My 81-year-old mom has dementia and is narcissistic. Is anyone else dealing with this?

Hi Polarbear,
Welcome to the Alzheimer's caregiver hangout. You can say whatever you want here and no one will judge you. We've all been in your shoes.

I'll bet your best friend hasn't been in your situation, caretaking a demented, narcissistic mother, has she? She has no idea what you're going through. We do, at times it's pure hell.
Whether your mom was narcissistic all her life (like mine and SO many others were) or she is just in her own little world and the only person who counts is her, it's really hard to put up with.
How selfless can we be until we loose ourselves all together? No one can be cheerful 100% of the time.

Do NOT accept guilt from anyone. Don't bring up the subject, but, if she does, ask her to stay with your mom for a couple of hours while you go to a doctor appointment. THEN she'll see the other side.
Until then, keep venting away right here. We're in the trenches with you. 😉

P.S. Carve out some alone time (away from your mother) each week. It's vital for mental health!

Polarbear all you can do is your best in the best way you know how. So carry on and don't feel guilt.

I am relieved to see that I am not alone in feeling the way I do towards my 81 y.o. Alzheimer mother. My best friend doesn't understand me when I tell her how I feel. She thinks I can do better and I shouldn't feel what I feel. So, I stop sharing with her anything about my mother. Even though, there is not a lot of things that can help me, but knowing that many other people understand exactly what I am going through really helps me feel less guilty.

Well all l have to contribute to all of you caregivers is l don't think there are any answers to these issues. My mom was such a actress, she could fool anybody, an you can't blame them. My mom was relentless in abuse, but l was determined to care for her, even tho she thought l was the hired help, an over paid. But what l learned to late, was it was like quicksand, as time went on l was sinking, l struggled to keep going an trying harder as she declined. In this struggle to keep her in her home, an do the best l could. We were isolated, l was judged, and now that mom has died, l realized what a price l have paid. My health, l am now trying to deal with depression, the fight to get back to normal. My mom at the end of life, said l was her best friend an she loved me. I learned to love her too, we never got along when l was young.Still, the bottom line is caregiving for dementia is way to complicated and demanding, for anybody to do this work, so don't fool yourself into thinking that you are unique an can handle it. The cost is so personally high to pay. Thanks for listening, an l pray that this personal story helps those with the same determination that l had. God bless all the caregivers, an there helpers.💝

Well all l have to contribute to all of you caregivers is l don't think there are any answers to these issues. My mom was such a actress, she could fool anybody, an you can't blame them. My mom was relentless in abuse, but l was determined to care for her, even tho she thought l was the hired help, an

Omg! Yes my mom is also acting narcissistic as she is now in moderate Stage Alzheimer’s. It never dawned on me what to exactly call it but this is very true and happening right now with her. Is it because they regress to being child like?
Everything revolves around her in her mind and only her requests and needs and wants seem important to her.

Yes, one solution - remove her from your presence before her behavior and attitude destroy YOU. Do it NOW.

I have a really difficult father in law; tried and tried to be good to him when he came here, several states away, but visits usually ended in a fight (I'm just not able to lay down and take it as his whole family does, for very long, I guess); I will NOT be the one to care for him.... does that make me bad - or just wise enough to know a lose lose situation?

The awful stoeies... where do I begin with my Mother-in-law? It started the day after I announced I was marrying her son 40 years ago. She was furious with me because spthat wedding announcement forced her to lie again to her beauty shop clients about her son (my fiance). Seven years before I met her she decided she would make her son marry a girl I'll call Ally. She gave Ally her own engagement ring, picked out the furniture, and even arranged for a church wedding. Problem was, he never proposed. So as the time neared, she gave Ally and the son a wedding shower. Lots of her beauty shop clients gave large gifts. The next day, the son left and flew to Hawaii for a month, to acoid marrying somebody he did not love. Meanwhile, Ally eloped, and she and her new spouse beoke into my Mother in law's house and stole all the gifts that had been given to her and the son. Since my Mother in law couldn't return the gifts, she chose to lie to her clients for seven years, saying Ally was still married to her so . Once I placed the wedding announcement in the local papers, she then chose to lie, saying her son and Ally had divorced! So from that day on, she chose to hate ME, not because I had done anything wrong, but because My wedding announcement somehow made HER look bad.

For the past forty years I have been called ugly names, my Mother in law has bit her nails and spit them at me, and she has slapped me on the face as she has gotten older. She has lied about me mistreating her. I have never said or sone one thing inappropriate to this woman of hate.. Her last words my husband a month ago were: "Your wife isn't here at my 94th birthday party because she is having an affair with some man in Chicago (not true, and I was actually there, hearing every word she said!). I only want to know: Did I have a good time with this imaginary man, because anything would have been better than what I was actually doing: cleaning her feces off every surface of my home! She accused the assisted living facility (she moved of poisoning her iced tea, and often tried to jump inside the television

I loved you first response! Your only human. We all,are and it's a pain in the neck when they behave like that. I know !
Well done for the great second response

Please scratch my earlier response. It would have been immensely satisfying to take that course of action, but it would be irresponsible to suggest that without knowing the actual circumstances. I thought about it for a while. I feel sometimes as they age and their body breaks down on them, they lose their inhibitions/ self-control over their bad behavior and let it all out on their loved ones. Maybe, she hasn't experienced true love in her life or underwent some sort of abuse early on in her life or it's just her physical infirmities. We're sum of our experiences, good and bad. But, that's not an excuse for her to abuse you. However, if your mother had given you a relatively healthy childhood with food, shelter, safety and education, when you were quite vulnerable, then maybe it's your time to take care of her, as best as you can. If you have the time and energy, dig into her past and see, where the hatred comes. It'll help with understanding her and sometimes, your own behaviors as we sometimes tend to mirror our parents, whether we like it or not. Give her love, but set boundaries. Make her understand that there are certain transgressions you will not tolerate and there are consequences. It's like handling a two-year old. Ultimately, it's upto you as to what you can bear with, all the while keeping your sanity. Try not to get baited into pointless arguments or insults. Be unaffected like a lotus leaf. Pray to the higher power to give you strength and courage. Most times, we don't know what we are doing in our lives. Do your best and leave the rest in His hands. Good Luck!

domesticgoddess, why did you ever do any caregiving at all for your witch of a mother-in-law????

How Can I say this nicely...well I can't. Throw her out of your house and mind. Last part is bit difficult though.

My Mother in Law is 94 in a Memory Care Assisted Living now. I've been married to her son for 40 years, and every year dealing with her even in a small way, was h*ll! So about ten years ago, I had to have knee surgery, due to an accident. I couldn't be released from the hospital without someone driving me home, and staying with me for the first 4 days. Of course, my husband (I'll call him Monty) took off work and took me to the hospiyral, and home. But the following 3 days he would have to be out of town, driving our daughter to a church camp some 400 miles away. My Mother-in-law said she'd be happy to stay with me while I recouperated.

So she showed up the night I came home from the hospital. I couldn't walk anywhere, and was in a lot if pain. Monty had the doctor call in a pain med and my MIL said she'd pick it up the next morning.

The next morning, Monty and my daughter packed the car and drive iff for camp, around 8:00 AM. Meanwhile, I was in agony, with my knee throbbing with pain. I asked my MIL to go puck up my pain medicine at the drug store. She stood beside me (I had to sleep on the coucg, because my bedroom was upstairs, and Zi couldn't get there!). She then tossed a dry, burned piece if toast on me, and said, " I'm leaving in the next ten minutes or so!"

"Thanks for getting my pain meds!" I replied.

"No. I'm not coming back!" she responded. "I'm driving back to my house (an hour away) and helping the pastor of my church prepare the baptistry for a baptism! You know I AM the head deaconness at my church! I can't be here all day, let alone all weekend just because your knee hurts!" And with that being said, she packed up her small suitcase, and headed for the door.

I still remember what I hollered at her as she disappeared from my sight... "but what about me?"

I crawled to my downstairs' bathroom, by scooting on my rear. It took me nearly 30 minutes to get there! Then, I crawled to my husband's study, and was able to get up into his rolling leather chair. After that, I called my girlfriend across town, and she picked me up, got my pain meds, rented a wherlchair, and kept me at her house for the next three days until my husband Monty came home.

My mother in law is beyond narcicistic. If it hadn't been for my girlfriend, I would have had to go back into the hospital fir three days. I cannot believe the misery she has caused my entire family over the years.

Now that she's 94 and in the Assisted Living Center, we are sighing a breath of relief.

To the woman who is worried about her Mom joining in activities at the center, forget it. She is making her own life choices. I have started a new mantra: "This is no longer my monkey, and it's not my circus any longer!" (truthfully, I've never been in my Mother-in-law's circus in 40 years. So why start now?)

Wow... I should write a book about my Mother in law! We've been married 40 years, but from the week before our wedding, she has literally hated me! (and yet you see who is her caregiver, at the end stages of her life!). Ha.

The week prior to my wedding, my fiance (her son) and I drove to visit his folks. She met me at the door with the comment, "I can't BELIEVE you had the newspaper print your engaement announcement! I am FURIOUS with you!".

I replied, "I am so sorry. Did they misspell your name?"

"No, you had the paper announce you were marrying my son, so I had to tell the women at the beauty shop I own, that he had divorced Suzie!" She responded indignantly.

I looked at my fiance, and said to him, "I never knew you were married before, This may be a deal breaker!"

"I've never been married, or even engaged before," He answered, adding that I should probably ask his Mom why she had to lie to her beauty shop customers!

So I looked at his Mom, and implored her, "Why did you tell your customers that your son was divorced, when he wasn't even married?"

"Well, I decided he should get married about 7 years ago, and so I gave a girl named Suzie (not her real name) that he was dating at the time, my engagement ring. I set a wedding date for them, and booked the chapel. I even gave her a wedding shower, and she got a lot of gifts! But the week before the wedding, my son withdrew all his savings accounts, and flew off to Hawaii with some of his buddies for three weeks! Imagine MY horror when I discovered Suzie, in the meantime,eloped with some guy she met at a bar, and they broke into my garage, and stole all the wedding gifts. So I couldn't return them to my beauty shop customers.

So for the last seven years, I've lied to them about the wedding, and the gifts. Once in a while Suzie drops by my beauty shop, and I ask how they are doing as a couple!"

"So you basically have been lying for the past 7 years, yet you choose to be angry with me for setting the record straight?" I asked incredulously.

"Well, I didn't exactly set the record straight," she said. "I told another lie and said they'd divorced, and THEN told the women he was marrying you!" She answered flatly.

"Thank heavens you got MY marriage straightened out!" I told her.

And that's how our relationship began. For the past 40 years, my Mother-in-Law has called me names like "lard-a**, and worthless Momma." She never babysat my children. and wouldn't allow them in her house unless I sat in the den to make sure they didn't touch her stuff! Meanwhile, I have raised three children to become educated, accountable adults, who respect me.

I have been nice to my Mother-in-law, and have never responded in anger to the poor treatment she has displayed. The last straw, however, has been this summer, She is 94, and has Alzheimers. She was still saying horrible things and just embarassing me. While I cleaned her feces off the walls in my home, she was telling my adult kids I was having an affair with an imaginary man downtown. How preposterous! . (My only thought was, 'I hope I had a better time with that imaginary man, than I am here with you, cleaning feces off my walls, bathing you, and being slapped and spit on!').

We finally had to place her in an Assisted Living lockdown Memory Care unit, while she paced the floor in June. She is now in Stage 7 of Alzheimers, not able to swallow, and I am having a horrible time reconciling her lifelong hatred of me, with caring physically for her. I wish her well, and hope she is not in pain.

That narcicistic behavior can be overwhelming. But they need our help. Someday God's got some "splainin' to do!

My Narcisstic mother passed away Saturday. I didn't expect it to be honest
She had become more pleasant to me in many ways but
She had some last words for my sister which are not nice for her to live with now . was it dementia or just my mums narcissist personality? We'll never really know .

I feel your pain. Fortunately, we were able to get her into an assisted living place and now our home has regained a good vibe. After 3 months of the gloom she emitted from her being, I took a year leave from my job just so I could dedicate my energy to getting her kingdom of a home sold. Long process but everyone is better off now including her

Much of the actual daily work of early years childcare is boring and exhausting - it's only because we love our babies so much that we get through it at all. Who wouldn't rather be running the country or curing cancer? - but Good Mothers aren't supposed to have regrets or frustrations. I'm glad you gave your mother room to be truthful, SueC.

I finally got the confirmation of the 'real' feelings my mother had about having a child.
My mother is narcissistic and has been all my life. Now she has stage 6 Alzheimer's and is no longer exhibiting the narc behavior.

We had a talk today to try to divert the subject of her "terrible headaches". I asked her if she enjoyed being a mother. She gave a lukewarm response. I asked if she would have rather been a career woman and she said, "Oh yes!" I then asked, "Or maybe a politician?", "That would have been good." She admitted that she didn't have much in common or interest with children. I asked her what career she would have chosen but, with the confusion, she couldn't answer.
I knew this growing up but, of course, it was unspoken.
I told her that was OK, that not everyone is cut out to be a mother.
I'm not mad at her, in fact I'm kind of relieved to have her admit it. I'm glad she could tell me this before she dies.

Wow DrAnn125..you just gave me a glimpse into my future with my mother. I'm sorry for what you are going through and that your mother never acknowledged what a great daughter you are. I learned something from this site about Narcissistic people. Compliment them! They eat it up. Mom can't be bothered socializing with the wonderful dear residents "doesn't like them" but to get her out of her apartment to eat with them I told her how she lights up a room when she walks in. Next day she went for breakfast after months of isolation. And the dear residents made a fuss over her...she hasn't gone since "doesn't like the food" but it's a start.

I never thought of my mother being narcissistic, I always thought it was just dementia. Our relationship was always contentious, but it became unbearable the older she became. I am one of 5 children and the only girl, so my mother and I always did things together, shopping, traveling, etc. As I got older, she became more critical of my friends, boyfriends and even my son. Now I see that it was because they were taking time away from her. We went on a trip to Europe together and I invited one of my friends to go along. Even though she had one of her friends with us, she complained that i was spending too much time with my girlfriend. When my fiance was diagnosed with cancer, she complained that I was spending too much time accompanying him to his chemotherapy. She said one day "what about me?", I said, mom he could die, she said "so could I". She didn't want to come to my wedding because "why would he want to marry you?" Her friends convinced her to attend, but at the reception when they asked her to say some words of encouragement, she said "I have nothing to say". Now that her dementia has progressed, she accuses me of stealing from her, and tells her friends and my siblings. She has taken me off of bank accounts, made my niece her POA and medical POA, (who has never been close to her) tells me to get out when I come to visit her. When I told her that I will continue to visit her and do what I can for her because I love her. She said to me "You don't have to love me, I don't want you to". "Go home to your husband and son, obviously you love them". She is now in a nursing home because of a stroke. Sometimes she recognizes me and sometimes she doesn't. But the last time I was there and was leaving, she opened her eyes, grabbed my wrist and wouldn't let go. So somewhere in there, I know despite her condition, she does love me. The dementia and narcissism hasn't taken complete control.

Similar situation with my Dad. Haldol chaned everything dramatically for the bettet. There is an increased mortality risk you can google it but for now it is a solution.

SisterLisa,

Your solution cracked me up! "My sister has narcissistic personality disorder and dementia.The ONLY thing I have found that helps is this: The local Senior Center has a play reading once a month. My sister can read and act,(even tho she can't remember) and gets to be the center of attention at the play reading." Lol - roflo.

My sister is a Narcissist, and unfortunately her personality has caused so much dissention. If it were my choice I wouldn't be involved with her at all, but our aging parents need my help. Unfortunately she interferes with every manner in which my other sibling and I work hard to try to provide good care for our parents by bullying us. It's a terrible thing to say, but once our parents pass I don't plan to have any involvement with her at all. Sadly, she destroyed the family relationships between her daughter, my parents and the rest of us. Although her daughter is often on the outs with her too, the damage was done years ago as we were made out to be the villains.

I feel for anyone that has a narcissist parent to care for, and especially one that has dementia too! It's difficult enough as it is to care for an aging parent, but having that coupled with NPD would be a nightmare!

As far as any pointers with how to handle it, I walk away as much as possible when my narcissist sister goes off. If you take them off the stage it can help to diffuse the situation; they don't like it if they don't have a captive audience, so try to turn away and not engage in their game.

anonomous529729, Wow! So I just got off the phone after having to refuse taking my mom out again this week, and feeling bad about it, when I saw your post. The first sentence I saw was "Don't feel guilty that you don't rush to her side to take care of her...." and I laughed! Thank You, Lord, and thank you, Anonomous; it was just what I needed....

Thanks, SueC1957. I believe she enjoys the whirlpool tub baths so that's not an issue. She just wants to stay in her night clothes all day for the last few days anyway. I will get them to try to appeal to that narcissistic side for the activities. I appreciate the advice.

ksordh,
You and the aides could try telling your mom how she's missed in the common area by other residents, how she added a spark to their activities but they've noticed that she's not attending the activities lately. Embellish it as you see fit. You're playing into her narcissism, she should love it.

Is she refusing bathing, clothes changing, etc.? That's what happened with my mom when I was caring for her. I finally had to tell her that she was smelling of body odor. She, the cleanest diva in the world, couldn't possibly be known for B.O.! Somehow the caregivers at the memory care facility get her in the shower.
It's better to ask, "What time would you like your shower?" rather than, "Do you want to take a shower?" There is no bargaining about taking the shower only what time she wants it.

My mother lived alone for 30 years before going into memory care. She is not a social animal. She never liked women due to the competition factor, so she didn't have any girlfriends. She didn't much like having a daughter either but I'm the one taking care of her needs now. She'll tell you she hates her daughter and she believes her daughter hates her. Fortunately she's unaware I AM her daughter. I play along 'cause I'd rather she like who I am than my relationship to her. For the first time in my life I'm getting complimented, so I'll gladly be involved with her confusion!

Really, you can't force them to participate or cooperate with the program. If all else fails, don't make it your battle. It's her choice and you're not responsible for what she chooses. You've done your best. Stop trying to have her fit in. I've had to. Mother won't talk to anyone because "they're all crazy." It's your life in there Mom, have it your way.

It has been awhile since I posted. Mom went into AL memory care in March and all was hunky dory until recently. Newness has worn off and she is no longer getting the doting she wants as the aids have others to attend to and she has a routine. She complains that the other residents don't/won't talk to her, they eat with their hands (she is now eating in her room) and as of yesterday she says she wants to move. No doubt she wants narcissistic feed because of boredom. She was going out to the common area for regular AL residents to exercise, corn hole, bingo, the Price is Right, singing/music programs but now she is back to refusing to get dressed and come out of her room. This is why she went into the AL because I could not get her to do anything. Is there anyway to encourage her without badgering her? My thinking is to ignore her but what do I tell the aids who cannot force them to do anything. It might not be permitted to leave the residents alone but I guess they can minimize their checking and encouraging her so she has to come out. I am convinced she is trying to manipulate them somehow, me as well. Any ideas for those with narcissistic dementia LO's?

My 88 year old mother is a narcissist royale! After  years of suffering from her wrath she is now living in an assisted care living facility and my oldest brother and I are able to make choices about how much we will tolerate. Her phone calls always include self serving motives or blame and shame, but we are thankful that we no longer have to go to her home and be treated like work horses who can never measure up. She spent her entire life buying herself beautiful things and at the same time treated her treasures better than she treated anyone in our family. Her grandchildren have no desire to acquire her things because it all contains negative memories for them.
My brothers and I have treated her with dignity and love regardless of her abuse. I made up my mind with the help of a psychologist that I would do my best to behave like a daughter regardless of my mothers inability to behave like a mother. It has never been easy. 
My father drove himself off a mountain road, leaving us to deal with her when we were very young. I've often wondered if she drove him to do it although I know that he was drinking heavily during that time. 
As her dementia increases, her desire to lash out at me has become worsened. I am thankful beyond measure that she is in assisted living where she can longer break my spirit with her demoralizing comments and actions. 

Wow! This all sounds like my mother-in-law! I have begun caring for her full-time in our home now. I have never heard of Narcissistic Personality Disorder before but that is her! The on set of dementia makes it even more fun. Well, at least knowing this helps.

Sunshine19 I'm delighted that you have recovered and now have a lovely husband, and I wholeheartedly approve your belief that he comes first. That is the proper order of things.

So I'm not disagreeing. But you say no regret, no guilt. And my eyes flicker up to your first sentence, where it says that this is the hardest time of your life.

You see the contradiction, there?

And pressure from siblings, hmmm. Social workers and hospitals can be made to see objective sense once they have a clear history. Siblings perhaps not so much, or so straightforward. What are they up to, exactly? - what mind games are going on, for example?