My alcoholic father (84) is trying to take care of my Mom with dementia. He won't take her to the Dr. When is it time to call APS?

Your mother is being neglected and abused, even though it may not be intentional.

Please call APS in your community immediately.

Call now.

It is time to call when you feel your Mom is in an unsafe situation, or when she expresses to you that she wishes to leave.
That doesn't include burgers and sweets (unless she is diabetic and said sweets place her in danger). It also doesn't include methods of dealing with incontinence unless the home is in a very bad and dangerous condition due to lack of hygiene.
Sure wish you good luck.
There is no reason not to call APS for a wellness check. Tell them all the information you can and I would stress DANGER, not whether or not she enjoys a burger. They will check the living situation and let you know what they find.

My first instinct is to make that call.

If I was Mom & couldn't self-care & my husband couldn't care for me.. If I could use reason, I'd want my kids to blow a whistle & get me some help.

If I was Dad & looking after my spouse with dementia, maybe little idea on that, can't cope, have always used alcohol to cope with life anyway, I may not recognise I need help - but may need help too.

They may wish to fight against old age themselves, in their private way.

It is a moral dilemma to let people have the 'right to rot' (as my Doctor put it).

Do you let them do that, or make the call? Is being together better than healthier but apart?

Does he let you into the house for visits? On the next visit discretely take pictures of the condition of the home and your mom. See what evidence there is of problems, like rotting food in the fridge, unopened mail, smelling like urine/feces, etc.

Is he your mother's PoA? Is anyone? Does your mother have an actual medical diagnosis of dementia in her records?

What kind of solution are you imagining? Are you willing to take her into your home and provide 24/7 care until another permanent solution is found? Can you afford this? Will your father come roaring over to your home and cause problems?

If you can take her in, then maybe consider going over there with another person (or two) who can distract him in another place in the house while someone else discretely starts packing some of her clothes and necessities. Then if a moment presents itself, she can be escorted out a different door and into a waiting car and can be told a "therapeutic fib" that she's being take out for a lunch date (or whatever story will keep her calm). After that will be the fallout from your father discovering what's happened.

My cousins had to do something similar to this trying to rescue their 90-yr old mother from her abusive and neglectful husband (their father). He went on a tear afterwards and fell at the bank (because $$ was his one true love), got a head injury and never regained consciousness. Ah, poetic justice...

I wish you much clarity, wisdom, courage and peace in your heart!

Another option besides APS is your local Area Agency on Aging. They may be able to come in to offer services, and get an outside perspective on the situation. That said, someone else ended up calling APS about my father's failure to understand the danger of my mother wandering. It ended up being a blessing. She is now in an excellent memory care facility.

From what you're describing, APS should have already been called.

Do it now.

Carson, you and your sister live 5 hours away from your parents. You say that your father is an alcoholic and your mother has dementia, but it sounds as though neither of them has a medical diagnosis. If your own mini-farm comes with health beliefs (and non-commercial farms often do), others may not agree with you eg about your father's drinking or about eating hamburgers and sweets. You say that your father is ‘is stubborn, prideful and delusional’ and is ‘starving her and depriving her of medical treatment’ although he is ‘trying to take care of Mom’. You sound as though you have very little love or respect for your father, and perhaps it’s not surprising that you and your sister ‘end up making them upset when we try to help’.

Because of the distance from your parents’ house, you can’t provide much hands-on help. What ‘help’ are you trying to provide, that upsets them both? Telling them what they are doing wrong clearly isn’t working well. Are you trying to get them (or either of them) to move to a facility? Have you checked it out in any detail – such as affordability? Have you discussed it with them?

Some more information would help to give you useful answers, and some type of independent view of their situation could be a good idea. What do their neighbors say? Are there other relatives you could talk to?

Kids allege strange things all the time. Sure call APS, my brother calls them all the time ... they can suggest great remedies but in the end the proof is in the pudding.

Please call APS now! This is not a healthy situation for either of them.