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I would like to add to my earlier post. I am absolutely convinced that some addicts are self medicating an underlying mental illness.

Situations are not always black and white or cut and dry. There are gray areas that must be addressed if healing is to take place.

Sometimes there is hidden pain that the person has not disclosed to anyone. Unfortunately, they mask it by drowning their sorrows. Not an excuse but a reason.

Solutions do not happen overnight. Some people never recover. No one is ever cured. It is an ongoing struggle for the rest of their lives.

AA and AL ANON are helpful. Don’t ever be ashamed of reaching out for help. It is a sign of strength, not weakness. Live the serenity prayer.
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elaine1962 Oct 2020
🙏 Amen!! You are absolutely right!!! I love your answer Needhelpwithmom.
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She will continue to risk her life for certain; there is no way around that. Sadly it looks like time for placement when she is no longer competent. As she now IS competent, this is her decision to make. She could have this delivered to her, and will in all likelihood at some point. My bro's ex partner was/is alcoholic. He has gone so far, when locked in memory care after last rehab, to drink both listerine and hand sanitizer, which, surprisingly, makes a very large number of quite lethal "cocktails". There is no way round this deadly game until they are gone of it sadly enough. And no, alcohol will take her down eventually with falls and encephalopathy, so I wouldn't participate in that. The amounts she will drink, knowing some supply is coming in, will just escalate.
Do know that when Mom does enter care or hospitalization it is CRITICAL she be withdrawn safely with medications in rehab. And that they KNOW she is an alcoholic. I know someone with "locked in syndrome" Central Pontine Myelinolysis from going in with family not telling, having low sodium, and getting it replaced too quickly and too much for chronic alcoholic, resulting in lifelong debility. Never hide this important medical information; never try to withdraw alcohol suddenly.
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In my opinion, at her age and debility, and as a long time alcoholic, to withdraw from alcohol would be dangerous.

You didn’t say if she goes to the liquor store daily or not? If she goes daily, she may drink all of what she buys that day. If she goes weekly, then she drinks a certain amount each day. So if you commit to buying her alcohol, and she drinks all that she has in one day, you would have to drop off liquor daily. And you would have to consider she may still go to the liquor store to buy more alcohol. Going to the liquor store may be her own way of controlling her intake and keeping a routine.

I have known doctors in nursing homes to prescribe a certain amount of alcohol for their patients - such as one beer a day, to keep them from leaving the facility in search of alcohol as well as for their emotional well being.

This is a very emotional topic for adult children of alcoholics. Even at her advanced age it still dredges up bad memories for you. Can you and your mother have an honest conversation with her doctor? Perhaps she will agree to sticking with a plan set out by her doctor to keep her safe.
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I am torn on this.

Walking a couple miles is really good for her.

Maybe this is how she keeps herself from drinking soooo much.

Falls are going to happen no matter where she is, in the street at least someone sees her.

She has told you no and the doctor says she is completely competent.

When she goes to the liquor store she is known and gets some socialization.

I think that I would leave it alone and let her walk to the store until she can no longer do it. It is more than buying booze for her and she probably needs everything she gets out of the trips or she would give them up.

Buy her a nice coat, gloves, scarf and hat for her trips and make sure that she has emergency contact information on her.
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I assume breaking an addiction is a VERY difficult thing to do.

I totally see where you are between a rock and a hard place here. She's going to drink, regardless of what you do. She has no reason to want to stop. You have to figure out which option is more palatable to you. Neither choice is right or wrong. Only what's right for you.

If you are very worried about her venturing out to the liquor store which is physically risky for her, then maybe go ahead and buy it for her so you will not have to deal with the guilt of her getting hurt or even dying from her next accident (which will happen, just a matter of time).

Or if you can not stand the idea of her drinking, then just let her keep making her bad decisions and being ruled by her addiction.

No good choice here. But you are not wrong to make either one.

Good luck.
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Al Anon was helpful for me when I could not understand why my brother would not stop drinking. Maybe it would work for you.
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Are you ordering her groceries? If so I would just add the liquor to the grocery list so it can be delivered.
the only one she is "fooling" by not having it delivered is herself.
The biggest problem I see is if she does fall during the winter and if she is not seen right away she may freeze to death. Even if she does not fall it does not take much for an elderly person to suffer frost bite. A mile, using a walker, 88 years old, that trip can take a while to get to the store and back. A lot can happen.
While I do not like the idea of feeding an addiction unless and until she wants to quit she won't.
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This is truly sad but your mother has not hit her rock bottom. Possibly at her age that might mean falling in the snow and hopefully being rescued which would put her in the hospital where alcohol and cigarettes will not be available. This shows the extent of her addiction which millions suffer from around the world. I would not aid her in making substances easily available. Sadly she has to want to avoid them or as I stated she puts herself in a position where she is not able to obtain them.

I have a far from ideal mother for other reasons and I grew up with that. She avoided medicine for years due to her religion. She also avoided seeking any medical intervention for me throughout my childhood despite pleas from her mother which I discovered in letters. Now she gladly takes medicine which is keeping her alive but years of deferred maintenance has certainly affected her present condition.

You are doing your best. At 88 your mother is still making very poor choices but if that is how she is going to go out it is her choice. An addict can receive help from others but has to eventually accept that help and the reality of their behavior. They have to choose love of available family over the substances causing them great harm. Sadly to venture out in the conditions she is going to shows how strong the addiction is and the seeming importance the hold it has over her. I wish you strength.
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I’m sorry you’re in such a tough place with your mom. No judgement here, can only say if it were me, I couldn’t provide an alcoholic a drink. It’s beyond sad, and I wish you peace
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Adult protective services won’t help at all if the elder is deemed “incompetent “. I called and had a nice lengthy conversation with them.

You know what they did? They closed the case without ever going over to her house. I told them everything about my mother and since she is competent she is free to make bad choices.

They also said that if they knocked on her door and she refused to open it, they would LEAVE. Nobody can walk inside someone’s home without a search warrant or the elders permission. You can’t just tell someone how to run there life if they are competent. If she wants to drink, let her drink. She’s elderly. What else does she have to look forward to?

Its a very hard pill to swallow. Watch an elderly LO who is competent and make bad choices and not being able to stop them. I tried and tried and tried everything and talked to doctors, elder lawyers, social workers, policemen, EMT’S. They all said the same thing. She’s competent to make her own choices. Her own decisions. Even if they are bad ones. As long as she’s not breaking the law, she is free to do what she likes in her own home.
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NeedHelpWithMom Oct 2020
Elaine,

You show respect to everyone as a fellow human being, regardless of your personal feelings on the destruction of addiction. It is a disease! It takes awhile to overcome and some like my brother never did. I am grateful that I can remember the good times before he destroyed his life. In spite of everything, he managed to have some success in life too. His life had value.

I see wisdom, compassion and love in your answers. It takes a special person to never want to strip away someone’s dignity. You are that person.

I try very hard to grow but fall short at times. We are all works in progress walking on our own path in life. Thanks for being an inspiration to me.

You accept what cannot be changed. You aren’t overly critical of others. You judge actions, not people. I see very few people that are able to truly live the ‘serenity prayer’ successfully like you seem to do.

I admire your qualities very much and always look forward to reading your posts.

I adore your sense of humor on many things. You’ve made me giggle often.

I truly appreciate a person that can make me laugh during challenging times.

Laughter is good for the soul. It’s not always easy to do. It doesn’t apply in all situations but when it does, it can really lighten our load for awhile. I find healing in laughter. In the past I have sunken in the depths of depression in my darkest hours when my brother was alive in his addiction. You have too with your mom’s gambling addiction.

I suppose we healed through being able to accept and forgive. God knows that no one has the power to change anyone else. We can only change our reaction, and hopefully grow past any bitterness that destroys us.

We both moved towards therapy to help us cope and walk away to save ourselves, yet still care as much as possible without going down with the ship. It’s a tough balancing act that at times I completely walked away from.

Thank God for all therapists that guide us in our time of need, huh?

I relate to your energy and spirit.
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It sounds as though your 88 year old mother would rather risk death than stop drinking. Perhaps it’s reasonable from her point of view. It might also be reasonable from your point of view too. She hasn’t got a lot to look forward to, and you don’t have much to look forward to in the relationship. Resign yourself.
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Why not place a call to your area's Adult Protective Services (APS)? You can do it anonymously. She is clearly a danger to herself...and that's what they are there for. They also should have list of resources that might be helpful to her. Seeing an authority show up and to know they are watching and could come again at anytime may cause her to cool her heels a bit. Or rage. Whatever, let her have her tantrum. I've had many alcoholics in my family and no amount of care or concern will help motivate them to change. The only time an alcoholic *might* think of changing is when they are truly at rock bottom. Rock bottom means their life is completely out of control (relationships, money, work, friends, etc.). My housemate turned out to be an alcoholic and while I knew this she kept her late-night drinking to herself in her bedroom. Fine. It's your life. But then she started coming out of her room drunk out of her mind, falling, peeing on herself and whatever she fell on. Quite disgusting. So I laid down a tough boundary: either go to rehab or we put the house on the market and go our separate ways (or something similar...whatever it is that floats your boat). Just because she's your mother doesn't mean you are required to help her....especially when she uses that help to continue her liquor habit. She can detox on a psych ward (maybe APS can help you with that) at a hospital (usually about 2 weeks) and most hospitals will take medicaid for this, and definitely medicare. Boundaries can be scary, but that is more a product of your imagination than what really will happen. Expect zero from her. Expect rage. But stand absolutely and peacefully beside your boundary and let her make the choice of whether she will stop or separate. It doesn't matter that she's family. In truth, with her being as old as she is, APS might look at you as being neglectful to an elderly parent and thus abusive and in a lot of trouble. A neighbor or relative could easily (and with reason) call APS on you as her caretaker. Call and talk to them (anonymously), feel them out for what they can do/provide. Ditto for your area's Agency on Aging. Still, she may never quit, but why should you be the one who stands by and does nothing -- surely this affects you hugely? Are you going to take care of her when her cirrhosis of the liver kicks in? As long as you accept what she is doing, you are also enabling her. There is no middle ground here: either she stops or you leave. Period. There is really nothing else you can do. Tell her the choices and give her time to think about if before she answers. Do not argue. She will not hear you. Ditto for the yelling. State your requirements as they are -- you do not have to justify or explain your needs...they just are and you're entitled to them and have a right to a peaceful life. You also have to make a choice: do something or live with her alcoholism and accept it. Her drinking is abusive to you (and probably other family members). The only way to stop this from hurting you is for you to do something. She will never change on her own. Actually, you don't owe a person like this anything (mother or not). Why should you have to put up with and witness her behavior? Who elected you as a whipping post? I bet not a lot of people come to the house, just because they can't stand her behavior. Why would you choose to accept and continue to be abused and very unhappy? Don't. Either stop or separate. You'll feel guilty, but that's normal. You'll feel grief. You'll feel anger. You'll feel frustrated. You may become more depressed. You may sometimes think of suicide. So find a therapist (Ask APS or the Agency on Aging if you need a sliding scale financial approach) to help you with coping mechanisms....how to find a way to feel good with your decision. You could be your very own hero. What are you waiting for?
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Listen to the doctor. She is competent and can make her decisions. Translates to leave her alone and let her make her own bad choices.

My 96 year and old competent mother lives by herself making all sorts of bad decisions. She’s a gambling addict and spent every last dime my father ever made and now is looking to see if she qualifies for Medicaid.

My mother is also a hoarder and has been since 1998. He house is a mess and won’t let anyone help her clean or throw anything out.

She takes call a bus once or twice a week to go to the grocery store and buy groceries and then play the scratch off machine for hours on end. Then she takes the motorized grocery cart in the parking lot and rides it next door to the liquor store to buy her booze.

Yup, been there, done that. Not a thing I can do to stop her or help her. You can’t help someone who doesn’t want to be helped.

You can’t stop a competent person from making bad choices.
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This is tough. She cannot and should not stop abruptly.

Has she ever been in rehab before? Is she interested?

First of all, alcoholism is a disease. This is not her choice to drink. She simply can’t stop.

It doesn’t sound like her doctor is willing to help you help her.

Please call AA and Alcoholics Anonymous and ask them about their program or simply to discuss your situation.

Call a rehab facility or your local hospital and ask to speak to a social worker. They deal with alcoholism as a disease. You will be treated with respect. They will give you sound advice without judgment.

For the record, I grew up with an addict. So, I know how painful it is. I know the shame also.

People back then weren’t very kind to family members. Some still aren’t. It’s hard.

I wasn’t anything like my brother. Still, I was considered guilty by association. It nearly killed me as a kid. I became withdrawn.

I was always terrified of losing my big brother. It becomes a love/hate relationship.

People do not realize the agony that family members go through. I learned a lot later on in my life when I sought therapy to help cope with many aspects of life that I was going through. So many things go hand in hand. Issues become intertwined.

I wish you the very best in this extremely difficult and challenging situation.

I supported my brother as best I could but there is a limit. We cannot help anyone that isn’t willing to receive help. I reached a point that for my own sanity I had to walk away.

Was the estrangement forever? No, I was the last person at his bedside when he died. Did I forgive him? Yes, completely. Am I telling you what to do? No, you have to do what is right for you.

Was I angry? Yes, I went through lots of angry days. I chose to forgive so I could move forward and allow him to die in peace. At the end, most of all I felt sadness. Pure sadness. No more pain, no more anger, just sad. Then by the grace of God, I was able to let go and find peace.

The hospice social worker, nurses and chaplain helped me and my brother enormously. I am forever grateful to them.

Take care. 💗
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ArtistDaughter Oct 2020
I'm sorry about your brother, NeedHelp. When and if my brother goes back home from rehab, we don't know if he will begin drinking again, though it is the reason for his heart failure. He was revived at the hospital. He died and was brought back. But will he stop? He hallucinates that there is a beer next to him in his hospital bed and sips on his imaginary beers all day. Substance abuse runs through my family, and those of us who do not have it manage to marry into other families who have it. It seems never ending. My youngest son is sober now, but he's been sober sometimes for 6 years straight, then something happens emotionally and he thinks he needs a drink. And it starts all over. Yes, it's a disease. A horrible one.

In the situation of the mom here, I would not buy the alcohol, but would try to find professional help in getting her to stop drinking. So sad.
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No. Let her suffer the consequences of her poor decisions.
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DobermanLover Oct 2020
People don't set out to be an alcoholic, no one says hey I want to be one...things happen and we do not know the circumstances surrounding this. She is human and deserves help.
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Oops duplicate removed.

PS my relative was taking taxis to go out unsupervised (needs supervision) fell & decided delivery was ok afterall.

Regarding delivery: Tell her they probably know her face very well in store 😉 but have 50+ delivery guys - there is no way those guys would know her.
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I personally wouldn't. I'd tell her of my concerns for her safety (again) & remind her of alternatives (again). Dr says competent so, the consequences (although dire) are hers. Tough love is indeed tough - on you too!

Steel yourself for the next fall: elderly, impaired eyesight & alcohol - a trifecta with the odds on a fall soon - probably before I finish typing... I do feel for you both.

If the next fall is survivable, the pathway of hospital, rehab, unsafe discharge home may arrive. You my not be able to stop her walking, but you can plan how much you are willing to 'aide & abet' her current lifestyle.
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