My 93 year old mom gets upset when I tell her I need to go downstairs to my apartment. I feel like a prisoner.

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My 93 year old mom gets upset when I tell her I need to go downstairs to my apartment. I feel like a prisoner.

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I feel like a couple of responses are kind of making fun of Romeo or belittling her with these “I give up” posts.

Romeo is up against a hard place knowing that her parents likely will pass within three years. They are 93 and 96 after all. Her rock is her husband, who could feasibly pass within three years. Same for her if her breast cancer has metasized to her lung.

When one is up against a rock and a hard place, one needs to choose between two non ideal options. Well, Romeo, given the nonzero odds of you or him needing another round of chemo that could trigger y’all into getting aides for yourself, you and he need to enjoy each passing day together as it is among your last as it very well be.

I am thinking that Romeo and her husband focus on being rescuers to avoid looking at the blunt bottom line of their own physical conditions. And maybe it’s a cope in that they’re not dwelling on themselves.

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This late in the game it appears it’s too difficult for Romeo to break the lifelong enmeshment . I can see that being hard at 93 and 96. Still would have helped if they were in AL though . 3 or more years is a long time in caregiver years .
Maybe AL when the lease is up on the condo , hopefully it’s not longer than a year lease .
In the meantime Romeo , try to set some boundaries as far as time away from your parents , and remember you don’t have to give them everything they WANT, just what they NEED.

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Thank you PeggySue and other posters who replied - I was actually going to post that I am surprised that a forum with most people caring for aging family, that maybe they are trying to help me by being tough sounding? Don't worry, I'm not as "soft" as you think - I've told many people off in my life - including my parents! I had to become tough because I had a brother that was physically and verbally abusive since he was 18 years old. The only thing with my mother is that she gets upset if she doesn't get her way, but other than that she is the most generous, giving, loving, intelligent person in the world - that's why I don't mind being around her (also my Dad). She just has to let me go home to sit in my own living room! Guess what? I told her - I'm going home and sitting with my husband and Romeo tonight - Love you and see you! She said but I miss your husband, he can rest up here - I said no - he wants to rest on his own couch. See you! Better everyone?

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That sound was me doing the world’s loudest facepalm.

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Well, I sound like I am abusive like my brother - no I had to protect myself from certain people.

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*Shadowing behaviour*
*Separation anxiety*

Romeo, maybe google those & see if it fits with Mom's clingy behaviour.

"She just has to let me go home to sit in my own living room!"

Do you see that you cannot wait for Mom to 'let you', for Mom to give you permission?

Do you see how you made a stand. Pushed back. Stated no, you were going home. You then did so.
Well done there.

I think the wider picture will include assessing your folks' real needs vs their wants & whims. These can come at you All.Day.Long. 100s of small issues - which will eat you up.

Especially if there is clingyness.

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Thanks Beatty

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Mom and Dad's families were not stable and on top of that they had to "pay off" my brother from fear. My brother never worked a day in his life. He left Duke University pre-med and went to another college and got straight A's in accounting and then stopped. That was it! They went broke (their own-doing) from buying my brother 7 homes - 7 different moves - just from fear. We had and still have to support them. My Dad had 1 million dollars 30 years ago and now lives off of his slight pension because his airline (not mentioning it) went out of business. REALLY SAD their fault and our fault. It's hard to call police on your son or brother, but in retrospect, that was the right thing to do. My Dad finally put his foot down and "we" stopped paying for his house and he was forced to live in his van. He just got out of the psychiatric ward in Brooklyn and is living in a "home". No one speaks to him. We're all scared he may start up again. I live in a condo with a concierge, so we feel a little safer, but that doesn't matter. He can take a bus. Obviously, he's getting some kind of monetary help. Mom was alone sometimes weeks at a time and then only days at a time when my Dad became Captain. Of course she depended on me for comfort while he was gone. I cancelled dates just to keep her company. I did enjoy bringing my Dad to the airport and picking him up. The bad thing is her son was a problem when my Dad was away. She was responsible for the problems and the household, and on top of it she has her own personality issues. She always wanted things done NOW and her way. When she was only 21 while my Dad was in the Air Force, she took apart the gas range and cleaned it. She was the type of person to want to be "different" than everyone else. She was and still is very "arty". She's good at EVERYTHING! But she was crazy about EVERYTHING at the same time - everything had to be in order and perfect. Everything had to be the BEST. Best food, clothes, etc. Guaranteed, she has a compulsive disorder. My Dad is also the same. They are 2 peas in a pod. They were the best parents to me, I couldn't ask for better, but I didn't like aspects of their parenting and now I am like the rebelling child. I never wanted to hurt their feelings and I felt bad for my parents for not having any family. My husband and I know why they want to be so clingy with us - it's to fulfill their void. They have no family - friends yes- like I said they were big entertainers at their homes, but WE are their only family.
This is the story.

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Unfortunately, you have felt responsible for your parents happiness and emotional states for a very long time . We see that often here.

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Resign yourself that are not going to change your mother's behavior. I think you should just go downstairs whenever you decide you want to. What is the worst thing that will happen if you do?

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Yes, like I did last night. They're actually getting annoyed with me trying to help them organize their lives? Oh - really? I'd like to say when you need me you don't mind - right?

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Anyway, I thank everyone here for their honesty, advice and opinions. I am going to close down for now and let you know the progress soon. Romeo/Maximus/Max PS: Feel free to post if you want to

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You're not going to believe this one - I know I said I was going to stop for awhile. I told my mom that I will drop her off at the nail salon and dad's ortho appointment is right across the street. I told her I will drive back to my condo garage, which is right down the street, park and walk back to get my nails done too. Then I said - I will walk back to get the car and pick you guys up. She turns around and says - so we have to wait there for you to pick us up? It would be literally not even 10 minutes, including walking back, getting out of my garage and driving there. I live right down the street. I replied - yes, just like you had to wait in Florida for Dad to pick you up and if you had to wait for a cab - I then said - Oh, Mom.

She's also asking me what am I doing in my apartment - I told her everything that I neglected when I spent 2 months in Florida and 1 month here unpacking. She just can't understand that I have a household to run and even if I just wanted to read or write or go on the computer - for heavens sake - anything else I want to do. What is her business? This is beyond ridiculous that it's becoming funny. Last night while she was sitting down she was directing where she wanted to fix her other chairs. I said - Mom I really really want to go home and I bowed to her - like yes mam, I'm at your beck and call - being sarcastic. She's a character!

Is she really kidding me?

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That would be the last time I took her to get her nails done . Buy her a nail clipper

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You know Romeo, it is one thing to be emotionally beholden to your parents. It’s a whole another thing to be financially responsible.

Like I said, I think part of why you and hubs are so into helping them is so you won’t dwell on the worst cases of your own physical situations. But that doesn’t mean denying them at your peril.

Cancer has not definitively let go of eith one of you yet. And if either of you have to go on for round 2 of chemo, it’s not going to be as easy as the first. If you’re both sick, then you’re going to have to get in at minimum 12/24 hour care for the two of you. Which could be near 100k a year, and we are talking the care.com or Nextdoor rate. An agency will be double.

If you yourselves are renting an apartment, I seriously doubt you can afford to take on another households bills.

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To everyone here - I need to vent to you guys - I just left there after a visit with their home care nurse to talk about measuring the urine output from the kidney stone issue. The nurse left a very small container (ridiculous) to measure it. I said to them I will go down and get one of those large hospital containers with the cc's on it. My mom said to me - well go down and get it angrily and I couldn't help myself - screaming back - I'm going - stop yelling at me!!!! Telling me why should I do it this way, etc. etc. Then they are giving the nurse wrong information saying he never had cataract surgery and he did and my mom said you're making it sound like he has dementia - are they kidding me???? I don't even have the strength to tell you what else happened up there in a matter of 1 hour. I went up because I knew it was going to be a disaster with the nurse.

I'm going to walk Romeo and I'm completely exhausted from their antics telling me stop yelling while I explain things, blah, blah, blah. I could give a crap about anything right now.

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Your relationship with your parents sounds co-dependent and enabling with no boundaries. Lots of people live that way. Some of my family members are that way. I'm not. I crave peace too much. I had an elderly family member move in with me once. She lasted 6 months. She was awful, a constant busybody and wanted all the attention. She cured me of be an enabler or co-dependent. My young home life was pretty good but it took a turn towards co-dependence and enabling in my late teens. Fortunately I got out before I learned that behavior.

You said that your husband is ill. He really should be your #1 priority, not your parents. I just hope he's really ok with it and (hopefully) not resenting you.

You said you have no friends anymore as you didn't have the time or energy to invest in them. I understand that. I also believe this venue is your avenue to vent to someone, anyone, about your life who might understand it. It's always good to have a place to vent. I also see you're using HUMOR, which is very good. It is the key to not letting the people in our lives, who are trying their best to manipulate us, upset us.

Just remember, you have to take care of yourself first or you won't be any good helping anyone else. And if you have to get into Therapy to learn how, do it.

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I thank you from the bottom of my heart! I hope everyone here is ok with their lives too.

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I have a question - does dementia make a person say things on purpose just to get a reaction out of the other person? I think that's what my Dad is doing.

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Yes it can . Dementia takes away their filter.

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@Burnt, hi. I respectfully have to disagree with you about the role of children and elderly parents in Italy.

I LIVED in Italy for three years (it was wonderful), and over and over again the Italians that I befriended talked frankly about how difficult it was/is to break away from family and cultural expectations. Children are EXPECTED to live in multigenerational homes with grandparents, parents, spouses, children, and often aunts/uncles and the younger family members are EXPECTED to care for the older ones in every way possible, until the elders die. And this expectation is not only for daughters, but for sons, too.

It's tougher on women who are typically paid less than their male peers. It's still a male dominated culture, for example, I was not allowed to sign the lease on our rental, only my husband was allowed to sign it. Women's efforts to rent places of their own are typically kissed off sweetly by real estate agents or landlords regardless of ability to pay the rent.. Inside the Italian home, Nonna is in charge and she rules the roost with a firm hand. Italy is all about the duty to maintain historic tradition regarding almost everything.

Ciao!

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Thank You....the moral of the story is, being a tourist in Italy presents quite a different picture than the reality of everyday life there.

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Romeo, like anxietynacy I am interested only in the lives of you and your dh, not what your parents think. If they want mty opinion they can register here themselves.

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Anxiety - Just like you, we had and have Mafioso friends, in fact John Gotti had one of my Dad's friends killed years and years ago, when Gotti was just coming around. What's funny is my maternal grandmother didn't even bake or cook for us, but my mother can really cook good. See - don't get me wrong, we really enjoy their company, I'm just tired of the "every" minute thing.

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To be honest "Lost" I'm getting tired of the constant battles and drama over how to make eggplant parmagiana and frigin end up yelling at one another and then laughing about it - I don't find it funny anymore - it's quite irritating and obnoxious! I can't stand cooking in front of my mother - my husband hates it too - we're literally scared! We tease her about it, but when she's in action, mamma mia - watch out! It's very unpleasant to cook together - too serious! My husband and I cook together a lot and really big meals and we laugh, while drinking our wine and just have a ball - my parents are yelling at each other not having fun and miserable! Wow - lighten up people! Thank goodness they can't sit in the kitchen in their place now because my husband said, even though he's not feeling well, he'll make them clam sauce. If he did this in front of my mom - "forget about it"! The micro-managing would be insane! She actually loves his clam sauce and then she takes credit for it because she taught him. It never ends!

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Oh yes, exactly Romeo. Don't EVER deviate from the tried and true recipe or what you are cooking isn't correct. For example, my husband cooked lasagna for our neighbors, they loved it, ate it all and said "this is Very good, but it isn't lasagna." (This is because we didn't use Bechamel.)

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@Way, In Italy I think the hands-on caregiving is expected more of the women, but the sons have their heavy share of family obligations, too. Every family is somewhat different, depending on the personalities involved.

But when a Italian woman marries, she goes to live with her husband's family in the multigenerational home. No exceptions. And si, Romeo, sharing family meals is a serious thing . No introverted personality behavior seen at the family table, though- you must be animated, extroverted, opinionated, articulate, educated, and celebrate the meal. Lots of happy arguing and witty humor about topics, lots of good natured laughter. Good table manners are essential. No snarky behavior evident at the table. Children and teens are well behaved.

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Those meals sound too intense for me , I grew up you were to be calm during meals……… while eating our Swedish meatballs. Also You NEVER argued with the cook over how the meal was prepared , it was disrespectful . On a holiday , Mom was in charge , no deviations from her recipes or criticisms , no menu suggestions ever to be made . None of what Romeo described about arguing how somethlng is prepared .

But it does explain my daughter’s future Italian American father in law . I thought he was just intense, but maybe that’s just normal for him . We’ve had dinner with my daughter’s future in laws quite a few times , it’s hard to get a word in . His wife ( she’s not Italian ) and I are both sort of quiet people but we try to have our own little seperate conversations , while our two husbands chit chat . My husband is a talker as well although he’s not Italian . Sometimes we wives look at each other and roll our eyes about how our two husbands go on non stop.

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Bechamel with lasagna - no way in hell!

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Maybe the Becamel is a Ligurian thing (?). As you know, cooking and Italian dialects vary, depending on the area where you were born. For example. If you were born in Genova and you moved to Rapallo 20 years ago you are still considered a "foreigner".

As one person told me in Italy, "the reason why we lost the second world war is that nobody in Italy could understand what the other Italian person was saying."

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My mother is the biggest micro-manager in history! I mentioned I am eating with them only because my husband has a feeding tube and I'm not cooking and don't want him to get nauseous. By accident I left a few crumbs in the middle of the table and she said be careful they'll fall on the floor - so tired of this - it's not funny anymore! This may sound trivial, but when you are raised by an obsessive compulsive person it's draining. I told you she was such a perfectionist I'm scared to do the wrong thing. Sorry to become so serious again.

Anyway, a few years ago, someone started "what are you having for dinner every night?" - does anyone remember that? We should do that again, except I'm not cooking - we're having PF Changs Chinese Frozen food every night. This is a mortal sin in an Italian family, but no one is up to cooking right now. Are you guys still doing that?

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Yes Romeo the dinner thread is still in Discussions .

I’m going to suggest a few things . Stop walking on eggshells . Stop caring what they think .

1) I know people say try to have some humor to get through . But in your case you need to let the angry direct you in the direction to stand up for yourself .

2) Don’t say “ Oh Mom”. Don’t do the gentle teasing or cajoling . She’s not getting the message .

3) Be blunt , brutally honest. Lose your filter woman !!

Tell Mom , what you tell us . You don’t want to hear her nonsense , you’ve had it , it’s obnoxious and whatever else comes to mind .

Also stop catering .
“ Mom that doesn’t work for me “
“ Mom that is not possible”
“ Mom I will not do that “ .
“ Mom you are being disrespecful”.
“ Mom I heard you but don’t agree , therefore I will not do that . “
“ Mom I will not come upstairs “.
“ Mom I don’t want to …..”.

And the best word ever . “ NO”

I know of what I speak . I had an OCD , NPD mother .

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Hi Lost - where were you living in Italy and why - if you don't mind us knowing? I lived in Guatemala for 4 years - my parents just moved for the experience - went to part of high school there.

By the way, my family is from Calabria, Italy.

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In reply to Way's comment about laughing and teasing my mom after her tantrums - it's my way of coping with her and yes it is giving in to her. I am here to learn how not to do this.

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The laughing and teasing only pours gasoline on the fire and encourages more tantrums.

It's attention. All be it negative attention but attention just the same. Then you give in and resume catering to her demands.

You have to stop your ridiculous nonsense first. No more laughing and teasing when your mother is acting up and no more catering to her demands.

When you want to leave you say good-bye then go. Same with phone calls. Don't give her a chance to guilt-trip you or start acting up in other ways.

Don't meet her tantrums with teasing and laugher meet them with this statement.

'I refuse to play your games and be treated disrepectfully by you'.

Then walk the hell away and don't talk to her for a couple days.

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I need to stop posting alot, but I was just telling my husband my parents were going to move to Costa Rica 29 years ago, but ended up in Florida - all of a sudden they want to be near family? They wanted us to pick-up and go visit them when they moved so far away? They were always like that doing things spur of the moment - drastic. Now it's - oh, don't you want to spend time with us? No, mom and dad - you left your mother and moved to Guatemala for 4 years and you moved away to Europe and Florida and then we went upstate NY for 4 years to visit them in their country log home, that we were obligated to go to because you spent the damn money on it. My husband's family owned a cabana on the beach on Long Island and we wanted to do that too, but no, we had to be "family" with them. My Dad yesterday is saying I made a mistake by moving up here. I said yes, you could have had help in your own apartment and stayed there, but no, we had to not think about it and run up to "family". They move away that far and then blame us for not being family oriented? Are they kidding us? My Dad already had plans for my husband's retirement by saying - oh I thought your husband and you would spend 3 months with us in Florida when he retires. Is he kidding us? You traveled the world with your wife and then expect us to sit in Florida with you? No, no Dad that ain't happening! That was said because they don't want us to go so far away at their ages now. See ya Mom and Dad - we're going like you left your family and you're not going to give us a guilt trip! Thank goodness we didn't have kids is right - what a disaster it would have been. As you all know, I'm starting to realize what happened in my life and REALLY resenting it.

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Your parents did all that moving around ,while you were helping support them because they bought your brother 7 houses . Now they have little to no money . Very wrong . Extreme dysfunction .

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By the way, my mom last night asked me - why doesn't your husband come up and rest up here - I said no - he took a pain killer and wants to rest on his own coach and then she knew I was leaving by me helping with a few routine things and I said love you again and left. I'm so shocked she hasn't said anything about me leaving - what's going on here? I know you guys are going to say - just wait for it!

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How about stopping the love bombing .
Rewarding Mom’s behavior with “ I Love you “, is just encouraging her behavior .

Adopt a much cooler tone . Act like Mom is a stranger , give her what she needs and ,
” Ok , you have what you need , it’s time for me to go “. And leave , without asking if she needs anything else .
Adopt a go in drop off and leave attitude .
And don’t fall for Mom calling you to bring her one thing at a time , cause she will do that . You go up once a day . She’ll have to wait .

Honestly , cut out the little girl act around Mom , stop being afraid of her .

Stop caring . Look at where it got you . You resent the fact that they used you all these years . They don’t deserve love and affection. They are manipulative users .
The bait is “ we are family “ . That’s crap . It’s a guilt trip to get you to do what they want . Honestly they should be living in a cardboard box now .

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Yes, Way - the home was built with their money that they had lots of years ago. You know, I can understand that they enjoy our company, but to become angry that we can't spend time with them? That is not normal! I said to my mom, my husband and I enjoy one another's company and watch movies that we enjoy together. They claim to be the "closest and most loving couple in the world" and yet they must be completely bored with one another. That happens, but you need to change that then. They lived - what one would say such a wonderful and adventurous life together - but that doesn't make you happy. It's way beyond loving your children - I think there are a lot of insecurities going on here. I mentioned to you guys that their own families were screwed up and they lost their son who became homeless. Lots of ISSUES and they are clutching at the only HOPE they have in life that will make them happy! I think by talking to you all that I am starting to figure it out myself. Even though I have traveled extensively, I have been living this lifestyle so long, I never realized what's going on. My parents thinks all of this is NORMAL!
PS: We had a flat tire before we went upstate one time and my mom said - Oh, you're not coming up this weekend? What the heck is wrong with this women?

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Now that the lightbulb has gone on over your head…..

You have acknowledgement .
Now MOVE FORWARD.

You will have days you slide , but keep trying , it is an uphill battle .

One day at a time, one battle at a time .
Try to stop reminiscing about the past as much as you can , I know it’s hard .

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Again - she wanted to know how many blocks away that I have to bring the car back to my garage and walk back to the nail salon. In Florida, she waited for my Dad to pick her up with NO PROBLEM at all! Stop the nonsense Mom - please! I turned the tables on her and said - it's too far for you to walk on bricks - I live in Old Town Alexandria - historic area. I just totally ignored that we were talking about me driving back to my garage.

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Google

Grey Rock method .
And
detachment from toxic people

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Is there another area I should be posting on?

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Anxiety, sorry about the grandson part. I feel for anyone in situations like that.

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So I did Grey Rocking without realizing it. Ok. So I am going to sign off right now, but thank you once again. I'll stop by later tonight or tomorrow.

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My husband and you think along the same lines - he literally told me exactly what you said about her being the "employer" - and I am going to listen to both of you. The other thing about my parents is they always want to be recognized. My dad always complains that when someone visits with him he always says you think they would look at my photos on his office wall - or you think they would ask me questions about my traveling as a pilot. This all stems from their families not recognizing that they existed. Wow! We feel sorry for them, but this has been way too long of catering to their needs. I feel bad that I am talking about them now and at their ages and they only have a few more years left, but I better do it now then when they die.

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I mentioned that my mom doesn't want me to give an explanation about something she is discussing with me and she says my voice is very annoying. She will hold her ears and head. She wears hearing aids, but sometimes she's fine when I speak. I'm trying to learn about Dementia too.

Also, my Dad wants to buy a used car to go the supermarket, instead of using our car. Good, because I told him, to be honest if you kill or injure someone using my car - they will sue us and wipe our retirement out. I told you what he did in Florida crossing 3 lanes with oncoming traffic and stopping in the middle. I have no control right now to stop him from driving and I'm not getting involved. I'm finished - even if he kills himself - they know everything! Hate to sound mean - but, I'm done!

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"I have no control right now to stop him from driving and I'm not getting involved." You are already involved since you are letting him borrow your car. So stop letting him use your car.

Just don't take him to buy his own car. If he wants a car he will have to go on his own to make it happen.

Are you the one that will be paying for the insurance and car since you are supporting them financially? Please don't pay for this insanity.

If dad wants to go somewhere he can take an Uber or a taxi.

And why are you letting dad use your car anyway when you know what a poor driver he is?

Yes if he does kill or injure someone you can be sued for letting him use your car. My husbands brother died because someone let the POS borrow their car and the family sued their insurance, if the owner of the car had assets they would have sued them personally too for the death and debilitating injuries to BIL's wife who will be in a wheel chair for the rest of her life.

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My 93 year old mom gets upset when I tell her I need to go downstairs to my apartment. I feel like a prisoner.

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