Mom signed the papers to leave AL at the end of March with my brother taking her home. I don't agree. Any advice?

Maybe she should call your brother 3 times a day and he can run over there. It's a toss up which will come first - he'll either get tired of it or she'll have another nasty fall and end up back where she was. If you're working you can't just drop everything and run in any event.

That's a big problem, Ashlynne. Her falls are scary. I don't want her to break a hip. She keeps saying that she can fall anywhere so she might as well fall at home. My brother is caving in and I just don't know what to do. I have no plans to help him move her out or even get her house ready, but I know I'll have to.

You're in a sticky position. Both you and your brother are enabling her. If you refuse to be part of this plan that will cause strife and more stress for you and the outcome will be the same - another nasty fall and back to square one. During the time I cared for my mother (Parkinsons & dementia) she fell a lot but refused to use her walker around the house.

The last bad fall (which sent her to hospital and on to a nursing home) came at 2 a.m. - she'd fallen again the evening before. I lived in the basement but I'd got up to pack away some chicken to freeze otherwise I'd not have heard the bang and been able to call EMS or she'd have been on the floor until the next morning.

Will your mother actually call 3x a day? That's once every 8 hours, so she could conceivably fall and be on the floor for 8 hours. If she doesn't call then someone's going to be running over there every few hours.

As a nurse, do you work full time? If you do I suggest you say you can't be called during your working/shift hours as you can't leave work. That puts more of the onus on your brother to do the running, which he'll quickly get tired of.

What your brother is suggesting is a recipe for disaster but if your mother and brother are determined, there's little you can do about it but be around to pick up the pieces when the inevitable occurs.

I agree with Ashlynne in that the "call three times a day" plan is a recipe for disaster AND that if your brother and mom are dead set on this plan there's little you can do about it and must make some kind of peace with it. Since this is your brother's idea I hope that he plans on stepping in to help care for your mom and not assuming that you will go back to doing it. If he is assuming that you'll go back to doing it you have every right to say no. I know the stress you're feeling. I've felt that stress too when I was caring for my dad. It was beyond anything I could handle and almost took me down for good. If you are not in a position to jump back in then you need to tell your brother this. Believe me, as he dives further into caring for your mom he will understand where you're coming from eventually.

And has your brother figured out how exactly your mom is supposed to make her check-in call if she's lying on the floor? My dad fell while I was gone and laid on the floor for hours. He was unhurt in that he didn't break any bones but just lying there landed him in the hospital for 4 days until he was transferred to a nursing home where he died 6 months later. Just taking a fall for an elderly person can be catastrophic.

Let your brother know what you're willing to do, if anything, to help. And let him know what you're not willing to do anymore. But if your brother says that he's going to take over caring for mom pitch in as much as you can, as much as you're able to do. Remember, you've done your part, you've put in your time. This situation may just go full steam ahead without your input and there may be little that you can do about it.

I can't believe how luck had it that your chicken needed to get into the freezer at 2AM that day!

You are so right about the strife it is going to cause. Unfortunately for me as it concerns her, I no longer work as a nurse. I switched careers and can name my own hours. She knows that. So, as far as she is concerned, I can plan my hours around her. I really appreciate your response to me. You've been more helpful than you know. I will just stay strong and be prepared to pick up the pieces. I have done the 2 AM emergency visits with her. Hopefully she will be near the phone when it happens again.

Thank you, Eyerishlass. It's just sad that Mom will not understand what I'm not willing to do anymore.

Amy from the four years I cared for my mother I think every ER in that city has a chair with my name on it. There were broken bones and injuries that needed a psw to come change dressings and many falls just causing bruises. Before that she had falls (broke a hip) and strokes and I was always running the 200km to collect her dog, bring her to my home for rehab and so on plus (unbeknown to me) EMS had to get her out of the bath tub a time or two. People with dementia are very good at hiding things. It can be never ending until there is the final major fall that puts them in a NH.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Amy, you are a nurse and you know what you are talking about. Unless your brother is an orthopaedic surgeon specialising in elder care, he does not outrank you and he is talking through his… hat, is I believe the polite way to put it. I admire you for not going round to his house and slapping him, frankly. What an idiot.

Nearly ten years ago, my mother had a full hip replacement, elective. It was arranged that on discharge she would spend four weeks sharing her sister's ALF apartment and having PT, and then return home with a full care package. All sorted.

Ten days in I get a triumphant call from my mother to say she's home. "You're WHAT? How come?!" Oh darling [my elder brother] gave her a lift.

Darling elder brother did this on a Sunday afternoon, without so much as putting in a courtesy call to social services or her GP's office. He thought he was being a knight in shining armour. Actually he was being an irresponsible twat. I still haven't forgiven him and it was nearly nine years ago.

So your brother's rose-tinted view has made my blood boil. CRETIN. Ok, though, if that's how he wants it. You have given them a qualified opinion. They are choosing to act against your judgement and advice. Fine. Mother goes home, he has officially taken responsibility for her welfare, you wash your hands of it. Put it in writing. Wish them the best of luck with their exciting new arrangements and let them get on with it.

You will, of course, have to harden your heart quite substantially, and buy a new phone, but this is your only route out of the bullshit guilt and resulting stress. I hope you can do it, because I feel SO frustrated on your behalf.

Amy, you're trying to make your mom someone she's not. She's not changing, so either you need to change or you'll be miserable. I agree with Countrymouse. You've stated your expert opinion and neither your mother or brother will listen. Fine. They're on their own. Just don't let them take you down with them. Your mom is living EXACTLY the way she wants to. Now YOU get to do that too! Visit your mom at home, but do NOT put yourself on the "emergency call" list. Let your brother take that responsibility, since he's the one who's set it up. If she breaks a hip, she breaks a hip. It's her life and her choice.

Absolutely agree with CM he dun it he can pick up the pieces. No way nohow did you agree to this so don't be bullied into getting dragged into Mom's care. Pull up your big girl panties but make sure they are iron clad. To h*** with YOU cauzing strike in the family he has already cauzed it so making bad feelings with him is nothing to what he is doing to you. Quite likely mom would prefer to be at home, most people do but she is the one who has made that choice and is presumed competent to do so so don't enable her and forget the guilt. She won't wear a medical alert so if she falls so be it, her problem not yours. Every thing has been done to keep her safe. DO NOT LIFT A FINGER TO HELP unless you want to be her slave for many years to come.

"My brother's plan is to have her call one of us 3 times a day, and if she doesn't call, we go to her house."

Yes. Your BROTHER'S plan. So, mom can call HIM 3 times a day if she needs to and HE can deal. That's the only way it would be in my world were he my brother.

What everyone else said, too..

Ashlynne, Eyerishlass,Countrymouse, blannie, Veronica91 and StandingAlone Thank you ALL for being there. You've really lifted my spirits tonight.

Tell your brother straight out, if he takes her, he is totally on his own. Don't take any calls, don't manage any care, don't intervene when she gets nasty with him. Tell him "You make this bed and you will lie in it." Do not enable stupidity.

Amy, who has the Health care proxy/authority? That is the person who should have the most say over this move. If it is your brother, take a deep breath, tell yourself that you have said your piece and stand aside. Plan an out of town trip for the last week of March and the first week of April. When the move is complete and you do get to visit, leave a note by the phone of 'contacts'. On it (in large type) put your brother's name, then below that other siblings and in a smaller font, your name at the bottom.

If you are the halth care proxy, that is a different matter. That would leave you with the option to decline to serve in this role if the move should take place and asking your Mom to draw up a new document.

In any event, you can suggest that a PT come in to inspect the home to see that it works for your Mom. That will give your brother an independent opinion and likely a 'to do' list to get it ready. As we all know, siblings are rarely on the same page as parents age. Keep us posted.

Leave town, even of it is only one county over and even if you need to commute to work. Visit a friend or stay at an extended stay hotel. Do not answer the phone, advise him you will be out of pocket for an undetermined amount of time. Fib, say you and your family are visiting a friend. Escape the day before she is to go home, so he can deal with it from the onset.
Reintroduce yourself after 2 to 3 weeks when they have had a chance to meet their new reality. Your brothers actions have created a fork in the road, that is the best time to introduce a major change....he took the I initiative to make a change, so he needs to deal with it. You need to take the opportunity to introduce your own major change, passing the primary care giver baton. You can drop in and out on your own terms.

If he wanted to bring mom home on his own back, I would applaud him, but if he did it at your expense and without your blessing, he needs to experience the consequence of his action.

Not easy dealing with family dynamics and expectations.

Take care
L

So sad when siblings cant be on the same page and agree with the best welfare for your mother? I feel for you as im in same boat BUT ive decided that as soon as i can i will walk away. I will be 3hrs away but my brother lives five minutes from mum so he will have to take care of her and i will visit when i can.
I have to leave my mum because of the lack of support i get from my brother he lets her do what she wants and just ignores me he rarely calls here and does the ODD job and hes her "hero". So let him at it unless youre here caring 24/7 you wont get it and just how hard this is.
My advice for your own mental state is be a daughter to her but let him take on the full responsibility of her care yes harden up and walk away when you have to or this stress will make you ill.
Its so easy for siblings to let mum have her way when it dosnt effect them ive been an idiot here letting siblings walk all over me because i had an accident and had no choice but to live here in mums but "the worm has turned" i am demanding help now but sadly it took a ministroke for siblings to be forced into doing something. My sister will take her now for 12 days yeh great but nobody wants to discuss long term solution so the only way they will is if i walk away and i will.
Like you if family arnt all on the same page with your mums welfare then its heading for disaster thankgod ive one brother who totally supports me and then another IDIOT of a brother who seems to be in denial of mums illness.
Good luck but let him take over now you need to back away and let him see how stupid his actions were. My brother "snaps" at my mum after 15mins here as she wont wear her hearing aid can you imagine if he was caring for her fulltime. Let your brother see that you are right and maybe then you can both agree on her long term care together?
Hugs heres to stupid brothers!!

Yes, yes.. here's to stupid brothers! Geewiz, as of now Mom is of sound mind, so as I see it, a health care proxy won't be valid. Everything is taken care of and my brother will get her out of there. Yeah, right... he'll take her to her home, but everything is NOT taken care of. In my brother's defense, he's a really good person with a big heart.

Here's a question. How am I going to tell my mother that things have changed? I am not the main man anymore. Everything will be in his hands (except any bathroom issues..he has told her he refuses to do that) I see it now. I will remind her to eat her veggies and oatmeal, she'll say OK, I'll see them in the fridge uneaten. About 3 days later I'll get a call that she needs me to buy her an enema. She'll do it herself, or try to....the rest is up to your imagination.

Give your brother the name and number to some home healthcare folks who can help your mom with her enema. Your brother can buy the enema when she needs it - when she calls you, say, "Gee mom, we talked about this, you need to call brother to handle that." Brother can buy the enema and call in outside help to give it to her if she can't handle it. Giving an enema isn't rocket science. If you don't do it, she'll figure out a way to get it done. It may not be the way you would do it, but that's what will happen if you give up involvement. And you SHOULD give up involvement.

Your mom wants to live at home and that involves tradeoffs. One tradeoff (if you're smart) will be to let her and brother handle these issues. They will find a way. Your mom won't be happy, because you're changing the equation, but as long as you tell her ahead of time and make clear what you will and won't do, she's been warned. Stick to your guns!

Amy go out and buy a very big hammer. Take it home and knock all the "what ifs" into pulp. Give it a good sanitizing (something positive to do) put it somewhere safe and when necessary use it to knock some sense into bro.
So "he has a plan" well so do you and that's to keep Mom in ALF. No one has POA so Mom can do whatever she darn well pleases. I agree you may have to pick up the pieces BUT that does not mean enabling her to remain at home if it is not practicle for her to do so. When she can't manage and bro is out of his depth then and only then step in and arrange for the only alternative which is to return to ALF.
Make it very clear to Bro and Mom before the end of March that this will be your only involvement. Go out and buy a new pair of big girl pants if the elastic is shot in your current pair. it is going to be hard but you know the alternatives and you came here liooking for advice and everyone seems to be in agreement so good luck. We are here for you.

How do you tell her?

"Mother dear. Do you remember mentioning how annoying you found it when I speak to you in my nurse's tone of voice? And I understand that you would. After all, you are my mother, not my patient.

"But here's the thing. I AM a trained, experienced nursing professional. I cannot help taking a professional view of your health, safety and welfare. Now, I realise that when I try to advise you it doesn't help because, instead of listening to what I say, you feel annoyed and defensive. So it is not only frustrating, it is counterproductive for me to be involved in looking after you. It makes things worse, not better, for us both.

"Fortunately, there are many other people who will be happy to give you any help you need. [Fred] has already said that he will contact you three times every day to make sure you're ok, and I will be helping him by putting him in touch with any outside services - such as nurses or home helps - as necessary. And, of course, I'll be visiting and calling you as normal, just like I did when you were living in your ALF apartment, only I'll be there as your daughter, not as your care-taker.

"And we'll see how it goes. If you're worried, or if you're not managing, you can always let us know and we can think about what to do next. How do you feel about that?"

Your mother will, of course, come up with a long, long list of things you - you wicked ungrateful child - should be doing for her. And to each and every one, you answer "but how can I do that? You won't let me."

You also take notes. You write down a list of what she says she wants. It is a racing certainty that at least a few of them will be mutually exclusive. Organise the list and read it back to her. "Can't be done, mother," you say, rubbing your chin ruefully.

The really important thing to remember is that at the end of this and any similar conversation, you get to get up and walk away. And that is something you are free to do at any time. Never forget it. Get up, and walk away. Speak kindly to your mother, understand her myriad anxieties and dissatisfactions, but at the end of it, get up, and walk away.

Just got back from the store with a 6 pack of big girl pants and opened up the computer to your answer, Countrymouse. It's almost as though you know my mother. I was going the write the beginning of what I wanted to say and ask for more assistance on finishing my thoughts. Mom has a way of turning conversations like this into a mess and ending by calling me an ungrateful child. I DO care and your response to her makes that clear. I'll be forever grateful for your response and those of everyone else. Feels good to know you are all there.

Oh Amy I'm afraid she still will do that! But having a mantra can help you not let it get to you so much (or so fast).

Hope the panties are a nice comfortable fit. Wear them in good health x

Yep, make it clear to both mom and brother that bro is first line of defense and he is her main contact going forward. Tell them AGAIN plainly that you can appreciate her wanting to go home but that you want to go on record as not supporting this decision and if they call you for help, then you will arrange for outside assistance 24/7 if necessary and it will come out of moms and bros pocket.

Stick with your guns and don't cave. If she calls, refrain from answering and absolutely don't return the calls for a day or two following the call. If mom says I need help, i need this or that, say "did you tell Billy?" "Well, mom, keep calling him cause he's in charge"...

Let brother deal with this for awhile at least til he caves. Then together you can agree to place mom or arrange outside services so everyone can have their independence.

Good luck and give us an update sometime.

What the other's said.

Watch out for the FOG, Amy - fear, obligation and guilt. No doubt your mum and bro will try those to manipulate you into doing what they want you to do. Do not respond to it.

My mother wanted to move to an inferior ALF. She is not mentally healthy and her technique of coping is the be angry/accusatory and to run. I have moved her twice in 4 years and will not do so again unless to a higher level of care should she need it. She was in the best place possible. Continual moving is too hard on me and does not solve any of her problems. My sis, with no consultation, though I have POA financial and am named as mother's agent should she be declared incompetent (she is walking a very thin line there), said she would move her. I looked into the situation and disagreed. There was a huge kerfuffle, name calling, verbal abuse and so on. Fine. I stood my ground and said I could not stop her moving, but I was not going to help with the move. Sis suddenly found she was faced with doing some work. The move fell apart and the ensuing emotional upsets and deterioration got the mental heath team assigned to mother in action, and she is now in a facility being evaluated and they will make recommendations about a suitable placement. Had I not stood my ground, mother would be moving to an inferior facility, and not had her mental health issues addressed and would be causing increased havoc.

This is not an exact parallel to your situation, and you are blessed to have a well meaning, kind brother, but you KNOW what is and is not best for your mother. Stick to your guns and good luck! ((((((((((((hugs))))))))))

Caregivers NEED to set boundaries for our own health and sanity. Tell him upfront you don't agree with what he did. Tell him you no longer can coordinate her care. Sounds like she has her control on him too. Since she is a fall risk, calling 3 times/day is poor planning.. If/when she falls it could leave her laying for hours in pain. I'd never agree to that. When you are able to say upfront what you wont do it will empower you and free your guilt!

Amy you dont say exactly what your mums aliments are? does she have dementia?

kazzaa, Mum does not have dementia. She has arthritis, spinal stenosis and has suffered mini strokes. Her instability and reaction time make her a huge fall risk. Her hands aren't strong enough to put elastic stockings or boots on, sometimes even buttons are a problem. She is frail.

Amy it's obvious she can no longer live alone. I'm sure your brother means well but unless he's prepared to have her live with him and be her caregiver 24/7 she must stay in ALF.

Yes, Ashlynne. I totally agree. Neither of them seem to see that. He thinks it will be much easier because she lives 5 minutes away and the ALF is 25 minutes away. He has been going every day.... he just couldn't listen to me either. Gosh, it stinks to be the baby of the family.

BTW, had a wonderful chat with my MIL and she said that my mom knows EXACTLY what she's doing to us. In the meantime, she's cleaning out, giving grand children things they may want or need and preparing herself to move into the lovely facility in her town.

Amy, we are moving my MIL to Assisted Living on March 1st. She has three kids, a son who is 63, a son who is 59 and a daughter 58. The oldest son and daughter and I (62) are relieved. The 59 year old son is coming apart at the seams with emotion. Of course he is the one who would appear in her kitchen like a gaping nestling, expecting her to toddle around and make his lunch and give him $20 for gas because it stopped his whining. Yes, his little world is crumbling, while Mom is looking forward to playing with people her own age. He'll be the first one to want her out of ALF, because they have a co-dependent relationship. Your brother probably expects the same thing, that mum will cook his meals and flip him a $20 when he needs gas in the car. What is it about some sons who never cut the umbilical cord? Your mother wants to go with him because they are still co-dependent. It's pure idiocy and be sure you do not support the move in any way.