OWN, as an experienced RN are that it is purely torture and torment to be forced to live when there is no quality to my life. Tube feedings are often pulled out. They cause aspiration and pneumonia and diarrhea.
I believe that doctors who are experienced in the end of life seem to be telling you that your mother IS at the end of her life.
I think at some point you may need to come to a conclusion here as to the difference in doing something FOR your other, as opposed to TO you mother.
But on so little information I would be guessing and I hope you will provide us with more.
I am so sorry that you are facing this now with your clearly much loved mom. I wish you the best. I truly believe, after so many years of this extremity of pain and disability, you should seek therapy for yourself. You deserve that.
Much of this we discussed with you in your last note to us, and I can see that things really are not improving. I am so sorry.
Also I asked her yesterday while I was feeding her why are you not eating. She said she was and that she ate breakfast. The nurse said she took a few bites. I told her you are going to die if you don’t eat. She said no I’m not, I ate. She probably felt full from the tube feeding which they just cut down yesterday. She can eat but is basically is refusing to due to processed diet like she did at the nursing home when they served something bad. Of course then she had snacks in her bag.