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She is still living alone but we can't even talk anymore as she's fixated. She believes there are people living in her ceiling, (one story residence with no attic) she believes that they are making drugs and pumping them in. She believes they follow her around, come into her apartment when she's asleep and move things around. She has a dog and won't leave him because she believes they mess with him when she's not there. This is all she talks about, refuses to be diagnosed by a doctor or listen to what a doctor says. She isn't on any medication, still lives alone, drives, pays her bills, etc but she says she smells the drugs all the time and it makes her dizzy and loopy. This has been going on for 10 years now. She'll be 84 this June. Because of her fixation and this is all she wants to talk about, we rarely see each other. I pop in and take her prepared food I make extra of, but it's become impossible to take her out to lunch, shopping or have her over. On top of everything else, she has NO filters and talks VERY filthy to my 24 and 25 year old adult children. When I try to step in she just goes further and further.... I'm at my wits end and I'm the only one she has here. My brother and sister live in Ca while we're in CO. Any suggestions? The manager in the HUD unit mom lives in says she can stay there until she hurts herself or others; I'm just waiting for the phone call that says shes completely lost it. She has always refused to have a 'plan' for when she can't live there anymore. I envision some agency stepping in and having her committed. Scares me to think about it, but I know it's coming.

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Spooh1, your situation sounds so much like mine.
I've made calls to doctors, had shrinks talk to her in the hospital, talked to social workers.
My mom acts normal on the street, too, for the most part, and at the doctor's. Several doctors have seen her over the years, and nothing. My mom dumps a doc if she doesn't get what she wants, which really is only painkillers and xanax.
As for dementia, I told her, how about we try some meds? Nope. Doesn't she want to be able to have a better relationship with me or others? Nope. When the time comes she'll be too far out of it, she says it won't affect anyone, not even her. (um, not really!) Same thing with a hearing aid. Doesn't she want to be able to hear loved ones and friends? Nope. Everybody complains too much. Oddly she is the one who complains left and right.
I even called the court and asked about an evaluation. They only want to do something, it seems, if she's threatening suicide at that very moment.
So, you're not in an easy situation, but at least find comfort in knowing you're not alone and that others have a lot of good advice and insights here! It's such a comfort to know that.
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Deceipt and Collusion. The only way I could get it done. Seriously.

There is no person, medication, or miracle that is going to make my mom wake up and see reason. Despite that obstacle, we still had to do the right thing for her or she was going to die in that filthy, nasty house a crazy old lady that nobody could or would help.

Playing nice by the book was getting me nowhere, so I took a different tact.

I played on all my mother's fears for about 6 months before we moved her. I talked about how much better it is to be in a secured building with a guard at the door and a nurse down the hall. Don't you want to be safe? I can't believe you are still living in that house by yourself. I'd be terrified if I were you.
I know, bad bad bad. I'm probably going to h3ll for it.

After about 6 months of that, I had my husband call and tell her how it was going to be. We did not ask. We did not give choices. We told and did.
And we only told her enough to get the action needed today, right this minute. We didn't describe the whole year long plan. We didn't talk about the step after this step we need to do right now. Just enough information to get the immediate need solution in motion. We are coming down to get you, so you can be near us. (Not a lie! Just not the full naked plate of details.)

We drove the 1800 miles to her house. The next day was bank day. We went to the bank to straighten out her money with the one person on the planet that mom trusts: a nice lady named Carrie at the bank. Carrie knew why we were there and played along perfectly. She told (NOT ASKED) mom that she was putting my name on some things so that I can make sure bills get paid. Since Carrie said it and not me, it was OK. Carrie printed out a form for POA we needed and TOLD mom we had to go to city hall to fill it out and be notarized.
So we did. We also found a lady who needed a piano who could come take mom's!

Then my aunt & uncle next door took mom out to visit her sisters & brother. They took her out to lunch. They tried to keep her out of the house as much as possible so we could pack. And pack and pack and pack for 5 days. We packed too much.

When mom was in the house, she was unpacking, yelling, complaining, berating, being in the way, and undoing progress. It was very disruptive to her to have her surroundings being changed and she couldn't handle it. If we couldn't get her out for an errand or food, we had a system to work around her. We had a room at the back of the house that was too far for mom to walk to, designated as the "Special Collections" room. It was for stuff we were not really taking with us. Mom didn't know the wiser. If it was some old cookie tin from the grocery store mom was refusing to let go of, we ran it back to the Special collection room to deal with later. (wink wink) Because you know, everything in there would have to be very carefully boxed up to move, right? All that precious, precious stuff. All the ungiven Christmas calendars from 1990. All the out of date clothes that aren't her size. All the kitchen equipment that doesn't work. You know, all that good stuff.

So we eventually got her stuff on a moving van through devious manipulation and probably 100 guardian angels looking the other way to help us. We got her loaded into the car and on the road. There was a LOT of theatrics involved, but everybody in the house working with us on this kept telling mom how much better it was going to be and to pick her up off the floor when she threw a toddler tantrum. You'll be near your grandkids. You'll be safe and never have to worry about men with red eyes at your windows again. You'll never see another bill or have to do your taxes. Somebody will wash your laundry for you, etc.

Mom pitched a real "mother" of a hissy fit getting into the car and for about 20 miles down the road. I stopped and got her a happy meal & strawberry milkshake, and she was fine. Then she fell asleep and I floored it.

Would I have preferred to do this like adults? Definitely.
Would I have preferred for her to make these choices with me 15 years go? Yes.
Would I have preferred for this to play out like a TV show where she sees reason and is willing to make good changes ahead of time? Oh my gosh yes.
Did I get that situation handed to me? No I did not.

I had to change the rules as I went. I had to overrule most of her theatrics and do what would keep her safe and clean. Not one person down there really got in the way. Her sisters were verbally difficult, but they never came over and actually stopped anything. Every single other person in town we encountered gave me a hug and told me I was doing the right thing. They told mom not to "show off and misbehave". Which is southern code for "Don't make a monkey's rear out of yourself."

When people say "mom won't let us ....." I want to challenge that and say that if there's a will, there's a way. You may find support where you least expect it. You will need a plan in advance though. You will need people to be in collusion with you. You will need to structure things so you can get the outcomes you need.

It's not for you anyway. It's for THEM. To keep them safe, clean, fed, and as well as we can for the time they have left.

Since I'm an only child, I did not want the authorities coming after me with elder abuse charges. I wanted every single person in that community to know that I tried. I tried hard.

My back up plan was that if it was going to be too impossible to do a real move, that we would throw some underwear in a grocery bag, hogtie her, and stick her and her Depends in the backseat of the car and drive until we couldn't drive anymore. It's just stuff left behind and I can always go back for it.

In hindsight, I should have moved her person before attempting to move her stuff. She should not have been present for the packing and sorting. She didn't need to see that happen. She had no productive input to contribute. It was like a scene out of the Hoarders TV show, with the old lady hanging onto her 1985 issue of Country House for dear life, verbally abusing everyone in ear shot and claiming nobody loved her.
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I feel for you, spooh1.Your story sounds a lot like mine with my mom, who's 77 and paranoid and refuses all help. My mom thinks her neighbor is a prostitute (really she's an accountant) who has called to her through the heat vents to go out and smoke cigarettes, or she thinks men 50 years younger than her are falling in love with her on the spot, and on and on.
I can't really talk to my mom anymore either. I have no more patience after all the paranoia and drama. And she mainly just talks about herself and whatever she's paranoid about, and we all know how irritating it is to deal with someone who only talks about themselves.
I've tried talking to the courts and to my mom's doctor and get nowhere, mainly because my mom puts up a good show in front of authorities.
How is your mom in front of the doctor or anyone else in a position of authority, for that matter? Does she behave or does it quickly become obvious she has dementia (or something related)?
You could try talking to her doctor and seeing if he or she will back your concerns, or try an area agency on aging, as they might have help.
I really feel for you, though. My mom has been on a downward spiral for about 12 years now and it's so frustrating.
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Documenting is a good idea. Plus she's been in the hospital a number of times and there's a record there, because doctors, nurses, social workers and psychiatrists have spoken with her.
Sadly she wants nothing to do with me right now, and I have to admit, I kind of don't either -- she has her own apartment nearby. As for guardianship, I don't really want it. She is super resentful of any and all family. She hasn't talked to many relatives for 20, 25 years, and still goes on about them, how they were jealous of her, ripped her off, deceived her. My aunt once said, ages ago, "we loved your mom, but never knew what to make of her." That always stuck with me. I think it underscores there have been mental problems for longer than I can even imagine.
I have to laugh at Sandwich's story about the guy hugging mom at the salon. Had that happened to my mom, she would have said the guy had fallen in love with her. Once, her neighbor parked close to her apartment window, and she thought it was a sign he wanted to court her! I had no words! But if he parks near her apartment, it's courtship, if I put my hand on her back to guide her which direction to go, I'm shoving or abusing her!
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I have no great wisdom to offer. I just want to offer my warm wishes for you in this trying situation!

Have you ever tried "evicting" the people who live in her ceiling? Have a friend who likes acting come out in official-looking workman clothes, carrying a clipboard and asking her some questions. Then he leans a ladder against the building (or goes into the elevator if it is a tall building), investigates, reports that he has found the way they are getting in, made sure there is no one there, and sealed up to opening.
Far-fetched? Sure. But she is not going to accept the truth and you cannot reason with someone who has lost her ability to reason. Try to get into her world and to comfort her. Might not work -- probably won't work for long -- but what have you got to lose?

This kind of going-along-and-fixing-the-problem has been known to work with some delusions persons with dementia have.
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Sandwich42plus:
Your situation has some similarities to mine. My mother has long shown erratic behavior: Threats of suicide, making up illnesses (once, stomach cancer, which she was just her being eccentric), if a woman looked at her too long she was obviously a lesbian and into her (there were lots of lesbians), plus my mom cut off contact with her entire family, one by one, and it's shaky at best with me. She's done impulsive things like suddenly will make a big purchase or make a big move with no planning or foresight. ("I'm bored and unhappy, so I'm going to move to Mexico! Guatamala! Ecuador! Poland ...")
A doctor once thought my mom might be bipolar, and now that she's older and untreated -- she won't see a doctor for anything except xanax, vicodin and blood pressure meds -- it's just gotten worse, and she's gotten nearly impossible for me to deal with. I don't know how anyone has the patience to put up with years of accusations and being emotionally yanked around.
And as for driving: you can often turn someone in at the DMV or secretary of state. They'll usually call the person in question in and make them take a vision and written test, then a driving test (if they pass). I did that with my mom, and she actually thought the secretary of state was out to get her personally! (And she flunked, and lost her license.)
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My only contribution is to record one of your interactions with her and play that back to the Dr., APS, anyone you can think of. It is probably illegal to do it but it is the only thing I can think of if she is still good at "showtiming" Hugs and sympathy.
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Sandwich - the visuals are hilarious, You get the gold medal for being creative with moving your mum.

Other than being that creative, or managing to convince them somehow, you pretty well have to wait until they are considered a danger to themselves or others. Mother mentioned suicide several times and that was enough for the geriatric psychiatrist to send her to hospital. She actually went voluntarily but they would have sedated her and taken her if she hadn't.

Your mum, and spooh1's must be cousins of mine. Oh wait, she already has some cousins who are tarred with the same brush.

The weirdest was when mother called me one evening and told me that she had opened the freezer in the middle of the night and when she looked in it she knew what was coming and God would get me for it.

sandwich - You are not alone. Mother was concerned that I would become a prostitute in my teens so she offered to show me how to satisfy myself so I wouldn't. I would probably have been voted by my classmates as the girl least likely to. What struck me most about her offer, apart from disgust, was the stupidity of it - the assumption of why women go into prostitution. It was later that I got "accused" of being a lesbian - which these days might not be a big deal, but on those days, in Scotland, where you didn't even wear slacks, it was a big deal. Fortunately, the people she shared with this knew me.

Heidi - looks like you are between a rock and a hard place.

There are times I wonder how we have survived.
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So sorry you are going through this. All I can say is lie, lie, lie to get her to a safe place that will take pets. When mom's husband died (at home and mom found him) the fire department called me on my cell because my # was posted on her fridge.

I live in AZ and Mom lived in IL. I flew up and arranged her husband's funeral and saw there was something wrong with mom. She was hearing people singing, etc, etc. Somehow I got her to a lawyer to assign me POA (health & financial).

Anyway, it has been a long road and I first put her in assisted living, which she could not do and the assisted living shipped her off to the hospital. Put her in a nursing home and she was there 2 days and they shipped her back to psych ward for med readjustment then put her in a nursing home I did not like due to her behaviors. They promised me they would not ship her back to hospital. They kept their word but she was now in Missouri and I'm in Arizona. Long story short I kidnapped her from nursing home and brought her to AZ close to me. She is now in a facility that puts her meds in her coffee and food because she refuses to take pills. If I can help in any way please let me know.
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spooh1 - you are definitely not alone. My mom is not quite as bad, fortunately, but she has paranoid delusions and obsessions which she will not let go of. Her current obsessions include: the housekeepers stealing her clothes, her missing social security check and if her house was sold and where is the money and furniture (sold 10 years ago!) It doesn't sound like your mom should be driving. Can you arrange for a social worker, psychiatrist (or someone who can help you get legal custody of her) to come to her house with you (bring lunch or something) tell Mom she/he is a friend of yours and let the person question her. (That is how we managed an interview with the Assisted Living person who had to evaluate Mom. Mom never knew it was an assessment interview.) It sounds like you are not going to be able to get your mother on the drugs she needs until such time as you get her moved and under care, even temporarily until such time as she is stabilized. During that time you could sell the house and arrange for AL, or at least hire an aide to make sure she stays on the drugs. She is probably as unhappy as you are, but she no longer has the mental faculty to take care of her needs.
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